HomeMy WebLinkAbout2015-02-24Dryden Conservation Board
February 24, 2015
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Conservation Board
February 24, 2015
Members present: Bob Beck (Chair), Charlie Smith, Gian Dodici, Craig Schutt, Mike
Richmond, Jeremy Sherman and Rick Ryan (at 7:45PM). Bard Prentiss and Steve
Bissen, excused
Liaisons: David Weinstein (Planning Board), Linda Lavine (Town Board)
Guests: Eileen Munsch (Cornell Design Connect) and Ann Leonard, Hammond Hill
resident
The meeting was called to order at 7:07PM
Review and approval of minutes from January 27, 2015:
C. Smith moved to accept the minutes with the suggested changes. M. Richmond
seconded the motion and the minutes were approved as edited.
Citizens’ Privilege:
Ann Leonard lives on Hammond Hill and is interested in trails. She read an article in
the Dryden Courier suggesting the Conservation Board is quadrupling the number of
trails in the Town and contacted Board member R. Ryan. Members of the
Conservation Board were surprised by the Dryden Courier’s statement as they have
not even discussed such a possibility. Ms. Hammond is a volunteer coordinator in the
DEC Unit Management Plan and is working in the Twin Sheds Unit. She has recently
donated some land the DEC and wants to encourage the expansion of the trails on
Hammond Hill and beyond. She has talked with Andy Zepp about a trail connecting
Hammond Hill and Yellow Barn State Forests. She has excellent connections with
multi-use groups: hikers, bikers, etc. She said the DEC is very excited to be working
with the Town of Dryden on this section of trail expansion.
D. Weinstein asked if there is a group thinking about cutting additional trails within
Hammond Hill. A. Leonard said she has to get the DEC on board, anything that you
want to do within the State Forest has to be approved by them. She has a preliminary
commitment to a minimum of another 1.5 miles. She said there is a social trail
network that was created by a private citizen but has been maintained by mountain
bikers. She is concerned that if the trails are not made legal, there can be negative
consequences, for example, not knowing where someone is in the woods.
Additions to Agenda: Game Farm Rail Trail
Reports and Updates:
Town Board: Supr. Sumner
Supr. Sumner was happy to take four resolutions to the Town Board. She considered
writing a directive to the Conservation Board based on the Natural Resources
Conservation Plan but she would not have been able to write the directive better than
the resolution. The Town Board has given permission for the Conservation Board to
move forward with the plan.
The Methods and Selection Criteria for Land Protection and Acquisition was accepted by
the Town Board.
Dryden Conservation Board
February 24, 2015
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In terms of the resolution requesting that the Town Board move forward on the Game
Farm section of the trail system, Supr. Sumner believes it is not the best option for the
Town and would like to continue working with the DEC to come up with a better
solution.
The last resolution was in regard to the Freeville to McLean Trail. Supr. Sumner
suggested that section be put off indefinitely. There was a strong objection from some
of the farmers along the proposed trail. The Town Board won’t do anything over the
objections of the land owners but she does wish to discuss it with them. She also
pointed out that the Town has other sections of trail that they can be working on.
B. Beck mentioned that there were residents’ objections regarding the William George
Agency section of trail but a plan was developed anyway. It is an example of how the
trail has been dealt with; the Town desires to continue the trail and thus, to keep the
idea in the back of their minds, the Town put it on the map even though there are
serious problems.
Supr. Sumner said that the petition from folks along the proposed trail indicated that
they believe the Town Board “for the Town Board to consider taking any action further
depriving landowners of our rights is illegal and totally inappropriate.” In reality,
considering anything is not illegal. The anti trail feeling is pretty strong among some of
the landowners and thus it is better to back off for now.
A. Leonard asked what the specific objections that these people are laying out.
Supr. Sumner responded that the farmers feel it is an intrusion on their privacy. They
are farmers because they like privacy.
B. Beck admitted that it is a very sensitive issue, a family issue but he is a proponent
of trails and they know that. In the summer, B. Beck talked to Ron and Russ Beck
and they were all in agreement that this would be a good thing. They did not object
which is why the Conservation Board put forward the resolution in September to go to
the Town Board to request that they approve this as a future project. Then after the
resolution was passed by the Conservation Board, Ron Beck said no, it will not
happen. That was a big reversal which was disappointing and B. Beck is not sure why
they changed their view.
Supr. Sumner mentioned that she was surprised at the petition from the farmers
because Ron Beck and Charlie Hatfield are former Town Board members so they know
that the current Town Board won’t do anything illegal.
M. Richmond said that he believes it is a good thing that the Conservation Board
moved ahead and put it out there and if they object to it, that is their right. It is not
like we are taking the approach of eminent domain. It was a good to get the word out
about the Conservation Board’s trail goals or they wouldn’t even know it is being
talked about. The Conservation Board (resolutions) has become an informational
source advising what the Conservation Board is thinking and what we would like to
have. Reasonable thoughts will prevail in this.
Supr. Sumner said that she thinks that was the intent of the resolution, to get the
trail on the map as a goal. Amending the official map is kind of a huge deal but if that
is what it takes, then that is what it takes.
B. Beck said that the fact of the matter is that the trail through the three farm
properties would have zero impact on any cultivated fields or pastures. The trail would
be off to the side.
Dryden Conservation Board
February 24, 2015
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The possibility that the trail will run under several established tree stands was
discussed as a reason against the trail since the trail would change the behavior of the
deer population thus undermining the purpose of tree stands in those locations.
M. Richmond referenced the walk members of the Conservation Board took last fall.
He said that they considered the location of the trail and the value to the community.
It is not like they went to a map on the wall and said “an old railroad bed, let’s take it”
and he believes the farmers know that.
B. Beck said that there are many property owners along the route that would be in
favor of the trail. Those people that object would be a minority.
B. Beck also shared that Beck Farms has a proposal to build a manure storage facility
and transfer line. It will have a 7000 foot line (1 and a third mile) and 3.25 million
gallon holding facility. It could cross Fall Creek, Fall Creek Road, Mud Creek and
almost to North road. It is a long distance.
C. Smith commented that maybe trail access is a small thing to give up to have this
opportunity.
J. Sherman said the storage facility will be at the corner of Dutcher Road and North
Road.
L. Lavine asked if the pipeline was crossing private property. Yes.
The Beck Farm dairy is growing with a current milking herd of about 1600 with
another 1600 of young stock.
Part of the reason for the pipeline is due to the closure of Red Mill Bridge. It is a long
way around to the Beck fields. This will save the Beck Farm fuel costs, will be
beneficial for the maintenance of the roads and will reduce carbon/ air pollution.
N. Munkenbeck commented that the DEC would have to approve the plans for the
pipeline and storage facility.
C. Schutt said the entire project has to be approved by Soil and Water.
B. Beck stated that the Town of Dryden had no notice of this project. Supr. Sumner
felt that letting the Board know would have been courteous, especially since they will
get questioned about it. The Town does not have any role to play in this situation, no
permitting authority.
D. Weinstein pointed out that crossing a waterway that supplies a large number of
residents introduces a great amount of public risk. Supr. Sumner again pointed out
that the Town does not have a role in this. Going under the creek is up to the DEC.
G. Dodici asked about getting permits for the 3 million + storage tank. Supr. Sumner
said you don’t have to get the permits if you are a farm.
C. Schutt revisited the resolution that the Conservation Board passed in September
regarding the Freeville to McLean section of the trail. He is not pointing fingers or
trying to cause problems but he feels the Conservation Board was not told the truth.
He is uncomfortable with the way the Resolution read because the resolution makes
reference to several farmers being agreeable to the trail. He asked that the resolution
be rescinded.
B. Beck disagreed with C. Schutt and read from the resolution: whereas, initial
discussion with several rail bed landowners has been positive. He indicated that he
has talked to several farmers, primarily the Becks and a couple of residents who are in
agreement. He listed 6-7 different land owners.
Dryden Conservation Board
February 24, 2015
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C. Schutt pushed B. Beck to provide the names of the owners that he talked to
between Malloryville and Red Mill Road.
B. Beck said there are three owners in that area. He has not talked to them. He then
stated that he objects to C. Schutt’s objection.
C. Schutt said that he simply wanted to be on the record that he is not comfortable
with the resolution. He doesn’t know what happened but when he sees landowners
this fired up, it makes him uncomfortable.
B. Beck responded that it makes him uncomfortable.
Supr. Sumner interjected that C. Schutts point is well taken, there was clearly some
misinformation. She recommended getting together with the three farms that are on
the petition – the Becks’, Hatfield’s and LaMottes’ – and see what the
miscommunication was.
M. Richmond asked if C. Schutt if he has heard from people who have the feeling or
have made the assertion that the Conservation Board is attempting to take this
property for the trail, or that we are trying to roll over these people? And how did you
respond to those people?
C. Schutt responded by telling people it is private land and he will stick up for private
landowners any day. He was questioned by the LaMottes when they heard about the
potential trail. No one has approached them to discuss the potential trail.
B. Beck replied that he knew the LaMottes would say no so he didn’t talk to them.
They know his feelings regarding the trail. Just because we know George Junior’s
feelings didn’t stop us from putting it on the map and planning for it. When the time
approaches they will of course, talk to all the land owners. Maybe we can sweeten the
deal, if they would cooperate with the proposal, we could agree to some kind of
negotiation to make it more palatable to some landowners. Some landowners might
say no, and it might never happen. But that should not stop him from saying here is a
great idea that will benefit future generation – a trail from Ithaca to Cortland. But the
longer we wait, the harder it will be.
R. Ryan agreed saying that the conversation has to get started eventually.
M. Richmond said that the truth of the matter is that if you run into a road block like
we are talking about here, but say we are going to call this the Sherman-LaMotte trail,
thus giving credit to the landowners might influence the landowners’ positions. It is
amazing how people see things differently when they are given credit for being
magnanimous in their behavior. M. Richmond related a story about Alan LaMotte,
himself, Cornell and an orchid bog. Cornell had made a mess of the situation and they
had to have someone come in who knew how to talk to people and the situation was
resolved. He knows what no means and sometimes it is absolute but he doesn’t think
that is what we are dealing with.
B. Beck said that in regard to the Freeville to McLean trail, he doesn’t know when they
will be able to revisit the idea but he hopes it will be soon before they have more
development which might make it harder or impossible to have the trail.
C. Smith thanked Supr. Sumner and the Town Board for their work with the Trails. He
appreciates their hard work.
Supr. Sumner said she does want to move forward with the Trail Maintenance Guide.
It is getting to be nicer out and the guide will be needed. B. Beck said that he will talk
to R. Young again.
Dryden Conservation Board
February 24, 2015
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Eileen Munch, Design Connect Project Manager
Ms. Munch said that her group is looking at about 6 miles of trail. Design Connect is a
student run consulting club based out of Cornell.
There are 11 students working on this project. They have members ranging from
undergraduate sophomores to second year graduate students working on majors
include City and Regional Planning, Landscape Architecture and various fields of
engineering, and one design and environmental analysis person. By May, they hope to
have completed a conditions assessment, a SWOT (Strength, Weakness, Opportunity,
Threats) analysis as they are applied to social, environmental and economic factors, a
conceptual design (to address road and water crossings) and a cost assessment.
D. Weinstein verified that the Design Connect group wasn’t planning on knocking on
landowners’ doors but that the Conservation Board was going to do that leg work.
B. Beck said that the Board will be glad to help as needed.
D. Weinstein asked what, beyond facilitating site visits with landowners, kind of
information will her group need from the Town or the Conservation Board. He said
that they want to be ready to help her when she needs the help.
Ms. Munch said she has already gotten good material from Supr. Sumner and B.
Beck. The group has a formal research phase that ends in a week and then they will
be working on opening a conversation with the general community, if possible.
D. Weinstein asked if Design Connect wanted to be part of the conversation, do they
want to start the outreach before May or do they want to finish their designs and leave
the communication to the Conservation Board.
Ms. Munch replied that outreach is a very big component in Design Connect and they
want it to be part of the project. Although on paper, the client is the Conservation
Board and the Town of Dryden, in reality the community is their client as well and
they don’t want to create a conceptual design in a vacuum. They have to present it to
the Town Board in May and prefer to have the landowners on board.
B. Beck agreed it is important to start the outreach and getting landowners interested
and involved.
M. Richmond said the start could be identifying the landowners that will be affected.
N. Munkenbeck asked if the outreach is for the entire community or only those whose
land is affected by the trail.
Ms. Munch said that was something she had been thinking about. She thinks there is
merit in reaching out to the landowners that would be affected but, although the trail
will be traversing their property directly, they are not the only ones to gain or lose as a
result. She would like to open the outreach to the entire community. There are folks
who might know more about the trail than Design Connect can learn and their input
would be valuable.
N. Munkenbeck suggested a specific invitation for the land owner and a general notice
to the entire public.
B. Beck said that they will have to get a list of all the landowners along the trail.
D. Weinstein suggested that instead of mailing to the land owners that they actually
go out and approach them personally. People might be willing to speak up more in a
casual setting.
N. Munkenbeck asked who was going to talk to all those people considering how little
time there is before May. She anticipates that there will be angry voices at the
meeting.
Dryden Conservation Board
February 24, 2015
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D. Weinstein disagreed based on his belief that most of the people along this section of
trail are already pretty much on board. He doesn’t think there are going to be many
that will be against it.
C. Smith believes that it might improve the chances of keeping this project moving by
not having individual approaches to each household with each household then
spinning it however they want for better or worse and then sharing it with their
neighbors. If you have a meeting with all the people that receive a notice, you will still
get everybody leaving with a different perspective.
D. Weinstein agreed that might be a better idea, it might stop the rumor mill.
C. Smith asked if it might be fair to co-sponsor this project with the DRYC,
Conservation Board, Town Board and Design Connect. We should spread the heat
around.
J. Sherman responded that something coming from the Conservation Board probably
won’t go over very well.
N. Munkenbeck said it might be even better if it was just Design Connect.
M. Richmond asked what Ms. Munch’s approach would be to get people involved.
B. Beck pointed out that this is a learning experience for the students.
Ms. Munch said she has some people on her team who have shaped outreach
meetings like this before. If she had not met anyone here or attended the Town Board
meeting Thursday she would have put an ad in the paper, contacting local leaders and
asking them to invite people on their list-serves and then a neighbor notification to let
people know that Design Connect is really interested in their concerns and thoughts.
R. Ryan asked when and where the public outreach meeting should happen
D. Weinstein asked what days might be better for Design Connect and suggested the
meeting be held at the Varna Community Center.
R. Ryan asked what the Design Connect team wants to have in hand for the meeting.
N. Munkenbeck suggested that the Design Connect team determine the date.
D. Weinstein asked that the Design Connect group decide on several dates that might
work for them and he will check with the Varna Center to see when it is available.
C. Smith asked if anyone knows the status of hiring a planner. It would be helpful to
have one to assist with this project.
All that has been said is that the Town has had one qualified candidate.
Ms. Munch asked whether week nights or week ends tend to be better for getting
people to show up. The Board recommended week nights.
G. Dodici recapped: someone is going to send a letter to landowners and a newspaper
advertisement for the rest of them that might be interested. Design Connect will draft
a letter for the Board to review.
R. Ryan suggested that the Board invite some of the folks that are along the south
/east hill recreation way who had feared having a trail near them. They might be able
alleviate the concerns that people along this section of trail might have.
A. Leonard said she would be happy to speak as an advocate since she has a trail
running across her property. She can tell you exactly what happens when you have a
trail across your property. She said trails attract the kind of people that you want
around, not those that you don’t want around.
D. Weinstein said it also raises property values.
Reports and Updates:
Dryden Conservation Board
February 24, 2015
Page 7 of 7
Town Board: Linda Lavine
See discussion above with Supr. Sumner
Planning Board: David Weinstein
They have not met since the last meeting.
Ag Advisory Committee: Craig Schutt
They finalized the landowner’s and farmer’s surveys. The surveys were sent out to
farmers and landowners that have ag assessment.
DRYC: Rick Ryan
The DRYC is trying to get reorganized and worked on getting their meeting set up. He
is meeting with Todd Bittner on Monday to discuss ways to ensure the two groups
don’t compete. He will also talk to the DRYC about working together on the trails.
Tompkins County EMC: Steve Bissen
No report
Continuing Business:
Dryden Trails and Preserve Guide: Rick Ryan
Todd Bittner called B. Beck to verify that the Conservation Board isn’t “competing”
with the County. The suggestion was made that this Board can just extract the
information they need from the County project (a website of all County trails) but L.
Lavine and C. Smith believe the information that this group can gather will be far
better than what the County will be using.
D. Weinstein suggested that the members start creating the descriptive section for the
Town’s trail map. They don’t want it to be just a book of maps but to have information
regarding the natural features.
Resolutions from 2014
See above.
Campbell Meadow Sign: G. Dodici
B. Beck asked G. Dodici to make minor changes to the sign design he created and
then return it to B. Beck.
Goals for 2015:
Revisit next month.
There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 8:53PM
Respectfully Submitted,
Erin A. Bieber
Deputy Town Clerk