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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMN-BZA-1980-04-07 ii i; �I I� I TABLE OF CONTENTS IIMINUTES OF THE MEETING OF THE BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS , ITHACA, j: I NEW YORK - APRIL 7 , 1980 �I Page �jAPPEAL NO. 2-1-80 King W. Tang 2 s 114-118 W. State Street APPEAL NO. 2-1-80 Executive Session 4 I ) APPEAL N0. 2-2-80 JVRC Enterprises (Postponed) 5 602 West Buffalo Street ; ; APPEAL NO. 2-6. 80 Chanticleer Restaurant 5 101 W. State Street Ij APPEAL NO. 2-6-80 Executive Session 6 APPEAL NO. 3-1-80 John Petrillose (Postponed) 7 � APPEAL 202-204 & 206-208 Dryden Rd. NO. 3-2-80 Nates Floral Estates (Postponed) 7 402 South Meadow Street j ( APPEAL NO. 4-1-80 George' s Restaurant 7 106 West Green Street �IAPPEAL NO. 4-1-80 Executive Session 10 APPEAL NO. 4-2-80 Bill Zikakis Trust (.Subaru sign) 11 381 Elmira Road APPEAL NO. 4-2-80 Executive Session 17 APPEAL NO. 4-3-SG Kenton Plaza Motel (Postponed) 18 1 701 South. Meadow Street , APPEAL NO. 1296 Elly Hartmanis 18 408 West State Street APPEAL NO. 1296 Executive Session 26 APPEAL NO. 1297 Dudley & Virginia Greenwood 27 214 Linn Street I No decision in the Executive Session on appeal 1297 . It is to be brought back next month. CERTIFICATION BY RECORDING SECRETARY 36 i ; 1 I ; j 4 i i i l i i BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS COMMON COUNCIL CHAMBERS CITY OF ITHACA, NEW YORK APRIL 7 , 1980 I i 11 CHAIRMAN AMAN: I will call the April meeting of the Ithaca Board I� of Zoning Appeals meeting to order. The Board operates under jthe provisions of the Ithaca City Charter, the Ithaca Zoning Ordinance and the Ithaca Sign Ordinance. Present this evening are four members of the Board: Mr. Joseph Gainey, Jr. j Mr. Morris Angell Dr. Martin Greenberg Chairman Alfred Aman i Thomas D. Hoard, Bldg. Comm. $ Secy to the Board Barbara Ruane, Recording Secy For those of you who are not familiar with the Board' s procedure , it takes four affirmative votes to grant the variance and that j means, since two of our members are not with us this evening, that you would have to have a unanimous vote from this panel of four for your variance to be granted. In light of that fact, if any of you who wish to defer your case for this month and i bring it up the following month., you are entitled to do that. On the other hand, if you go forward it will take a unanimous vote for the variance to be granted, We will take the cases up in order and hear the appellant first and ask that you come forward, state your name and address here at the microphone and present your case. After that point, members of the Board may have questions for you and naturally we ask that you respond to those questions directly and as simply as possible, Then we will ask whether or not anyone in the audience wishes to come forward first, to speak- in favor of the proposed variance and then we will i ask whether or not anyone out there wishes to come forward to speak against the proposed variance, We do not operate under strict technical rules of evidence but we do base our decisions on what we hear and on a record, your remarks are taken down and the proceeding is , in a sense, quasi-judicial . After we hear all of the cases, the Board goes into executive session and we deli berate and decide those cases, Then we open again to the public Iand announce those decisions. You need not stay until the very � - 2 - i ii 11 end - you will be notified tomorrow or by mail of what the deci- sion is but on the other hand if you do wish to stay, after we deliberate, we do come back again and announce our decision. Mr. !i I; Secretary, will you call our first case? SECRETARY HOARD: The first case , Mr. Chairman is Appeal 2-1-80 : { Appeal of King W. Tang for a variance under Sections 34.4b (regulations for projecting signs) and 34 . 3 (historic sign regulations) to permit retention of the existing sign at 114-118 West ! State Street (Asiatic Garden Restaurant) in a B-3 (business) use district. The existing sign projects more than eighteen (18) inches from the face of the building. The appellant is also requesting designa- tion of the sign as an historic sign. MR. TANG: My name is King Wing Tang and T live at 421 Warren I' Place and I am here to appeal my sign and to get a variance under I the historic value of the sign, is what T am supposed to be here ! for. Now I wasn' t sure about the - you know, the 18 inch projec- tion or what is that supposed to be? What else am T appealing on? SECRETARY HOARD; The question on this is that the sign does pro-ject more than the 18 inches permitted under the Sign Ordinance but you have appealed under the recent amendment to the Zoning, or the Sign Ordinance which does permit certain signs of historic I' value to be saved. So , even though they do have certain violation of the Sign Ordinance .I MR. TANG: Well , this is what I am appealing anyway - for the historic value of the sign, CHAIRMAN AMAN; Mr, Tang , has it been designated a historic sign? IMR. TANG; Right R it has been designated by the Planning Board ! and the - one other Board, i forgot the name of that department. There were two different groups there involved, and they both 1 approved it. I SECRETARY HOARD; The Ithaca Landmarks Preservation Commission, iMR. TANG: Right, i "MR. GAINEY: The 4ign measures 12 square feet? ( SECRETARY HOARD Yes , I think that is what it is . i MR. GAINEY: He is allowed 18 inches? (' SECRETARY HOARD: No , 18 inch projection but it does exceed that. j I ' - 3 - I i CHAIRMAN AMAN: Do you know how much it exceeds it by? MR. ANGELL: 1212" . MR. TANG: I do have those measurements written down but I didn' t bring them. i MR. GAINEY: The sign is allowed to extend 18 inches from the building, right? It now extends 12? j SECRETARY HOARD: Right now the sign is 12 square feet. Okay, it projects 8 feet. Maximum permitted is 18 inches . It has been designated an historic sign. MR. GAINEY: The sign illuminated? f MR. TANG: Yes. MR. ANGELL: Before we get into this any further, I think we ought to clarify this. Now it says Mr. Tang is requesting designation of the sign as an historic sign. In other words, he hasn't re- ceived that designation . . . SECRETARY HOARD: No, he has received it. But it still has to go through this Board. MR. ANGELL: Well , here we have other ones that say "The sign has received historic designation. ' SECRETARY HOARD; The legal notice should say that for this one too. MR. ANGELL: It doesn' t, But it should? SECRETARY HOARD: Right, You see that legal notice was written at the beginning this was one of the first ones to go through I this process and that was written when we used a different sort o language, We had to carry the same legal notice each month. By how old the sign is and by the fact that it is neon, MR. TANG: You see the first time when this has been going through the zoning appeals maybe three or four months ago and because of a mix up in the directions on how this was supposed to be done, they said for the zoning appeals we wouldW t have to i just rewrite all of those letters and go through all of this legal notice stuff again. So they are still using the original ! thing, where, in the meantime , they did pass it give it the j designation. MR. GAINEY: So this has been designated a historic sign by two I! it i I I - 4 i i' ; different groups? SECRETARY HOARD: Yes. MR. TANG: Yes. I� CHAIRMAN AMAN: Any further questions? i �f MR. GAINEY: Have you looked into the cost of replacing this sign? I' WHAT it might be? MR. TANG: No, I haven' t because all along they just assumed that I could keep it if it was going to be otherwise then I would have looked into it. MR. GAINEY: Who is they _ these two groups? i MR. TANG: Right, CHAIRMAN AMAN: Thank you Mr. Tang. Anyone wishing to speak on behalf of the variance request? Anyone wishing to speak against the variance request? If not, we' ll call the next case. i EXECUTIVE SESSION APPEAL 'NO.* 2-1 r'8 0 i The Board considered the request for a sign variance under Sectio I 34. 4B and 34. 3 of the Sign Ordinance, to permit retention of existing signs at 114-118 West State Street (Asiatic Garden Res- taurant) which is in a B-3 (business) use district. The existing sign projects more than eighteen (18) inches from the face of the building. MR. GAINEY: I move that the sign variance requested in this appeal be granted. DR. GREENBERG; I second the motion. I FINDINGS OF FACT: 1) This sign has received historical classi- fication from the Landmarks Preservation I Commission and thus qualifies as an ex- ception under Section 34. 3 of the Sign iOrdinance . VOTE: 4 Yes ; 0 No ; 2 Absent. Sign variance request granted F I' I'. i i i BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS COMMON COUNCIL CHAMBERS CITY OF ITHACA NEW YORK is f APRIL 7 , 1980 I ; SECRETARY HOARD: The next case is appeal number 2-2-80: Ii I Appeal of JVRC Enterprises for a variance under Sections 34. 4B (regulations for projecting signs) , 34. 5 (regulations for sig area in a residential zone) , 34 . 8 (regulations for sign setback) and 34. 3 (historic sign regulations) to permit retention of the existing sign at 602 West Buffalo Street ( I Joe' s Restaurant) in a B-4 (busi- ness) use district. The existing sign projects more than eighteen (18) inches from the face of the building , exceeds the total area 44 permitted, and projects within �! eighteen (18) inches of a sidewal . The appellant is also requesting �I designation of the sign as an his- toric sign. This appeal has been held over at the request of the appellant. This case has been deferred at the request of the appellant. = The next case then is appeal no. 2-6---80; Appeal of Chanticleer Restaurant for a variance under Sections 34, 4B (regulation for projecting signs) and 34 . 3 (historic sign regulations) to permit retention of the existing sign at 101 West State Stree j in a B-3 (business) use district . The existing sign projects more than eighteen (18) inches from the face of the building The appellant is also requesting designa- tion of the sign as an historic sign. This one also has been designated a historic sign by the Landmarks Commission and by the Planning Board, SMR. LEONARDO: My name is Richard Leonardo and I reside at 1134 Danby Road, Ithaca and I am here representing the Chanticleer in { regard to the Sign Ordinance, requesting a variance. It has been approved by the historic sign committee. MR, GAINEY: We are talking about the sign on the corner, the (rooster? w MR. LEONARDO; Right , the sign and the canopy, or the circle there. MR, GAINEY: What was the problem with this Tom? SECRETARY HOARD; You mean on dimensions? �MR, GAINEY; Yes, SECRETARY HOARD; Okay. This one projects three feet. Eighteen I�, �i i� - 6 - i inches is the maximum permitted. It is twenty-five square feet o Ii signage which is permitted. To I MR. ANGELL: It is protected by canopy under it though isn' t it? SECRETARY HOARD: Well the little canopy - or whatever you call that - I does project more than the signs themselves. The sign - it says �I Chanticleer on that thing that comes out which is also included I as part of the sign. MR. ANGELL: I mean that is firmly affixed to the building itself, right? The canopy. I SECRETARY HOARD: Yes. CHAIRMAN AMAN: Any questions? Thank you very much Mr. Leonardo. f Anyone wishing to speak on behalf of the variance? Anyone wishing t to oppose it? Mr. Secretary will you call the next case please? i EXECUTIVE SESSION APPEAL NO. 2..6,80 The Board considered your request for a sign variance under Sec- tions 34. 4B and 34 . 3 of the Sign Ordinance, to permit retention o existing signage at 101 W. State Street which is in a B-3 (business) use district. The existing sign projects more than eighteen (18) i inches from the face of the building. The decision of the Board was as follows : ii MR. AMAN: I move that the sign variance requested in this appeal be granted. MR. GAINEY. I second the motion. FINDING OF FACT: 1) This sign has received hsitorical classi- fication from the Landmarks Preservation I Commission and thus qualifies as an excep- tion under Section 34 . 3 of the Sign Ordi- nance. VOTE: 4 Yes ; 0 No ; 2 Absent . I Sign variance request granted. �I I i i �j 7 - Ij i BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS i� COMMON COUNCIL CHAMBERS �( CITY OF ITHACA, NEW YORK j APRIL7 , 1980 I SECRETARY HOARD: The next case is appeal no 3-1-80. This is i another one that I have to read into the record, Appeal of John Petrillose for sign vari- ances under Section 34. 4B and Section 34. 8 to permit the retention of the existing signs at 202-204 Dryden Road and 206-208 Dryden Road (Johnny' s Big Red Grill) in B-2b (business) use district. One sign, on 202-204 Dryden Road projects more tha eighteen inches (18) from the face of the building, the maximum projection permitted. The second sign, at 206-208 Dryden Road , is a pole sign which is set too close to I� the public right-of-way, in violation of j the setback requirements of the Ordinance . This is another case which has been postponed at the request of the appellant. The next case is Appeal No. 3-2-80 : Appeal of Nate' s Floral Estates for a sign variance under Section 34 , 4E (prohi- bition of billboards) and 34, 5A-4 (regu- lations for directional signs) to permit retention of the sign at 402 South Meadow Street in a B-4 (business) use district. The sign is located on property other than the premises on which the advertise business is located, and thus falls under the definition of a billboard, a prohibited use, The sign also exceeds th.e maximum size permitted for a directional sign. Is there anyone here for Nate' s Floral Estates? (no one appeared) We' ll go on to the next one , whish is Appeal, No, 4-1r80 Appeal of John Boronkay for a variance under Section 34,4B (regulations for projecting signs) to permit retention of the existing sign at 106 West Green Street . (George's Restaurant) in a B-3 (business) use district. The existing sign projects j more than eighteen (18) inches from the j face of the building. The sign has re- ceived historic designation from the Itha a I� Landmarks Preservation Commission. Mr. Boronkay? MR. BORONKAY: I 'm Dick Boronkay, representing George 's Restaurant i and I live at 150 Pearsall Place. Tom, do you have a picture of { that? My stuff is all taken from me. I 'm sorry. Well - could I ` use the blackboard? As you walk out the door tonight, if you look oto your right you will see a sign that looks something like this . �I jIt has George' s Restaurant written on it - all the way down. This � is 17 inches from here to the wall . This is the one that I am I! l iI I ff - 8 - l f� asking for the variance on. It is a semi-circle sign that goes I� I off here. From this point to this point (pointing) here I believe `I it is 48 inches. From this point here , to this point here , it is 48 inches. Am I right Tom? This has Rainbow and the neon sign has i; been classified as an historic sign. This is in compliance and I this over here is what we need a variance on. It has gone through the historic signs . . . MR. GAINEY: Is there any writing on it? �i MR. BORONKAY: Yes , it says George' s Restaurant or George ' s Lounge. There are neon lights that go around here, like this . . . . MR. GAINEY: Is there neon on the other - the upper part there? MR. BORONKAY: Yes , right. It is all neon. SECRETARY HOARD: Doesn' t the upper one just say "taurant"`, MR. BORONKAY: Yes , right now. The top half isn' t lit because in fact I need a transformer put up here. Now if I can get the designation I will do it, If I don' t get it, there is no need to Iget the transformer. We' ll have to take the whole sign down probably. This sign here was originally put up in 1350 or 51 . I II That is as close as we can prove it. And that is why we got the historic designation - that was the original sign right there. I� That was added about 3 or 4 years later the 17 inch sign. As I far as I can understand that is in compliance - it is this one here that I need a variance on. It is a two face sign in either direction. I I MR. GAINEY; What would you do if you had to take it down? MR. BORONKAY: Take it down. MR. GAINEY: Would you replace it? Would you replace it with something with_ th-e 17"? MR, BORONKAY: I may leave that , I haven't decided. The whole thing has been designated a historic sign, that is all I know. IAnd after tonight I ' ll find out what I am going to do with it . I am just here asking you for a variance, DR. GREENBERG: For the record, Tom, how big is the sign and how much does it project? SECRETARY HOARD: The sign projects 51 . I - 9 - i' MR. GAINEY: - He' s allowed 18"? { SECRETARY HOARD: Right. i. MR. GAINEY: Is he within the square foot allotment? SECRETARY HOARD: It is within the square footage. i MR. GAINEY: And this again, has been designated as historic?� g � g j MR. BORONKAY: Yes. And it has gone to the Planning Board and I they okayed it . MR. GAINEY: Do we have any signs that aren' t designated as his- toric in the city? ; SECRETARY HOARD: Yes there are a couple more on the agenda tonight. Well it was known that they would come through in a bunch like this . Because, as of August, they all had to come down. MR. BORONKAY: It was just passed in August by Council so it is a new ordinance that just became effective in August. MR. GAINEY: What is a new ordinance? MR. BORONKAY: Historic section of it, That 's why no one ever had historic designation before August 15th:, was it? When it was passed? Ever since August 15th on, anybody that has - you know who is considering a historic sign has come before you to ask for I one . 7 MR. GAINEY: Common Council set it up with the Ithaca Landmarks to designate it, right? ySECRETARY HOARD: They designate it but it still has to go through this Board because of the non-conforming . . . MR. GAINEY: What do you do with the signs that came before us before August - before this went in, do they have the right to ; reappear? SECRETARY HOARD: If somebody' s got an historic sign in their basement somewhere , yes . There is a provision that if you have a ; historic sign and it is not mounted, you can come back and apply jfor historic status and put it back up. So far no one has done jthat, to my knowledge. s ! CHAIRMAN AMAN: 1950 is the cut off date, it is my understanding, i ' of historic signs , Pre 1950. IMR. ANGELL: Pre 1950 - you just said yours was 1951 . If 3 - 10 - I! MR. BORONKAY: But it was made in - about 1949. We've got verifi- cation on when it was put up and a sign like that - Morrie , took more than two weeks to make. It went through the historic designa- tion under the assumption that it was in the era that they really wanted to keep. I� P• �! SECRETARY HOARD: Were you a councilman in 1972? IMR. BORONKAY: Been on for twelve years , I went on in 169. i MR. ANGELL: Did you vote for the Sign Ordinance? i MR. BORONKAY: Yes. Any questions? CHAIRMAN AMAN: Thank you. Anyone else wishing to speak to this i case? If not, we will call the next case, EXECUTIVE SESSION APPEAL NO, 4-1-80; I The Board considered the request for a sign variance under Section I 34. 4B of the Sign Ordinance, to permit retention of the existing sign at 106 W, Green Street (George' s Restaurant) which is in a B-3 (business) use district. The existing sign projects more than eighteen (18) inches from the face of the building, The decision of the Board was as follows : CHAIRMAN AMAN: I move that the sign variance requested in Appeal No. 4-1-80 be granted. 'I MR. GAINEY: I second the motion. i { FINDING OF FACT: 1) This sign has received historical classi- fication from the Landmarks Preservation Commission and thus qualifies as an excep- tion under Section 34.4B of the Sign Ord- �f inance. ! 4 Yes ; 0 No ; 2 Absent. VOTE: , , Sign variance request granted. i i i i i I I BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS COMMON COUNCIL CHAMBERS i' CITY OF ITHACA, NEW YORK �i APRIL 73, 1980 I I SECRETARY HOARD: The next case , Mr. Chairman is Appeal No. �i 4-2-80 : Appeal of Bill Zikakis Trust for a vari- ance under Section 34 . 6B (permitted signs I in a B-5 district) to permit the erection of three new signs at 381 Elmira Road (Bill Zikakis Imports) in a B-5 (business) use district. The requested signs would increase the number of signs to four; district regulations permit only two sign on this property, i MR. ZIKAKIS: I 'm William Zikakis , I 'm president of Bill Zikakis Chevrolet, Inc. , 401 Elmira Road and of Bill Zikakis Imports , 381 I ( Elmira Road. I reside at 871 Cayuga Heights Road and I am the ! holder of a Subaru franchise. The problem is that Subaru requires sthat we have signage and representation for them - highway repre- sentation for them on the premises . For several years I have been fable to avoid this but at this point , when I sign my new franchise liagreement I had to agree to erect three additional signs on the ! Subaru property to show the representation. At this point they ijhave no representation at all except a sign that is mutual if I could pass these out mutually displaying the three products that I have in the 381 Elmira Store and that' s the Volvo , Mazda and Subaru together, Subaru would like to have their own representation sand they would like to have three signs erected. The signs one of ithem is a module sign which is a 4 x 4 each letter -- 4 ' x 4 ' each letter SUBARU plus a logo that they have on the building itself which- gives it 116 square feet, A product sign which is 41 x 10 w1lich ! would be 4G square feet and a ready-car which would be a used car I , sign on the same plot of 30 square feet, The sign that we have no lis 64 square feet � the one that has all three products on it at this time and that is the appeal that we would like to have is for the additional signage for representation for the Subaru for me to , conform to my, Subaru franchise agreement, i ! CHAIRMAN AMAN: To make sure that I understand, how many signs do I ! you have now? i MR. ZIKAKIS: We have one. One sign that has all three products r ; listed on it, It is rather small for the facility, ISI - 12 - ; CHAIRMAN AMAN: And what would the total number of signs be? jMR. ZIKAKIS: Four CHAIRMAN AMAN: A total of four? MR. ZIKAKIS: We might change the fourth one where it has Volvo , �IMazda and Subaru - we may change it and make it a Mazda sign by I' jitself because obviously we wouldn't need the Subaru representation on that one, if we have three additional signs. it (MR. GAINEY: Do you have a letter here from Subaru? i�MR. ZIKAKIS: Yes there is a letter there showing that I have not conformed at this point. There is also a copy there of my fran- chise agreement stating my requirements of having to conform to !this sign program. 'MR. GAINEY: Okay have you addressed this issue with Sabaru? IMR. ZIKAKIS: Yes , that is why it has taken four years to bring it to Council because I have addressed it until they finally told me ,1that I must bring it up. We thought we could go along on the same basis that we have using one sign for all the products but they i demand their independence, I guess. �MR. GAINEY: What happens if we tell you you can' t have it? Do you lose your dealership? IMR. ZIKAKIS: Well we have the Subaru representative back there , we' ll ask him. I don ' t know. MR. GAINEY: Have him step forward. 'MR. ZIKAKIS: This is Charlie Dafeldecker, who is the zone manager ( for Subaru of American. IMR, DAFELDECKER: Yes sir? ,IMR. GAINEY: I had a question - if we deny this , do you deny them their franchise? Because if the law states that he has exceeded. . MR. DAFELDECKER: No, I don't have that right. But to make him a better dealer, a more visible dealer, we need signing in Ithaca. Definitely, we don' t have the power, because of not having signag , � to cancel his franchise. MR. GAINEY: Okay, is it possible that these signs could be cut i ! down in size? MR. DAFELDECKER: No, they are standard size - they are not avail- 11able in smaller dimensions. it 13 - , MR. GAINEY: We heard that from K-Mart , too , but they came up with ;;smaller signs. ii MR. DEFALDECKER: Well , this is what I 've been told by our executive i ;committee. i '!MR. ZIKAKIS: There are three different dimensions on the signs , the 'lone SUBARU sign is 4 x 10, which is a stand-up sign and a product ( identification and the large one , yes . . . and then the large one i ja building sign that goes across the building itself and that' s the large one, that 116 square foot. ±MR. GAINEY: That goes across the face of the building or . . . ? IMR. ZIKAKIS: Yes , that is 4 x 4 modules letters - each letter is i4 x 4 plus the logo which is 5 x 4 which gives it a total of 116 ;square feet. i CHAIRMAN AMAN: What would be the difficulty of having only two signs and cutting back and have Subaru sign, for example, rather i ;than . . . �IMR. ZIKAKIS: That would be agreeable to me, i would have to present l ilit back to Subaru and tell them that was what the Council has agree i;as satisfactory and then work it within that framework. ;CHAIRMAN AMAN: I would assume that all franchise agreements are subject to local federal and state laws and have . . . I MR. DAFELDECKER: I think we 'd be happy with, you know, two of the I (signs but . . . 1IR. ANGELL: Tom, what is the accepted square footage of signs in i �!that . . . ? i SECRETARY HOARD: Well it' s based on the linear footage of the building and I think. that I 've forgotten what the total is there i NIR. ZIKAKIS: The problem comes then that once the representation f r { One is made then I have to have - I cannot slight the other fran- jchises . The Mazda is of equal importance to me and I would have to have a Mazda sign so that if I was limited to two signs I 'd have to ii 1have a Subaru and a Mazda sign which puts me in a bind with Volvo. Ii ``. Now with Volvo, I 'd probably have a little more flexibility with it l Mand could perhaps work out something on some other basis on that. Ideally it would be to have representation for each line, I j 14 I I SECRETARY HOARD: He is permitted 1 . 5 square feet of sign for ever Hlineal foot of the business up to a maximum of 200 square feet. jMR. ANGELL: Alright. What ' s his frontage? MR. ZIKAKIS: 300 foot frontage. lMR. ANGELL: The building? I! MR. ZIKAKIS: The building is 100. I �'MR. ANGELL: So that is 100 1 .4? MR. ZIKAKIS: Rand what is the building , do you know? Size of the 1build.ing? I MR. ANGELL: Allowed is 1 . 4 per foot? SECRETARY HOORD; 1. 5 IIMR. ZIKAKIS: The building may be bigger than that , Morrie , I could (be mistaken on the size - I didn' t know the measurement was by !building, I thought it was by frontage of n and I didn't measure Ithe building. Maybe its 125. The lot is 300 and the building 1takes up a good chunk of it. �MR. GAINEY: So we are talking the building that is this side of 'Spencer Road - toward the Ithaca side, right? �MR. ZIKAKIS: Right. It faces Elmira Road but it is also on (Spencer Road. I MR. GAINEY: Okay and you are talking - you want four signs in total? IMR. ZIKAKIS: Right. According to this letter by Garrett Schnock (fit says you are entitled under the provisions of the Ordinance to l Ione additional sign either a building sign or an additional free !standing sign not to exceed 136 square feet in area if a building (sign and that is giving us credit for the 64 square feet that ' s lus the 64 so he is figuring that we are entitled . to 200 square feet in all. We are a BR5 zone . lMR. GAINEY: Do I read this right then, you want three signs that !say Subaru? i R. ZIKAKIS That ' s Subaru' s request, R. ANGELL: Then you are going to come back- and ask for additional �' igns for Mazda. . . . ? I MR. ZIKAKIS: No, I probably{ . . . • Morrie, I 'd probably change the i i 1 i sign that I have to a Mazda sign. I have a sign this existing sign now . . . ;SIR. ANGELL: It says Volvo , Mazda, MR. ZIKAKIS: Right. iC. GAINEY: What would you do with Volvo? i R. ZIKAKIS: Probably be here next month.. I don' t know, I 'd have El problem because once we . . . I IIIR. GAINEY: This is something I want to get squared away while we i dare here because - you know - something is approved, if it is ap- i! (proved, for signs and I go under the presumption that this is it, 11I don' t want somebody coming back a month later and telling me he 1! 'ants another or two signs. �iMR. ANGELL: Alright, he ' s entitled to 200 square foot of sign, is jlhat including the free standing sign? ISECRETARY HOARD: Total 208 and two signs , one a free-standing, one 'f pn the building or two on the building, . GAINEY: And no free-standing? �I5ECRETARY HOARD: And no free-standing. Or he can have two free- 6, tanding and none on the building . SMR. GAINEY: As long as they don't exceed the 200 square feet? SECRETARY HOARD: Right. �R. GAINEY: And this is the one that you are proposing to be on the front of the building? IR. ZIKAKIS: That' s right. That one is 116 square feet. R. GAINEY: This would be a free-standing or on the building? R. ZIKAKIS: Free-standing and the third one would be free-standin . SIR. GAINEY: I take it these aren' t historical? I �R. ZIKAKIS: Not yet. We are working on that. i I�R. GAINEY: Which sign does Subaru feel is the most important? .(gym I putting you on the spot? �R. DAFELDECKER: The product sign is the most important. SIR. GAINEY: Okay. �R. ZIKAKIS: The free-standing one. �M. ANGELL: What' s the square footage of that 30 or 40? JAR, ZIKAKIS: That ' s 40 square foot . i I ii i 16 - I:iMR. ANGELL: There is no existing sign on the building now? u 'iMR. ZIKAKIS: No. ( CHAIRMAN AMAN: Is it possible if you had just two signs that you could get all of these names on those two signs , if you . . . ? ii MR. ZIKAKIS: Subaru would like to be alone —would like to be by I themselves - they are trying to obviously get recognition - sort of dike McDonalds - so you recognize the sign and have the sense of good feeling, I guess , that those dealers are there - an identifica- tion. So they want to be alone whatever way you present it back to me I 'd have to put a Subaru all by itself. Now Mazda also , I am �lsure, is going to request that. I don't know what we can do with (Volvo. It' s not a major a part of my business as Subaru and Mazda. I alsoo have room - I have only one sign on the Chevrolet sign - I i _ay have more room on the Chevrolet sign to put a Volvo sign up and conform legally. CHAIRMAN AMAN: If you were to conform legally and have simply two i signs , the total footage of which does not exceed 200 square feet , (I !you are suggesting you probably would have a Subaru sign by itself i and a Mazda sign by itself? i MR. ZIKAKIS: And a Mazda sign by itself. CHAIRMAN AMAN: And this would leave you without . . . I R. ZIKAKIS: A Volvo representation. '��CHAIRMAN AMAN: Any further questions? Thank you. IMR. ZIKAKIS: Thank you. .i CHAIRMAN AMAN: Anyone wishing to speak on behalf of this variance? Anyone wishing against it? (no one) We ' ll move on to the next I� case. I i i i ij i i i i' - 17 - i ji BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS COMMON COUNCIL CHAMBERS CITY OF ITHACA, NEW YORK I; APRIL 5 , 1980 a EXECUTIVE SESSION APPEAL NO. 4-2-80 : ,The Board considered the request for a sign variance under Section i 134. 6B of the Sign Ordinance, to permit the erection of three (3) new signs at 381 Elmira Road (Bill Zikakis Imports) which is in a B-5 (business) use district. The requested signs would increase the number of signs to four; district regulations permit only two signs on this property. The decision of the Board was as follows : DR. GREENBERG: I move that the Board deny the appeal of Bill Zikakis Trust for a variance under Section 34 . 5B to permit the erection of three (3) new signs . R. GAINEY: I second the motion. OTE: 4 Yes ; 0 No ; 2 Absent. Sign variance appeal denied. FINDINGS OF FACT: 1) The petitionerls request twice the number of signs allowable under the Sign Ordinance. 2) The signs , as requested, would exceed the tota square footage allowed under the variance. 3) The number of signs requested would certainly I contribute to the visual pollution. 4) Undue hardship was not shown; the cars being sold can adequately be advertised on signs tha fall within the requirements of the Sign Ordi- nance , i 5) The fact that the business sells different named products does not entitle it to a sign for each named product that it sells , i I I i I 18 - li BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS COMMON COUNCIL CHAMBERS CITY OF ITHACA, NEW YORK APRIL 5 , 1980 1' : SECRETARY HOARD: The next case is appeal 4-3-80 : f`f Appeal of Mr. & Mrs . Francis W. Wolcott II for a variance under Section 34 .6-A-1 i� (permitted number of signs) and 34. 8 j� (required setback for signs) to permit retention of the existing pole sign at j 701 South Meadow Street (Kenton Plaza f Motel) in a B-2-A (business) use district, The existing pole sign consists of sev ra] individual signs which exceed the total area permitted and project over the public right-of-way. SMR. WOLCOTT: Yes , you mentioned earlier that we could defer until ithe May meeting? I 'd like to do that. i !SECRETARY HOARD: Alright. IMR. WOLCOTT: Could I have the date and time of that meeting? I! CHAIRMAN ARAN: It would be the first Monday in May. MR. WOLCOTT: The first Monday in May.. Thank you. CHAIRMAN AMAN: 7 : 30 starting time . (SECRETARY HOARD: The next case then is appeal 1296 : Appeal of Elly Hartmanis for an area variance under Section 30. 25 , Column 4 (required off-street parking) , Column 13 (minimum required side yard) , and Column 14 (minimum required rear yard) to permit use of the house at 408 West State Street for offices and apartments and use of the carriage house on the same property for a one-car garage , a shop, and storage space. The property, which is located in a B-2a (business) use district, is deficient in off- street parking, one side yard depth, and rear yard depth. �iow, neither of you were here at the beginning of the meeting - there are only four members here so you'd have to get - you need our votes to get the variance. So you have the option of asking Or deferral if you wish. Wait for a time when there are more i Oeople here. i IR. PEER: There is no appeal if they - the decision goes against Is? With four members you cantt appeal to the full board? I �HAIRMAN AMAN: No. MRS. HARTMANIS: Good evening. My name is Elly Hartmanis and I 'm e! I I li - 19 - ' here to speak to you about this particular variance. We will go i !;ahead with this appeal because I think we have a good chance of ;;getting it - hopefully. I 've tried to explain quite carefully �I I�already what we would like to use the building for. I hope you I have all had a chance to read it since I am speaking particularly , with regard to the variance in parking at this point. I would lik ,Ito point out that the particular yard of this house - this house, by the way, is the private residence of the owners of the Brianwoo i (Antique Store and it is - as many have said - the most beautiful house on the west side of town - it is in a commercial block but I still has a very private air about it. The yard is particularly beautiful - it has been planted by a landscape architect, Mr. Nevin who lives in the house and for sixteen years he has made it a show- case. Apparently it was on garden tours and is supposedly just 1ivery, very beautiful. Unfortunately these pictures don' t quite show it because the trees , of course, haven't leafed out yet. We I� 11do not intend to change the house in appearance at all except for Isome - more glass area on the porch which we want to use as a dis- play area. The Company of which I am president, will be having lits offices there . We are in the construction and custom remodeling business, of homes . We build homes - additions to homes and remodel i , existing homes, We will have a small office in the front - we hope to rent some offices that are located a little bit further Iiinside the building to a real estate agency or some other profes- sional office use. There will also be two small apartments in the 'building; one occupied by Mr. Peer who is the construction manager of our company and will speak to this appeal.. . .. �iMR. GAINEY: Two apartments you say? IMRS. HARTMANIS: Two apartments, yes . Two one-bedroom apartments . is I figure that with these various uses I would be required, under ithe law, to have seven parking spaces, of which I can provide four; one in the carriage house and the others in the spacious driveway. ,JHowever , there is a side yard deficiency. One of the side yards ; has only thirteen feet instead of fifteen which is required - that ' s Hnot very unusual for that particular area I don' t think there is I; ii - 20 - '; a house in the whole distract that satisfies any of these require- i ! ments. We are actually on a double lot which makes this particula lot much more spacious than any of the others there. The other side , yard is twenty-one feet which is sufficient. The back - the rear lI and variance which we would also need pertains to this articular �:. Y P P ; carriage house which is used as a storage area and a garage. That was built some ninety years ago, almost on the lot line and we !would need a variance there . If you have any questions I ' ll be Ihappy to answer them. MR. GAINEY: What is in the house now, just apartments? MRS. HARTMANIS: No it is privately occupied by Mr. Nevin and Mr. ( Southwick. However they also use it as a base as sort of an adjunct to the antique store they sell out of it. It is fur- Inished with antiques . i IMR. GAINEY: So they actually operate an in-house antique shop? I�MRS. HARTMANIS: Well they have an antique shop which is directly �lacross the street from there, the Brianwood Antique Shop, but they tare . . . CMR. PEER.: They have private showings and basically, antiques are custom items that they don't want to put on display. They are !valuable and they would have a - when they want to walk a special ; s customer through, they gill take them through their private showing , (basically. The place is really interesting on the inside. It is ;chucked full from one room to the next - full of antiques . The I !entire house has actually been reconstructed from items restored from different areas and different houses around town. The column Ion the side were not there, the door treatment ,, the impediment over ; i the top was not there, the heavy soffit treatment was added - the (place has been maintained impeccably the entire inside was torn up. All the floors were torn up, to provide for a temperature humidity controlled environment for his antiques , he installed a completely new forced hot air system, with humifi.cat on dehumifica- gtion to control the environment for the woods . The woods needed a , certain moisture content for the antiques in that house. In doing this they tore up all the hardwood floors , put in the heat runa, i I r i I' - 21 - ( relaid them. They really did a stunning job on it. We hope to follow up on that tradition that they started on that house - that 11 His why we were interested in it. It is unfortunate that it is �i next to a commercial area - next to Pirro' s Pizza but the house is w la bit of a refuge. As Mrs. Hartmanis said, the - at the Planning Board meeting, Mr. Southwick spoke to this appeal , saying that his 1partner, Mr. Nevin, who is a landscape architect and did do the work there, had done a lot of work to the point that it was on fl gardening tours in the City. It is that environment that we want I! to maintain or hopefully, capitalize on. The location - which is , very comfortable surroundings, they are cozy - meticulously done ;; and maintained. We will get a feeling that they will be taken car 1of by our firm - that their house will look something like this jwhen we are finished. And this is the reason for this site which ` interested us. It is particularly suited for our needs . We have f jsmall firm, we don' t - we are not large, we have three employees land will stay, probably, at this level . The rear - the front porc - 1 you can see from the picture , will have a glass enclosure created around it and from floor to ceiling probably and there will be custom lighted cabinets that I have a franchise for - will be dis- played there for general view from the street. jCHAIRMAN AMAN: May I interrupt you for a minute? I 'm just curiou on the parking, if you could tell us what that area is like in I terms of parking facilities. ;MRS. HARTMANI.S. Well , there are n there is metered parking, of i 1course, there. Actually the area- is never totally full , I mean, ; you can drive up almost any time of the day and find a parking space within the block. This is so, because quite a few of the establishments around there have bought up some lots and made them ! into parking spaces; like, for instance, Tioga Auto Parts has bought 11ithe lot next to it and then just razed it so it is just for their own parking, however. But there are other areas . � . jMR. PEER: The y`.P,W`. which has a very large space to the side and behind it. There is city metered parking lot within 460 feet , . . 11CHAIRMAN AMAN: How would that work as far as the tenants are i1 liconcerned? ii 22 - ii iMRS. HARTMANIS: Well there will only be two tenants. 11CHAIRMAN AMAN: So presumably their cars would be in your four ,! spaces? Ii MRS. HARTMANIS: Yes. I' MR. PEER: I will be one tenant and my vehicle will be in the garage space and the second tenant - in the driveway there is an ! offset right in front of the garage where one could pull over to the side and still provide access in and out of the garage and probably the permanent parking for the tenant, the second tenant I1will be in that area. MRS. HARTMANIS: Our office, for instance, is not generating much I traffic we will only meet customers by appointment - it 's not a iretail business in any sense . I MR. PEER: in some sense but not in the sense of off-street trade. They won't come in and buy a couple nuts and bolts and leave again. IIt is not a heavy -- someone will come, spend a few hours and then ,I jleave. They are merely for us to serve better as far as presentin i Ila plan - a proposal for their job , drawings , some displays of item 1which would be incorporated into their work whether its cabinets o its a pictorial display or items out of a catalog - door treatments , windows reatment , windows or the like. This is much more easily presented in an office environment which we would have, rather than taking it to the client. MR. GAINEY': What kind of shop are you putting in th.e carriage (house? MR. PEER: The shop is a - will be an adjunct to the cabinet sales lend. The manufacture of the cabinets - its called Rutts - they are ! lout of Pennsylvania Dutch. Country in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania land they will sell the entire cabinet to me or we successfully jincorporated their cabinet face frames and doors and drawer fronts !the entire front of a cabinet we manufacture the cases sometime jwhich, are the sides , the backs, the bottoms. They have a better iImaterial which. is like a formica lining so they have a natural woo ;face w ,th. their factory finish which we cannot duplicate and cannot Htry to duplicate and so their factory finish is on our case , basi- 11cally. This would be a custom item where if someone wants someth9 I - 23 - Ila little bit more special and expensive this is probably the most li ;; expensive cabinet made for kitchen use. And if somebody wants i ;i it a little bit jazzier as far as cleanliness on the inside and longevity we would do this treatment or if a special cabinet , I� :which the factory cannot supply, needs to be made to fit into an l Todd corner or something like that, we would make it there. The J'pieces of machinery will be normal shop pieces which - if anyone f� is interested in woodworking probably has in their own place ii llis small stuff, a drill press, a table saw, a four inch joiner - I ii !have what they call a multi-tool which converts to three tools - I Ilputting a lathe, a drill press and a table saw and that will ( probably" sit there. A new electric line will be brought in but ( there won't be any heavy equipment as far as needing high electri- city requirements like a three phase supply or anything it will , just be normal small shop stuff - the type of things you find at Sears or Montgomery Wards or something like that. IMR. GAINEY: The way you describe it, it looks like its three ! stories? IMR. PEER No, it's two. � MR. GAINEY: Two? MR. PEER: The bottom level that you see there, the left hand side would be - would house a vehicle, a pick up truck, And the right , hand side would have the equipment, MR. GAINEY: What' s this all up here (pointing to picture) ? MR. PEER: That would be storage area for cabinets which came in ahead of time, they couldn't be dropped at the site . . . MR. GAINEY: Is that one story or two story? i MR. PEER: That' s one and a half, I guess one and a quarter. It' s one story with a vaulted ceiling, is what it is . IMR. GAINEY: There is no floor up in between here? MR. PEER: No. Right above the garage door (pointing to picture) - as you see here , right above there, there is a floor - up here no fit' s just like when you walk in you see right up to the rafters . ( (More conversation between Mr, Peer and Mr. Gainey which was not 1picked up by the recorder) MRS. HARTMANIS: The upper part would not be used for the wood shop. �i I� I 24 - 1 ;;That other would be strictly for storage. The wood shop would only take up only this part (pointing to picture) - half of the two car li ;garage - this end would be the construction office. 11 DR. GREENBERG: Tom, there is no use variance that is required? Iiii'i; SECRETARY HOARD: Well there is a question here on whether you con- i 1!sider the work that Mr. Peer has described as being light hand it fabrication, which is permitted in a B-2 or if it were considered la cabinet shop - a real cabinet manufacturer- it wouldn' t be per- k I�mitted industrial zone. Or if it were somewhere be- tween then it would probably have to go down to a B-4 zone which i ' - permits printing, heating, welding, air conditioning, plumbing o ! similar shop. But he is talking about using home type power saws. s IMRS. HARTMANIS: I would also like to mention that directly adjoin ding this particular structure is a printing press - Seneca Printing lis within a few feet of this particular building so you see the area its commercial - quite densely commercial. We would not have a full time person working in that shop from morning to night. Our men a e ,Ion site at their construciton bases . We would be using it only I loccasionally, sonetimes maybe for several weeks not at all. But we would like to very much. have an opportunity to be able to do that if �we were called upon. We have so far done it always on the constru - i ! tion site but that makes it difficult sometimes because it may I� necessitate finishing a cabinet while you are cutting and sanding i lit which creates a little dust you know and it makes it much more difficult. It would be much easier for us if we could do that. MR. VEER: It is not cost effective either to site construct cabi mets or modify cabinets because they are special cases , they can b i lmoved like a desk and installed as a unit so they can be brought Ito a site very easily and installed so to have a site space taken l up with- somebody making cabinets is very messy and not at all cost effective. As Mrs. Hartmanis said the - we would envision that ma be 11possibly one full day out of a week someone would be modifying a jcabi.net or a case or constructing a small item to bring to a job. I lilt may run two days, three days and then not for three weeks. It ! is just as we need it. We do not do a lot of volume , with only �i I' Ii !i - 25 - ii four people you can't do a lot of volume. We do one job at a time i and stay on the job and make sure that everything is right about i� it. I understand that we do have to go to the State Board for a ivariance on a fire district, is that right Mr. Hoard? SECRETARY HOARD: Yes . IMR. PEER: Okay. And in treating the issue of the set backs , now ; for the garage - the carriage house. Once - assuming that the variance is favorable from the State that this Board here could address the city variance need, is that true or do we have to come back again? ( SECRETARY HOARD: You could do - what I would suggest is asking fol ! the city variance at this time . SMR. PEER: Contingent upon the state. I ( SECRETARY HOARD: That is what you are doing, basically it ' s an in - i � terpretation whether it ' s a permitted use or not. MR. GAINEY: Has the fire chief looked at this? Or hasn' t he been involved yet? i SECRETARY HOARD: He has not been involved in this . He has been linvolved in similar cases. The breakdown comes to the question of just what we have been talking about - is it a small occasional USE 1with a domestic type machinery or is it a full scale cabinet makin loperation? And this is something that the state - the state is going ito have to rule on the safety aspect of it as well because it is i a wood frame structure. ' CHAIRMAN AMAN: Thank you very much, MR. PEER: Thank you. IICHAIRMAN AMAN: Does anyone wish to speak either for or against ' the variance request? We 'll take the next case. f I t f I I �i i i I 26 - i{ f! BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS j' COMMON COUNCIL CHAMBERS CITY OF ITHACA, NEW YORK i; APRIL 7 , 1980 I I EXECUTIVE SESSION !APPEAL NO. 1296 : jhe Board considered the request for a variance from Section 30. 25 Ij �lof the Zoning Ordinance to permit use of the house at 408 West " State Street which is located in a B- 2a (business) use district , I jlfor offices and apartments , and use of the carriage house on the �isame property for a one-car garage , a shop, and storage space. Th ,property is deficient in off-street parking, one side yard depth I Viand rear yard depth. The decision of the Board was as follows : 'MR. GAINEY: I move that the Board grant the variance requested in appeal No. 1296 for both. the main structure and �i the carriage house with the stipulation that the j buildings comply with all applicable codes either I I through physical modification or through variance i from the State Building Construction Code. 'CHAIRMAN AMAN: I second the motion. VOTE: 4 Yes ; 0 No ; 2 Absent Area variance granted. ,FINDINGS OF FACT: 1) This use doesn't change the character of i the neighborhood. 2) The deficiency in parking is not extreme in that particular area. I 3) The businesses involved would not generate excessive 1 traffic. i 4) The owners have provided a total of four (4) parkin I spaces , at least two (2) of which are for the resi- dential tenants . l I t �f i 'i 11 f. - 27 it BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS COMMON COUNCIL CHAMBERS CITY OF ITHACA, NEW YORK h APRIL 7 , 1980 I; i� 11SECRETARY HOARD: The final case Mr. Chairman is appeal no. 1297 : it Appeal of Dudley and Virginia Greenwood (� for a use variance under Section 30. 25 , Columns 2 and 3 (permitted primary and accessory uses) , to permit the continue operation of an existing garage business at 214 Linn Street. The property is located in an R-3b (residential) use district in which a commercial garage is not a permitted use. Mr. Greenwood has been operating the business since 1947 under a use variance granted to hi j on a year-to-year basis by the Board o Zoning Appeals , The property is now for sale. MR. MORRISON: My name is Richard Morrison and I 'm a lawyer repre- senting the Dudley Greenwood' s on this . Mr. Greenwood is here with me and he will answer any questions that you may have. Mr. & Mrs . Greenwood have owned the property since 1944 and since a short time after that have operated a garage on the premises - automotive re- pairs , small engine repairs, mowers and he has worked on some city vehicles from time to time but it has been a full time business . We bring out in our papers here, which I hope everybody has had a chance to look at , that he works or has worked approximately on to or twenty cars on a busy day with- a good share of that being done i inside the building. And all his storage, aside from a few items which are neatly stored outside are inside the structure. Mr. , Greenwood applied in 1947 for a I think he was denied a permit to conduct a commercial garage - business on the premises. And !he applied at that time to this Board for a variance and I 've attached the minutes of that meeting to our papers here. He was granted a year to year variance with the stipulation that the premises be properly maintained, the alley not obstructed, no nuisance or disturbance developed, This property is on the west I ( side of Linn Street. It fronts on Linn Street and it backs up on I an alley which is about ten feet wide and the alley gives access t w , the property as well as giving access to the back areas of all the ' adjoining properties on either side of the block of Linn Street. f I - 28 - I �lIn 1961 Mr. Greenwood had a permit issued from the city and con- ! structed - he demolished the wooden building which was there and jconstructed a steel and concrete fire proof building for the conduct �! of his business on the site and since that time he has been doing i' ; business in that building. Every car or vehicle that is worked on i is kept either in the garage or on property to which Mr. Greenwood Ihas title . The alley-way isn' t his property and the vehicles aren' t kept out there. He is going to retire from his business now, he i I terminating business and he has already bought another house and i , in the process of selling this property. We've had one purchase ofler 'which has fallen through because of the variance problem here - won' t take it with - on the year-to-year basis inasmuch as it ,peopleY Y its not a transferrable kind of a variance. The stipulation that w have now to purchase offer is that we come to the Board and request ( this variance. It makes a $3, 000 dollar difference in the purchase price as to whether or not Mr. Greenwood is granted the variance for not. He has put a good deal of money into the property over the last thirty-three years that he has operated the garage there - it _ I represents a good share of his savings - he has got a lot of equity in the property and that is what he is trying to recover now. He Ihas worked a lot of vehicles which belonged to residents , we have la petititon whi,ch. I can present to you - will present to you which Itis signed by, I believe, every one of the property owners within the 200 ' zone - within the 200' distance from his property lines - approving his application, indicating that they are with him on I �Ithis . We have people here tonight who will speak to the Board in favor of this application. I it just seems to me that strict application of the Zoning Ordinance is going to work a hardship on Mr. Greenwood and he is not going to be able to sell his property Ifor its highest and best use. He is going to have to take a loss , or not take a loss but he is going to have to accept less consider dation for the property. Issuance of a variance wouldn't change the character of the neighborhood any, in my estimation, since its been ,operating in the same fashion for over thirty (30) years . It ' s not la kind of a hardship which is general in the neighborhood, it is c I; I' 29 - ,, the only garage there and the new owner is intending to operate a I1business similar in nature, as I understand it to Mr. Greenwood' s , ii on the premises . We, of course, don' t speak for him - I don't kno what he intends to do with it. Our sole purpose here is to try to isecure that variance which has been year to year to secure that on a permanent basis, in Mr. Greenwood' s name. 1MR. GAINEY: You say, you have a purchase offer now? !MR. MORRISON: Yes, that 's right. IMR. GAINEY: What do the people that are buying intend to do with it 11if they are allowed to buy it? MR. MORRISON: I don' t know. They just say they are going to ( operate a business which. is similar to Mr. Greenwood' s - a repair I� (business, in that building. i �MR. ANGELL: But you have no guarantee that they will conduct a business in the same manner that Mr. Greenwood is? fMR. MORRISON: Absolutely not. �MR. GAINEY: Do you have a copy of the petition, Tom? (!SECRETARY HOARD: Yes I do. MR. MORRISON: I have the original of that if you would like to 'see it. DR. GREENBERG: Tom, what was the meaning of a year-to-year vara- , ance . Obviously we haven' t seen Mr. Greenberg year to year. IMR. MORRISON: There hasn' t been any contact with the city, period, lin thirty-three years on this year to year variance. No checking up on it or anything. �DR. GREENBERG: What was the meaning of it then? !SECRETARY HOARD: In 1947 the Board granted a year to year variance . JWhy they did that I don' t know. And what their - or how they inten ed Ito follow up on it or whatever, I really don' t know what was in their minds at that time. DR. GREENBERG: They made other stipulations . . . SECRETARY HOARD: Obviously it was not followed up on. R. GREENBERG: They made other stipulations provided the premises Abe properly maintained, the alley not obstructed would this be objectionable to you if these clauses were . . . . ? it p 30 - i l IMR. MORRISON: Not at all , that' s the way its been operated for h thirty-three years. You see we can only transfer whatever you - i you give us anything at all , that' s all we can transfer. We are just trying to do our best to keep it on the same basis as it was in the ii jpast. I �IDR. GREENBERG: I understand that you were objecting to a variance I that would have to be appealed from time to time . . . MR. MORRISON: Right, the buyers are requiring in the purchase offer, that if we get it at all , that we apply for it on a permanent basis. IDR. GREENBERG: So this would be a condition of the variance? MR. MORRISON: Right. I think what they were objecting to is the year to year nature of it even if it isn't enforced year to year, ,still the opportunity is there. CHAIRMAN AMAN: I guess that is my understanding, presumably if the neighbors complained at some point or it was determined that the mature of the repair business was changing, or branching out or something of that sort, the City reserve the right to reconsider the variance . . . but what you are asking now is to make it permanent for 'a prospective buyer whose business we don't really know what . . . MR. MORRISON: Can it be made permanent on a conditional basis? I 'A permanent variance on the condition - the same conditions that are I !set out on the year to year variance? A year to year variance isn' t �Igranted anymore is it? I mean it' s not . . . R. ANGELL: Yes. NIR. MORRISON: It is? I MR. ANGELL: We did it before , Tom, didn' t we? (SECRETARY HOARD: Not to my recollection. R. GAINEY: My hang up is , you are asking me to give a variance Ito someone that I don't know who it is and what they are going to do with it and it is in- a residential neighborhood. Because Mr. jGreenwood is - you know, has done this for over thirty years > what the has done, you know, he has lived there in that neighborhood - he !is proud of the neighborhood and everything - he wouldn' t do anythi g i I to bother th-e neighborhood but as far as the people that you have moving in there what guarantee is there that what they are going - 31 - I I� I! to run? If I was going to live there I sure as h--- wouldn' t have ( signed that petition. No way. Not knowing what is going in there jI 'm kind of leary - if these people want this house as bad as they ! do, I can see Mr. & Mrs . Greenwood' s feelings as far as they want i i, to get as much out of their house as possible but if these people i !'want it so badly they could come forward and tell us what they are �Iplanning on doing. We are going into a blind alley if we grant a variance that we can be stuck with the rest of our lives , in that ilneighborhood. ( SECRETARY HOARD: Maybe I should read for the record what the peti Ition says . It says "February 13 , 1980. Greenwood' s garage Petitin for a Variance. I am selling my property at 214 Linn Street , Itha a, I 'New York. I find the new owners want a permanent variance to conduct la business such as I have operated for thirty-three years . This ( petition is to be presented to the Zoning Board. " (then it has a ( list of names and addresses) IMR. GAINEY: I need more information. I 'd like to have an idea what' s going to happen- you know what kind of a business are the i ; going to run. IMR. MORRISON: Alright then, with your permission I ' ll withdraw this I (appeal and we ' ll come in with the new owners next month, if that ' s i necessary. Their attorney has indicated no interest in coming in i Iihere - if that' s going to be the requirement then, or if that ' s jsomething that ' s necessary we' ll have to do that. CHAIRMAN AMAN: I think it would be helpful to have some indication I las to what the new business that is proposed, whether or not they fare thinking of expanding it or just precisely what the arrangement i would be. We don' t prejudge that in any way but I think that I I information would be helpful. !DR. GREENBERG: I see one problem with this, in that I could see that I �somethlng should be told the new owner, if he wants a variance that' s attached to the premises , apparently Mr. Gainey should indi- jcate whether he is only willing to accept , as he sees it now, a I (variance attached to the owner. �IMR. ANGELL* You see, we could grant the variance with a number of �I i ii i 32 ii ;: conditions on it which might be totally unacceptable to the pur- i! ii 1chaser. i ! MR. GREENWOOD: Well what basically I am asking for is that it be 1' ! continued as it is right now - that' s what I 'm asking. MR. MORRISON: The contract says to it is contingent on the ii lability of the seller to obtain City of Ithaca approval for a permanent variance as to the use of the garage on the premises under I the same terms and conditions as existing, etc. , etc. , etc. - same ii terms and conditions . So presumably its - a variance is acceptable if it says , you know, maintain the alley-way unobstructed, etc. I IDR. GREENBERG: Is there anything in the previous . . . ? i. (!MR. ANGELL: Well they also - we would have to put a - they couldn' t it !change the nature of the business. MR. GREENWOOD: Unless they came to the Zoning Board. IDR. GREENBERG: Does it require occupancy by the owner? IMR. GREENWOOD: I understand this is the way it was written up. I !didn' t know this until I tried to sell the property. I never (i (iquestionedit - I had a lawyer at the time and they said go ahead an igo to work. And that ' s thirty-three years ago. It has never been questioned never been brought up before as a matter of fact , I didn' t know what the variance looked like, I didn' t know the minute lof what went on or anything. r,R. MORRISON: We just got these minutes last month. r' �MR. GREENWOOD: I 've not been notified from year to year. DR. GREENBERG: It mentions no owner occupancy as far as the i variance . . .. ImR. MORRISON: No it doesn' t. That may have been implicit - what i Ias said at the meeting I don' t know but it doesn' t . . . ,II R. GAINE'Y': The neighbors seem very receptive to having something !None but my feelings are if these people want the property and they I� ll show us by having a desire to come up here and explain just !,exactly that they are going to do exactly what you are so that if w Ido set some stipulations they are not going to come back and say , plater to you or to us that you mislead us into this or that in a flat the same time 1 don't want you to be stung with the hardship of ii l ii is i! i Ii 33 - i 11not being able to sell this place. If we set certain guidelines (ifor these people and then they say, well they've set these guide j; 11ines and I can' t live within these guidelines , I don' t want to bu ', it now. There is a little dark area there that maybe should be !I j, cleared up to make it a little bit easier on both parties - all i iithree parties . i CHAIRMAN AMAN: Why don't we take it under advisement and determin Ilamongst ourselves what further information we might need. I take � it that you are requesting - you would be willing to live with a i request for a variance which was exactly what you have right now? I, MR. MORRISON: Only without a year to year condition. Same condi- Itions of use but not the same time differential in it. CHAIRMAN AMAN: When you say same conditions of use . . , �iMR. MORRISON: Same conditions of use - the alley-,way, premises I properly maintained, the alley not obstructed, no nuisance or dis- 'Iturbance developed which is what the minutes of this 1947 meeting. i� ! Thoseconditions which they attached to it then. Because that is iwhat it calls for in the purchase contract , you know the same terms and conditi..ons - so I should think that 's adequate. iDR. GREENBERG: I'm almost sure that the Board will attach. occupan y i �!of the premises by those who manage the garage. I' think - I 'm i ,almost sure that this Board will only concede on those terms . SMR. MORRISON: Do you know what their intentions are? ,Are they going i to live there? MR. GREENWOOD: Well , I'm not sure. i 1MR. MORRISON; Well, okay. We better reappear then - with. them. I , ijust can't say, I don' t know. MR, GREENWOOD: I would doubt that CHAIRMAN AMAN; That's the problem you see, we are being asked to rant a variance and it is g going to be for an entirely different party than its applying for it right now. We are worried about what 'the use of that property i;,s going to be in the future . Naturally you want to sell it and so I thank. that would MR. MORRISON: Do we need to go through more notice requirements , !etc. or can we simply be rescheduled for the next meeting and s i! i Il �I i� - 34 - Ij Ireappear with them? i SECRETARY HOARD: Would you be putting forth the same appeal? � I �'IMR. MORRISON: Yes , exactly the same thing except we would bring �jin the other attorney and the clients. I' �ISECRETARY HOARD: More information. MR. MORRISON: And she can talk with you about what' s - what they intend to do. Or can it just be adjorned - can she submit it on papers herself or would you prefer to examine the new owners? I wonder what the procedure is I just don' t know what to do. CHAIRMAN AMAN: Speaking for myself, I think it would be preferabl �jif you supplement this petition with further information as to the proposed uses of this property after it is sold. And you could do that however you like - if you wanted them to supplement it . . . MR. MORRISON: Okay, without appearing again in person necessarily ECHAIRMAN AMAN: I think that would be prudent - I think you should I reappear. I think we should call the appeal again and give us an opportunity to ask questions about the appeal . MR. MORRISON: Okay, fine, whichever way as long as we are clear on what we are doing, So should it be noticed again - we have to publish- it again? ( SECRETARY HOARD: I think what should happen here is that because of the chance that we might have different members present for instance, that it should be presented in whole to the Board next month. iMR. MORRISON: Okay, SECRETARY HOARD: Go through the notice procedure and present a whole case to whoever is here next month otherwise if you have a different combination of people you might not have four people - you might not have four favorable votes . . . MR. MORRISON: Okay, we don't have to go back to the Planning !Board though? f SECRETARY HOARD: If it is the same appeal I would say , . . MR. MORRISON: Itis the same thing just more information. i i'SECRETARY HOARD: If the nature of the appeal changes then it would 11 11have to have a whole new appeal . . . f ii 35 - I l MR. MORRISON: No. Okay, fine, thank you. I !; CHAIRMAN AMAN: Thank you. Is someone here for representing ;' Nates Floral Estates? (no one appeared) . That concludes our I ; public portion of our meeting. We will reconvene after the �lexecutive session and give the results to those who wish to stay. I 1 I I I� if li I i iI I i I I i i i i I i' 36 - I I , BARBARA RUANE, DO CERTIFY that I took the minutes of the Board '! of Zoning Appeals , City of Ithaca, in the matters of Appeals I, !,numbered 2-1-80, 2-6-80, 4-1-80, 4-2-80 , 1296 and 1297 on April i' 7 , 1980 at City Hall , City of Ithaca, New York; that I have trans r icribed same, and the foregoing is a true copy of the transcript of I !the minutes of the meeting and the Executive Session of the Board of Zoning Appeals , City of Ithaca and the whole thereof to the best of my ability. i A I I Barbara C. Ruc(ne j Recording Secretary I i I� I Sworn to before me this k I day of , 19.80 Notary Public JEAN J. HANKINSON NOTARY PUBLIC. STATE OF NEW YORK No. 5 i-1660300 QUALIFIED IN TOM.PKINS COUNT MY COMMISSION EXPIRES MARCH 30,19 I f I i i i i I!