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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2009-04-07 - PB TOWN OF ULYSSES PLANNING BOARD 04/07/09 Approved 04/21/09 Present : Acting Chairperson Rod Hawkes, Planning Board Members : Stan Beames, Rick Rainey, Rebecca Schneider, John Wertis, Town Board Liaison David Kerness, Deputy Supervisor Dick Coogan, Code Enforcement Officer Alex Rachun Excused : Ken Zeserson, Rod Porter Public : Scott Sherwood Mr. Hawkes called the meeting to order at 7 : 00 pm . He noted they have Mr. Sherwood from Spruce Row located on Kraft Road in attendance . He provided a lengthy description at a prior meeting of the project which would allow him to change the development district. He would like to expand the types of recreational vehicles he can have there. He would also to allow the commercial sales of recreational vehicles . He noted a few members were not in attendance at the prior meeting. He asked Mr. Coogan for guidance in the action plan for this project. Mr. Coogan stated this is a development district. The Town Board has asked the Planning Board to review and provide recommendations . The Town Board would hold the Public Hearing and approve or not the application . The zoning does not allow for amending a development district . A new development district would be created as a result of this action. Mr. Wertis asked in what form does the Town Board expect a response from this Board. Do they want the recommendation to come back as a resolution or list. Mr. Coogan stated the previous process has been in the form of a resolution with a list of recommendations, agreements, suggestions . Mr. Sherwood provided a survey plan for the proposed sales area in the campground. Mr. Hawkes asked if the members had additional questions or comments . Ms . Schneider asked how many this area would allow for in the sales area Mr. Sherwood stated it is 40 x 75 , he could fit 6, 7 would be tight. He does not really plan to have that many onsite at any point in time. The real goal is to be able to order for delivery as well as obtain dealership pricing for rental units . Ms . Schneider asked about the 12 feet wide units mentioned in an email . Mr. Sherwood stated he is not allowed to have the park model units in his campground due to zoning restrictions . They can be 8 to 12 feet wide. He would like to allow these units . Mr. Wertis stated is was an educational experience reading through the booklet that Mr. Sherwood provided . He had never heard of destination camping prior to reviewing the book. Mr. Sherwood stated this is becoming a big area of business and it is his hope that the Board will allow this to help increase business revenue. Mr. Wertis noted driving down Kraft Road, the deciduous trees screen the campground very well . He did not that going down Cole Grove Road there is an open field and the campground is visible. From that view it does look like a trailer park.. He is inclined to approve both of his requests as long as screening is provided. The park models look more like a trailer. Planning Board 2 04/07/2009 Mr. Sherwood agreed some have vinyl siding and a shingled roof but they are smaller the square footage is the deciding factor. Mr. Hawkes asked if they would be hooked to septic . Mr. Sherwood stated they are on septic, however they do not allow the trailers in the park that do not allow them in without having holding tanks . The sites that are not on septic are provided with pump out service . This is all monitored by the Health Department. Ms . Schneider asked how many are on septic sites . Mr. Sherwood stated they have approximately 90 sites . Ms . Schneider stated they have 90 home equivalent on sewer. Mr. Sherwood stated this is not home equivalent, they are governed by 55 gallons a day which is half or less than a home. This is strictly seasonal use . They are inspected and approved by the Health Department for water and sewer within the campground . Mr. Hawkes stated the Board shares the concern for the future of the park however they are also concerned it does not resemble a mobile home park. Mr. Sherwood reiterated that is not his intention . People do not want to spend recreational time in a mobile home park he would be maintaining it as a campground. Ms . Schneider stated he is currently allowed 90 sites, would he be asking for additional sewer sites . Mr. Sherwood stated he is not they are looking for allowing the park models and cabins which is not allowed in his district. The cabins nor the park models would need to have increased capacity for sewer or water as they would be using current sites . The cabins are basically hard sided tents . Mr. Hawkes asked if the 40x75 would be the limit of the sales area. If so , he could feasibly put 6 12 foot models in this area. Mr. Sherwood stated it would be the only area. He could feasibly put 6 onsite however he does not have the resources nor the inclination to have that many onsite. His plan is to be able to order the trailers as customers come to him. He would probably have two at a time onsite . Mr. Wertis noted the sales area is screened from Kraft Road, the sales area is between the office and road by trees . Mr. Hawkes asked if there are signage changes . Mr. Sherwood stated he would have to post his dealer license however that could be placed inside the office area where his other signs are. Mr. Hawkes asked what the requirements for a dealer' s license are. Mr. Sherwood stated he has not gone into depth as he could not get past the allowance to sell on his property. This was a requirement and as he could not meet this did not get past the licensing process . Ms . Schneider stated she appreciates the way he presented this there is niche that could be filled and with the economy he could benefit. However, she is concerned with the use of year round use. Planning Board 3 04/07/2009 Mr. Sherwood stated they are not allowed to operate all year. The Health Department restricts him to 180 days . He could request to operate longer however he does not want to . Mr. Rainey asked if there would be substantial cost to operate longer. Mr. Sherwood stated yes the way they are charged by NYSEG is by demand. This is a higher way to be charged, they would have to treat the water for freezing . He has toyed with staying open through November. However they do not really see any benefit in it. They are allowed but they have always chosen not to . Mr. Wertis noted there is a percentage they are allowed to . Mr. Hawkes stated a possible use for winter would be snowmobiling. Mr. Sherwood stated they could however the snowfall here has not been reliable. With the snowfall they get it is not realistic . He is an avid snowmobiler and more winters than not do not provide adequate snowfall for snowmobiling. Mr. Wertis asked if he sells these units would the sales tax come back to the town. Mr. Sherwood stated yes it would. They are working on figures with the Campground Association that can provide the economic impact by this Fall . They know campers go into the local stores and spend their money but are hoping to have numbers for this impact. The NYS Parks had an article in the newspaper stating they gauge their economic impact around 2 million dollars. He has a friend in Chautagua County that did a study he stated the impact from seasonal campers is about $200 . 00 per week per unit. Mr. Rainey apologized for missing the initial presentation however he does have a few questions . First, the motivation to get into this business, and two the turnover of these 5 to 6 units and lastly do the units leave the property or generally stay. Mr. Sherwood stated he and his wife chose to pursue this career after her parents had decided to retire . Selling the trailers is another market for sales and he can purchase these units at dealer prices to rent. He is hoping to catch the people who come for a visit and really like the area, purchase and set up in the campground. He would be happy with 3 units sold per year, 5 units would be ecstatic . Mr. Rainey stated he was curious if he would be able to turn his inventory over yearly to prevent deterioration of the units . Mr. Sherwood stated he would not have sufficient resources to have a large number. Once he built capital he might have one more, he would like to have one for themselves . They live in the house adjacent to the campground but generally stay in the campground themselves during the summer in an RV they own. Ms . Schneider stated if they submit a recommendation to approve these two changes would all the rest of the restriction still be in place . Mr. Hawkes asked what the time frame would be for this process . Mr. Coogan stated with zoning there are no time frames, it could take a year or more if necessary. Mr. Kerness stated he would suggest they make the recommendation with the changes, recommendations for or against as an action item to the Town Board. This would hopefully eliminate lengthy delays . Mr. Wertis noted that Mr. Sherwood had provided the language in his written request to the Board . Mr. Hawkes asked if there was any other discussion. Planning Board 4 04/07/2009 The members stated they did not have any other questions or comments . Mr. Hawkes stated he would recommend they discuss this at the April 21St meeting once the regular Chairperson is back. Mr. Wertis asked why they would not make a recommendation tonight. They could recommend the Town Board approve the changes as presented. Mr. Hawkes stated his only hesitation is that he has not seen the actual zoning to review the changes . Mr. Sherwood stated in his presentation it has the old wording as well as the new wording he would like to have. Mr. Hawkes stated he does not have a problem with making a recommendation tonight. Ms. Schneider asked Mr. Rachun his perspective on the park models as well as the sales area in this request . She stated he would not increase his sewer but would use sites as they are, she asked Mr. Sherwood if he could put a number on the unit she would need. Mr. Sherwood stated he did not see this happening. Mr. Kerness stated they cannot present this to the Board with they do not think it would happen. Mr. Wertis stated the restrictions would stay in place so frankly he does not care what happens as long as it is behind the tree lines and the buffers remain intact. Mr. Kerness stated he believes they have to take the time to include the items they want specifically, commercial sales and park models allowed. Ms . Schneider stated she understands this and is comfortable with this project as long as the current restrictions stay in place. She would like to have the restricted size sales lot so there are not fifty of them out there . She noted they could include commercial sales will be allowed in the presented plat by Mr. Sherwood. Mr. Hawkes i.f there were any other wording changes or inclusions they wanted. Mr. Rachun asked if there was a SEQR done on this . The members questioned why the Town Board would not do the SEQR. What would pop out in a SEQR and if the Town Board did the Public Hearing wouldn ' t they do the SEQR hearing. Mr. Rachun stated the development district in and of itself does not have to follow the zoning etc . but it would be nice if it did. The Board could decide if they want to do SEQR Ms . Schneider stated if they were changing sites they should be required to adhere to the zoning requirements . Ms . Carlisle Peck stated could they include new construction terminology to be brought to the Planning Board for approval prior to construction. Mr. Rachun stated they have seasonal and overnight campground and it sounds to him like they want to make it more seasonal campground. Mr. Sherwood stated it is an overnight campground but with the changing market he would like to be able to provide this niche and get the revenue from sales . Planning Board 5 04/07/2009 Ms. Schneider stated she would like to add the new construction would have to be reviewed for zoning regulations . Mr. Sherwood stated all new construction, sites have to be approved by the NYS DEC and NYS DOH, this would take care off all of these concerns the Board has . Ms . Schneider acknowledged that was a good process to have. Mr. Wertis asked if they ever abandon specific site numbers and move the number to a different place. Mr. Sherwood stated they are approved for 425 sites, they are currently in the 200 ' s . Mr. Rachun stated he is a neighbor and he does not have an issue with this business being there . He does want to mention that the Town needs to cross T ' s and dot their I ' s . An Article 78 , which is a lawsuit could be brought against the Town if all items are not done. Mr. Rainey asked if he were playing devil ' s advocate and he is worried about his selling out and turning this into a mobile home park how would he address their fears . With these small units are coming in and he decides to sell out. Due to the small size these units would be low income, it is now four seasons and people could be fearful of this . Mr. Sherwood stated the size and shape of these units are not four seasons . They could probably be but the ones he purchases are not. The NYS DOH does not allow us to operate four seasons, it only operates through October. Mr. Kerness stated he would like to see them look at the full scope of this project . He understands what he is trying to do and how could they restrict this in the zoning. Mr. Coogan noted the items they are discussing is already in the zoning for this development district, he is restricted to operating May 1st to October 15 `h . Occupany off season cannot be more than 20% of total sites . He noted it is 20% of 425 . He could have 85 units occupied for 7 days . Mr. Rachun stated the Board can pick a number that is allowed. The intent is to not have a mobile home park next to a proposed conservation district. Mr. Hawkes noted they were not ready to make a recommendation tonight. Ms . Schneider stated she agreed, they needed to get the wording straightened out. Mr. Wertis asked who would compile the resolution . Ms . Schneider stated Ms . Carlisle Peck is writing notes she can compile the document for the next meeting. Ms . Carlisle Peck asked when the SEQR process would be done. Mr. Rachun stated the LEAF would have to be done, the Public Hearing could be done together or separately it is up to this Board ' s discretion. They had a SEQR done on the American Legion, an Article 78 was presented and they won on that. The Town Board had done the SEQR. The Planning Board is an advisory Board the Town Board can accept or do another SEQR but this Board should do the SEQR. Ms . Schneider asked if the initial information could be presented at the next meeting. She would like to see a complete map of the site . He had previously presented a campground map . She stated if they do SEQR they would need that information. Mr. Hawkes stated this Board should do SEQR, and prepare their recommendation to the Town Board. Planning Board 6 04/07/2009 Mr. Coogan stated they would have to get the referendum from the Town Board asking the Planning Board to do the SEQR for this project . Mr. Rachun stated Mr. Sherwood would have to prepare Part 1 of the SEQR before the meeting on the 21St Mr. Sherwood stated he would make time to get together to do complete this document. A discussion as to who would be lead agency, the neighbor letter processes, as well as the time frame working with the Town Board was held . Mr. Rachun stated the Town Board would be Lead Agency, they would request Planning Board do the SEQR. The Planning Board would do the SEQR, hold the Public Hearing and forward the SEQR with the recommendations to the Town Board for the decision making process . Mr. Kerness will present the necessary request to the Town Board on April 14th, he will be back at the meeting on the 21St to report the decisions . Mr. Hawkes stated reviewing the site would be a good idea. He asked Mr. Sherwood if there would be a good time they all could meet . Mr. Rachun stated if there is quorum it is a considered a meeting. Mr. Wertis asked why would they meet. Mr. Rachun stated no one on this Board should make a decision without visiting the property. Mr. Wertis stated he agreed with this however this is not changing the property. This is allowing sales and the type of models coming in. Mr. Rachun stated he disagreed this would allow semi-permanent models into a park that has not been. Mr. Sherwood stated the reality is these are not permanent. They have the wheels still on them and can be moved. Mr. Rachun stated they are not the same, if these were pulled out it is not a normal occurrence. They could say the same thing about a trailer park. He is hoping these units are rented permanently. Mr. Hawkes asked if there was a reason the cabins and park models were not allowed in the initial zoning request. Mr. Rachun stated there was a large backlash, some did not want them at all . They did not want these units or more sites . The concern was for increased smoke as well as the look of the campground . Mr. Sherwood stated at that time there were two unit in the park, these were allowed to stay. He provided the members with his cell phone number to contact him individually for onsite visits . He stated he would be away until Wednesday for a family visit. Mr. Hawkes stated the wording he is looking for would allow as many potential sites as he has to allow park models . Mr. Sherwood stated no he would not want 200 park models . That is not his intent . Mr. Kerness asked Mr. Sherwood what number would work for him . He reviewed the total sites and asked Mr. Sherwood if 100 park models allowed would work. That would be a quarter of the total sites allowed. Planning Board 7 04/07/2009 Mr. Sherwood stated 100 would more than sufficient . He would be ecstatic if he sold that many. He really does not want to turn this into a permanent campground. A transient camper does not like a permanent campsite. The transient people actually make him more money and he likes the transient camper situation better. The homes he is looking at are wood sided and natural looking. Mr. Hawkes stated their problem is the next guy coming in. With the information they have received regarding the 1991 problems he would like to have a thorough review of the process . Mr. Coogan reviewed the process with him . The time frame if all goes well would be into the end of July for the process to complete . Mr. Rachun stated they need to follow the process . The Town Board has not designated the Planning Board to be Lead Agency, the SEQR is not done at this point in time. They need to send out letters and he would not be surprised if Environmental Health informed them they would like to be Lead Agency. Mr. Wertis asked for clarification of what they would be doing SEQR on. Mr . Rachun stated it would be all new, they would have to review the entire district . They cannot amend a district thus it would be a new review and everything would have to specified. They can copy the current district and change the specific areas however it would be a SEQR process . Ms . Schneider agreed she could not draft numbers or agree to recommendations until she sees the campground. She expressed her appreciation to Mr. Sherwood for helping them in drafting the wording, making himself accessible and allowing them to visit the site . Mr. Sherwood told the Board thank you and stated he would contact Mr. Rachun to get the SEQR completed and be at the April 21st meeting. Mr. Hawkes asked if they were expecting Judy Cone tonight. Mr. Wertis stated Mr. Coogan could walk them through the plan. Mr. Rachun stated the packet is complete. It is nicely designed sign to replace the existing sign. It meets all the zoning requirements . It has to be approved by the Planning Board . Mr. Hawkes asked the members to review the packet and asked for comments or questions . Mr. Wertis asked if the were doing this as a site plan review. He cannot find anywhere that this Board can waive a public hearing, do we have to do a hearing for this . Mr. Rachun stated what they did with the Board of Zoning Appeals for a simply area variance is establish the meeting as a Public Hearing. The people come to request the variance the meeting and hearing occur that night. This Board may want to consider the same process for signs, simple site plans . Ms . Carlisle Peck asked Mr. Coogan if he could get the notices out by April 21s` . Mr. Coogan stated he could. Mr. Rachun stated it should be a simple meeting. Mr. Wertis asked Mr. Rachun to review the zoning for signs . The discussion led to the conclusion they would have to have a public hearing. Mr. Coogan stated he would get the notices out for the hearing to be scheduled at 7 : 30 . Planning Board 8 04/07/2009 Mr. Rachun discussed the design criteria and site plan review issues in the zoning document. Mr. Hawkes stated Mr. Coogan had handed out information for the Board. He asked Mr. Coogan to discuss the hand outs . Mr. Coogan stated about five years ago during the Kinney project a traffic management plan was discussed. He went to Tompkins County Dept of Transportation Council, the Town of Ithaca, and the City of Ithaca meetings who were all interested in this traffic corridor. They have been working on this for a year and a half. They prepared 3 reports 1 . traffic study, 2 . corridor management study 3 . what can they do on roadways . Bergmann Associates who did the Comprehensive Plan prepared the study. Each member was given a copy of the corridor management plan. A discussion among the members regarding the plan and suggestions was held. Mr. Hawkes stated his wife is renting from the Ulysses Square complex . He has been very impressed with the eco-friendly design the owners have put into this building. He wondered if this Board would like to recognize them going the extra nine yards to renovate this building so extensively. Members discussed this, the Town Board would have to approve and expenditures but members felt this would be a worthwhile cause . Mr. Beames MADE the MOTION to approve the MINUTES of 03/ 17/09 . Mr. Wertis SECONDED the MOTION. ALL IN FAVOR, MINUTES APPROVED . Respectfully submitted, Robin Carlisle Peck Secretary