HomeMy WebLinkAboutCAC Minutes - 06_23_18Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 1 of 9
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council
Minutes of monthly meeting on Monday, June 23, 2018
Danby Town Hall, 1830 Danby Road, Danby, New York.
Council Members present: Matt Ulinski (chair), Joel Gagnon, Don
Schaufler , Ruth Sherman, Mary Woodsen
Council Members absent: Bill Evans, Clare Fewtrell
Others present: Elizabeth Keokosky (secretary), C.J. Randall (Danby
Town Planner), Ronda Roaring (Danby resident), Bruce Richards
(Danby resident with related interests – consultant to the logging
industry), Anne Klingensmith (EMC)
Meeting opened at 7:05 pm
Agenda Review (Additions or Deletions) - none added (Klingensmith
took PoF rather than make a report)
Public Comments/Privilege of the Floor (later referred to as PoF)
PoF Klingensmith: Summery of Environmental Management Council
(EMC)
• Explained she joined the Waste Reduction subcommittee of the
Environment Management Council (EMC). She announced Friday
Cayuga Power Plant applied converting to gas with the intention
of using 25-60 trucks of gas a day. They also have an ash dump
that is depositing massive amounts of mercury in Cayuga Lake.
For more information email Irene Weiser
(irene32340@gmail.com )
• Several Lake organizations are investigating amendments to the
regulations that implement the State Environmental Quality
Review Act (SEQR) for salt mines
• NYDOT wants to replace historic Freese Road Bridge (Dryden –
awarded money but the bridge is owned and maintained by
Tompkins County), currently a single lane bridge, with a double
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 2 of 9
lane one. Others want option to rehabilitate it. UNAs on either
side.
• Unique Natural Areas (UNA): Karen Edelstein and Bob Wesley of
EMC reviewing sites, documenting how to define and how to use
them for environmental stewardship in our own or other towns.
• Ulinski comment: Deputron Hollow property has a UNA so to be
able to use it would be very useful – but current plan has no teeth.
Klingensmith: Most important to EMC - How are they cleaning up
after themselves.
• Bill Evans got municipal street lighting recommendations through
Tompkins County legislature that were good for humans and
animals. Timely, sinceust as Ithaca is replacing streetlights.
Reading and Discussion of Minutes
• Reflected some email corrections and comments during month
• suggestion that it be sent in a Word document for review
Approve Minutes MOTION
• Moved that CAC approves the minutes of May 22, 2018, as
amended.
• Moved by Gagnon, Seconded by Sherman. The motion passed.
• In Favor: Matt Ulinski (chair), Joel Gagnon, Don Schaufler , Ruth
Sherman, Mary Woodsen
Reports and Updates
• Town Management Plans: still waiting on information and work
from committee members.
• September presentations on “Alternative Income from Land”:
Woodsen suggested she recruit a neighbor who does
permaculture. Schaufler going to tap into Cornell Cooperative
Extension (CCE). Ulinski suggested survey format to lead into
more detailed presentations later. Ulinski getting dates. Try to
get into Danby news.
• Agreed on second Wednesday in the month to be the permanent
day-of-the-month meeting date. Change made to better facilitate
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 3 of 9
working with Planning Board (helps C.J.). September starting
month. Tentative until OK from Evans and Fewtrell.
• Schaufler had nothing to report on possible conservation
easement with Autosalvage of Ithaca on Hornbrook Rd. -- about
100 acres of their non-road front property. Gagnon noted that the
property already has a long list of things you cannot do there
since it is a recharge area for the aquifer, and such areas are
restricted in their use by the Aquifer Protection Law. Aquifer
study generated a USGS report in Nov 2015. CJ will forward it.
Action Items
Status of Meeting on Local Law to Amend the Zoning Ordinance Related
to Timber Harvest in Town of Danby, New York:
§ Ulinski summarized report by subcommittee {members: Scott
Davis (Planning Board), Matt Ulinski (Town Board and CAC), Don
Schaufler (CAC), and George Adams (Marsh Rd. resident)}. Main
Point - How does Danby protect itself from people who don’t use
best management practices. Discussion went from a focus of not
over-reacting and minimizing regulation to some realization that
regulation may be needed in order for Danby to protect itself. If
used, regulation would be for commercial applications, with some
triggering threshold.
o Ulinski reported that Subcommittee met a couple of weeks ago
and got through 4 pages of draft language.
In email exchange tone was for not over-reacting; focus on a
reporting approach and minimizing regulation
o Discussion followed on the special case of potential erosion on a
steep slope in aftermath of poor logging practices.
Gagnon: Should regulation only apply to steep slopes?
Sherman: Depends where slope is – sediment can
accumulate on plain. Impacts on adjoining properties
should be considered.
Gagnon: concern - Degradation of the land – how to prevent
erosion.
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 4 of 9
Gagnon said not hard to measure slope – just use a level and
drop a plumb line down. Put down some ground cover –
branches, hay, etc. to stop erosion.
Schaufler: There is the potential for blow back from people
getting upset over being told what to do with their property
Schaufler suggested that a threshold harvest in excess of a
certain amount require use of certified loggers (NYTLC),
which already exists in NY state, and use DEC NYS Best
Management Practices for Water Quality guidelines for all
cases. Require certification and best management practices.
Commercial threshold to be determined by CAC.
Ulinski: Review by CAC to resolve when certification needed
Randall: noted that CAC currently can’t make any binding
requirements because it is an advisory board. Gagnon
asserted that the town board could give the CAC that ability
by modifying the enabling resolution since the ability to do
that is in the state legislation governing CACs. Leave
notification requirements in Draft. Working on framework.
o Prompted by PoF: Richard’s questions, discussion continued on
why contractors were stopped in the past and not now and how
law changed. Schaufler talked about other NY State strategies.
PoF Richards: why didn’t Highway Department just shut
down contractor on Deputron Hollow Road?
PoF: Richards –they shut down Beech Hill in the past
Randall: Road use law was updated and exempted logging.
Schaufler: In the case of Deputron Hollow there is an
informal (unseen by CAC) agreement between town and
operator negotiated by the highway department.
Schaufler said that he had 1) had meeting with Matt Swayze
and John Clancy SAF (Society of American Foresters) DEC
foresters and other SAF Certified Foresters to go through
Draft Ordinance. They were willing to put a letter together
for CAC and town board clarifying definitions and
suggesting solutions to problems. 2) He had talked with NY
State DEC Foresters about logging on Fisher Settlement
Road and they are managing for “early successional”
habitats (which are highly dynamic, highly productive serial
stages with herbaceous ground cover) or “high canopy”
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 5 of 9
which assumes a canopy of tall older trees and many other
approaches to long term forest health. These cutting
methods are part of “NYS STRATEGIC PLAN FOR STATE
FOREST MANAGEMENT”
PoF: Roaring: Town signed a 10 year management plan for
State Forest, which didn’t incorporate Danby’s suggestions.
Schaufler: DEC got input from other stakeholders, not just
Danby, to determine their overall plan.
Ulinski – Perfect storm in Deputron Hollow – wrong time of
year, poor contractor, steep slope.
PoF Roaring: Owner of land is Southern Tier Hardwood so
contractor cut for and sold to owner – (first priority was
profit, not land protection)
Suggestions were made about possible solutions – again one of
the perceived problems is conflicting interests of private property
and town’s requirements of best management practices. Richards
brought in contractors point of view. Suggestions were:
Remove exemption of logging in road laws
Require permit and Best Management Practices
Require performance bond or fines
10-15% of timber sales have forester involved, most are
managed by a less knowledgeable person.
PoF Richards: Most logging companies have own crews -
60% of logs are hauled by their own people, 40% by
miscellaneous contractors.
Schaufler: It comes down to the land owner. He is
responsible for what happens to his land.
PoF Richards described what his company was doing. He
said asking for a plan of action is not unreasonable. He
suggested copying Vestal’s Plan, which he had worked
under.
Randall, commenting while checking out Vestal’s Plan on
the internet, said that Vestal was an EPA MS4 (Municipal
Separate Storm Sewer System) compliant Community and
required storm water management programs (SWMPs)
review. See
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 6 of 9
https://library.municode.com/ny/town_of__vestal/codes/c
ode_of_ordinancesnodeId=CD_ORD_CH6ENCO_ARTVCOTRH
A
“Commercial Tree Harvesting” Article V under Chapter 6 -
Environmental Conservation
PoF Richards: says Vestal plan shields contractor from
angry people.
Schaufler: Notification plan could include how logging will
comply with best management practices.
Sherman: Then there could be a notification requirement.
Ulinski: voiced concern with keeping costs down.
Schaufler noted that costs are taken out of what landowner
receives.
PoF Roaring: makes point other people besides those whose
land is harvested are affected; trucks going by her, water
use, etc.
PoF Richards said that there is a code enforcement person
in Vestal but people who cause problems don’t happen if
they know they are dealing with someone who knows what
is going on.
Gagnon: said that we need a stick – a fine or bond - to
enforce compliance with an agreed-upon plan, and
monitoring, but Ulinski, referring to our citizen reporters,
said that we have monitoring for free
(Mary Woodsen left at 8:25 for health reasons)
Ulinski: need to have rules in order to catch the person who
violates them. But how expensive is it to check them? What
are the mechanisms to fine somebody?
Randall:
1. use Storm Water law to facilitate writing our
local law – rewrite like Vestal’s – no exemption -
allows town to shut down operation
2. The Storm Water Pollution Protection Plan
(SWPPP) would go to Tompkins County Soil and
Water who would help review it.
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 7 of 9
Ulinski: Does this affect state forest logging?
Randall: SWPPP would apply to state forest, but the zoning
ordinance would not.
Question: How do you protect yourself from people who
don’t do what they say they will. If you had an open fine on
contractor then he couldn’t work here - could have
performance clause
Randall: SWPPP is basically a business plan. Vestal plan
needs an engineer. Notice of service can require a SWPPP.
Gagnon: At a minimum in order to get something in place
quickly Town Board should change law to protect roads by
deleting the exemption for logging (that was previously
added to accommodate Ag District laws). Others agreed.
No firm decision made on including Vestal’s requirements.
Buckeye Pipeline – Katherine Hunter had sent an email on herbicide
application concerns -- she had received notice from a gas line that goes
across King Rd. She has an agreement with them that they will not
spray on her property. But she thought others should know about it.
General discussion followed on situation: Questions and
Comments were:
§ Could cause financial impact on company – cutting more
expensive than spraying
§ Why is spraying needed - to provide access, keep out roots?
§ Existing Rules and Regulations must be posted somewhere
§ Generally use glyphosate and something else stronger
§ Alternatives to herbicide – brush hog, selective cutting,
NYSEG working with short, bushy plants –
§ Glyphosate not as benign as people first thought - Runs into
surface water, affects microbiome
§ Railroad right of way uses herbicides too – limited to ballast
area in the biodiversity preserve
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 8 of 9
§ Communicating with Buckeye useful even if they don’t
change; Know town is paying attention
§ NYSEG is doing more selective cutting to develop an
understory – cover of bushy short plants– sumac,
honeysuckle etc., keeps trees from growing. Buckeye wants
to keep access, maintain a certain width. Just better
oversight improves performance.
Approve MOTION
Moved that CAC Requests Town Board investigate contacting Buckeye
regarding information on nonchemical alternatives to Herbicide
Application.
• Moved by Ulinski , Seconded by Gagnon. The motion passed.
• In Favor: Matt Ulinski (chair), Joel Gagnon, Don Schaufler , Ruth
Sherman
Gagnon had nothing to report on topic of Land by Gift and Living Estate.
Next Meeting is on July 23, 2018 at 7p.m.
Adjournment
The meeting was adjourned at 8:53 pm
_____________________________________________
Submitted by Elizabeth Keokosky (Secretary)
After note submitted by Schaufler:
Empire State Forest Product Association (ESFPA)
Comments/Concerns
The Governor’s proposal under EFFI to strengthen the RTPF in New
York would amend the law requiring any municipality proposing an
ordinance, regulation or permit requirement which may restrict the
practice of forestry, including but not limited to, timber harvesting,
Town of Danby Conservation Advisory Council Minutes Page 9 of 9
other forest management practices, and temporary storage or
transport of logs or other wood products from harvest sites, shall
submit such proposals to the Department for review, comment and
input, to ensure they do not adversely impact the landowners right to
practice forestry.
At a minimum the municipality must submit the full text of the
proposed local law or ordinance to the Commissioner. The
Commissioner shall have 45 days to review such proposal and to
provide comments. Should the Department recommend modifications
or disapproval the referring municipal body may not act contrary to
such recommendation except by a vote of a majority plus one.
The proposal would also pre-empt any local government from
adopting a local law or ordinance which explicitly requires a
landowner notification of a timber harvest. ESFPA supports the
proposal as a means of strengthening the RTPF law in New York yet
we acknowledge it is still substantially less than the protection
afforded agriculture under the Right-to-Farm law.
For More Information Contact: John K. Bartow, Jr. Executive Director
Empire State Forest Products Association 47 Van Alstyne Drive
Rensselaer, NY 12144 Tel (518)463-1297 Cell (518) 573-1441
jbartow@esfpa.org (Approved for use in the 2017-18 Legislative
Session 1/23/18)