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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2013-12-02-PH1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 VERBATIM REPORTING &VIDEO (800)368 -3302 1 PUBLIC HEARING TOWN OF ULYSSES REGARDING PROPOSED ZONING REVISIONS HELD ON:December 2nd,2013 at 7:00 PM HELD AT:ULYSSES HISTORICAL SOCIETY 39 SOUTH STREET TRUMANSBURG,NEW YORK 14886 APPEARANCES: ELIZABETH THOMAS,Supervisor MARSHA GEORGIA,Town Clerk KEVIN ROMER,Board Member DAVID KERNESS,Board Member LUCIA TYLER,Board Member NANCY ZAHLER,Board Member DARBY KILEY,Planner HEARING REPORTER:SHAUNA M.POTTER Court Reporter 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 2 MS.THOMAS:It's seven o'clock,and we are going to start this meeting,but we're starting it first by saying there's a Toyota Tundra with its lights on with license plate GD323,something,58 maybe. If you have a Toyota Tundra you might have your lights on. PUBLIC:GDJ. MS.THOMAS:GDJ.Okay.Sorry. Some technical difficulties here.I would like to start this meeting with a motion to open the public hearing.Do I have a motion? MS.TYLER:So moved. MS.THOMAS:Second? MS.ZAHLER:Second. MS.THOMAS:All in favor? BOARD MEMBERS:Aye. MS.THOMAS:Opposed,abstained? Okay.Welcome.My name is Elizabeth Thomas.I'm the supervisor for the Town of Ulysses.I'm conducting tonight's public hearing on behalf of the Town Board of the Town of Ulysses.Before I begin,I'd like 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 3 to introduce the other town board members. Dave Kernas,Nancy Zahler,Lucia Tyler, Kevin Romer,our Planner,Darby Kiley,and our Town Clerk,Marsha George. So just some housekeeping.There are restrooms in the back,and if we do start going,I may have to recess the hearing if it starts going too long.So we'll just take a recess for a little while for people to have a break if we need one. So the subject of this public hearing is the proposed local law to amend the Town of Ulysses zoning law.New districts have been added along Cayuga Lake,parallel to Route 89.These areas have been described as the lakeshore and conservation districts and have been discussed by the town board and several committees over the past four years.Other major changes besides the lakeshore and conservation districts are a marina district where the yacht club is now which is now zoned residential.We have an addition of the revised nonconformance language that's also known as 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 4 grandfathering.We have revised article three which is the administrative part of the zoning.We added some new definitions and corrected some inconsistencies throughout the document. All of those pieces have been reviewed individually and discussed as individual parts.This proposed zoning law takes all those parts we have reviewed over the years and rolls them into one document, the Town of Ulysses Zoning Law.What is not being presented tonight are any regulations governing docks,boat hoists, moorings or riparian rights.All of the water sections of the previous lakeshore zoning drafts have been removed.If the town board chooses to take up these in water regulations,it may do so in a future change,but these areas are not the topic of tonight's public hearing. For those of you in the back,there's still quite a few seats up front,and you're not disturbing anyone,and you'll be a lot more comfortable if you come sit 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 5 down.So feel free to come and go as you need to. Copies of the proposed zoning regulations for the proposed new lakeshore, conservation and marina districts and other sections of the zoning law proposed revisions are available by the door.Those are excerpts though and the full text of the entire proposed zoning law consists of 189 pages.It's available on the town website for download or the town clerk can provide a printed copy for a fee. The date of this public hearing was set by resolution of the town board on November 18th,2013 and a notice of the hearing was posted in the Ithaca Journal on November 21st,2013 and posted on the Town Clerk's notice board on November 18th, 2013.Notice of the public hearing was mailed on November 19th,2013 by the Ulysses Town Clerk to the clerks of the Village of Trumansburg,the Town of Covert, the Town of Hector,the Town of Ithaca,the Town of Lansing,the Town of Enfield,the 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 6 clerks of Tompkins,Schuyler and Seneca Counties and the Regional New York State Park Commission. This has been a long process.With the town board initiating work on conservation zone in 2008 and lakeshore zone in 2009.The planning board presented a draft of the conservation zone in September 2010 and a committee was formed by the town board --let's see.A committee was formed by the town board to present their version of lakeshore zoning in September 2011. After the public information meeting of October 24th,2012,the town board formed an ad hoc committee to review the comments that were submitted and create a revised version of the lakeshore zone. This happened from January to June this year,2013 with the ad hoc committee formally presenting its recommendations to the town board on June 25th,2013.The town board then reviewed both the lakeshore,conservation,and marina 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 7 districts beginning July 9th,2013 and finishing on October 8th,2013. So the public has had an opportunity to comment on these documents throughout the process,and has had opportunity to comment specifically on the lakeshore and conservation zones since the last draft was available on October 9th,2013.The board completed their review of the marina district on September 24,2013,and on the nonconformance language on September 10th, 2013.That's it for all the dates.Oh, except for one more.The public information meeting on this topic was held on November 18th,2013 and provided a more detailed description of the changes to the zoning law revisions. Tonight's meeting is a public hearing which is a time for the town board to listen to comments from the public on the proposed local law.This is not a time to answer questions or debate the matter,but if you do have questions,please contact Darby Kiley,myself,or other town board 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 8 members after the public hearing. Darby Kiley,the Planner for the Town of Ulysses will now briefly summarize the proposed zoning law amendment once I give her her voice. MS.KILEY:I'll try to do this so you guys can hear me.I'm going to --the course of the presentation is very similar to the public information meeting that was held a couple weeks ago.I am going to go through the process and timeline,a little overview of the zoning in general,overview of the changes,some background on the 2009 comprehensive plan,information on the unique natural areas,overlay area,and then go through the contents of the lakeshore,conservation,and marina districts and the nonconformance. Liz just mentioned kind of the details of the zoning process and timeline, and this graph also includes the comprehensive plan which began in 2006. And they worked on,the comprehensive plan worked on by committees through 2009 was 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 9 adopted in 2009,and then here are some dates for the conservation district and the lakeshore district. Just some general information about zoning,and our zoning law is similar to many other municipalities across the state or includes a number of general provisions, anything from definitions and just general standards that are applied throughout the entire municipality and they also include zoning districts and this is our --the proposed zoning map that divides the town into a number of districts.While I hear someone else's cell phone,if people can silence their cell phones to not distract anyone else in the audience.So the zoning districts,within each district there are a list of uses and examples of those,a single family home,restaurant,or church, and then the district also includes lot dimensions,which is lot area,lot coverage and setbacks. And the zoning applies to new projects and new construction.It's not 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 10 meant to apply to ordinary maintenance of existing homes,and the way ours is written,if you have a nonconforming lot or a nonconforming structure,you don't need to bring it into compliance with the zoning in order to meet the zoning requirements. So I'll just briefly go through the administration definition section and then go through the lakeshore district separately.In the administration section, we have information about the board and zoning appeals and the planning board and what was added into those sections were an option for having alternate members of the BZA and the planning board.We currently don't have a provision for that.That was a recommendation that came up years ago to add that to the zoning law. (PHONE RINGS). PUBLIC:It's me. MS.KILEY:Just a little distracting.Then the special permit procedure was changed a little bit.So it is to be reviewed by the planning board, 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 11 and we also added review criteria to that section which had not been included before and site plan review process is just much more streamlined than it had been in the past,and there was a change in state law a few years ago that addressed reservation of park land or money for under residential development so that was included in our zoning law to be consistent with the state regulation.This article three administration was reviewed by the planning board and they presented recommendation to the town board a number of months ago. Under the definition section,the few changes that were included there is a minimum dwelling unit size was removed.We improved the flag law description.The planning board worked on that.Throughout the document the reference to code enforcement officer was changed to zoning officer and then we added a number of new definitions,clear cut,tree,unique natural area,slope overlay area,and the bike,ski rental business. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 12 Under the nonconformance which I will address towards the end of the presentation,the reason why that was, there was some changes made there,because that hasn't been changed in the zoning documents since 1960.There's been some confusion between nonconforming uses and nonconforming building and also the town board is expanding some of the allowances so that you can have a voluntary demolition and rebuild that in the same square footage and footprint and height and then they also extended the timeline for rebuilding. This is the cover of the comprehensive plan that was adopted in September 2009,and a number of the objectives that were part of the comprehensive plan under objective number one which was to preserve and protect the town's natural and environmental resources. It has letters A,E,and H which all are addressed by the zoning changes presented in this --for this proposal,to investigate and implement different 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 13 mechanisms to protect and preserve environmentally sensitive areas,such as steep slopes,wetlands,unique natural areas and so on,and then to enact zoning regulations to protect the Cayuga Lake waterfront,and the third one listed here is for official recognition and preservation of the unique natural areas. So the town board did pass a resolution in 2010 concurring with the designation of the unique natural area as was presented by the Tompkins County Environmental Management council.The comprehensive plan includes a future of the land use plan which is part of the map as shown here which on the Cayuga lakeshore shows the lakeshore area and conservation area.So the idea behind the future of land use plan is to identify how the town would look ideally in the future as development occurs.Specifically within the lakeshore future land use area, it describes that area as a natural --as natural and environmental resources that should be considered as part of development 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 14 process.That special consideration should be given to steep slopes,water quality, erosion,and viewed as that there is environmental sensitivity as needed for establishing strong building regulations. Any future development should be evaluated for any negative impacts on natural resources and the mechanism to achieve these goals include overlay zones,size, and density limitations,et cetera. The conservation area also is described in the comprehensive plan that that's the area of steeply sloping land that is to the west of 89 and it also warns a high level of scrutiny for any new developments,their environmental sensitive area that demands that establishing strong building regulations and also have a list of mechanisms for that protection. This is our existing zoning map.You can see in this area of the orange is all the R1,rural residence districts and that includes a few more spots throughout the town in R1 zone.This is a proposed zoning 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 15 map which keeps everything to the west of conservation zone as the same.I'm going to just zoom in a little bit.So it has the lakeshore zone in the purplish color and conservation zone in the aqua color and also the marina district and I just want to point out the Girl Scout camp has been in the park and recreation district,the Girl Scout camp and Cayuga Nature Center as well as the Taughannock Park.That's all been in the park recreation and it's going to remain in that.So there is no change to the zoning in those areas.And we'll also be discussing the unique natural areas and slope overlay areas that's shown in the hatching here.That's one of the maps of the handout.The intent of these is not to prevent any development,but it just is to require an extra level of review and using site plan review taking into account the sensitivity of those areas.So as far as the unique natural areas as I mentioned it's a designation by the Tompkins County Environmental Management Council,the 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 16 original,they began doing the work in 1973 and I think they had a couple different variations and the last update was finished in 2000 and in 2010.The Town of Ulysses passed a resolution concurring with the designation,and in this the lakeshore and conservation area,there are three different unique natural areas and the reasons they were selected are listed here, because the geologic important,part aesthetic,scenic value,and the plant community where scarce plants and old growth forest.This is the Willow Creek Glen and lake slopes area to the south of Craft Road and little to the east of Taughannock Boulevard around Willow Creek Point Road and the other two unique natural areas include the Maplewood Glen lake slopes and the Glenwood ravine and lake slopes which is south,towards the southern end of town. In the slope overlay area,we -- there are a couple different iterations on how to protect steep slopes but this is a 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 17 little more specific than just using one percentage.We are actually targeting six specific soil types,because of their steepness and erodible characteristics and they are just of particular concern and so those are the soil types that are listed in for the slope overlay area.And I chatted with a couple different people on the phone today and recently about how do you really look at your specific site.This was in a previous presentation.The best way to do it is to go through the NRCS's web soil survey.So if you just do a Google search on that,find this website and has a little green button you push,then you go into a mapping,interactive mapping site where you can click on your --zoom in and look at your property and then you can come up with a soils map.And so you can see that there are different soil types within a property. And this is an example of one that's in the conservation district,and it has a number of soils that are similar to those in the slope overlay area,but percentages are 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 18 lower than threshold for the slope overlay area.So they would not be subject to site plan review. Within the conservation and lakeshore districts they include purpose,the permitted uses either as of right uses or accessory site plan review or special permit,lot area and yard requirements and design standards.Just as a note,Liz mentioned this in her introduction,that the in lake structures,the docks,boat hoists,et cetera are not addressed in the proposed zoning law. The purpose for the lakeshore and conservation district are pretty similar. That they are pretty general protection and preservation statements about the Cayuga Lake unique natural areas and the slope overlay area. Permitted uses include very similar to what's in the R1 district now,and the site plan approval requirement is only if the proposed project is in a unique natural area or in a slope overlay area.So this 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 19 is,I am just going to run through these, just the uses that are allowed by site plan approval in the lakeshore district and then here in,this is in the accessory uses in the conservation district and site plan approval is only required in a UNA or slope overlay area.Uses allowed by special permit in the lakeshore and the conservation more the commercial and nonresidential type uses.In terms of the lot area and yard requirements on the right-hand side is the current R1 regulation and there is lakeshore, nonlakeshore and conservation listed.And the town,we've gone back and forth on the lot area requirement and right now for lakeshore property it's two acres and,you know,actually all similar requirements as the current R1 except for the tree setback which is actually there is some more flexibility in terms of the impermanent streams,except in streams that are in the unique natural areas or slope overlay area. And then the conservation district is much 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 20 geared towards much larger lot development. And the lakeshore and conservation district also include a number of design standards,and they're listed as either requirements or recommendations.So I'm not going to go through all these.We've talked about them quite a bit in the past. So there is streams and wetlands design standards.In terms of the vegetation and landscape,the requirements for tree removal is that no approval is needed if a tree is a threat to life or property.So if it's too close to your house or concerned about it falling down, no permission is needed for removing that. If there is a building permit,any of the trees in the footprint for that construction area can be removed.In both the conservation and lakeshore zone,clear cutting is prohibited by this definition, and then only in the unique natural areas and slope overlay areas is a woodland management plan required for firewood and lumber and forest management in other area 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 21 so outside of the UNA and slope overlay areas,the forest management plan is only a recommendation for tree removal.So trees can be removed for any reason outside of the UNAs and slope overlay area without a woodland management plan or without permission from the town.Then we have a number of recommendations,and these were developed by the various committees working on this and wanted to keep them in the zoning regulations as just some guidelines for future development. It also includes design standards for soil and sediment control mostly targeted in the unique natural areas and slope overlay areas.Design standards for driveway and parking.The only requirement is to avoid backing vehicles onto 89 and that's again for new development.That does not impact the existing parking that might be already in existence along 89. The subdivision requirement for the lakeshore and the conservation is that simple and minor subdivisions are allowed 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 22 as well as cluster subdivisions,but major subdivisions which is four or more lots are prohibited.Lakeshore adds on several requirements of what's needed to be shown on a subdivision plot. In the marina district as we were developing the lakeshore district at some point,we realized that to continue having the yacht club in the residential district wasn't very applicable.So the idea was to preserve what is in existence on the lake, and to not have the yacht club be of a nonconforming use.So we have a number of these are the permitted uses within that district,and then their accessory uses to would be accessory to an allowed use and a number of uses kind of more business office,and retail,and restaurant site plan review and several uses allowed by special permit,and then those that we also apply the lot area and yard requirements to that zone which is in comparison with the current R1 district. I'll just talk about a number of uses 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 23 that need to go through site plan review. This is a four phase current site plan review process,and as we've been looking at reviewing the Article 3 section of the zoning law,we decided that this is an area that really needs some improvement to streamline the process.So it's going from this four phase approach to a much simpler one or two submission approach which should be easier on the applicant regardless of what the project is.The nonconformance section includes several different sections.I've talked about this at I forget how many meetings now I'm going to go into a lot of different details other than quickly review,what is a nonconforming use:A nonconforming use has either been in existence since before we had zoning and it's no longer allowed in that zone or it's an existing use that's in an existing R1 zone or another district and then that use is no longer allowed in the district so it becomes nonconforming.If an existing use is single family or two 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 24 family and the zoning district changes to lakeshore and conservation,they both allow for residential uses so that residential use continues as a conforming use.So it's not nonconforming,and so any issues with nonconforming uses are not applicable to that because it's a conforming use.There is no time limits on occupying structures or not occupying.I think that was a concern that came up a number of months ago.And so what's a nonconforming structure:It's an existing structure that does not meet the lot dimension requirements,and I will show an example of this in the next slide,and/or existing structure can become nonconforming if the zoning changes and the lot doesn't meet the new district requirements.In this example there is a house that's built really close to a southern property line and right now, the requirement in the R1 district is a 15 foot side yard setback,and that's what is continuing into the future for the lakeshore zone.Say this house is 10 feet 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 away from the property line instead of 15 feet,you can add on to any side of the house except for this southern property line.So you can't get any closer to the neighboring property line.You can't increase the amount of conformity in that area,but you can add on in different areas within the property.And a lot of the lots at least on the lakeshore are smaller than what's required with the two acre zoning and actually the 1960 zoning had a 2,000 square foot area requirement,and this just shows that there is even within a much smaller lot than what's required right now, you have a buildable area meeting all the setbacks,50 feet from the road and the lake and 15 feet from the side yard,and with a five percent lot coverage,you have about a thousand square feet of lot coverage.So if you have an existing house that has a 700 square foot footprint,you have 300 square feet for either an addition or a new building and then you can even build up,and we have a 32 foot high height 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 26 requirement.That's just some of the options that there are with even some of the smaller lots. Then I'm going to turn it back over to Liz.I've again been getting a lot of e-mails today,and so those will be incorporated as part of the written comments section and all of the verbal comments tonight will be taken into account and I'll let Liz talk about that some more. MS.THOMAS:So hang on one second. All right.So back to you.The purpose of the public hearing is to afford the general public an opportunity to make statements and comments about the proposed amendments to the Town of Ulysses zoning law,and allow for a smooth and fair process and ensure that everyone who wants to speak can be heard,this won't be a question and answer session.At previous town board meetings,there were presentations about the proposed amendments to the zoning law by the planner. The hearing will remain open until 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 27 all members of the public who are present at the hearing have --who want to speak are given an opportunity to make statements or comments on the proposed amendments. There is a stenographic transcript of this hearing being made.Comments presented at this hearing will be taken into consideration by the town board when it considers action on the proposed local law. The town board may take action on a proposal of the law later this month at a meeting set on December 10th and December 17th,but the agenda for those meetings have not yet been set.The agenda will be on the website. Written comments submitted prior to this public hearing will be considered by the town board.The town board will also accept and consider additional written comments received until the end of tonight's public hearing.I request that speakers sign in on the sheet by the door. Those wishing to speak are asked to speak at this microphone here.In order to give 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 28 everyone an opportunity to speak,each speaker will be allotted three minutes to make their comments.Speakers will be given a signal when one minute of their time remains.You may but are not required to state your name and address.If you are appearing as a representative of an organization or government entity,please again identify the organization or entity and its address.Please speak clearly into the microphone. So next I will address some administrative matters by asking the stenographer to mark the documents I provided to her earlier as exhibits to the hearing transcript.And I provided her with a public hearing notice that appeared in the Ithaca Journal on November 21st, 2013.There is also an affidavit of publication in the Ithaca Journal and posting and also a copy of all the 189 pages of the local law. So now I would like to ask anyone who would like to speak to approach the 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 29 microphone.It might make sense just for people to approach,maybe have three at a time up there,something like that.I don't have a system,just,you know,you just have to come up.Also before we get started,those of you who are in the back there is still,you know,quite a few seats up here in the front if you'd like to come up and sit.So speakers and members of the audience should observe commonly accepted rules of courtesy and public decorum and respect the rights of others to different viewpoints.So with that,I mean,we could raise hands if you want,and I can call on you or,who would like to --well,who like to begin?Must be somebody here wants to make a comment. MR.ZESERSON:Just a housekeeping note.This is my sound system the mic goes up and down.We're not all the same sizes so the way you adjust it,is just,go up go down.Okay. I'm Ken Zeserson,and I speak as a lakeshore dweller and also as the Ulysses 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 30 Planning Board Chairman.We're in that second half,I wanted to submit in the record the resolution that the planning board passed November 19th.I know the town board has seen it,but I want to make sure it's in the resolution.I'm not going to bore us all by reading it,especially because Ms.Kiley did a great job of citing the parts to me that are the most important.The planning board follows the recommendations of the regulations of the comprehensive plan,is one of things we're supposed to do.And the comprehensive plan clearly,as you've already heard,says we're supposed to be considering the environmental sensitivity of the conservation area and establish zoning regulations and we're supposed to investigate,implement,manage,protect and preserve environmentally sensitive areas such as steep slopes,wetlands,unique natural areas,what have you.So that's what we did as a planning board.I also want to stress that the process of the 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 31 proposal was indeed transparent and open to all citizens.I know you've heard that already,but it really is true and a lot of people just don't seem to believe it. Those that feel that feel they were shut out,just didn't take advantage of it until recently,and to me that's very good news. I'd like to point out this has been a contentious process.We all know that,but one reason the draft nonconformance to the grandfathering clause as Darby just explained to you,as raised by the lakeshore association.They raised really good issues about that that we haven't considered since 1960s,not that I've been here that long.It's a document as result of their input.Let's also remember the most contentious issues,is the repairing dock issues,they're not even involved here tonight.As far as --there still has been a lot of contentious back and forth and we recently had an election,and I would like to call the board's attention to the results of that election,because I think 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 32 in effect it was done on lakeshore zoning. This is what was worked out to be,because two of the candidates were running for town board clearly said that they were running only because they wanted to dismantle this potential resolution --regulation.They lost sizably in town by a two to one margin and two,most salient,is they didn't even win the lakeshore.They didn't win the lakeshore,and presumably didn't win because of zoning.I would hope you take that into consideration.Finally I'd like to take a step back if we all could,we're getting a little nutty,but we all have to think hard about this,not just what's in front of our face,but the world outside, the people running for the town board in line,we're running on issues of property rights -- PUBLIC:Three minutes. MR.ZESERSON:I'd like to talk about the rights of property.The rights of property and -- PUBLIC:Three minutes. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 33 MR.ZESERSON:If you want to hear about the rights of property,talk to me after. MS.THOMAS:Do we have another speaker? MR.REYNOLDS:Hello,everyone.I'm Greg Reynolds.1084 Glenwood Heights Road. Our family has over 200 some acres in the proposed conservation area.I don't really recall getting an e-mail or call to discuss that area with anybody,but I have been here and I have participated,and I've tried to do it in an amicable way and not finger pointing or backstabbing or anything like that.We also own property next to the yacht club,and I'm not quite sure from the level of map how far it extends or if it's to the current yacht club property or not.Family's in the area over 90 years. We've worked very hard.My Uncle Dick, caring for the property and caring for the Black Diamond Trail which we support and you'll see the best maintained spots of the trail between Perry City Road and the Town 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 34 of Ithaca.There is a reason for that,my Uncle Dick.And you know,as a kid growing up here for the three months of the year I was allowed to be here and being a part of the agriculture and farming put that in my heart to come back here and do the same thing.And we really want to work with the community to keep that going for our fifth generation kids who are now doing it,one of them full time and I'm very proud of that.Not only is it a sustainable business,it's a growing business and we're able to have more interns and put more agriculture in the spirit of the younger generation and just hope after taking care of the property for 90 years I don't have to ever get in a situation to be told how to take care of it still.Thank you. MR.FALLON:My name is Tim Fallon,I live at 3 Maplewood Point,Ithaca.The town board may have been working on the zoning since September 2012,but for the whole time you've absolutely tried to block,ignore the Ulysses Lakeshore 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 35 Association also known to ULA.It has taken multiple town meetings to make simple requests for corrections to technical issues such as buoys,streams,and surveying.No wonder it seems to be such a long process.There's been a consistent lack of town deliberation on many items brought forward by the ULA and residents that should have been discussed by the town board.Last minute changes were made that even blindsided your fellow town board member.Questions of process,integrity have also been raised by a town board member.For all the time you've spent,the proposed zoning document is lacking definitions for some key,long debated key items and at least five articles or sections that are referenced throughout the document don't even exist.The town's using the 2009 comprehensive plan as justification for proposed zoning,but the comprehensive plan survey was more general as quoted by Supervisor Thomas in the November 30 Ithaca Journal article.This 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 36 is a core issue that the residents have been making for the last 30 months.Last February the ULA asked for a proper survey for that request and got no response,even in July when 55 percent of property owners petitioned for a proper survey.The Town still denied the request without one bit of public deliberation.The Ithaca Journal quotes the town is essentially not going to ask the residents whether the zoning changes are desirable.Is that because you already know that the answer does not agree with you?This zoning process is like continuing to force us into a new car and then holding a public hearing to see if we want blue or green,even though we don't even want a new car. For five years the Trumansburg Sewer Plant has been polluting the streams in the town of Ulysses and Cayuga Lake.When this was brought up at a town meeting,the initial response was to ignore the citizens'concern.It was a number of ULA members that finally got the town to pay 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 37 attention. The Black Diamond Trail has been the environmental poster child for Ulysses and an environmental disaster.The multilocation erosion on the Black Diamond Trail is enormous.At one location a 25 foot section of the trail has washed away leaving a 17 feet deep ravine.The erosion was caused by inadequate maintenance and/or design and additional DOT cleanup costs were around $100,000.I believe we all share concerns for the environment and Cayuga Lake.With most of Ulysses lakeshore already developed,property owners are well aware of dealing with steep slopes.The cost of erosion or other steep slope issues fall squarely on the property owner.There is a huge self interest by owners to mitigate environmental issues and they have done rather well with that without Ulysses micromanaging.I wish the town would focus on building community for things like a Friends of Black Diamond Trail for things like working with other 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 38 municipalities for the big picture common goals.They need to focus on real time business instead of trying to micromanage the lake district properties owners.The existing R1 zoning is sufficient. MS.LAMBERT:Hi,there.My name is Hilary Lambert.I'm the Executive Director of the Cayuga Lake Watershed Network. Thank you for this opportunity to comment. The Cayuga Lake Watershed Network was established in mid 1990s.It's a small nonprofit with about 500 members to work with agencies,municipalities,and organizations to support research,public education,and protection of the 860 square mile Cayuga Lake watershed.The network encourages and supports lake fronts and slope conservation practices that protect the lake's water quality.Effective conservation practices here must focus on Ulysses'steep slopes,streams,and gorges to minimize erosion and water impacts. The draft law supports good practices in several ways including prohibition of 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 39 the altering of streams,a recommendation to avoid plowing salt-laden snow to streams,consideration of variations in tributary-courses when siting docks, minimizing bank erosion by retaining vegetation and/or removing invasive plants; encouraging native plants,and not blocking streams with structures.Provisions about removal of trees and erosion control are good recommendations.Setbacks, recommendations for us on permeable surfaces for driveways and parking areas, and restrictions on excavation in vulnerable areas are also prudent measures. The draft law identifies slope overlay areas that are vulnerable to erosions because of soil and steepness combinations. Each soil type is associated with a range of slopes which we assume defines the natural range of vulnerable slope for each of those soil types.Thus vulnerable lands may be fairly well identified,although the possibility of slope variation within a tract of land should be clarified. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 40 These proposed water protective provisions will benefit all users.We congratulate the Town of Ulysses for the development of a protective zoning law that will ensure long term shoreline and water quality protection and support its passage. Thank you. MR.RICHARDS:Good evening.My name is Ben Richards,and I live at 1220 Perry City Road,and I also own an adjacent lot to that.My request is somewhat kind of personal is that under,within UNA 62 and how it was drawn my house,half of my house is in R1,and half of my house is now going to be in the conservation district.I am just simply asking that when you look at how these were drawn,use some common sense and not just follow what the UNA broke down,because my lots now --I sent a letter to Darby,and I'll follow up with all of you also looking,but just use some common sense.I have several impermanent creeks on my property,but for some reason they listed one and followed it all the way 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 41 up into my property when many of the other impermanent creeks in my property are not, wasn't done with that at all.That's my request.I'll send a follow up to Darby and the rest of you also.Thank you. MR.RIEDERER:Yes,I'm Heinz Riederer.I live at 1 Maplewood Point. I've been here on numerous occasions,and today I have a short statement.I have appeared before you on numerous occasions pointing to procedural issues relative to the above referenced zoning proposal. Tonight I'm wondering if the proper notification has been given to all those entitled to notice concerning this matter. Since I'm only able to speak for three minutes,I would like to incorporate all my previous formal objections to this proposed zoning law which are recorded in minutes of prior meetings of the board,into the record of this meeting,specifically but not limited to my comments of November 12th,November 18th,and November 26th. I've included copies of the minutes.Land 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 42 use regulations are often unnecessary and counterproductive.This regulation is particularly troubling relative to future land values and represents a taking of the land in many instances.Unintended consequences have not been fully considered.In summary,there is no inherent evil or demonstrated problem with current zoning.What's the rush?Frankly, what's the rush?The two new board members which are coming aboard on the 1st of January should have an opportunity to weigh in on this proposed zoning laws. I have a short statement from Mrs. Bioudi.She indicates I am against this proposed zoning law on the basis that it restricts property rights.Mrs.Bioudi lives at 4 Maplewood Point. I have a short statement from my wife,Anna Riederer.I'm against this proposed zoning law on the basis it represents a taking of the land without compensation.Thank you. MS.THOMAS:Do we have anyone else 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 43 who would like to speak? MS.ANGER:Hi,my name is Barbara Anger,and I have property at 1583 Taughannock Boulevard.I know there is a lot of acrimony around the zoning,that no one likes to feel restricted or controlled; however,I believe that even though it's not perfect,proposed lakeshore zoning is more protecting the lakeshore and the quality of the lake for our community than restricting.I live next to the Girl Scout Camp and the proposed zoning would preserve the land in the camp.Under the present zoning it could be developed into a residential community that could change, negatively change the land,environment,-- the land is environmentally sensitive areas and ecology of more than a mile of natural beauty and home to unique wildlife indigenous to this area.I feel it's important to maintain these natural resources and to preserve them.I truly appreciate those who are already maintaining the quality of the lakeshore 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 44 even without zoning,but I believe that forethought often prevents natural disaster. MR.CULLER:My name is Johnathon Culler.I own a small cottage on the lake in the Town of Ulysses.My entire property is nonconforming.Our lot is too small, the house is much too near the property line,et cetera,but I would urge you to go ahead and pass this,the proposed zoning regulations.I think second,Hilary Lambert's remarks about the importance of protecting the lakeshore environment especially in areas where they're quite closely packed together.Clear cutting on one piece of land across the road could quite radically disturb the small lots of many of us on the downstream on the lakeside of Route 89.The question about takings without compensation or without due procedures makes one wonder what sorts of plans these lake dwellers might have for their properties.For the most part lake properties have been in quite good shape 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 45 these days and people are,as several speakers have said,maintaining the environment quite well in the existing properties,but it really is a deep concern that passing this rather modest zoning law is the taking of property makes one fear all more for plans of some land owners to do something fairly radical and disruptive to the environment. MR.PENNINGROTH:Hi,my name is Steve Penningroth.I live at 2080 Cayuga View Road.I'm also the Director of Community Science Institute.We have a water quality monitoring program in the Town of Ulysses which is supported by the Ulysses Town Board and by seven other municipal governments in Tompkins County. And I don't have any prepared remarks.I have studied the plan carefully,but my sense is that it is not onerous,and it is in fact just prudent management,and it's --I think plans like this are intended for the minority of cases when there's a problem.I think in vast majority of cases 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 46 people do the right thing.I think people here who have owned lands for generation are doing the right thing,but that does not mean that someone who would come along or a company would come along at some point and not do the right thing.That's what these kind of plans are for.It's like insurance.You buy insurance for the accident case,not for the every day,the 99.99 percent of the time,when,you know, when there is no problem.I guess I'd also like to,you know,commend the West Shore Homeowner's Association whom has,they have become concerned about the possibility of contamination along the lakeshore for pathogenic bacteria.We've started working with them to collect samples and hopefully figure out whether the onsite septic systems along the lake are functioning or not and that's,you know,I think a good thing.And if there were more,if there were,how should I say this,less vegetation on the slopes,if there is more runoff,you're going to get more bacteria 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 47 in the lake and --I've talked for two minutes already.I'm sorry.Sorry.Okay just 30 more seconds,but you get more runoff.So just looking at it from that angle of,you know,wanting to protect the lake from pathogenic bacteria,run down streams,or you know,roll off the slopes, you know,there is runoff,I think that, you know,maintaining the vegetation and natural areas on the slope overlay is really important.Thank you. MR.WILSON:Don Wilson,lifetime lakeshore resident,Willow Creek Point. Like many of you,I made some zoning comments at the public meeting a year ago in October.Following that,I was appointed to the ad hoc committee,planning committee to review the lake front regulations,the proposed regulations.In the past year,I've learned more about zoning than I ever thought I wanted to. And you can ask me these questions about this later,but I'd like just to make some general comments now.The --when the ad 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 48 hoc committee was formed,the Ulysses Lakeshore Association put forth five names to be on the committee.You can argue whether that's a good idea to overwhelm the committee that way or not,but one person that was appointed,that was me,and I think that the bias here was my self described conservationist philosophy.The committee has met over the course of six months.At the last public meeting Darcy made very good notes on all of your comments and they were all addressed,and I think it's overstating an issue to say that the people sitting in front you have not been listening.I believe they have been listening.I've gotten to know Liz Thomas over the past year,and I know that she does listen to all of these comments.You may not agree on the results,but you're being listened to. Another point to make relates to the public relations nightmare of the past year.This is more of a plea than a comment.I would suggest we try to put 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 49 this behind us.Ulysses Lakeshore Association has acted as a gad ply (phonetic),it has been very helpful in pushing the process forward but the polarization involved also creates the other factors of anger,personal attacks, things that we are not,that we should be a little embarrassed about maybe.And I think we don't have to forget these things, but we can put them behind us to try to move forward,and what I would suggest is that we look at the document as it stands at this moment in black and white in front of us and not the past year.Occasionally CNN starts to report news. (TIME BUZZER SOUNDS). MR.WILSON:I'm going to ignore that.Reports news as it's happening and then turns out not to be news. MS.THOMAS:Don,I'm sorry.I have to cut you off here. MR.WILSON:The news reporting of the past year has --in the case of our present document proven to be not news. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 50 MS.THOMAS:Don,I can't let you go on.I'm sorry. MR.WILSON:Okay.As I said,I've learned quite a bit about this.You can ask me afterwards too. MS.McCANN:Cheryl McCann,and we own land at 40 Maplewood and our land is designated as part of the unique natural area,slope overlay,and lakeshore zones. The proposed zoning laws place undue hardship on us and other landowners.Our dream to build a home on our land will be too prohibited if this document is pressed on.For every step of the way including a simple driveway we'll have to go through a site plan review,employ a town board appointed engineer and licensed forester with no guarantee that we will be able to move forward.We can not afford all this. These proposed zoning laws are too restrictive and cross the line of unnecessary self interested exclusion.A member of the ad hoc committee described the situation of eminent domain.As a 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 51 zoning law has been greatly relaxed across our street on the lakeshore side,our side has been tightened to where its virtually impossible to build,all in the guise of conserving the lake.The zoning laws should separate land uses for the good of the community,not limit other people's property rights for the benefit of the select few. I'm hoping and hopeful our many voices and concerns will be heard and considered but disheartened when I hear the Town Board Supervisor say the public hearing is a misnomer.What purpose is served by an e-mail that I have here that the town board is instructed by two lawyers not to speak or respond tonight.This is the kind of undemocratic process we have been dealing with since the last public hearing in October 2012.The town board has refused to respond to many of our requests for clarification,information, and fairness and inclusiveness.Please postpone the vote on this document and have 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 52 a dialogue with the affected landowners and citizens.Thank you. MS.MARKS:My name is Katie Marks. I live on Garrett Road.My property extends down to Route 89.I'm only here tonight,because I bought my property a year and a half ago.I only knew about this evening because of some kind neighbors who left me a wonderful letter about what's going on,and I have a unique situation, because the home that I live on is also the Black Diamond Trail so I have to build a driveway now down to Route 89,and because of all these new zoning laws,it will make my life a lot more difficult,and I would like you to extend some time before moving forward on this vote.I understand it's my responsibility as a citizen to know what's going on in this area and something like this is now moving me forward to know more, but I think as a young homeowner,there wasn't enough outreach.So I would like more,to be informed.Thank you. MR.CLEMENT:Hi,my name is Dan 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 53 Clement.I live on Dubois Road,5027.We own land that's below the Black Diamond Trail and adjoins part of the nature center.It's in the unique natural areas. I want to talk just about the requirements you have a forester,pay a forester to make a report in order to cut firewood,and I think we own about probably 40 acres of woods.Before I came,I just looked briefly on the Internet and it seems like there might be something about 500 trees on the average acre of land.So that's 20,000 trees,maybe 10,000.I take like 10 or 15 trees.And I think that it would be silly to require someone in my situation to hire a forester to make a report.My concern would be that they would probably suggest I take down more trees than I have the time to take down to clean the forest.It's a lot different than having somebody clear cut or do a heavy forest cutting for timber and there should be a threshold before that requirement clicks in.Thank you. MR.SMITH:My name is Don Smith,and 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 54 I live at 1329 Taughannock Boulevard,and I'm primarily here about focusing on the lakeshore on this side.I appreciate one of the things that Don said.You have to look,forget about some of the things that have been said in last year.There have been a huge amount of just simply incorrect interpretations of what was being proposed, just absolutely crazy,inappropriate statements made,and it's got a lot of people inappropriately upset.You have to look at this with a clear eye,and when you do so you'll see some majority advantages on the layout of this today.One of things that is a total misconception is people are saying my God,90 percent of properties are nonconforming.Yeah,it's true.That's not because of current zoning.That's because of zoning in 1960 or 1972 or 2002 not because of now.If you look at that one chart that Darby had up here,it had some sections there that showed current setback for proposed lakeshore zoning in comparing it with R1.You know what's 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 55 different?What's different is it makes it now --what's now different is you can go 25 feet away from that street rather than 50 feet.This gives you more freedom from a setback perspective in relation to lake frontage,in relation to wide area,side setback,building height,all of the setbacks are the same.You now have more freedom from a setback perspective.Look at that slide.Number two are the revised grandfather laws.Without getting in detail,this gives you more freedom.It gives you more rights from a property perspective.Number three the proposed zoning permits your neighbor to clear cut trees.I hear what you're saying in relation to Route 89.I really appreciate people taking care of their properties.My goodness sakes,across the street from me on Route 89,they're clear cutting for goodness sakes.They're just cutting it all down,and it just makes me cry.Right now you can clear cut one acre with a simple burning permit.Proposed zoning may 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 56 facilitate securing public water for people on Route 89 and Maplewood.Proposed zoning helps reduce the pollution and runoff from construction.There's been some recent projects that you've seen that are just absolutely --one gentleman he totally removed a mountain.He removed a mountain. That's just a shame.That shouldn't happen.You can still do it,you just need to get reviews.Thank you so much. MS.FLANNERY:Gail Flannery, 1157 Taughannock Boulevard.I think a lot's already been said that I had written down,and I also think that a lot of angst could have been avoided if the board had answered one question,and that was asked several times:What are the problems that we're addressing with this zoning?What are the issues?You can wrap your head around that,but when you can't get that answer,it makes you wonder where you're heading.I can still say I don't get a lot of it.I really don't.I spent a lot of time looking at the comprehensive plan. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 57 It's a lot more general,and I see that the people want to protect the natural resources,and I say who doesn't?I mean, nobody's out to pollute the lake especially people that live on it.That would be stupid.So I think overall we've done a pretty good job with that.The other thing I saw in the comprehensive plan,we live in a small,rural,character town.We like that.We don't want to live in the City of Ithaca.We don't want to be micromanaged. We do a good job without asking how high do we have to jump.I think that's important to the character of a small town. Finally,I have one other question. I see that there is a cluster development and the lake frontage has been reduced to 150 feet.I haven't heard any discussion of this previously by the board.I am wondering what it is,if it pertains to the parks and recreation which would be the Girl Scout Camp,because that's the only last piece of land to be developed and I'm wondering why we would be encouraging this 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 58 kind of development.Thank you. MS.WARNER:Hi,I'm Beth Warner.I live at 1055 Glenwood Heights Road.I was one of the unsuccessful lieutenant candidates for the town board that Mr. Zeserson spoke so kindly of.I'm proud to have run even unsuccessfully,because I think we brought up the zoning issues to the election,otherwise they would not have been addressed at all.One other candidate ran on passing zoning. My concerns about the conservation and the marina district,the marina district zoning was just written three months ago and does not have the proper time for members to consider and I would like to have this whole portion delayed,if not the whole thing.I live in the conservation district.Believe me,there are no advantages of being in the conservation district unlike maybe the lakeshore district.If the ultimate goal of this zoning is to protect the lake,the setbacks,minimum lot,building height,lot 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 59 size,coverage,et cetera they are of little or no value.There are right now existing precautions that should be used and enforced to prevent soil erosion and stripping of the land like this person up on 89,that's preventable right now.We have current regulations.It should be enforced to prevent this kind of thing. Excuse me.And prevent the soil erosion into the stream beds and the lake from the roofs and pavements during construction, and any existing storm water practices that mitigate runoff from completed structures. We are not against zoning,but we are --we need to create better balance here of keeping the rural character of the community,but not at the detriment of our tax base.We want to be environmentally sensitive but not to the extreme of the town dictating what size or type of tree we can cut down on our own property.The town board may have been working on these additions for several years,but several conservation district residents have been 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 60 unaware of these issues.There are people who are directly affected,but have not been notified that it even affects them. We were told by the town board that it'd be too difficult to notify all these people, but we on our own put up fliers over the weekend.I'm glad to hear we did help some people to be notified about this.What I'm asking is I'd like the zoning to be opposed and to ask you to truly listen to the resident's concerns. MS.SHELLY:I'm Mary Shelly.I have property at 1383 Taughannock Boulevard.I guess the thing that bothers me the most is all the animosity,one side plotting for one,one side for the other,I'd just stop the plotting,because I hate the animosity. And I totally,you know,I don't want to stop anybody from cutting fire wood on their land,but let me just describe what it's like on my property there is no trees above me and when it rains,it's (indicating)right down the hill and I get floods right into of the basement if I'm 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 61 not careful,and I got my property very cheaply,because somebody cut down a very large tree that caused all the steps to erode.So,you know,that --it happens. And so I think people are trying to do the best they can,and I'm hoping this gets put behind us and we're all friends in the end so.Okay. MR.McCANN:Lawrence McCann,2115 Taughannock Park Road.We own property at 40 Maplewood,and we're also members of the Cayuga Lake Watershed.I stood here 13 months ago,October 2012 questioning the five acre zoning above Maplewood and two acres directly below in same zoning spot in the same lakeshore zoning.This is preferential spot zoning.Five acres zoning on one side of the street, Maplewood,and until last week one acre zoning on the other side,under the guise of environmental protection suddenly it's back to two acres.On our land like everything else it's a highly restrictive and unfair five acres.It's a total 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 62 inequality.I cannot build in the 75 feet of abandoned stream.This can be arguably increased by 50 percent to 112.5 feet and streams not defined in the zoning draft and it's not on the map.How is it different than intermittent streams?They are not defined either.I cannot build a 144 square foot or less shed on the land without site plan review on my 6 acres,a right provided to all New York State landowners.You do have more freedom along the lake,but we have significantly less freedom directly above on Maplewood.Site plan review is directed for anything,a walkway,cutting down one tree,any work on my 6 acres,even the height of planned house,any filling,any excavation.I note that Hilary Lambert said it's the possibility of variation and the slope needed to be clarified.That's a really significant statement.I've been saying that for a year now and no one's paid attention to it.I don't have time to cover the varied slope overlay area which 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 63 lacks scientific supporting data. Everything is more restricted on our side of the street while everything is grandfathered by those who control the process on the other side where it is steeper,where it is steeper.It's all of more cost and significant expense.This is pricing us out.At the public information meetings no comments,no clarifications allowed but it was stated the DEC provided a free licensed forester service for one requirement.I called DEC after a great deal of effort,many calls.We offer no such service on private land they told me. I also want to state that any waterfront property owner who owns lake property within the lakeshore district should be required to recuse himself from voting due to a clear inherent conflict of interest.So I'm requesting that on the record.I am also providing some of the statements I've read over the last year that have been completely ignored.I also want to finish a really significant point 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 64 that the supervisor in an early summer town board meeting that she felt it only fair and reasonable to hold the public hearing in the summer when the majority of the residents were present,here on Thanksgiving weekend,day after.We have new town board in January. (TIME BUZZER SOUNDS). MR.MCCANN:Both incoming members have expressed the desire to help resolve this conflict in the next year.What is the rush? MR.HOUGHTON:Peter Houghton,1333 Taughannock Boulevard.My family's owned Cayuga lakefront property in the Town of Ulysses for over a hundred years.My family still owns 500 acres of farmland and woodland dating back to 1929.I'm a licensed professional engineer with knowledge of the west short of Cayuga Lake through my career with the New York State Department of Transportation and my personal experience.In addition to the oral presentations I gave to the board over 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 65 the 15 months,I submitted several written documents.I want to submit two of those tonight,which I will give to the stenographer,to be incorporated into the record. I'm not going to rehash all the comments tonight.I want to focus on two issues.One of them is first,first with arbitrary unsubstantiated requirement of a five acre minimum residential lot within the conservation zone and parcels within the lakeshore zone that do not have lake frontage.In all the months of discussions and deliberations,there has not been one substantiation,one justification,nothing as far as where this five acres came from. It could have easily been two,three,four, five,who knows.The answer I was given was that to protect the old growth timbers, forests on the steep slopes with highly erodible soils between Route 89 and the old Lehigh Valley Railroad.I was told it is environmentally sound to protect these old forest lands.Those statements are false. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 66 The vast majority of timber land on the west side of Route 89 and portions of the lakeshore zone are not old growth forests; they're second,they're second growth forests.As part of tonight's record,I am submitting copies of US aerial photography from June 1938,some 75 years ago,that shows much of the Town of Ulysses Cayuga Lake west shore area that clearly shows many tilled fields and much pasture land stretching down these hillsides from the railroad tracks right through 89.Some 60 years ago,they also did the aerial topography from October 1964 showing the exact same thing.So it's safe to say,by various board members that agriculture was never possible on these slopes,agriculture can't be possible today are blatantly false,because it was agriculturally tilled and pasture in times past.It's not possible by today's standards with modern commercial farming,but it's certainly appropriate for organic farming and for small vineyards. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 67 The second issue is one of process and procedures applied by this board in developing the ordinances.Many of the examples used for justification were not applicable to the Town of Ulysses,the west shore of Cayuga Lake.There is too much validity given to a very small marketing survey.The request for a professionally developed independent survey of affected property owners was summarily denied by the town board.There are far too many private deliberations and discussions between board members considering these documents. Meetings were held in violation of the New York State open meeting law.There are far too many special meetings and emergency board meetings convened with very little public notice -- (TIME BUZZER SOUNDS). MR.HOUGHTON:And the second ad hoc committee was essentially the same as the first ad hoc committee.It's been inappropriately handled and ending with a very,what should I say,document filled 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 68 with problems.Thank you for your time. MS.THOMAS:Thank you. MR.BREUHAUS:My name is George Breuhaus.I live at 1055 Glenwood Heights. Primarily I'm going to speak on the conservation district.But the basis for the zoning,given basis is to protect the environment.If we're going to protect the environment,why doesn't the town enforce DEC simple swim requirements that would apply to all residents.The partial that's being clear cut on 89 has no sill fences protecting the downhill slope,no sill fence on the driveway,no sill fence protecting the streams.You've got all kinds of setback to protect streams,but you're not even enforcing what you've got currently.If you don't write it yourself, well,it must not exist.That doesn't make any sense.There's no provisions in any of this for checking existing septic systems. I live on an intermittent stream,well, what you would call an intermittent stream, and occasionally there'd be algae on it. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 69 Now when the Cognans moved in and cleaned up the septic system upstream,the algae's gone.Well,I wonder what happened? Probably a new septic system.There are spots in the lake that we know are running septic.Biggest thing is Village of Trumansburg sewage treatment plant.Has the town done anything to request or put pressure on the village to clear it up. I've heard that you're monitoring streams. If that is in fact true,you know what the data is or --that or you choose to ignore it.The thing on two acres versus five acres.Two acres on the lakeshore which one could argue is the most environmentally sensitive area,but across the street,up the slope it's five acres.That doesn't make any analytical sense.The argument for slopes,DEC requires no special permits for soil types A through D.E soils which basically start with about 25 percent slope and F soils start at 45 percent do require special permits.Once again it seems like it's not understood. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 70 I'm going to bring up one last point that I see the zoning officer is being asked to issue building permits.If you check the Department of State website that administers codes,certified code enforcement officer does that.So unless Darby,and I didn't see her name as a certified code enforcement,Alex is.She cannot by,I believe by state law,enforce, do the planning review or issue a CO unless she's a certified code enforcement officer. Thank you. MR.COOK:Hi.I'm Peter Cook.I do not have a dog in this fight,but I have been on the school board,I don't speak for them,I'm speaking for myself,for seven years.I believe that our town needs to build its tax base.And I'm afraid from what I hear and sense is that the more you restrict anybody's building of in a reasonable --in an unreasonable way,the more the tax base stays the same.Our school ten years ago had 1,400 kids.We now have less than 1,100.We need more 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 71 growth.Now,how that happens,obviously is contentious.But we need to have and every zoning board needs to be open and reasonable,and I think this one will take that into account when you think about our 1,100 children in our district.This is my main concern,and I don't want to see our school in decline. MS.THOMAS:More comments? MS.CAIL:Hi,my name's Krys Cail, and I felt like I've hadn't had an opportunity to kind of say things before. So I haven't been coming to most of the previous events that you've had for public input.I was involved in drafting the first comprehensive plan that Ulysses did back in early 90s,and then spent nine years on the planning board.Folks who don't think there's been any issues or problems associated with updating our zoning haven't been going to all the volunteer meetings that I went to.There's been a lot of work done over the years,and there's been a lot of issues,been some 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 72 lawsuits,there's definitely been reasons that zoning has needed to be updated.One of things I think happens sometimes is the less you know,the more sure you can be to know the answer.Sometimes the more you find out,the more you realize there is 2 or 12 or 15 sides to some issues.In particular,I think it's really interesting that although I was on the lakeshore zoning committee,the original one,and it did change,because myself as a person who was in the conservation zone,and not a lakeshore resident was replaced by Dawn, who is a lakeshore resident,because those lakeshore residents really were upset,and they needed more people who were lakeshore homeowners on the,you know,in other words just me,a farmer,what represented the rest of the town.Most of the lakeshore zoning was put together by people who lived on the lakeshore,and yet arguably the lake does kind of belong to all of us,but I was particularly interested in some of the comments that were being made about the 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 73 five acres versus two acres.I want to really praise the two acres zoning.There is a rationale for that,and that's that lakeshore residents are powerful and loud and rich.And that's why we have two acres there and those of us who live further up the hill,you know,in fact of terms of property loss and so on so forth,you know. I'm going from a 24 acres that could be made into 12 housing sites to 24 acres that can probably be made maximum of three. That being said,there really aren't environmental issues involved,and the business about takings.That's nonsense. I have a Cornell degree in city planning. There is no takings going on,but what there is is maybe some process whereby people are talking to one another much less than we should,and when the community is small,you end up depending on volunteers to do the work.As I've said,I've been to meetings maybe over 15 years now working on zoning as a volunteer,and -- (TIME BUZZER SOUNDS). 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 74 MS.CAIL:--I'm sorry for the lack of service,folks. MR.AVERY:Good evening.I'm Ken Avery.I live at 2 Maplewood Point with my wife.I'm going to be short,about two sentences.We strongly oppose the Ulysses Town Board's new proposed zoning regulations,and we totally support the remarks made by Tim Fallon and Peter Houghton,in this meeting as well as past meetings.I do thank you for this opportunity,and I sure hope we can come to some good conclusions for both parties. MS.THOMAS:The mic is empty. Anyone else? MR.HAWKES:My name is Rod Hawkes. I live at 5054 Taughannock Boulevard.My house is in the proposed conservation zone. I'm a member of a planning board.I volunteered a number of years ago to help with whatever,the town,and I was placed on a comprehensive plan committee.It was an ongoing process when I joined it.It evolved into being a member of the planning 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 75 board when a vacancy opened up,and I've been a member of the planning board since. I might be the only person maybe,with the exception of John Wertis,to be involved in all three of these documents,the comprehensive plan,the lakeshore district, and conservation district.I was also asked to chair the ad hoc committee that was assigned by the town board to react to the public comment from the October 2012 public hearing.I think I approached that entire process,and I think I've been impressed with all the people that I've worked with in all these processes with an open mind.I hope that this is a process that's taken place over the terms of three town supervisors,lots of changes in board members,town board and planning board and all these committees,and I think that nothing's perfect,and I think that what we do with zoning is not address existing conditions,we're planning for future conditions and that's been the perspective I've felt we've taken,I'm speaking for 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 76 everyone I've worked with,various committees and processes,throughout and we'll never satisfy everyone,but this is democratic process.It's as democratic as it can be.There's concerns voiced tonight about information and sharing notification, the town has not done all that it's been required to and all it can afford to to notify about each of these processes.We didn't get all 5,000 people in the town participating in these activities.I don't think you ever do.So I appreciate all the comments tonight.I appreciate all perspectives,we've appreciated all the various meetings that we've had.Thank you and I encourage the town board to move forward and act swiftly on the process, because it's been a long time,and a lot of effort's been made.Thank you. MS.SULLIVAN:My name is Marissa Sullivan.My husband and I just purchased a house on Maplewood about a year and a half ago.We don't know enough about this process.We have been informed by a lot of 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 77 it,but we don't have time to be up here all the time.We're currently renovating, and we'll be leaving here at some point in the future.We are concerned that we haven't had time to really study this. We're not here,my husband had to go home back to work today,and I stayed longer just to come to the meeting tonight,but we would hope this would be put off and a vote would be made at a time when people are here.Thank you. MR.ABLE:I'm a lakeshore resident, but from the Town of Ithaca,and it's very clear,very near to Ulysses,and of course, as a lakeshore resident,I'm concerned with the health of the lake. MS.GEORGIA:Can I have your name, please? MR.ABLE:Yes.My name is John Able.I signed the sheet at the back.And I just think it's maybe worthwhile to reflect on what Ithaca went through in similar experience several years ago,and I have to admit I had some initial misgivings 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 78 about lakeshore zoning and so forth,and as I've learned more about being grandfathered and so forth,these were alleviated,and at the same time,I saw when my neighbors were making some reasonable additions that were outside of the zone limits,they were able to make a reasonable appeal to the planning board there and succeeded in getting that done.I was also concerned that the conservation zone in Ithaca was not either implemented soon enough or enforced well enough and just on the other side of Route 89 from me,my property,upstream from my property because I have a creek running across it,someone came in and timbered all along,dropped trees into the creeks,took out the larger trees,but left a lot of trash,we could see the effects coming down the hill,this person built without proper planning for drainage and so forth.So I think,I'd just like to lend my voice from a experience as a neighbor to Ulysses that the lakeshore and conservation zoning is in my view a very favorable perspective,and 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 79 there certainly has been a lot more community input here than there was in Ithaca.So you're complimented for that, but I would urge you to go ahead and complete this process as soon as possible. MS.THOMAS:Any more comments?I don't want to,if anybody has a little niggle of wanting to come up here,now's your opportunity.No?Okay.The time is now looks like 8:37.Before I close this hearing,I'm just going to ask again if there isn't anyone who hasn't already spoken,if they would like to make a statement?One more time?Okay.That is the end.Thank you for attending.We need a motion to close the public hearing.Do we have a motion? MS.ZAHLER:Move to close. MS.TYLER:Second. MS.THOMAS:All in favor? BOARD MEMBERS:Aye. MS.THOMAS:Opposed?Okay.This hearing is now concluded.Thank you for coming. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 80 C E R T I F I C A T I O N I hereby certify that the proceedings and evidence are contained fully and accurately in the notes taken by me on the above cause and that this is a correct copy of the same to the best of my ability. ___________________________________ SHAUNA M.POTTER