HomeMy WebLinkAboutPB Minutes 2004-03-04FILE
DATE
SPECIAL MEETING OF THE TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
THURSDAY, MARCH 4, 2004
The Town of Ithaca Planning Board met in special session on Thursday, March 4; 2004,
in Town Hall, 215 North Tioga Street, Ithaca, New York, at 7:00 p.m.
PRESENT: Fred Wilcox, Chairperson; Eva Hoffmann, Board Member; George
Conneman, Board Member; Tracy Mitrano, Board Member; Rod Howe, Board Member;
Kevin Talty, Board Member Jonathan Kanter, Director of. Planning; John Barney,
Attorney for the Town; Dan Walker, Director of Engineering
EXCUSED: ' Board Member; Larry Thayer; Susan Ritter, Assistant Director of Planning;
Michael Smith, Environmental Planner.
OTHERS: John Bowers, 1406 Trumansburg Road; Celia Bowers, 1406 Trumansburg
Road; Gordon Walden, 121 Hopkins Road; June Walden, 121 Hopkins Road; Tom
Garcia, Tompkins Community Action, 701 Spencer Road; Paul Richards, 142 Bundy
Road; Jo Richards, 142 Bundy Road; Sharon M. Marx, 156 Bundy Road; Gerald Hall,
1307 Trumansburg Road; Patricia Hall, 1307 Trumansburg Road; Barbara Blanchard,
316 Brookfield Road; Doria Higgins, 2 Hillcrest Drive; Herb Engman, 120 Warren Road;
Anna Smith, 242 DuBois Road; Chris Crosby, American Red Cross, 201 West Clinton
Street; Steven Daughhetee, 245 Hayts Road; Sidney Merritt, 127 Woolf Lane; Joyce
Merritt, 127 Woolf Lane; Joseph McEnerney, 131 Hopkins Road; Sandra Conrad, Ithaca
Neighborhood Housing Services, 60 Spring Road, Groton; Jon Hitsous, 87,Uptown
Road; Joseph Sweet, Ithaca Neighborhood Housing, 407 Hancock Street, Peter
Trowbridge, Trowbridge and Woolf, 1345 Mecklenburg Road; Diane Hardy, American
Red Cross, 201 West Clinton Street; James Knowlton, American Red Cross, 201 West
Clinton Street; George Gesslein, 118 Sharpstein Road, Locke; Paul Mazzarella, Ithaca
Neighborhood Housing; Brenda Ludwig, WHCU; Carol Chock,. 39 Woodcrest Avenue; K.
Houpt, Town of Ulysses; Deborah Campbell, 1445 Trumansburg Road; Tim Ciaschi, 120
Grove Road; Joel Harlan, Newfield; David Herrick, T.G. Miller, 203 North Aurora Street;
Chris Papamichael, Aris Development; Heather Weiss, 105 DuBois Road.
Chairperson Wilcox declared the meeting duly opened at 7:10 p.m., and.accepted for the
record Secretary's Affidavit of Posting and Publication of the Notice of Public Hearings in
Town Hall and the Ithaca Journal on February 27, 2004 and March 1, 2004, together
with the properties under discussion, as appropriate, upon the Clerks of the City of
Ithaca and the Town of Danby, upon the Tompkins County Commissioner of Planning,
upon the Tompkins County Commissioner of Public Works, and upon the , applicants
and /or agents, as appropriate, on March 1, 2004.
Chairperson Wilcox
read the Fire
Exit Regulations to
those assembled, as required by
the
New York State
Department of
State, Office of Fire
Prevention and Control.
Special meeting called to order at 7: 10 p.m.
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Chairperson Wilcox — It's good to see you all again
doesn't it?
AGENDA ITEM: PERSONS TO BE HEARD
It feels like we were just here,
Chairperson Wilcox opened this segment of the meeting at 7:11 p.m.
Chairperson Wilcox - Alright, the first item, ladies and gentlemen, as always. is Persons
to be Heard. If you wish to address the Planning Board this evening on an issue, a topic
that has nothing to do with the proposed Overlook at West Hill Project, may I ask that
you please step to the microphone, have a seat, give us your name and address. We
would be most interested to heard what you have to say. If you are here to speak about
the Overlook project, you will have your chance in a few moments. Mr. Merritt. Now, as I
said, if this have anything to do with Overlook, it has to wait. Okay.
Sidney Merritt, 127 Woolf Lane — I just have a simple question for the Chairman. Would
you please confirm that the Town Planning Board has a responsibility to support the best
interests of the residents of the Town of Ithaca? That's my question.
Chairperson Wilcox — Take a seat.
Mr. Merritt — Do I get an answer?
Chairperson Wilcox.— Take a seat. Would anybody else like to address the Board this
evening?
Mr. Merritt, I will. address you in this fashion, the Planning Board has rules and
regulations and responsibilities under which we must operate. They include State Law,
Town Law, Zoning Ordinance and those are the guidelines, the rules, the laws under
which we operate and must operate. I think I'll stop there. John?
Mr. Barney — That's a fair statement. There are a number of criteria that the Planning
Board has to consider when it considers any matter before it. Those are spelled out in
some length in the statutes and there is some interpretation that goes along with that.
Chairperson Wilcox — There's your answer.
AGENDA ITEM CONTINUATION OF PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of
Preliminary Subdivision Approval, Preliminary Site Plan Approval, and a
,recommendation to the Town Board regarding the Zoning Change for the
proposed residential development, Overlook at West Hill, located at 1290
Trumansburg Road (NYS Route 96), Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 244-14.2,
Residential District R -15. The proposal consists of two phases of residential
development, consisting of 128 affordable rental apartment units in .16 buildings
and a. community center in Phase I on a 24.5 +/- acre portion of Tax Parcel No. 24-
4 -14.2, and 15 lots for single - family, market rate homes in Phase II on about 19
acres of the subject property. The current owners would retain about 5 acres
containing the existing medical practice fronting on Trumansburg Road. The
applicant is currently requesting consideration of rezoning the 24.5 +/- acres for
affordable rental apartments from R -15 Residence to MR Multiple Residence and
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preliminary subdivision and site plan approval for the Phase I apartments. Song
Ja Kyong, Owner; Aris Investments, Applicant; Grace Chiang, HOLT Architects
and Peter. Trowbridge, Trowbridge & Wolf, Landscape Architects, Agents. This is
a continuation of the Public Hearing that was opened on February 26, 2004:
Chairperson Wilcox opened this segment of the meeting at 7:13 p.m.
Chairperson Wilcox — Ladies and gentlemen, I mentioned it to some of you who were
here early, the way we will operate tonight is, since this is a continuation of a Public
Hearing which began last Thursday, we will allow those persons who have not yet
spoken as part of this Public Hearing to speak first: It' is not our intent, once again; to
impose time limits. We will give you an opportunity to speak what is on your mind. When
everyone has spoken a first time, anybody who then wishes to make some additional
comments to the Planning Board, will be given tow.minutes and limited to two minutes.
That will take care of those of you who, in the intervening one week, have some
additional comments to make or wish to have made some additional comments last
Thursday. When the Public Hearing is closed, I have a few letters that I have been
asked to read and I will read them. Then the Planning Board will be asked to make it's
decision. Given that, the floor is open, whoever wishes to speak. Barbara, your hand is
up first.
Barbara Blanchard, 316 Brookfield Road — Thank you Mr. Chairman. My back lot line
borders the. Town of Ithaca. I also represent the area in question where the project is to
be located on the County Legislature. I would guess from the crowd here tonight, that I
am probably going to loss about 60 votes if I stand for re- election again. However, I did
want to be here tonight and to thank you, first of all, for accepting the letter that I
submitted at one of your earlier meetings. I was not able to be here in person because of
the County Legislative meeting, but I appreciate your taking the written comment.
In addition to my work on the Legislature, I am a certified housing analysis for the
State of New York and for the Federal Government and I've spent virtually all of my
professional life since 1966 working on behalf of affordable housing in New York State
and other parts of the County.
I've been out of Town for a little while and when I came back and read the
newspapers, there were two things that struck me and have brought me here tonight and
I'll address those very briefly. First of all, there seem to be feelings among people that
there was no one from the area that was supportive of this project. I do live in the area, I
do represent it and, as you know from my previous letter, I do support the project. I
wanted to make that clear. The second thing I was reading in the paper was a number of
comments that had to do with why is all the affordable housing begin concentrated on
West Hill. I just did a quick kind of casual listing today of all the affordable housing
projects that I knew of personally, in Tompkins County and I thought it might be helpful
just to enter them into the record. The communities that have affordable housing include:
Groton, Lansing, Caroline, Dryden, Ulysses, the Town of Newfield, the City, of course,
with a number of different projects: Titus Towers, Overlook Terrace, the Northside
Apartments, Southside, McGraw House, West Village and a complex on Floral Avenue.
So Linderman Creek, which is practically in my front yard, which I also supported and
the project which your considering as a complex on West Hill, I think that doesn't not
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consider an undo burden on that area. It looks, to me, like we have a fair amount of
distribution here.
One last remark that I would like to make is that I think it's perfectly appropriate
for people to say that more communities need to share the development of housing for
families and elderly individuals that need affordable apartments and I hope more will do
so. Thank you very much.
Chairperson Wilcox— Next,
Tom Garcia, 701 Spencer Road — Good evening. I am the Director of Housing Services
for Tompkins Community Action. I was not able to be here at your last meeting, but I
gather one of my staff associates did speak, Jasmine Caberro. I am basically here to
back up some of the comments that she made. TO give you some general information,
Tompkins Community Action currently administers 802 vouchers in this County for
affordable housing. All 802 vouchers are in use. That is to say that, on top of that, there
are 602 people on our waiting list that need vouchers. Affordable housing is a crucial
issue. Currently, the County Planning Board and the County Legislature is working on
their comprehensive plan and I know, as the preliminary draft starts coming out, you are
going to see an immense amount of communication that is coming out about affordable
housing. Tompkins Community Action is very much in support of the Overlook housing
project because there are two things that it is going to do for us, it's going to bring.
decent, safe, affordable housing. It is going to be 124 units over a period of time.
Another area that is:very important to us is that we have 86 people on the waiting list
that are disabled or handicapped. It is very difficult to find handicapped units with ramps
and whatever else. These buildings are going to provide a number of units that are going
to be handicapped accessible and adaptable, which is very important for that particular
population.
I just want to give you some general information. The fair market rents, currently,
in this County are, if you would look at one bedroom goes for $529, a two bedroom goes
for $679, a three bedroom $949, a four bedroom $118. These are the rents that we can
afford to pay with subsidies. The tenants are.required to pay 30 percent of their adjusted_
income. Our income levels are going to go from a family at 30. percent of the median
income at $12,450 up to a family of four at $17,750. If they're at 50.percent of the
median income, we can do a family of one at $20,700 or a family of four at $29,800. So
the spectrum of income, the way.this housing project is going to be designed fits our
waiting list. There are also a lot of people at lower income that can be housed here, we
will just have to provide more subsidies, if the vouchers are available. We are constantly
requesting more vouchers from the State.
I came just to give you a little more information. I know Jasmine spoke about the
waiting list and also some of the history of her own personal life and I just wanted to
support where Tompkins Community Action is. We are very much in support of this and
feel the need for the continuation of affordable housing. That's all I have to say.
Chairperson Wilcox — I need an address, -either personally or professional.
Mr. Garcia — This is professional. 701 Spencer Road, Ithaca, New York, Tompkins
Community Action.
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Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you. Is there someone else_ over there who had a hand up.
Yes ma'am.
Tricia Whitney, 100 Graham Road - First of all I want to say thank you. I am the property
manager at the Meadows Town Homes and I just wanted to take a few minutes to
discuss, my experience as a manager at a market rate housing community. I lease
apartments through phone calls that I receive, advertising and marketing. We. keep a
monthly hone log of all the phone calls that are received and, if they are not interested,
the reason that they are not interested: Roughly seven out of ever ten calls that I
receive, say they cannot afford the rents based on their salaries. I go around to the new
businesses that open to do part of my marketing, as I introduce myself and our complex,
I. am usually told that many of the employees cannot afford the apartments that we run,
based on their salaries and that the only one that would be able to afford it would be the
manager. That would be places such as Target, Chili's, Home Depot, any of the newer
properties that have opened. We maintain a monthly market study of our comparable
properties, such as Lansing West, Northwood, Gaslight Village, Warren Wood and
Candlewick. Candlewick being the one that is down the road from the Overlook at West
Hill on Trumansburg Road. The average rates among the five properties that I study are
one bedrooms run between $780 and $850, two bedrooms run between $895 and $945
and a three bedroom runs $1115, most of which the residents have to pay their own
utilities. SO, I just wanted to give out some facts and some statements. I also have stuff
if anybody needs to see it on the prices. Thank you.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you.
Board Member Hoffmann Could you repeat the rates for tow bedroom units?
Ms. Whitney Sure. The -tow bedrooms run between $895 and $945
Mr. Barney — If I could ask, the one bedroom was $780 to?
Ms. Whitney - $780 to $850.
Mr. Barney — Thank you.
Ms. Whitney — You're welcome.
Chairperson Wilcox — We should point out that none of those town homes are owned by
Aris Investments. Yes ma'am.
Sandra Conrad, 60 Spring Run Road, Freeville —. I am the property manage for Ithaca
Neighborhood Housing Services. I wanted to address the Board tonight and I appreciate
your taking the time to listen to everyone here that is pro - affordable housing and I
wanted to speak as my experience as a property manager with Ithaca Neighborhood
Housing over the last seven years. When I came into the program seven years ago, our
vacancy rate, just to give you an idea, was running about five to seven percent. That
has, over the past seven years, dropped dramatically. Over the past three years, our
vacancy rate has been less than one percent. The 2000 census indicated that there was
enough housing for the number of households. I don't believe that if you looked at
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today's census that it would show that. I think that what you are seeing now is a dramatic
drop in.the housing availability and that the demand has out - weighted the housing units
that are available. So, I wanted to speak about a couple of those issues, just to give you
an example so that you understand the housing shortage that we have for low- income
families: We had a studio that just became available. I advertised it for three days. We
had a flood of about 30 or 40 calls. All the people that called in were low- income people.
We showed it probably to ten to 15 clients. We had five applicants within one day, they
were all low- income, they all qualified. Unfortunately, we could only.give it to one
qualified applicant. So, we had four on our waiting list. We have no other apartments
available. I don't foresee any other apartments in any of the categories, studios, one,
twos or three bedroom, coming available for another three to four months.
When they talk about the vouchers that are available through the Section 8
program, our experience is that, when people call us, the first thing they ask is "Do you
accept the Section 8 voucher ", because many of these low- income families, their first
experience, when they start calling around, after they receive that voucher, is that there
is no housing available that accepts Section 8. Very few landlords. It used to be that
many landlords accepted the Section 8 vouchers. It's becoming less and less frequent
that landlords will accept the voucher because of many issues that have some up in the
market place, one is that they can rent they can rent the units to someone who doesn't
have a Section 8 voucher and get more rent for the units, so why would they want to rent
to a Section 8 person and lower the rent to meet their needs? The other issue is with.
lead paint. In many of the older homes that are around in the area. Landlords don't want
to deal with the Section 8 housing quality inspection that have to go on and so they
would rather not rent to someone who has a Section 8 voucher. So, while there are
vouchers out there for low- income families, the housing is not there for them to be able
to get into a low- income affordable housing. So, they have to turn in their vouchers. We
see this over and over. They have a voucher, they are out there looking for two to three
months and they have to then turn in their voucher and lose their opportunity to find
housing that is affordable. Many times, what ends up happening to these people is that
they end up living with other family members; they end up being in crowded housing that
maybe doesn't meet the standards that they deserve. Many of the "affordable" units are
very poorly run, they are in very poor quality.condition. The landlords aren't meeting the
minimum standards for housing codes, lead paint issues that aren't being met, peeling
paint and issues like that. So, I just wanted to let you know, from my experience, as to
what a lot of these low- income families are facing when they are looking for an
affordable apartment. I've looked over the rent structure for the project and these rents
meet their needs, in terms of the structure. It is affordable for them, based on.a person's
income of $12,000, a rent of $311 is a very affordable rent. It's only 30 percent of their
income. We see _many people that some into our program that are so desperate for
housing that they are willing to pay 50 and 60 percent of their income, just so that they
have adequate housing and good - quality housing and a landlord who cares, who takes
care of the .units, who will take care of the maintenance issues that some along. So that
they don't have to deal with furnaces that don't work, problems with carbon. monoxide
poisoning because furnaces aren't and we've seen that just recently in the County.
Those are all issues of health and safety that this affordable project will provide for many
residents who can't find housing right now. I think it's a very viable project. We need
more housing in this County. Thank you.
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Chairperson Wilcox — I can actually verify that I fall within the range of rents for a two
bedroom apartment, for what it's worth. Next. Sir?
Jon Hitsous, 87 Uptown Road = I'm currently an intern with the American Red Cross of
Tompkins County. I would also like to place it on the record that I am a student of Cornell
University, College of Human Ecology. By that virtue alone, I am going to assume that
there are a couple of people here who probably don't think that I belong here, after all,
as a student, my presence here is temporary. To, that, I have to admit. I've been here
since July of 2002. That is less than two years. Now, in that miniscule amount of time,
research aside, I've seen with my own eyes, that there are homeless people on the
streets. You go to Ithaca Commons, you go to Wegmans and you are going to see them.
Now, how anybody can counter that there is not a problem with homeless or that there is
no need for affordable housing, and these are people who have been living here since
before I was born, obviously, they are not looking in the right places. I
I am going to speak under the assumption that human beings are reasonable
people, that they like, whenever they can, to help each other out. Now, if you were to
give a survey to people, by themselves, alone, based on that assumption of people
genuinely wanted to help each other out and you ask them about homeless people, you
ask them about affordable housing, I'm positive that many of the same people in this
room would respond enthusiastically that there is a need for affordable housing and that
we have to do something about it. Well, here's your chance or a chance. There is areal
possibility right now to build 128 units of affordable housing and now these same people
who would respond affirmatively in a survey are saying "Well, we still need affordable
housing, but.." Feel free to fill in the blank with whatever issue that's been proposed here
already.
Now, I haven't lived here, as I said, for a long time, and I would never be so bold
as to undermine some of the local values of the members of this community hold so.dear
to them and that they. have raised in opposition to the development of the Overlook, but I
would also say that as the issue of affordable housing has been proven as the number
one cause of homelessness in every county in the United States that this is a problem
that is bigger than the Town of Ithaca, it is bigger than the County of Tompkins and it's
bigger than the State of New York.
Other issues that people have brought up, such as transportation, such as safety;
I am gong to assume that the local government here has already begun to address
these issues. I am going to assume that the local government has already begun to
address these issues. I would assume that if transportation and safety were an issue,
that they have been for a while and that the presence or non- presence of the Overlook
isn't going to change anything and that, as has been rightfully pointed out in other
hearings, that they will be addressed in their fullness in their own hearings. As to the
question as to whether or not the housing itself is going to be affordable, some people
here have designated "affordable" as housing at $250 and below. This is simply not a
possibility. We live in a time of inflation and we live in a time where political issues that
have trickled down from the state and federal governments and forced our local
governments to raise property values at unprecedented levels. Landlords simply can't
afford to charge rents of $250, even if they wanted to and besides that, talking about low
income people, we must take into consideration that many of these people qualify for
Section 8 and other income maintenance programs, programs that are conditional upon
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certain guidelines and certain behaviors. Given this, not only would Overlook be
sufficient to provide housing for low income people, but we could probably assume that
the low income people who are living there are not in the negative light, that theses
residents are choosing to better themselves right now or therefore, they wouldn't qualify
for the income maintenance programs necessary to supplement the rents at any level
that they are designated.
There has also been an issue brought up that it won't just be all low income
residents at the Overlook. There was an issue about graduate students living there. As a
student myself, I can say that graduate students don't have a lot of money, that's for
sure and I can also testify, with confidence that a lot of graduate students,' especially
those with families are not just leeches upon the community, they are productive
citizens, contributing in a very productive way and they also pay taxes and vote. That
aside, there is also little evidence that there would be a shortage of graduate student
housing. There are many developments, some of which have already been listed today,
that have a very large population of graduate housing and many of these people are my
neighbors. They, to the best of my knowledge, are very happy with their arrangements
as of the present. Finally, I would like to address the issue that this Would have an ,
impact on the character of the community. I can see no way that the Overlook is going to
have a negative impact on the community. If anything, it is going to have positive impact
because this means that there are going to be less homeless people on our streets and
in our shelters. Moreover, I am disturbed by the assumption that some of the members .
of the opposition have made that the Overlook would, in anyway, have a detrimental
effect on the Ithaca Schools. This is a complete false. There has been no study, to my
knowledge, that has displayed that there is a correlation between education ability and
any demographical factor, with the exception of the study the Bell Curve by Charles
Murray, which many. of you might know is arguably one of the most questionable and
refuted studies of our time. It is insulting to believe that the Ithaca .schools would be
somehow marred by the inclusion of students from low income house holds. You can
call it what you wish, but the last time I checked, we already had a name for placing
children from different backgrounds into the same classroom, that name is integration
and integration is a good thing.
In closing, some might ask what right I have to come in here and speak about a
development that will undoubtedly outlast my time in Ithaca. To this I would counter that
the Overlook will outlast all of us in this room. We have a chance right now to be part of
an incredible act of selflessness towards those that are less fortunate than we are or we
can do what people in many communities have done and make excuses for why, all of a
sudden, we feel that loss income housing is no longer necessary in our community. The
choice is now in the hands of the people on the Board. In closing, I would say that if you
choose to reject this development, the next time such a chance comes abound, if such a
chance comes around, the problem my be out of our direct control. Thank you.
Chris Crosby, 65 River Street, Cortland - For the last eight plus years, I have had what I
consider an honor and a privilege to work here in the Ithaca area for two service
providers that work directly with people who are homes or at risk of being homeless. The
one thing that I get when I speak with, not only people from Ithaca, Cortland and even
my own family who are from the north country, when I mention the word "homeless" they
get this horrible vision of people who are slumped in a corner or sleeping on a park
bench. The homeless people that I have had the privilege of working with in the last
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eight years are people like you and I that we see every day on the streets. I work with
both professionals from Cornell and Ithaca College, from businesses in town, from
different areas that for just whatever reason can't afford to live in the Ithaca area.
Personally, the 45 minutes commute a make everyday, I would love to live in the Ithaca
area, but even with my salary and my wife's salary, we couldn't afford it. So, I deal with
the 45 minutes commute and, at times, enjoy it. But, the winters are pretty nasty and it
would be nice to live in Ithaca. That's my choice to do, there are people who actually are
living in substandard housing and they don't have that much of a choice because they
can't afford anyplace. The Section 8 vouchers that people have spoken about are gone
and it looks like the future of additional vouchers aren't very bright. They are proposing
now to cut Section 8 vouchers. for the Country, so that means even less affordable
housing for people who have it now. Right now, in the Red Cross Shelters, there is just
about 60 people and those are single people, there is a number.of families. We have
people who have been looking for housing for going on three months who just,. for one
reason or another, just can't find affordable housing, even with the Section 8 voucher.
The cost of housing in the Ithaca area is very high. We've had special occasions where
we've had the clients we work with who live in the outside communities and stuff
because they are on a bus route and they work.
A lot of people we work with are working people, but again, because of the cost
of housing, for a single mother with two or three kids to be able to be able to work even a
part time job and look for housing to deal with child care and all the other costs, they just
can't afford it. The Overlook Project that we are putting people in now if affordable
housing. The project that is being proposed, while it's going to make a dent in the
number of people that we are going to get out of the shelter, we need more projects like
this. There are a lot of people that are out there today that, you know, are on the streets
and busting their butts just to trying to get into places they need to, but they just can't
afford it. Thank you.
Chairperson Wilcox —Tim, do you have your hand up in the back, is that you? Or the
lady?
Carol Chock, 39 Woodcrest Avenue — I also live in the City, looking across my back yard
at the Town of Ithaca at multi -unit housing on the other side of Town. I would like to just
say, just to start, that hasn't been a problem. I don't hear too much noise. I don't feel like
there is too much traffic or that multi -unit housing, as a concept, is a negative thing for
me.
I would like to address the question of who is going to live in this housing? I've
worked at Cornell University, I am a professional. I don't think I have had an
administrative as who has been able to live in Tompkins County. So that while I
enjoy the right to have my ten minute commute to work and run home at lunch, if I need
to. The people that would be able to afford in this type of housing are now community
from 45 minutes and an hour away, some on buses. They are not able to go home.for
lunch or be there when their kids come home or even unit, sometimes, very late at night.
They are the people who drive our buses. The images that have been called forth
tonight, it would be very nice if this housing were going to produce housing that would
house all of these homeless people who are wondering around town an produce the
$250 a month rent, but that is not what is being proposed.
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I am a planner, by training and I have had some experience in the planning realm
and I know that the public section, this Board in this case, can't create $25 a month.
housing. The one thing that we can do is really enable a project like this to really come to
fruition. To do it's one little piece to address a question of housing and I believe housing,
is one of the few items, the need for affordable housing and promotion of all kinds of
housing, home ownership, affordable housing, housing at different levels, is the one
thing that they've been able to agree on the federal level, democrats, republicans agree
on this issue. It would be nice if our community could do it's bit to support that concept.
Finally, let me say that this project, in particular, has the opportunity to have Ithaca
Neighborhood Housing Services involved. If there's any housing agency in Town that
can help make this project work, it would be them. They are called upon nationwide as a
model for small cities and have to reputation to help pull this off so that it works for the.
community. Thank you.
Board Member Mitrano — I have a question, if you would, before you leave. Last week
we heard some speakers question the safety of this project, I ask you because you
mentioned that you do planning. I ask you as a person who has some general expertise,
I don't expect you to have looked at the specs, I don't expect that you can analyze this
question, but is there . anything about that that you can speak to.
Ms. Chock.— The thing that struck me was that there have already been studies done of
the impact of traffic and things like that because of the hospital and because of the PRI
development and I don't know why the assumption should be any different on those
kinds of items for this project. If anything, those are more kinds of commercial kinds of
establishments That are going to generate more trips back and forth. I think we are
going to see mostly working people that are going to come and go the way that we do
from our homes.
Board Member Mitrano — With children, I guess, was the particular question that was
raised last week.
Ms. Chock — I live in a part of the City that has a higher density with people with children
and working people and they come and go and they manage to make it work. I can't
really comment on the specific numbers, but it does seem that the Town and the County
have looked at the numbers.
Board Member Mitrano — Thank you
Chairperson Wilcox — Anybody else? Yes ma'am.
Joyce Merritt, 127 Woolf Lane — Can you hear me alright?
Chairperson Wilcox — We can hear you Mrs. Merritt.
Ms. Merritt — I am kind of going to have to speak for the whole group, many of whom
couldn't be here tonight for one reason or another and also most of the reset of those
who are here could only speak for two minutes. I don't understand the protocol and
procedure for board meetings. It seems like the deck is stacked against us speaking and
responding. I resent so much time being taken up at the last meeting and then again
tonight by these planted people who have, I'm sure, been asked to speak tonight
10
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
because they're not from West Hill, they are.all connected with low income housing and
so forth. There isn't anyone on West Hill who doesn't understand the crucial need for low
income housing in the Ithaca area and that's never been a question about needing to
have it explained over and over again tonight, why there is such a need. What I question
and many of us question is, is this the right place to do it? For the City, the Town, the
whole area. I don't know. We don't know about any previous investigations by Aris for
other sites that might be better ones for this project. Also the fact that this particular
project is going to cover such a small number of housing units in the area where it is
crucially needed. It doesn't seem like the right project. I'm thinking from what these
people have said tonight that this is only going to be a stop gap measure. That it
provides so little of the needs. There is going to have to be another development. How
soon it will be, I don't know, but I would think the planners and the people concerned
about development in Ithaca would already be busy looking for another place to put a
housing development for the low income people that would be larger and continue on.
Nobody considers the detrimental affects of squeezing out a large population of
wildlife that are on that hill, including foxes, which are our communities most beautiful
wildlife treasures. Nobody talks about the beauty of that particular, hill. It is a very pretty
hill, the slope and the wild type of unplanned vegetation on it. I know these are not going
to sell the Board on delaying on the project, but it breaks my heart.to see this beautiful
hill decimated for a project that is not going to provide the Town with the needs that are
coming up, so I feel very badly about that.
Another thing that I would like to address is that right now, the egos of this
country is to promote development. Build, build, build, put more box stores up, put more
housing up, but in a few years, I do believe that we will be talking about restrained
development and restrained developed applies to this community more than most
because of fact that there is a lake running through the community, a big lake. It can't be
forwarded with a bridge. Ferrying people across the lake doesn't seem logical `and the
only way that cars can get from one hill to another, from one part of Town to another, is
to converge downtown. At some point, down town is not going to be able to
accommodate that growth and I think West Hill, in particular is the most vulnerable hill
and access because of the fact that the hospital is there and it is such a narrow road and
very, very little way to resolve this problem without major, major changes at the octopus
area. West Hill is limited and those of us who live up here and know the topography,
know that the road narrows dangerously so and does not have shoulders in many place,
and in some places there are curbs on both sides and I want to tell you how many times
I have been going up or down and an ambulance or fire truck either barreling at you or
behind you, you have no place to go, two lane are full, there is no shoulder, there is a
curb, it is very, very frightening. Sometimes I am still shaking when I get home from that
type of frightening experience. It's considered that the population will probably double up
here if this project goes through and I don't know.what will happen with the doubling of
the population up here trying to get down that narrow route with more fire trucks, more
police, more ambulances and more traffic.
I would like to mention, indirectly, the problems that I foresee for the future. of
downtown Ithaca, too because of this lack of restraint and growth and this past
administration has begun a major development in growth which will bring in traffic. and so
forth and more people. It certainly is going to add to the burden of low income housing
and we haven't begun to see the affect of that yet.
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Okay, I have talked quite a bit. Are there any questions on what] have said?
Board Member Conneman — Can I ask a question?
Chairperson Wilcox — Absolutely
Board Member Conneman — Mrs. Merritt, I have a question for you. There may be a
difference as to whether you think the hill is beautiful of I think it is beautiful, let's get past
that.
Ms. Merritt — Of course.
Board Member Conneman — Some people would say it's brush and it wasn't beautiful.
Ms. Merritt — To some people it doesn't matter.
Board Member Conneman —.Let me ask you this questions, part of the job the Planning.
Board has here is to re =zone this. If we allow affordable housing, we have to re -zone it.
Suppose it wasn't re- zoned, suppose instead of having what is proposed by this
developer, we had, let's see, 90 single family homes on that hill. Would that make you
feel any better?
Ms. Merritt - On that particular hill?
Board Member Conneman - Yes.
Ms. Merritt — I would like to see, again, restrained development. on. that hill.
Board Member Conneman — So you would like nothing?
Ms. Merritt — Oh no, no. I would like to say that I have no objection to this project if I
thought that it really fulfilled the need of this community. So, my first objection is that it
doesn't seem to, from all the research that we have done, accomplish what Aris is trying
to tell us it will.
Board Member Conneman
— Would it fulfill it
if,
in fact
we let
them build 90 single family,
market value homes on the
same property?
Is
there a
need
for that?
Ms. Merritt — I would like to see, let's say that it doesn't go through for that particular
area, I would have much less objection for it being placed further up on West Hill, where
there aren't the terrible traffic and fears of it being dangerous intersection being nearby
the hospital and the traffic could move more freely.
Board Member Conneman — Suppose we put it up on the fruit farm?
Ms. Merritt — Apple orchard?
Board Member Conneman — Yeah, over by the apple orchard, would that be any better?
12
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Ms. Merritt — I think it would be because it's not so "in your face" as this is going to be.
Board Member Conneman - People have got to come down that road. It doesn't matter.
Chairperson Wilcox — We're talking about that fruit farm up the hill. Indian Creek.
Board Member Conneman - What would be the difference? You would come down
Hayts Road and get on —
Ms. Merritt — I think the problem of the overgrowth is going to be a real problem.
Board Member Conneman — So, the real thing is you're opposed to growth or nay kind?
Ms. Merritt — Of course not.
Chairperson Wilcox — I don't want to get into a debate. If you want to ask questions, she
can answer them.
Board Member Conneman — That was the question, in my opinion. I asked her if she
was opposed to growth of any kind.
Ms. Merritt — Certainly not.
Board Member Conneman — It is a dangerous road Mrs. Merritt, we all know that. We
had away to mitigate that at one point in time, which was turned down as you probably
know because I think you have lived here maybe as long as I have..
Ms. Merritt — Thirteen years.
Board Member Conneman — Well, maybe that's not long enough. Maybe John and I
have to remind you that there was a proposal to build a four lane road into Ithaca and
eliminate all this stuff on Cliff Street so that you can get downtown and there would have
been less traffic in my view. But the issue here is that what a Planning Board does, in my
view, is to try to take .a proposal and, if it is viable, if it is possible, to change that
proposal so that it is better. In other words, can we mitigate the traffic, the safety for the
kids and all that kind of stuff. That is our job.
Board Member Hoffmann — Yes.
Board Member Conneman — That is what we would try to do.
Ms. Merritt — To that, my answer would be that it would be better to put it away from the
hospital so that it doesn't presents the dangerous aspect for children that we talked
about in the previous meetings of children and adults crossing.the street.
Board Member Conneman — Last time, I assume you were here last time, we talked
about mitigating that by having the right kind of traffic signal down there so it would be as
safe as you can make it.
Ms. Merritt— I didn't speak last time.
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Board Member Conneman — I know.
Chairperson Wilcox — All set for now.
Board Member Conneman — I'm all set.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you very much. Ma'am? Did you speak last week? Then
you may come us. Let me make sure and explain, if you spoke before and did not speak
last Thursday, then you spoke as part of the Public Hearing for the Environmental
Review. This is now the Public Hearing for the subdivision, the site plan and the zoning
recommendation.
Anna Smith, 242 Dubois Road — I live on Dubois Road, just off of Route 96. Not to be
too repetition, but the issue is not about affordable housing in the neighborhood, it is
about the density of the project. We all, I think every person agrees, that there is a. great
need for affordable housing and for some lucky people, I guess rents of $600 plus are
actually considered affordable..
Last week when we were here, Ms. Hoffmann asked a question about the buffer
zone being planted around the proposed Overlook project and we were told, as I
understood it, that natural vegetation would be maintained and some other trees would
be planted also and specifically maples and crab apples were mentioned. If this project
is approved and goes forward, I would ask the Board to consider that buffer zone issue a
little more carefully because, for six months of the year, I don't see how deciduous trees
are going to provide much of a buffer. However, I sincerely hope the project is not
approved as presented because of the density of the housing. As you consider the
project, pleas keep in mind that you would be changing the Town Zoning, changing the
Zoning Plan that you just very recently, a couple of months ago, approved, when you
deemed this site inappropriate for high density housing, referring to the new long range
zoning plan. Also, again, traffic. Remember that in addition to the traffic load created by
this proposed project that there is another project underway for some 64 units to go in
lower down on Cliff Street right near Vinegar. Hill. So we have a total of 207 households
that we are talking about, the Overlook project, plus this other one on Cliff Street and I
did attend all these meetings and I haven't heard any traffic analysis of what would
happen down in the west end of Town. I don't know where the traffic engineer did his
studies, but I am thinking of the Octopus and the west end where all these.cars and
buses, etcetera converge. Plus there is also more commercial development going on in
the west end now with all kinds of big plans for that and that is going to draw a lot of
traffic right through there where 96,89 come together, State Street, Fulton Street that
whole bus depot area, the greater west end area. The congestion is also terrific and I
would re -affirm what the previous speaker said about being stuck on Cliff Street when
ambulances are trying to get through, it's awful at rush hour when both lanes are packed
and you're just tooling along at ten miles a hour with an ambulance right behind you and
there is no where for you to go. It's even worse if it's a fire truck, although those are less
frequent.
Imagine what the traffic.would be like if we moved these proposed developments
to a mile or two out Ellis Hollow Road, out Coddington Road, out Slaterville Road or out
Triphammer Road, we'd have all that extra traffic coming in through an already busy
14
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
area, plus commercial development, right at. the edge of Town where all of the cars
come in. I don't think any area can absorb so much traffic and that is.just another reason
to distribute high density projects further around the County. I have no objection to 'this
project, .if it is less dense. Thank you.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you. Yes sir.
Joseph Sweet, 407 Hancock Street — I am a resident member of the Board of Directors
of INHS and it's Executive Committee. I am here to speak in support of the Overlook.
project through a little personal testimony. I've been involved in affordable housing
issues in the City of Ithaca for. the last 20 years, beginning with Cornell University. When
I was a student, I was president of the Student Family Resident Council we fought the
University to improve the conditions of graduate housing in the Hasbrouck, Maplewood
and Pleasant Grove complexes. To it's credit, the University responded so their
residents no longer had an inch and a half of ice on the inside of our.windows and
apartments filled with mildew. I can't tell you the positive effect and I can't tell you the
positive effect that having clean and well insulated, efficient apartments after the
renovations, meant to students and their welfare.
The second phase in my involvement with housing was with the Mutual Housing
Organization. I was one of its founding residents. My little family, among others were the
first two who moved into Mutual Housing downtown. There was a certain amount of.
resistance to that project from the Fall Creek Neighborhood. They said that we might
bring in drug dealers and crime. Some of the other criticisms were litter and trash. Now,
indeed when we first moved in there was drug dealing going on at the bottom of Franklin
and Adams Street every evening, which, in a very short time, the activity of the residents .
who took an enormous pride in their houses because we had new clean, affordable and
efficient units to live in, we had a sort of collective pride which was apparent then. We
worked with Ithaca.City Police and dealt with, eventually the drug issues. Today, in good .
weather, I often ride my bicycle through that neighborhood and what do I see, but the
same conditions with neighbors outside enjoying the grounds, enjoying one another, lots
of children on the street. My involvement with Mutual Housing came at a very difficult
time for me personally. It was the bridge to my, eventually, buying a house on Hancock
Street. It gave me the pride and the determination to better the lives of myself and my
children.
The third phase of my housing involvement is with the Ithaca Neighborhood
Housing Organization, which I have been a member of the Board for about ten years
now. We look, with pride, on the, especially, Cleveland Avenue, site in the south side of
Ithaca, where we feel we have had a marvelous effect in improving that neighborhood
and our organization is always interested in its positive impacts on the neighborhoods
that we are involved in projects. I can't tell you the testimonies that we have in written
testimonies and testimonies I have gathered or have heard from people personally, how
having good affordable housing has improved their lives in all aspects. It certainly did in
mine and I have been grateful for that since. I urge this Board to support the Overlook
project. 128 families who can achieve affordable housing and have that pride and.
positive effect in their lives is worth a little traffic to me. Thank you.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you sir. Anybody else? There is a hand in the back. Tim?
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Tim Ciaschi, 120 Grove Road — I just want to go over, the gentleman here, George, I
believe, had mentioned earlier about 90 single units, as opposed to this project and
believe me-
Board Member Conneman — I said that this was a possibility.
Mr. Ciaschi — That was a possibility. You have to realize I did a subdivision up there
many years ago, as John Barney will tell you and we had our fun back then. The main
issue there was, one of the issues is, they thought it was going to be basically,'junk and I
said well, I'm going to live there and from that point on, it went.pretty smooth. The factor
behind all of this, after I did the road, the sewer, the water and handed it to the Town, it
wasn't like 128 units were there in less then a year, it was over a period and it is still
being developed. It's a period of, I think I've been up there 15 years now, 16 years. So,
over a course of 16 years, it's a nice introduction to have another new home, another
new family, a real nice neighborhood and it has and it is a very nice neighborhood and I
still live there until this day. So, that's to answer your question, those are two different
animals. I worked at, I lived it, and I'm there. I worked it, I lived it and I'm there. That's
not going to happen with this side of the room. I have nothing against this side of the
room. Ithaca Neighborhood Housing does a. beautiful job, EOC, DSS, believe me, they
all have a purpose here, we all do. But we have to remember Cornell, County Board
reps, all of them, they all work for tax payers because ultimately it's the taxpayer's
dollars, one way or another fueling the people on this side of the room. Don't forget that..
You're the Planning Board and you are up here to lookout for these people that are
paying the taxes. We are carrying the burden. A while back when the Town wanted a
new Town Hall and I'was one of the members that stopped that and now look at the
beautiful place you have instead of tearing down, I think it was the old OBGYN building
over there and raising the tax dollars. We stopped that. How did we stop it? We had a
vote on it. We let the people vote. That's the key. When this Country started, I once
heard there was a piece of paper that said "We the people ". It can't be we the
developers because when I was a developer and I had these shoes on 15 years ago,
you guys put me though hell. Literally hell. I did everything from a retention pond to
roads, to safety, to signs, to sewers, everything and I see this project going a lot faster
than mine and I think I made a lot more people happier on my project.
Board Member Conneman — I was not this Planning Board.
Chairperson Wilcox — George.
Mr. Ciaschi — Yeah George, you weren't there.
Board Member Conneman - I wasn't there.
Mr. Ciaschi — I just want to run through a few facts for you because I've lived it and I've
been here most of my life. I'll get with the Cornell student in a little bit. Rent roles in this
Town of driven by two universities, I know because you can go on the hill and as you
come down the hill, they decrease. My father owns Rebecca Hall, which is a nicer castle
on the hill right next to, what is it, the paleontologists building. He has two bedrooms for
$600 and they are gorgeous. There is somebody always in there. I have ten apartments
above the Valley House, there is not a one of them that's over $600. I'm just trying to tell
you what is out there and what I have. I'll put my apartment units against any of the new
16
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
ones on the hill or any of them anywhere. Okay? I have three units in the Lakeview
Mental Health Building, which is Louis Casiatti's old building. None of them are over
$600. Those apartments are out there. That's a fact. I have a lot of them and they rent
very well.
There is another fact, that you don't' want to hear, but I have to tell you about
because you always hear the one side of coin. I am going to give you the other side of
the coin. I've been involved with. DSS people, EOC people, every kind of institution and
I've had about nine or ten or them and every single one I've had a problem, whether.they
didn't pay their partial rent, they left the apartment in shambles, they showed me and my
place no respect at all. You have to realize, when you do 128 units up there, they don't
own that building, they don't own that piece of property. They don't care, once the year.is
up what bad shape it's in. We have to drive by it and see what shape it's in. If you give
them an ownership in it, well, that's a different story. If it's a condominium situation. But
here, you have to realize like a student, he is going to come here and a lot of them trash
it and they leave and some come to meetings a try to tell you how life is. I've lived it, I'm
almost 50 now, so.
Another fact that we all have to live with, when Linderman Creek came through, I
guess it didn't solve anything. I'm hearing there are twelve and 18 month waits. Is that
what everyone is hearing? The prices are reasonable there. So, where's the problem? I
don't know how many units are there, but that didn't solve the problem either. Don't look
at this as a cure -all. because 128 units, you're not going to save the world by doing it. I
know, everybody wants to feel right and say we need for low income, we need it for
moderate income. Well, of course we do, that's not the problem. The problem is that
you're not going to solve the world's problems by putting it on West Hill and our biggest
concern is that there: is already an over concentration of that housing on that hill. As the
young lady said, what about out in Slaterville of Freeville? There are a lot of other areas
with less tension. You have to realize when you come down West Hill, there are still four
or five roads funneling to two bridges, it's not like that around the rest of the County.
Picture it, I see it, George, going in your head. It's not like that. We're the worst and you
are going to plop 128 more. There is a problem there and I know they've done their
traffic studies and all that other good stuff and they conveniently did it when the Cornell
students and IC students were gone, so that was a little funny.
Let me see what else I scratched. I think I'm done.
Chairperson Wilcox- It's hard to believe.
Mr. Ciaschi — Believe me, I am not against., believe me, my father has worked.with a lot
of people on this side, that's not the problem. They are all be institutions. They are
there for a reason and they take care of the people. Okay? My main concern is that area
on West Hill is already concentrated enough. Yes, single family homes would be
beautiful there.
Board Member Mitrano — What about the traffic then? You're concerned about the traffic
Mr. Ciaschi — On 90 units, single family homes?
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Board Member Mitrano — Yes.
Mr. Ciaschi — Well, first of all that would probably a course of 25 to 30 years to do 90
homes. I can pretty well guarantee that because I had 20 and we're only got 16 over
there now. Over a period of time, good studies can be done. You're ram - rodding this
thing through. When I went through it, it took close to nine months and that was only a
20 unit subdivision. It was a cluster subdivision. We met once a month when we had
ours. This is the third week in a row I have been here. It's like we are family now. I feel
real comfortable coming in here now. I'm willing to sing for John Barney.
Mr. Barney — Please don't.
Board Member Conneman — Please, before you go away. There was a ... I think I was the
one who said to Mr. John Bower last time, that if there was affordable housing, would he
list the rents that it is rent at and when and so forth. We have some material from him
today. He took up the challenge and I appreciate that he did that. Is what he has in this
fact, regarding your apartments?
Mr. Ciaschi — Exactly. Like I said. I have three buildings with apartments in them,
actually four or five, out of the fourth and fifth building with units, they're $395, $3952
$395. The back full house is $ 500 and that's right. in the City. So, the housing is there. In
that little complex there, it's an older home, it's run down. I just took down a building on
Fulton Street, which has three units on it and they were $450, this includes all now. So,
there's $450, $425 and $300 and I pay all the utilizes and I have, usually, all townies and
these people all work. A lot of times when I get phone calls form DSS and EOC, the first
question I ask and maybe it's wrong, but are they working and can they work? In the
past I have put a lot of people to work on the side and paid them and it worked real well
and I have a lot of kids that are in the work force now and are working. Don't look down
on this, some people just don't want to work, okay? That's nature, some people won't
work. I like to work,
Chairperson Wilcox — Tim, always a pleasure. Thank you.
Mr. Ciaschi — Thanks Fred.
Chairperson Wilcox — Anybody else. Did you speak last Thursday? Okay. Did you walk
in late today? Anybody who spoken, gets a chance to speak, then anybody who has
already spoken, gets tow minutes for follow up comments. So, right now, I am looking for
people who have not yet spoken, either last Thursday or tonight. That's who I'm looking
for now. Is there anybody else who did not speak last Thursday as part of this Public
Hearing who wishes to address the Planning Board?
Female voice from the audience — Are you saying that people who have not spoken get
five minutes to speak?
Chairperson
Wilcox — The people who have not
spoken,
I
have not limited anybody's
time, except
for one gentleman. For people who
wish to make supplemental remarks,
tow minutes
and that's it. We are running out of
time. So, once again, is there anyone
who has not
spoken, either last Thursday or today as part
of this Public Hearing. There
being no one, now we will give and (I will let you
go first, if
you would like to) now I will
IF:3
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
give each person who would like to make additional comments, two minutes based upon
either additional thoughts that you have or respond to comments that you heard. Doria,
would you like to go first?
Doria Higgins, 2 Hillcrest Drive — I came to Ithaca in 1964 to work as staff psychologist at
Tompkins County Mental Health Clinic, where I worked for almost 20 years and I still live
on West Hill and I had to go back and forth to work there everyday. Incidentally, not a
person who is opposed to this is, opposed to low cost housing, we all are for it. Our
argument really has nothing to do with that. The traffic density on 96 at rush hours is
reaching dangerous proportions. I live there and I know this. I have worked in Planning
in Washington D.C., with the Washington D.C. Redevelopment Land Agency. It's
something I know something about and people, who ignore that and pretend that it is not
important, are just not looking at the facts. Bangs ambulance, as I told you last time, is
having trouble getting up and down now, with patients. So far, I haven't see a fire engine
at rush hour, but god help them, if they do have to get through at rush hour. My
suggestion is that you re -zone this area completely to make it rural. I don't think it should
have 90 more or anything there. I know that Dr. McKenzie has approved the project, he
is a good physician, but he doesn't know anything about planning. I think you should
look for a new site.
Chairperson Wilcox — Doria, address the Board please. Look at us.
Ms. Higgins — Oh, sorry. I think the Aris Development people should look for anew site
think it's a good idea to have adequate, low cost housing or whatever you call it, in our
town. No one is against that. Not there. No more traffic. There is no way, unfortunately,
the way the houses are on either side or the road —
Chairperson Wilcox — Doria, your time is up. Thank you.
Ms. Higgins — Okay. That's my advice to you. If you don't face this fact, god help you in
20 years from now.
Chairperson Wilcox — Doria, thank you. Joel. Joel with a two minutes time limit.
Joel Harlan, Newfield — I know, this is going to be real quick. I've been to every meeting
and it's the same old crap only different day. Everywhere you go, they want it out of that
area, it goes to the next. Then somebody else is going to come out and say:we don't
want it in our backyard. I can't understand why they complain about traffic and all that
stuff and the messes and the lights and everything else in this development. Why don't
they go live up in College Town and see how those college kids terrorize people by
partying and leaving trash and throwing things through windows and damaging the cars
and puking and urinating on peoples yards and trampling bushes. Why don't they go live
over there or just go and see how they act? Shooting fireworks off at three or four in the
morning, rocking people out of their beds. I've been around it, I've seen it. People they
throw bottles all over the place, try to hit you if you're out their protecting your yard.
Yeah, I think this is a pretty good idea of what they are going to do because it is a piece
of cake. This apartment complex compared to up there in College Town and south hill. I
think you ought to approve of it because it's going to be the same thing, even if you
move this project somewhere else, it's going to be the same things, somebody is going
to come out and stop it. They are just making all kinds of excuses, just like everything
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
else, like Burger King and small drive throughs, stop it, we don't want it in our backyard.
You are the same people that approve of all the college projects up on the hill and
everybody is against that, but you still approve of it. It would be wrong if you turn this
down. I say approve of it because it is going to be the same thing if you move the project
somewhere else, they are all going to come out of the woodwork —
Chairperson Wilcox — Joel, your time is up. Joel.
Mr. Harlan — It's the same old crap, only different day.
Chairperson Wilcox - Joel! Are you going to bring some sanity to this?
John Bowers, 1406 Trumansburg Road — Well, I don't know about that. That you for the
two minutes. I just have two things to say. First of all, Mr. Conneman asked me last time
after my remarks to come up with some more data and despite the fact that I have
another job, which I occasionally have to go to and despite the fact that there wasn't
much time, we did come up with some data. You have already heard about Tim
Ciaschi's apartments, all of which are affordable and well below the rents that will be
charged at Overlook. I will only point out to you that the other piece of data that we came
up with is 17 apartments advertised in Saturday's Ithaca Journal all of which, again, are
affordable and most of which; are under the rents that will be charged in Overlook. My
second comment is simply this, at the end of my remarks at the last meeting, I asked two
questions and I don't want those questions to be overlooked. I want these questions
answered by the developers. I have looked through their market study and have been
unable to find any statement of how they arrived at the average market rents for the
Ithaca area, which, of course, are much, much higher then they are proposing to charge..
My tow questions are, what data are the average market values that you have sited in
the developer's market study based on? What methodology is used in arriving at these
figures? I really want answers to these questions, publicly. I can't find anything in their
material which tells me how they arrived at those figures. On the spur of the moment, I'd
also like to ask another question. This is for INNS, Paul Mazzarrella or any of the good
people that work for this organization and the question I have is what percentage of the
rental units that INHS owns, do they rent to people with incomes of under $107000.
Thank you very much.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you sir. Next? There must be someone else. Mr. Merritt?
Sidney Merritt, 127 Woolf Lane — Shall I re- identify myself?
Chairperson Wilcox — I think we will recognize you voice on the tape.
Mr. Merritt — Okay. Now, at the last two meetings I attended, concerns regarding traffic
safety were expressed by members of the Board. However, I didn't hear mentioned any
potential problems with respect to public safety. Since Linderman Creek was used by the
traffic engineer to justify his results, I am also using Linderman Creek to call to your
attention person safety problems that exist in cluster housing developments. Now; I don't
know if these have been mentioned before. The Tompkins County Sheriff's Department
reported 183 safety calls in Linderman. Creek in 2001, 191 safety calls in 2002, 160 calls
in 2003. 1 called the State Police to see, but they keep no records, but according to the
Sheriff's Department, one out of every three times a Sheriff's Department's called, the
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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State Police usually call about the same time. This would mean that in 2003, over 200
calls were made for public safety in the Linderman Creek Development: Those safety
problems really tend to originate in large quantity in cluster housing developments. They
do spill over into the residential areas, so some concerns regarding public safety of the
residents in the approximate area to Overlook need to be considered. So, if safety hasn't
been considered, at least, as one of the items that you need to address, I hope you will. I
think that occupies my tow minutes. Oh, one last thing, I do have a letter from.the
Sheriff.
Chairperson Wilcox — Two minutes, thank you sir.
Mr. Merritt — I do have a letter from the Sheriff-
Chairperson Wilcox — Mr. Merritt.
Mr. Merritt — And. I'll give it in copies to the Board. because time doesn't permit me to say
any more.
Mr. Kanter — I think it was submitted in other materials that we got.
Board Member Talty — We have it.
Chairperson Wilcox — I think we have two copies of the letter from the Sheriff?
Mr. Kanter — Yes, we do.
Mr. Merritt — Pardon.
Chairperson Wilcox — We've each got two copies.
Mr. Merritt — Well, I've got ten more.
Chairperson Wilcox— Thank you. Thank you. Mrs. Bowers.
Celia Bowers, 1406 Trumansburg Road — I'd like to point out, first of all, that the design
of Overlook precludes home ownership. I did contact three banks in the area and
condominiums of this size are just going to be able to turned into home ownership for
various financial reasons. By all means, contact the banks and I'm sure they'll. tell you
the same thing. I think this is a problem. I think home ownership for low income or the
possibility of home ownership is extremely important and I think the lack of it can lead to
a lot of trouble. The last point that I am going to make and I wasn't going to make this
point, is that somebody talked about Ms. Ann Byrne and really said some nasty things,
about.her statement that low income children might need some special help. I would like
to point out that Ann Byrne teaches teachers, that her special area of expertise is
teaching children who come from low income background, that there is enormous
amounts of research that show that these children need special attention in order to
reach their full potential. I know Ann Byrne, to even consider the thought that she thinks
that low income children have less ability than the population at large, is totally and
utterly offensive. I feel so insulted by this young man.
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Chairperson Wilcox — Please speak to the Board please.
Ms. Bowers — I feel so insulted by his comments about someone he knows nothing
about and on a subject he obviously knows nothing about because there is a lot of
research on this. I felt that I before the Board. She is a wonderful woman and she does a
lot of good and she teaches.people who teach children in inner cities around this
Country. and she firmly believes that all children can learn and that all children deserve to
learn.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you. Next?
Heather Weiss, 105 Dubois Road — I have been away.doing research with friends in
different places around the County on affordable housing and I come back from that
convinced even more than before of two things, one it that I think the residents of West
Hill will work with Tompkins County and the Town of Ithaca to figure out a way to provide
high quality affordable housing on West Hill. High quality affordable housing is mixed-
income, low, density. I think the mutual housing concept, which the Board person from
Ithaca Neighborhood Housing spoke about eloquently, is a very powerful way to do
affordable housing. If you look at the website of Mutual Housing for Ithaca, which I did
this week, it leads to empowerment, it leads to collective responsibility and a sense of a
powerful neighborhood among people who live there. So, mixed income, low density, a
mutual housing concept and scattered around the Town and the County to accomplish .
that. With that come distribution of kids across a variety of schools, so that there is no
impact on any particular place. There is a lot of evidence that kids do better in mixed
income school than concentrated in low income school. So, the message, 1 think is that
many of us, I suspect, on West Hill and around Tompkins County and the Town of Ithaca
would be happy to work the Town of Ithaca and the County to develop an affordable
housing plan that meet the standards of quality affordable housing, that promotes the
development of kids and families. I, personally, would be willing to spend my time
helping on that and I suspect there are many other people around this community who
would be willing to do the same. Thank you.
Chairperson
Wilcox
— Anybody
else? There being no one I will close the Public Hearing
at 8:38 p.m.
Thank
you all very
much.
Chairperson Wilcox closed the Public Hearing at 8:38 p.m.
Chairperson Wilcox — Alright, a couple things I need to do. One is a communication from
Larry Thayer who is not here. Some confusion, I think about the reason that he has
abstained vis -a -vie the use of the word "partnership" in the article in the paper. So, bare
with me, there is a ton of paper sitting here in front of me. I will repeat Larry's statement,
which he made on February 17`h so it's clear, from the minutes. "Because of the strong
opinions of my neighbors and the emotions of my neighbors who are also neighbors of
this project and because my son has an excellent business relationship with Ithaca
Neighborhood Housing, I am going to abstain." The word "partnership" is not used. So,
that's that.
I have some letters to read because I have been asked to read them for one
reason or another. Mr. Merritt, do you still wish me to read your letter?
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Male voice from the audience - I thought you would have read it last time
Chairperson Wilcox = We ran out of time and I was going to do them at. the end of the
Public Hearing and now we're at the end? Would you like me to read it?
Male voice from the audience — I'll abstain.
Chairperson Wilcox — You don't.want me to read your letter? Do you want me to read
your letter or not?
Male voice from the audience.— No.
Chairperson Wilcox — I will start with a letter dated February 19th from Ithaca
Neighborhood Housiny addressed to me. (See Attachment # 1):
Letter of February 23r from the Tompkins County Chamber of Commerce, addressed to
myself (See Attachment #2).
I have one more letter from John Bowers and Andy Byrne and as I've mentioned to Mr.
Bowers before, the other letters that I have read all were written by people who, one,
requested that I read.it' and two; did not speak at the Public Hearing and therefore. I read
the letter. I believe Mr. Bowers covered most of the topics, if not all of them at the first
part of this Public Hearing last week, so reading it I think would be redundant and not
add anything.
Male voice from the .audience — I disagree because I spoke and you wanted to read my
letter.
Chairperson Wilcox - I asked to read your letter because your letter has a lot of
misstatements of fact and if you wanted me to read it, I was going to read it and then I
was going to deal with the misstatements of fact. Alright.
Inaudible voice from the audience.
Chairperson Wilcox — Joel please. Members of the Board the floor is ours.
Board Member Howe — Did you get a letter from Ann?
Chairperson Wilcox — I did not get a letter from Ann and I am surprised I did. not get a
letter from Ann, but I assume. that Mrs. Merritt spoke for Ann. She was here Tuesday
night and indicated that she would provide us a letter, but we did not get.one.
Inaudible voice from the audience.
Chairperson Wilcox- So, let it be said that we did not get a letter from Ann Byrne. It's our
discussion, whether we want to talk amongst ourselves or if you have questions of.the
applicant they are here again tonight. The agents are here again tonight. Suits, as I call
them.
Board Member Hoffmann — There are still some details that I would like to ask them
about.
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Chairperson Wilcox — You're prepared to answer questions, I assume. You didn't bring
these guys along for nothing. The floor is yours Eva.
Board Member Hoffmann — The last time, I talked a little bit about the plant buffer. I think
I would like to add some language in the conditions about that when we get to that point.
But I have an additional comment about the trees, maybe I can ask Mr. Trowbridge to
come up and answer some, questions about that. It has to do with the tree species that
were selected to be planted among the houses. From the list that we were provided with
there are three different species of trees. Let's see, I should probably pull out the
planting plan here.
Peter Trowbridge, Trowbridge and Wolf.— There are three different large canopy trees
that are used as well a number of smaller trees. The three large.canopy is a red maple,
it's a hybrid maple. It's the same tree that's used along the primary entrance road at
Wegman's it's fairly fast growing, it has great fall color, it's one of the hybrids of the
native species that we've had very good experience with'. Two of the other trees, one is
a flowering pear that gives us really good spring bloom, holds it's leaves late into the fall,
gives good color. The third is corpus bicolor which is also a native tree which is swamp
white oak. We've had very good experience with that as a street tree here in the City of
Ithaca and it is a native.
Board Member Hoffmann - I don't have a problem with the selection of the species and I .
can't find the numbers now, but it seems to me that there were large numbers.
Mr. Trowbridge — Of trees?
Board Member Hoffmann Of each tree. Could. you repeat the numbers?
Mr. Trowbridge — Yes. There's 39 red maples. 46 flowering pairs and 15 of the oaks.,
Board Member Hoffmann.— Okay, now what I would prefer to see is.mixing in a few other
species so that you don't have those three species and so many trees. I would like to
see a selection of additional species to be added for variety and also so that if a disease
cuts down a particular species that you don't lose so many trees.
Mr. Trowbridge — Sure.
Board Member Hoffmann — Do you have any suggestions for other trees that could be
planted, substituting for some of these that there are lots of.
Mr. Trowbridge —Sure. That wouldn't be a problem Eva, I think we could take the three
selections that we Piave, keeping the same number of canopy trees because we think
fast growing, big shade trees are important in this project to give amenity around the
homes and shade in the parking. I don't think it would be a problem to diversify the
species.
Board Member Hoffmann— Okay, good. I also feel that we need to have more
information and details about the playground and what's going to go into it.
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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Mr. Trowbridge — We have talked to the developer and we have selected a play structure
with some details and we will be providing that for planning.
Board Member Hoffmann.— I am talking now about the play ground in the Overlook
Circle area.
Mr. Trowbridge — That's right.
Board Member Hoffmann — I am a little concerned about the playing circle that you have
located along the entrance drive and the sloping of the ground.there and it being so
close to the road. I wonder what could be done to improve that.
Mr. Trowbridge — The staff did mention that to us as well earlier and we've subsequently
re- graded and re- positioned the playing field and we will be bringing that back with the.
modified final site plan. So, we have made it about three percent gradient, which is really
very flat and re- positioned it so, I think it has a better orientation. It is a half of a
regulation field.
Board Member Hoffmann — That's alright. I'm not so concerned about the size. I think
you can play it safe and it doesn't have to be regulations games and it's very valuable
anyway. What about putting some sort of barrier on the down hill side. so that balls won't
roll into the road with kids.running after them?
Mr. Trowbridge — Well, I think that it's possible. We have to look at it and make sure that
we have positive drainage so that we just don't catch water. I know that there are other
parks, here in the City, for instance, that you are probably seeing, like the park across
the road from Tops. What We don't want to do, we just want to make sure that we can
get positive drainage, but I think that's sensible idea.
Board Member Hoffmann — I remember reading in the paper something about the sewer
line, which will have to be put in. Could you point out where it will go?
Mr. Trowbridge — Well, we do have David Herrick here from T.G. Miller's. David does
have both the sanitary and water line drawing and he would be best to point that out to
you. It will run parallel, while David's pulling his drawings out, it will run parallel to
Trumansburg Road. As you know, the sewer line now stops approximately near the fire
house. So, it will continue up the west side of Trumansburg Road parallel to the right -of-
Way and then enter the site approximately at the new intersection, but David can speak
to that in greater detail.
Board Member Hoffmann — All right thank you. Well, then my related questions is, if it's
going to go along the western side of Trumansburg Road, wouldn't that offer a very nice
opportunity to put a sidewalk on top of the area which has to be dug out.
Mr. Trowbridge — ...certainly Dan knows that it would be in a ... there would be an
easement, sometimes outside or most of the time outside of the State right -of -way and it
is on Cornell University property. So I think there would have to be a bigger
conversation about how that might happen. I think that certainly John Majeroni ... I mean
there should be some sort of conversation perhaps over time where that should be. But
as you know, the closest sidewalk then is just at the Town /City line north of Brookfield
25
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Road. It is about a mile from, in fact as George measured it, it was just about a mile...)
did the same thing, it is just a mile from sidewalk to entrance.
Board Member Hoffmann — Right, but I think I remember seeing a figure for the length of
the sewer line that has to be put in and it was about that long or do I remember that
incorrectly.
Mr. Trowbridge — That is not quite right.
David Herrick, TG Miller Engineers & Surveyors — The distance is roughly 1200 feet from
the southerly edge of the University property up to just north of the NYSEG substation.
Board Member Hoffmann — All right, so how much would one be short if there were to be
a sidewalk along the sewer line and how much more would there be needed between
the City sidewalk and this sidewalk?
Mr. Herrick - Well, if it is slightly over a mile, then. it would be roughly 5,300 feet. So we
would be 4,000 feet short.
Chairperson Wilcox — Three- quarters of a mile.
Mr. Herrick — Correct.
Board Member Hoffmann — We have in the past sometimes. made sure that we have
gotten sidewalks put in wherever possible hoping that in the future there would be more
sidewalks to hook them together.
Mr. Kanter — Well, can I comment? There are a couple of things. One is, we can't
require sidewalks off site of the project site. We can't require off site improvements,
basically. We have talked about sidewalks and actually our Transportation Committee
and we've talked to Cathy Valentino about this, um, there is a possibility that someday a
sidewalk or sidewalks could go on Trumansburg Road. It requires a lot of work with the
State DOT to figure out how that would be done and who would pay for it. If for
instance, the sidewalk could only go on one side of the road, it makes sense that it
would be on the east side toward the lake as opposed to where you are talking about it
because if you had to have .people at some point cross Trumansburg Road to hookup to
the City sidewalk system and also because there is a large drainage ditch through most
of the right -of -way of 96 on the west side that you are talking about. It would probably
make sense that if you could only do it on one side, then to do it on the east side and the
place you would want people' to cross to get there is at the new crosswalk that will be at
this new intersection with the hospital. So those are just some thoughts.
Mr. Trowbridge — Thinking of sidewalks on site, as part of the resolution this evening
there is a proposal to continue the walk along the future dedicated roadway. We have
looked at the design of that and once again that would be something that we would bring
to you in Final Site Plan. That would fall within the potential future dedicated road so
that would be a part of that roadway system.
Board Member Hoffmann — Well,
I was just trying
to think of a
way that
we could try to
add some sidewalk in some way
and especially
since that it
is Cornell
University that
26
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
owns the lands just south of this parcel and that there might be development there. I
was thinking if you dig up some land to put in pipes, its nice to make use of that land on
top because whatever you put back over the sewer pipes would be well drained and it
would be appropriate for putting a sidewalk on, it seems to me.
Mr. Walker — In this case, the grading would be fairly level. It would be away from the
road also and probably on private property so we would have to get an .easement:
Again, it is the policy question of what the Town wants to do, with sidewalks and
walkways because once you build it someone has to take care of it. In this case, it
would be a sidewalk to nowhere basically because until we decide how we might linkup
in other areas of the Town. I think definitely if the Cornell property is ever developed, we
would definitely look at pathways and other opportunities at that time, too.
Board Member Hoffmann — I don't want to miss any opportunities, even if they are
sidewalks to nowhere at the moment, the might be connected in the future and I know
that the sidewalk that was built between the Cornell housing on Mitchell Street and East
Hill Plaza came about because of discussions with Cornell University and the Town.
Mr. Walker — That sidewalk has definite destination and major transportation between
Cornell departments and East Hill Plaza. There were a lot of projects going on at the
same time and everyone was cooperative and it worked out very well.
Mr. Kanter — The other thing that we have talked about here, but I'll repeat it, is that
there is a future road and pedestrian bicycle system that we are actually preparing a
map that we are going to be showing to the Town Board on Monday. We will be glad to
show you. We have talked about it before, but there would be a road system that could .
theoretically go through that Cornell property. We have proposed in our resolution
indicating that there should be a right -of -way for future road connection to this Overlook
entrance road if and when Cornell does develop their property. It would go down
through their property to Bundy Road, cross Bundy Road through what is already platted
as a future road on the Perry site and on the Linderman Creek property. All part of that
is the ... to the road system is a pedestrian and bicycle trail that is shown as the Upper
West Hill Path Network in our Park and Open Space plan. If it is done right, it could be.
designed in conjunction with that new road system. So these are things that we have in
our long range plans and actually the transportation plan that we are working on will
address that much more directly, but I didn't want you to think that those were not being
thought about and the opportunities will be there. I don't think we are missing an
opportunity.
Board Member Hoffmann - Um, I'll pass it down to someone else for now.. I have a
couple of other things.
Board Member Conneman
but this is a school district
in which we have resource:
need help, then we can do
must address that, but that
going to redistrict anyway.
has anything to do with the
— First of all, in terms of the schools, I share Ann's concern,
which has handled those things before. It is a school district
s and we can shift resources to if there are more children who
it. I'm not concerned about that. I do agree with Ann that we
is up to the Superintendent and her staff to do that. They are
That is something that is ... that is up to them. I don't think it
Planning Board.
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I want to be sure, Peter, that I think in the draft resolution there is indication of what
might happen at that ... for public safety, not cars... public safety at that walkway. I would
like that to be very safe with a crossing sign. I think if we do, I would feel badly if any
child ever got hurt. I will hold your feet to the fire, if that's the issue to be sure that if that
happens and I think that the rest of the Planning Board would do the same thing.
I am unclear, Fred, on what TCAT is proposing.
Chairperson Wilcox — In the letter that we received from them?
Board Member Conneman — The letter that we received. I don't know whether they say
they would service this place or they wouldn't or if they would, one of the things is that I
can't read their schedule. I don't know what they means where they come and go, but
certainly stopping on Sunday or any other day at 6:00 p.m. is ridiculous. People ride the
buses later...
Mr. Kanter — Can I comment on that part because I'm the one who copied the schedule
off of the TCAT website.
Board Member Conneman —.I'm sorry to hurt your feelings, Jon
Mr. Kanter No. I didn't design the website and I didn't make the copy machine to copy
it, so I have no bad feelings at all. I gave it to you to indicate because people had been
talking about whether there may be enough service, there may not be enough service.
The schedules show what there is and there is a good bit of service. I know that also the
Town has been talking with TCAT and this letter from Rod Gehering that is dated March
1St, which we just received, indicates that he willing to talk further to the Town to address
the safety issues and the scheduling issues and so to me, this letter indicates that TCAT
is willing to consider all of this in further discussions with the Town.
Board Member Conneman — And as I said last time, I believe that all the County
representatives from the legislature who asked us to approve this because they thought
it was a good deal should be putting the pressure on TCAT since they control of the
funds to do something about it. I would expect that to come up in our' final site plan
approval, when we get to that.
Well, I think sidewalks ... I agree with Eva. Sometimes sidewalks to nowhere may be
okay. Incidentally, if you go up to Linderman Creek, you have probably seen there are
no sidewalks. At least there were none the other day when I drove up there. I think that
one of the concerns I see, as one of the people who made statements, is that they think
that Linderman Creek is going to go down hill and so is this project. I think that is not
fair. I think we have got people who are managing these who are reliable as far as I can
see looking at what they have done. Those of you who, I assume from West Hill, have
been up to Linderman Creek and see what is up there, I think it is pretty good in my
opinion. any way.
In terms of traffic on the road, no matter what you do, you are going to have traffic on
that road. There is nothing you can do about that. If you ask people in Washington D.C.
if that's traffic, they would tell you no. So you have to wait three minutes to get through a
light or four minutes and what we have done very cleverly is to distribute the traffic
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
between four or five roads instead of one road. So instead of going through the octopus
in three minutes, you are going through in a minute and a half or a .minute and a third,
whatever it is. So I don't consider that. You can't do anything about that traffic unless
you build another road as Jonathan has proposed and that would probably anger some
people because it would then come out and spill out some other road and that would be
there.
I also have heard among some people that they believe that property values on West Hill
would go down if in fact this is built. I can't believe that. I think that West Hill, although it
is not pristine, is an area that.in fact is nice and people want to continue to live there and
live there in nice houses and improve their houses and I would say that the values are
up in West Hill just as they are in every place else in the County.
I agree with Eva on trees and buffer zone and I think that, Peter, .I still would like you
when you come to final, if this is approved, to give us some more on the view corridor
because people .keep raising that .question about how many feet and I don't want to
guess that.: I think that is important to some people and I think we should take .account
of that for the people on West Hill who are there already. I think they have a right to look
at it. In terms of the foxes and the red - tailed hawks, which I don't know what they are,
but my wife tells me that they do exist in some places, that is nice, but we have driven
the wildlife.out of a lot of areas and I don't know what you can do about it. That's life, but
you know, they survive. For example, the deer, at least in my backyard. They, eat
everything.
I gather the turning lane is also in the proposed approval, Jonathan, is that right?
Mr. Kanter — No, not the turning lane. The reservation of land for future widening if
necessary.
Board Member Conneman — I think that is important. So I think if you do a good job on
the light and can protect . public safety and TCAT is agreeable to do something that I
think is reasonable, that this looks okay to me.
Board Member Mitrano — Well, I think these discussions have been very interesting.
They've also been very frustrating because I think that each and every one of the issues
that every person in .every side of the question has raised are real, legitimate and
important. My largest question would appear to be one of the overall housing policy and
then with it become questions about urban sprawl and support of our school district and
the obligations of mainstreaming developmentally disabled students, traffic, safety in the
area, safety for the specific development and the optimal environment for low income
families. I believe all of them are very important issues. It is unfortunate in that the rule
of this board in hearing the voices of all of these people who have raised the questions
and the issues is limited to the project before us and the criteria by which we have to
make a decision and if we don't use that criteria and make decisions based on matters
that are outside the law, we are not only unfair, but we would also place ourselves I
believe in a position of legal liability. It is that reason that I will vote for it because I don't
believe that any of the positions that have been raised put the criteria in position for me
to vote against it, but I would wonder. and I would also be very wiling to participate as
Ms. Weiss saw for herself, in any discussion that could raise all of these questions to
nou
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD.
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
any larger level for the County or the Town, if that could be done, I would like to
contribute to that discussion as well.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you, Tracy.
Board Member Howe — I don't have much to add to what Tracy just said. I think that this
issue of affordable housing is being raised as a Countywide discussion and I hope that
the Town Board will work with.the sister municipalities in County to continue to think
comprehensively about how to solve this issue. Some folks have thought we might think
that this is going to solve all these problems. I think it is one piece of a puzzle. I hope
that we still look at development and other mechanisms to meet the need: Just as
transportation is an issue that is not going to go away, I am encouraged by this letter
from Rod Ghering that he is willing to look at the level of adequate service. I think all of
us need to think more about public transportation and other modes of transportation and
that issue is not going to go away for any of the municipalities.
I don't have any specific comments about the site plan. I did call. Jon this morning, I
would want the developers as they go and look at the finale plan,..is there any additional
things. that could make it feel even more like a neighborhood. I think the more it feels
like a neighborhood, people will want to stay there and invest and raise their families.
So, if there is any additional tinkering that can happen that would even make it feel more
like a neighborhood, making sure that the pedestrian /car areas are safe and that kids
can get to the playground and that type of think. So, I am prepared to vote for it.
Board .Member Talty — I would just like to say, I am going to make some very slow,
deliberate comments so I don't speak ill- willed towards anybody or miscommunication
any points. I would like to congratulate and applaud all the West Hill residents that came
forth with all the documentation on a short period of time. I :think the outcry from the
folks that live on that hill has been tremendous and I would hope that everyone would
take notice to what they have done with regards to developing their communities. With
that being said, I think that Mr. Bowers has raised legitimate concerns and this board
member would like to have the applicant's answer to three questions and I will repeat
them in order that Mr. Bowers brought up.
The first is, where was the average market rent derived and where was that data
founded and the methodology behind it, that's the second question. And the third
question is again to INNS, what percentage of the rental housing pie do. they rent to
people under $10,000. 1 think those are legitimate concerns and if you could provide
that documentation in writing to the staff, I would really appreciate it. I want to know also
from the developers if alternative sites have been looked into and proposed prior to this
one. Also, I have concerns with regards to the rezoning. I know we did a
Comprehensive Plan. The staff did a great and methodical job with .regards to the
zoning in the entire area and I would like to know myself, why are we flipping on a dime
it seems. I know there are guidelines, but it just seems that it was just introduced, it was
just voted upon and all of a sudden now we are rezoning. I think that's legitimate
concerns that these people brought up and I think we should have an answer for that as
well. And if there has been an answer, I'd like to hear it again.
Did the developer with their
traffic study take into
account the
Cliff Street
development? I
think that is a legitimate concern with regards to
all the traffic
questions
that have come
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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up. I have to applaud Heather Weiss. I think she is a true professional. I think her
creditability is unmatched to almost anyone in this room. I would also echo Tracy. I
would volunteer myself to alternative sites in this community and based upon points that
are brought up, I think the points that she brought up brought are very legitimate and
should be looked into even in greater depth.
This is going to be on the record as far as Kevin Talty, T- A- L -T -Y. I have real issues
when every single politician puts a piece of paper in front of me that is going forth with
this project. Republican, Democrat, I don't care what it is, I'm going on the record. Not
one politician gave me a piece of documentation that indicated that they were not for this
development. I've been around long enough. I've travel the State and when these
I hings happen I have real issues. As Barbara Blanchard pointed out, she'll probably lose
80 votes. I think we are here as public servants and that we have to do what is right for
the people and sometimes we have to make tough choices. I'm going to make a tough
choice and I'm not going to vote for this project all the way through because I don't feel
as though there has been burden of proof. I still don't feel that many of the issues that
many of these residents have brought up have been completed and proven beyond a
doubt that each one of these issues have been resolved. At that -I'm done. You're more
than welcome to come up and. answer the questions that I have.
Mr. Papamichael — First of all, the methodology of the study. Number one, the study that
Was in the report was the executive summary of that study. The methodology for any
market study is very simple. You survey the properties that are within the market area,
properties that are comparable to the property that we are building. there were 16
properties surveyed throughout the Ithaca market within a 5 mile radius of this site.
Some of them were low income. Some of them were middle income and some of them_
were at the higher end,. but what you do is you take an average of them all and you
determine what the average rent is and that is how the average market rent is derived. I
would also like to point out that the occupancy among these properties were all well
above 95 percent. So again, I know that there were several listings that they report
seeing in the Ithaca Journal. You have to take comparable .properties. As the
gentleman stated before, he has units at $600 and he has none available. That should
go to tell you that units at $600 do not stay available very quickly.
In response to John Bowers's comments regarding his study, I think if you interpret the
statistics that he looked at literally, then you would make _ the assumption that in the
middle market there is a 56 percent vacancy rate. We all know that is not true. There is
a less than 4 percent vacancy rate in Tompkins County. This is an income based
housing complex and what that means is that you cannot have people who earn too
much living in an apartment for more than what they can afford, which happens in a
market rate housing complex. If you look at statistics, again those rents are taken from
the 2000 census, which means they were 1999 rents or earlier. As an owner in this
complex in this area, I looked at our market rents in 2001. They were $700. Today they
are $895. that is a 28 percent difference. Now, you also have to adjust income. The
2001 median income for Tompkins County was $52,400. Today it is $59,200. So that is
a 13 percent increase: So you have more than double the increase in the housing costs
than you have in the median income. More clearly, there is a 100 person waiting list at
Linderman Creek. That is an equivalent to 2 -3 year waiting: list. A gentleman said
tonight that the Tompkins Community Action has a 600 person waiting list. I think that is
clear evidence of the need for affordable housing and the lack thereof. Also, a Cornell
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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report shows that between 1990 and 2000, although there was only a 2.6 percent growth
in population, there was a 13 percent growth in renter households and:what that means
it that there are smaller households, less people live per house and. they need more
units. It also stated that 67 percent of low income renters overpay for their rent in
Tompkins County. What that means is that they pay greater than :30 percent of their
income towards rent so that is 67 percent. All of these units fall within the low income
renters category. Ninety -two percent at very low income housing overpay for housing.
More importantly, in the Town_ of Ithaca 100 percent of very low income. residents
overpay for housing. So, that 30 percent threshold meets that very low income
requirement. It also predicts that you need approximately ,1350 units over the next
several years to meet demand. So if you take 128 units proposed, that is: not even 10
percent of the total need for housing. So, this is a real opportunity to add much needed
housing in a market that is struggling.
Your second question was alternative sites. We did look at alternative sites. I'm sure if
you ask Jon Kanter, there are probably almost no sites that are zoned for multi family
residential: development. That is certainly an issue when you are trying to build multi
family housing. Again, land:cost is an issue. If you are building an affordable housing
development, you need to buy land that is affordable enough to build such a
development. You cannot compete against a market rate single family home builder for
these types of developments because you are just going to get priced out of the market.
So there is heavy competition. You also need such things as utilities. This site has
sewer, water, gas and electric. These are all things you need to build housing. There is
also enough land to. , support an economies of scale that you need to build housing that
can be. maintained properly and efficiently. So those are the reasons that we chose this
site.
Board Member Talty — Were there specific sites that you can indicate to this board
tonight that you actually looked into given the criteria that you dealt on?
Mr. Papamichael - The one site I can name off the top of my head and a lot of them
quite frankly just got knocked out because we looked. at the price and there was not
even a chance that we could come close. The one site that we had talked to the Town
about prior to this one was the Indian Creek site, which was in an agricultural district,
which we did not want to disturb. I know that we had a stack from.Audrey Edelman and
other brokers in the market looking for available land. Ideally, would you want to do a
scattered site? It is nice to blend things into certain neighborhoods, but you need a
certain amount of economy scale and feasibility and because we need 1350 units, if you
looked at scattered sites you would have to find a heck of a lot of scattered sites to meet`
that demand. I hope that answers your question.
Board Member Mitrano — John, what is the legal...for the criteria?
Attorney Barney — Which issue do you want to talk about? There are really three issues.
Board Member Mitrano — When we measure the criteria, are we measuring it by a pre
ponderance of the evidence beyond a shadow of a doubt?
Attorney Barney
— Oh, no. You're
not
using beyond a reasonable doubt. It is the
preponderance of
the evidence is the
test
there.
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Board Member Howe — John, we actually talked about the MR districts last time and Jon
said something that I found very helpful and maybe he could reiterate that.
Chairperson Wilcox — Would you like to?
Mr. Kanter — I would love to. If the chair would like me to, I would like to.
Chairperson Wilcox — You were asked.
Mr. Kanter — All right. Yes, we spent seven years on our revision of the zoning and it
was based largely .on the 1993 Comprehensive Plan, the anticipated land use patters
map and the red colors that are actually shown on this part of West Hill are what we
consider the growth areas of the Town. I am sorry to say that, but that is basically the
fact. That is where the infrastructure is. That is where the water pressure area is. That
is where the. sewers are and that is basically the edge of what we determined the
agricultural area to be preserved west to that is when we looked at rezoning, the
question of should we be proactively looking for multiple family housing sites in our
zoning update and basically, what the Town Board said and their past record and history
of this .fingers this .out, is that the Town Board has looked at the multiple residence
zoning basically as a floating zone. That if appropriate opportunities present themselves
in appropriate areas and if they are consistent with the goals and objectives of the
Comprehensive Plan, then the Town Board will consider specific proposals. We even
expanded that statement of purpose of the MR zone and our new zoning to say that
appropriate areas would be places where you would have public transportation available
and existing infrastructure available and that is actually worded in the new multiple.
residence zone now. So basically what it comes down to is and this was a Town Board
policy decision; not to add new multiple residence zones around parts of the Town that
did not have them, but to continue the practice of using them as basically a floating zone
technique. And using the Comprehensive Plan to figure out where appropriate sites
would be and so that is where we are right now.
Chairperson Wilcox — Kevin, were you done?
Board Member Talty — I'm done.
Chairperson Wilcox - Eva?
Board Member Hoffmann — A couple more little things that I wanted to cover. The
developer earlier had said that they would be happy to come up with some sort of
arrangement where people who work at the hospital would be able to get on the waiting
list to get apartments or whatever other things could be done to encourage or make it
easier for people who are working right nearby at the hospital to get housing here
without discriminating against anybody else. I would like to see for next time a proposal,
a draft of such agreement.
Chairperson Wilcox — Could you say that again ... what you are looking for?
Board Member Hoffmann
— Some language that
indicates how the developer can
make
it easier for people who
would be working at
the hospital to have access to
these
33
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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apartments. They mentioned when we talked about it last time that they could help
setup a waiting list, for instance for people who work at the hospital so that :if an
apartment becomes. available they would contact the hospital' and let those employees
know that there were apartments available. Am I saying that correctly? I think that is
what you said.
Chairperson Wilcox — A letter of understanding or a something between the hospital and
the developer? .
Board Member Hoffmann — Or whatever other ideas you had to make it...?
Mr. Papamichael — It would be more of an outline of process rather than an actual
contractual .agreement. 'I'm not sure that we would be able to supply something like that.
Certainly we would love to have members of the hospital employees living at the
complex. It makes sense for both of us. We can market it to them as much as we .can.
It is really an opportunity for the employee to come and seek the housing, which is close
by to their-work and safe and so forth and affordable.
Board Member Hoffmann — I guess I would like to hear and see how you could do that in
a way that makes is practicable and workable because I think that would help with a
number of things. It would help cut down on traffic mainly and I think.it.would be a good
thing to do in this case. So whatever you can come up with.
Mr. Papamichael - We will work to see what we can do.
Board Member Hoffmann - The other thing is just sort of a general comment about
people mentioning that fire engines and ambulances have trouble getting through and I
think this is a general societal problem here in big cities, like in New York City, nobody
stops when there is a ambulance coming. You can just keep going as if they don't
notice it and I think it seems to be'spreading here, too, and I think it is a matter of people
understanding that they really, have to pull over on to the. shoulder to make room for
these vehicles to go through and not just sit there in the driving lane. Maybe the
ambulance and fire engine drivers have to do as much as possible is write down the
license numbers of the cars and whatever. In general what I would like to say about how
I feel about the project, as you Tracy, I..like the idea of doing a study of how one could
create low income housing and spread it around like Ms. Weiss said. I know, too, that
this is the better way to deal with it, and I think it would be great to have such 'a study
done if we could do that, but in.the meantime, our job is to respond to applications that
come into us and follow the rules and regulations that we have in place and so we have
to deal with this application as it is. Look at the advantages and disadvantages and
make a judgment based on that and while such a study is going on if other applications
come in we have to deal with them the same way. We can't just say that we are not
going to look at the applications. So after having heard the pros and cons, I really feel
that there are some things that are not ideal about this plan and it certainly is not going
to take care of the need for low income housing but it is a small step in the right direction
and I think whatever disadvantages there are and problems with traffic and so and I think
one can look at the rest of the Town and look at what else could happen on this site and
see that it is not exceptionally much .worse. It is manageable and there are things that
the developer can do to make things as good as possible and staying within their limits
9
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
of cost, obviously, because otherwise it is not going to be housing that is affordable to
the group that needs the housing. So I am going to vote for it
Chairperson Wilcox — My turn? Or do you want to ... go ahead.
Attorney Barney — I just have a basic question for the developer and I don't know quite
who to address it to. I didn't quite understand the reason for the subdivision of parcels b
and parcels c. Why are we dividing the project into two halves?
Mr. Papamichael — The reason for that, as you know, we are putting in and submitting an
application to the Division of Housing and Community Renewal for a tax credit
application and each year the Division of Housing and Community Renewal issues a
note for which is a notice of funding availability. For this year they have capped the
amount of credits that they are going to put into any single deal so.in order to make the
project feasible on a tax credit basis we split it up into two separate tax parcels and two
separate DHCR funding applications.
Attorney Barney — Is there likely to be two different ownership groups for those two...?
Mr. Papamichael —The LP's may be different, but it is unlikely. But as far as the general
parties who would be running it, it would certainly be us.
Attorney Barney — But the actual title holder, the make up of the title holder could be
different and you can't consolidate the two for the purpose of getting the credits. I'm not
quite sure I follow why that is ... do they cap the number of credits?
Mr. Papamichael — They cap the dollar amount of credits. Correct.
Attorney Barney — Is the dollar.amount tied to the number of units in some fashion ?.
Mr. Papamichael — The dollar is tied indirectly to the number of units because it costs a
certain dollar amount to build each unit.
Attorney Barney — So what is the dollar amount that they cap?
Mr. Papamichael — It is a million dollars in credits.
Attorney Barney — So what you are saying is, if you consolidate the two together you
would have a million dollars to apply against the development of both halves at the same
time, if you were awarded the credits.
Mr. Papamichael — It would be just over the million.
Attorney Barney — And by doing it this way you hope to in affect get two million dollars
worth of credits.
Mr. Papamichael Which is essentially the same thing Linderman Creek did.
a
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Mr. Kanter — I have a related question to that. We actually kind of indicated that this
would come up, so I might as well bring it up, but what happens if the tax credits are not
obtained. What happens to the project?
Mr. Papamichael — Well, if it is not obtained in this 2004 round, we will certainly have to
submit an application in 2005, but under this program this is the way that ... we are doing
everything we can to submit a strong application as we can.
Attorney Barney= How many years would you submit requests for the credit approval,
supposing it is denied this year? Would you reapply next year supposing you didn't
make it next year?
Mr. Papamichael — It is tough to answer. It really depends on the reasons in which it
Was denied.
Attorney Barney .= Our guess our problem from the Town's
standpoint
is if we
rezone
this for this particular project and you don't get your credits,
where do we
go from
there?
Mr.
Papamichael
— We would have to
look at other sources to fund it,
but currently under
this
scenario we
are looking at the tax
credit application.
Attorney Barney — I guess the question is, would you move forward in some fashion with
this project if you didn't get the credits.
Mr. Papamichael — Again, we would have to look at the way ... there are different ways to
finance an affordable housing project. We would have to look at other funding sources,
perhaps a 4 percent bond credit and some sort of subsidy below that, but it is not
something that I can answer at this point. Again, Linderman Creek was the same
scenario.
Attorney Barney — .Would you have a problem if we put some sort of a time limit into the
local law that said if you didn't get your project in the ground and moving ... you know we
have an automatic' sunset provision now which I think is three years on rezoning, if we
shorten that down a little bit?
Mr. Papamichael — I think anything less than three years ... we would certainly. submit
three years in a row if we could.. We are going to do everything we can to try to .get the
credits. 1 don't see what shortening that time period, how that benefits anybody.
Mr. Kanter — It might help ... maybe this would be a good time or maybe if. there are
questions on the local law because it has been drafted and redrafted several times. This
is one of the issues that John was thinking about when he did this revision. I think the
reversion clause right now is four years. So that is something for the board to think
about because that is part of what the Town Board would be considering at their March
15th meeting. but then also, the things about income levels and structure of how this will
be developed is in the local law as well. It is pretty tightly defined paralleling the tax
credit program and the income levels that we have been hearing about. I guess the
question for the board is between the definition of the income levels, the long term
affordability that is also in the local law as 50 years and the reversion clause is that it is
sufficient to meet concerns about what happens if this project doesn't make it.
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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Attorney Barney = ...you have to start your work earlier of one year of receiving a
building permit, which obviously you get for specific period of time. Thirty -six months
from the day that the Planning Board gives you final site plan approval, which would
presumably occur after the rezoning, or four years of the effective date of the local law,
which would be if the Town chooses to rezone. I don't know how the rest of the board
feels, but I know the Town Board feels ... (not audible). ..I guess I could probably suggest
that we could live with that`timeframe.
Chairperson Wilcox — Anything', Jonathan?
Mr. Kanter — No.
Chairperson Wilcox — My turn? I actually wanted to do a couple of things and then so
everyone is clear where I'm going to vote, I'm going to vote in favor of it.. First of all, I
think we need to look at the applicant and their agents and make some sort of decision
about what kind of complex this could be. They've hired the best, I think, if not the best
some of the best in Town in terms of Trowbridge and Wolf Landscape Architects, TG
Miller Surveyors and Engineers and HOLT Architects. The fact that they hired those
three says something, I think, about the commitment to this project and its quality. We
have had a lot of comments about the traffic study and the market study. I frankly have
been. amazed at this particular document, the Tompkins County Housing Forum
background report. This thing has been spun by both: sides. Both sides claiming, those
for and those against, that it supports their position. I have a market study produced by
a professional, which says that they need to capture 11.6 percent of .the available
market. I have a traffic study produced by SRF Associates which says .... which lays out
the traffic and the impact on the existing road network. A number of people have said,
well the developer paid for these. You know if I'm a consultant or if I'm in my own small
business, I'm not going to produce.a faulty report in order to get a paycheck. I was just
thinking about what if SRF Associates produced a faulty report and the DOT engineers
got a hold of it. Can you imagine what they would do with it and kick it back? Can you
imagine what the developers and the investors would think about it? DOT engineers
would then tell other .applicants I hope you don't use SRF for example or Aris.
Investments might go to their colleagues and say don't use SRF and maybe they'll go to
their competitors and tell them to use SRF. I'm not sure. It serves no purpose to
produce a faulty report. It serves no purpose to give them what they want to hear.
You've got to give them the truth otherwise SRF doesn't get anymore business. It is the
same thing with the market study. If you are ... and you are doing consulting, you do the
same thing. You have to give the client your best work and the client does with the data
as necessary.
That out of the way, I'm going to talk a little about the zoning recommendation. There is
a need for the proposed Overlook at West Hill project in the proposed location and more
particularly the market study shows that. there is definitely a need in my opinion. The
market study shows that. the proposed location has water and sewer and bus
transportation. It is not sprawl as some people have said. It is. in -fill development.
Other people want to move it out farther, that would potentially be sprawl. The existing
probable future character of the neighborhood would not be adversely affect. That is the
interesting one. What does the current zoning allow? George, you started to address
that point earlier. My calculations, the zoning allows roughly 70 lots. Roughly. Zoning
37
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
allows each one of those lots to have on it placed a duplex. Two units. Each of those
units could have three unrelated individuals on each side. Now, that is worse case, but
those units would be scattered throughout the project site. Those units would need a
greater road structure, more driveways, more rooftops. When we talk about traffic, Jon
you handed these out at a Codes and Ordinances meeting last month. This is from
whatever the official trip generation book is, right?
Mr. Kanter — Institute of Transportation Engineers.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you. Single family detached homes 9.55. average weekday
vehicle trips per single family home. Nine and a half, a.m. peak three -quarters, p.m.
peak one. For apartments, what are called low -rise or one to two -level garden
apartments, the average weekday vehicle trip is six and a half with a.m. peak at a half
and p.m. peak at point six, anywhere between 45 and 60 percent lower for garden
apartments. I'm not talking about Linderman Creek, I'm just talking about garden
apartments, one .to two levels. The affordable units have been moved away, they have
been concentrated in an, area which. is away from the existing single family homes on
Hopkins Road. I'm hard pressed to think how the impact of this development including
the single family homes, the maximum 15 that could be subdivided, I'm hard to think how
that impact of this would be any worse than what is currently allowed by the zoning. It
wouldn't matter whether they build 70 duplexes, just 70 single family lots. Tim Ciaschi
mentioned construction being spread over 5 years, 10 years or 15 years. Noise, dirt,
trucks, graders, etc., etc., etc., etc., bulldozers. The zoning is in accordance with the
Comprehensive Plan to develop suburban residential. The bottom line is, people talked
about density, the density of the project. Essentially, the density of this project when
done is going to be about the density allowed under R -15 zoning. The Comprehensive
Plan calls for residential development, here and that is what this is. That is my
statement. My comments.
Would someone like to move it?
Board Member Hoffmann — I'll move it.
Chairperson Wilcox — So moved by Eva Hoffmann.
Board Member Conneman — I'll second it.
Chairperson Wilcox — Seconded by George Conneman. We :have some changes to
make, at least that have come up. Eva, I'm sorry. I had to walk out briefly, but I suspect`
that you wanted to add something to do with additional landscaping on the east side of
parcel b to screen the development similar to what is proposed on the west side of
parcel c. We are looking at on their property, under their control, screening from the
neighboring R -151 John, that's good enough with what I just said?
Board Member Hoffmann — I don't mean a
give shade,
solid wall of plants, but something planted to
Attorney Barney — Anything else? What is it you want to add, Fred?
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Chairperson Wilcox — This is with.. regard to site plan. Additional landscaping to be
shown on the east side of parcel b, which would screen the development similar to what
is proposed on the west side of parcel c. There is screening there, but it is not on
property that the applicant would control.
Board Member Hoffmann— Actually, I don't want to see something like that buffer area.
I would like to see something similar to what is in and among between the buildings on
the western most part here. You know, something like this because if you look here on
the eastern side there are no trees at all on this. side of the building, whereas here there
are.
Chairperson Wilcox — So you would like to see more trees intermixed with the buildings?
Board Member Hoffmann - Yes, and east of the buildings in particular. There are some
in between the buildings and the reason for it is that this buffer, which exists already is
fairly low and is most shrubs and it is on the Kyong's property so it could go.
Mr. Trowbridge — So just for clarification, the kind of canopy trees that we have on the
west side of the westerly units, that's the character we are looking for, not necessarily a
hedge row.
Board Member Hoffmann — Right. Yes. I don't want a wall of trees.
Attorney Barney You are looking to put it where?
Chairperson Wilcox — This will be on the east side, parcel b.
Mr. Trowbridge — Fundamentally adding more canopy trees east of the most easterly
units.
Chairperson Wilcox — Second, Jonathan Kanter, I looked again and again and I probably
missed it, but is there anything in here about revising the grading plan to show the three
percent grade in the playground area? I looked and looked and looked and I didn't see
it.
Mr. Kanter — I think we did mention something about the play area.
Chairperson Wilcox — Under site plan, bear with me here. H?
Mr. Kanter -- Well, no. that was dealing really with the playground up near the community
building.
Chairperson Wilcox — I didn't see it.
Mr. Kanter - I thought I had put something in there. Lets see.
Board Member Hoffmann — I thought I saw something, too. But maybe it was not in the
resolution. maybe it was in your text that went with the description of all of this.
WE
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
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APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Chairperson Wilcox — None the less, we want the grading plan revised to reflect the
three percent slope in the play area that was talked about. Essentially, we all agree that
it is reasonable, we just need to reflect that.
Mr. Kanter — If you can't find it, then we should definitely include it.
Chairperson Wilcox — I think John Barney is looking at "h" as well.
Attorney Barney - "h" on page 5 of the revision of site plan to show location and
arrangement of matching bicycle racks,... enhancement of the play areas including
the... facilities...
Chairperson Wilcox — As Jonathan pointed out, that is actually the one near the
community center, not the one that we are talking about.
Mr. Kanter — We were talking about re- grading. of the playing field near Trumansburg
Road. We have been doing this so long and going through it so many times, it's likely
that maybe I put it in the memo and just didn't get it in here.
Chairperson Wilcox - So., none- the -less, revisions of the grading plan.
Mr. Barney — grading plan or final site plan?
Mr. Kanter — Revision of final site plan to show re- grading of play field.
Mr. Barney — Can we add an "h" " and also show play field" or something like that?
Board Member Hoffmann — And would we need to include a possibility of putting up
some sort of barriers to keep balls from going into the road or is it enough that we
discussed it here and we will ask you to bring in some ideas?
Chairperson Wilcox —We better put it in writing. Are you guys writing over there?
Mr. Kanter — Yeah, we are trying to figure out the wording.
Chairperson Wilcox Should I go on? Eva also would like them to come back with
something having to do with whether there should be some sort of a fence as part of that
play field. We're not asking for a fence...
Board Member Hoffmann — On the eastern edge, where it slopes down, so that things
won't role down into Route 96.
Chairperson Wilcox — Either come back with some sort of a barrier to prevent the balls or
an explanations as to why that would be inappropriate. And then last, but not least is the
issue, Eva, you brought up about wanting some sort of a statement of a process or
something with the hospital. I will tell you that I live and work in property owned by IAD
and I get a discount on my rent because I work in one of their buildings. I don't know
what you can do in terms of discounts or hospital employees possibilities. All right.
IN
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Board Member Hoffmann — The other thing that I mentioned is that I would like to see
more variety of species of trees in between the houses.
Chairperson Wilcox — Peter, do you need any more information about that?
Mr. Trowbridge — No.
Board Member Hoffmann — But do we need to add it to the resolution?
Chairperson
Wilcox —
We've
got to let the lawyers catch up. The two assistant attorneys.
Can you tell
us what's
going
on?
Mr. Barney — My question is when do we want title to the road because it's a little
unclear here as to when we get that and when do we need it because we will be issuing
certificates of .Occupancy for buildings on a non - public road and I get a little
uncomfortable doing that if we are going to take title to it
Chairperson Wilcox — Can I ask you to speak in nice full voices?
Mr. Barney — Well, somebody may have thought about this before so I don't want to tred
on someone else's toes.
Mr. Walker — I don't want to set policy, but I can't recommend to the Town Board, I don't
have the Highway Superintendent to recommend taking that road over until it became a
through road from 96 to Hayts Road. I think it will function just fine as a privately owned
road that will be built to Town standards, that the Town could take over in the future, but
we will not have the.appropriate turn around facilities if that is a private driveway through
the rest of the development.
Mr. Kanter — Well, I believe one of the phasing plans showed a turn around on that as
part of the phasing.
Mr. Walker — We will have to discuss that with the Highway Superintendent also
because that picks up another liability and cost for the Town to maintain that road that I
don't think we are ready to do until we can drive all the way through. And is there a real
need for it? Because, if there is not a real need for that through road basically because
the upper subdivision is not completed.
Mr: Barney — My problem is if we are going to have 128 units here with people living in
them-
Mr. Walker — On a private driveway.
Mr. Barney — On a private driveway.
Mr. Walker — Which we have at College Circle. We have more than that at College
Circle.
Mr. Barney — It leaves open the possibility of obviously not have developments
maintained reasonably well or having the snow plowed.
41
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Mr. Walker — But we are not going to be maintaining the roads inside the development.
Mr. Barney — I understand that.
Mr. Walker — That's a Board decision so .I absolutely could throw that at the Board.
Chairperson Wilcox — By Board, you mean Town Board?
Mr. Walker — Yes.
Mr. Barney — Probably both.
Chairperson Wilcox — Okay.
Mr. Kanter — .Could I ask maybe Peter Trowbridge to tell us. I am almost sure I have
seen on one of these site plans phasing diagrams, some kind of a temporary turn around
during the first phases of construction on that main road or was I imagining it.
Mr. Trowbridge — No. What we did is beyond the westerly loop, we did provide a little
hammer head at the end. So, you could do a three -point turn. You could go up, back in,
go back out. So, it doesn't just come to a screeching halt just west of the loop. There
would be a little tab on the end that would allow for, like, a hammer head turn. But it
would be a back. out, it wouldn't be a cul -de -sac.
Mr. Barney —
Why don't we put in
a condition that on the final
site .plan and subdivision.
that it shows
that arrangement if
the Town Board requires it
as part of the re- zoning.
That way we'll
leave it to the Town
Board and let them make a
decision.
Chairperson Wilcox — .Okay.
Mr. Walker — I'm just speaking for the cost liability of maintaining that road if the
remainder of the subdivisions do not occur to generate a real need for that road to be
owned by the Town. I'm just putting that into the record.
Mr. Barney — I hear you and I think there is counter veiling argument. I appreciate that.
Chairperson Wilcox — George and Eva are those changes acceptable?
Board Member Conneman — They're acceptable to me.
Chairperson Wilcox — Mr. Barney, are we all set ?.
Mr. Barney — I think we're close.
Chairperson Wilcox — Should I wait a couple of minutes?
Mr. Barney — No, I think you can go ahead.
42
Chairperson Wilcox — I have a motion and a second
from the Board?
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
Any further comments from staff or
Mr. Kanter — I just wanted to clarify, I am sure you all realize, but this red line version is
taking the earlier draft of the resolution for the February 17th meeting and putting in some
revisions, which you see in red line changes. So, the draft that we are proposing for you
is the red line changes, not the old. one.
Chairperson Wilcox — All those in favor, please raise you hand. One, two, three, four,
five. All those opposed? Kevin Talty. There are no abstentions, the motion is passed.
Thank you all very much.
PB RESOLUTION NO. 2004- 016:Overlook at West Hill: Preliminary Site Plan
and Subdivision Approval and Recommendation to Town Board Regarding
Rezoning, Tax Parcel No. 24 -4 -14.2, 1290 Trumansburg Road
MOTION made by Eva Hoffmann, seconded by George Conneman.
WHEREAS:
1: The Town of Ithaca Planning Board is considering Preliminary Subdivision
Approval, Preliminary Site Plan Approval, and a recommendation to the
Town Board regarding the Zoning Change for the proposed residential
development, Overlook at West Hill, located at 1290 Trumansburg Road
(NY S Route 96), Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 244-14.2, Residential
District R -15. The proposal consists of two phases of residential
development, consisting of .128 affordable rental apartment units in 16
buildings and a community center in Phase I on a 24.5 +/- acre portion of
Tax Parcel No. 24 -4 -14.2, and 15 lots for single = family, market rate homes
in Phase II on about 19 acres of the subject property. The current owners
would retain about 5 acres containing the existing medical practice
fronting on Trumansburg Road. The applicant is currently requesting
consideration . of rezoning the 24.5 +/- acres for affordable rental
apartments from R45. Residence to MR Multiple Residence and
preliminary subdivision and site plan approval for the Phase I apartments.
Song Ja Kyong, Owner; Aris Investments, Applicant, Grace Chiang, HOLT
Architects and Peter Trowbridge, Trowbridge & Wolf, Landscape
Architects, Agents, and
2. The proposed actions, which include subdivision approval and site plan
approval by the Planning Board and rezoning by the Town Board, are
Type I actions pursuant to the State Environmental Quality Review Act, 6
NYCRR Part 617, and Town of Ithaca Local Law No. 5 of the Year 1988
Providing for Environmental Review of Actions in the Town of Ithaca, and
43
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
3, The Town of Ithaca Town Board, in a resolution dated October 23, 2003)
.has referred the petition to rezone the above- referenced.parcel to the
Planning Board for a recommendation, and
4. Having received no objections from other Involved Agencies, the Town of
Ithaca Planning Board established itself as Lead Agency to coordinate the
environmental review of the above - referenced actions, and
51 The Planning Board, after holding public hearings at meetings held on
December 16, 2003 and February 17, 2004, and continuing discussion at
a special meeting on February 26, 2004, .has reviewed and accepted as
adequate the Full Environmental Assessment Form. (EAF) Part I prepared
by the applicant, Part II of the EAF prepared by the Town Planning staff,
and has reviewed other application materials, including the applicant's
"Submission for: SEQR, Site Plan Review, Subdivision, Rezoning for the
Proposed Overlook at West Hill, Aris Investments, Ithaca, New York,"
dated 14 November 2003, "Site Traffic Impact Evaluation for the proposed
Overlook at .West Hill," dated September 2003, "Preliminary Stormwater
Management Study — Proposed Residential Development, Overlook at
West Hill," dated November 2003, "Phase 1A Cultural Resource
Assessment," dated October 15, 2003, "Phase 1B Archeological Survey,"
dated November 25, 2003, "Supplemental Information and Submission for:
SEQR, Site Plan Review, Subdivision, Rezoning, Proposed Residential
Development, Overlook at West Hill, Aris Investments, Ithaca, New York,"
dated 9 January 2004, preliminary plans for "Overlook at West Hill
Apartments'; including Drawings C001 — C012, L001 — L006, and A001A
— A006, all prepared by HOLT Architects, P.C., Trowbridge & Wolf,
Landscape Architects, and T. G. Miller, P.C., and dated 9 January 2004,
and other application materials, and
6. The Town Planning staff has recommended a negative determination of
environmental significance with respect to the proposed rezoning,. Site
Plan and Subdivision Approval, and
7. Based on the above, the Planning Board, at its February 26, 2004
meeting, issued a negative determination of environmental significance
with regard to the proposed rezoning, Site Plan Approval and Subdivision
Approval, and
80 The Planning Board, after holding another public hearing on February 26,
2004, and continued on March 4, 2004, has reviewed and accepted as
adequate the above- referenced materials,
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED:
..
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
1. That the Town of Ithaca Planning. Board, pursuant to Article XIV, .Section
78 of the Town of Ithaca Zoning Ordinance, hereby finds that:
a. There is a need for the proposed Overlook at West Hill project in
the proposed location, and more particularly, that the Market Study
prepared by the applicant adequately demonstrates that there is an
unmet need for the ranges of affordable housing proposed in the
Overlook at West Apartments, and
b. The existing and probable future character of the neighborhood will
not be adversely affected by the proposed rezoning and project
development, and
C, The proposed rezoning is in accordance. with a comprehensive plan
of development of the Town, which designates the project site as
appropriate for "Suburban Residential" development, and in
addition, is adequately served by public water and sewer facilities,
is proximate to the City of Ithaca, and is served by-public transit,
and
2: That the Town of Ithaca 'Planning Board hereby recommends that the
Town of Ithaca Town Board enact a proposed local law to amend the
Town of Ithaca Zoning Ordinance by rezoning a portion of Town of Ithaca
Tax Parcel No. 24 -4 -14.2 from R -15 Residence to MR Multiple Residence,
which is proposed for the Overlook at West Hill Site Development,
consisting of approximately 24.5 +/- acres for 128 apartment units in
sixteen buildings and a community center on Parcels "B. and "C'; as
shown on the "Preliminary Subdivision Plat" (Drawing C001), dated 9
January 2004, prepared by Allen. T. Fulkerson, L. S., T. G. Miller P.C., and
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED:
1. That the Planning Board hereby grants Preliminary Subdivision Approval
for the proposed subdivision of Tax Parcel No. 24 -4 -14.2, totaling 48 +/-
acres, into four parcels, including Parcel A to be retained by Song -Ja
Kyong consisting of 5.0 +/- acres, Parcel B proposed for the Phase la
development of 64 apartment units and a community center on 12.224 +/-
acres, Parcel C proposed for the Phase lb development of 64 apartment
units on 12.351 +/- acres, and Parcel D for a future Phase 2 subdivision
and development of 15 single- family homes consisting of 18.764 +/ -acres,
as shown on the drawing entitled "Overlook at West Hill Preliminary
Subdivision Plat" (Sheet C001), dated 9 January 2004, prepared by Allen
T. Fulkerson, L.S., T.G. Miller P.C., conditioned upon the following to be
completed prior to the granting of Final Subdivision Approval, unless
otherwise noted:
EN
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
a. Rezoning by the Town Board of the proposed project site (Parcels
B and C) as described above prior to consideration of Final
Subdivision Approval by the Planning Board; and
b. Acceptance by the Town Board of the concept and location of West
Hill Drive proposed for future dedication to the Town as a public
road; and
C' Submission of draft language providing access and use for all
residents of the apartments on Parcels B and C to the Play Area,
Community Center, bus stop facilities, and the open
play /recreational area on Parcel B, as well as cross easements
between Parcels B and C to ensure rights of both portions of the
development to all drives, walkways, utility lines, and other common
improvements, prior to signing of the plat by the Planning Board
Chair; and
d. Submission of draft easement language allowing emergency
access for the Phase la development over the access drive to the
water tank until Phase lb development and the full main loop road
is completed, prior to signing of the plat by the Planning Board
Chair; and
e. Submission of draft easement language providing access to the.
Town of Ithaca to all storm water management facilities, and sewer
and water mains, and indication on the Final Plat of the location
and dimensions of all such easements to be conveyed to the Town,
prior to signing of the plat by the Planning Board Chair, and
f. Evidence of the necessary approval by the Tompkins County
Health Department on the final plat, prior to signing of the plat by
the Planning Board Chair; and
g. Before construction of any improvements anywhere on the project
site is commenced, requirements of the Final Site Plan Checklist
shall be met, and Final Site Plan Approval granted by the Town of
Ithaca Planning Board; and
h. Completion of the Phase la, road and required utilities to the
satisfaction of the Town Engineer and Town Highway
Superintendent, and conveyance of same to the Town, if required
by the: Town Board, prior to .the issuance of any building permits for
construction on Parcel B and completion of the Phase lb road and
required utilities to the satisfaction of the Town Engineer and Town
Highway Superintendent, and conveyance of same to the Town if
we
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
required by the Town Board, prior to the issuance of any building
permits for construction on Parcel C; and
i. Revision of the Final Plat to show a future 60 -foot wide road right-
of -way extending from the possible future. Town road for a possible
road connecting to the adjacent Cornell property to the south (Tax.
Parcel No. 244-5.2); and
j. Reservation of a right -of -way strip on Parcels A, B and C adjacent
to the existing right -of -way of NYS Route 96 for highway purposes
sufficient in width to accommodate a future exclusive left -turn lane
on Route 96, for future dedication to the New York State
Department of Transportation, details of such dedication to be
worked out between the applicant, Attorney for the Town, Director
of Planning, and Director of Engineering prior to Final Subdivision
Approval, and such right -of -way strip to be shown on the Final Plat
for submission to the Planning Board, and described in a
declaration of restrictive covenant for review and approval of the
Attorney for the Town ; and
21 That the Planning Board hereby finds that there are adequate recreational
facilities incorporated within the proposed development, and 'there is no
need for any additional park land reservation created by this proposed
subdivision, and the Planning Board hereby waives the requirement for
any park land reservation, and.
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED:
1. That the Planning Board hereby grants Preliminary Site Plan Approval for
the proposed Overlook at West Hill Site Development for Parcel B
proposed for the Phase la development of 64 apartment units and a
community center on 12.224 +/- acres, Parcel C proposed for the. Phase
lb development of 64 apartment units on 12.351 +A acres, and Parcel D
as a fill site for the .placement of excess soil from the Phase 1 .earthwork
operations, as shown on preliminary plans for "Overlook at West Hill
Apartments', including Drawings .0001 — C012, L001 — L006, and A001A
— A006, all prepared by HOLT Architects, P,-C., Trowbridge & Wolf,
Landscape Architects, and T.G. Miller, P.C., and dated 9 January 2004,
and other application materials, conditioned upon the following to. be
completed prior to the granting of Final Site Plan Approval, unless
otherwise noted:
a. Rezoning of the proposed project site by the Town Board: and
47
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
b. Preparation and submission of final design and construction details
of all proposed structures and improvements, including drainage
and storm water management facilities, roads /driveways, parking
areas, curbing, walkways, sewer and water facilities and other
utilities, design of the play area, and sedimentation and erosion
control measures, for review and approval by the Town Engineer;
and
C, Submission of final details of size, location, design, and
construction materials of all proposed signs and lighting, including
the proposed entrance sign; and
d. Submission of a final landscaping plan and planting schedule for
Phases la and lb showing additional landscaping along the east.
side of the easterly units similar to that proposed on the west side
of the westerly units; and
e. Submission of final, detailed building elevations and floor plans for
all apartment buildings, bus shelter, and the Community Center,
including descriptions of building materials and colors, and accurate
.
dimensions of buildings, including building heights; and
f. Provision of record of application for and approval status of all
necessary permits from other county, state, and /or federal agencies
and obtaining the necessary curb -cut and road work permits from
the New York State Department of Transportation, prior to issuance
of any building permits; and
g. No development shall take place on Parcel D except for one single
or two - family home until a subdivision plat for future subdivision and
development of that area has. been reviewed and approved by the
Town of Ithaca Planning Board; and
h. Revision of the Final Site Plan to show the location and
arrangement of benches and . bicycle racks, particularly in
conjunction with the Community Center and play area, and
enhancement of the play area to include additional children's play
facilities, as well as the addition of picnic tables and other such
common amenities for use of the residents of the apartments and to
also show re- grading of the area of the play field near Trumansburg
Road to make it more viable as a ball field or similar facility, to
include a fence or other barrier to prevent items. from exiting onto
Route 96B, unless it is demonstrated that such fence or other
barrier is not feasible; and
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH 4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
i. Submission of a draft drainage facility maintenance plan to Town
Director of Engineering for review and approval prior to issuance of
any building permits; and
J. Obtaining any necessary variances
Appeals, including a variance to allow
than the required 180 square feet, or
modifying the parking spaces to cor
Zoning Ordinance requirements; and
from. the Zoning Board of
parking spaces to be smaller
revision of the final site plan
iform to the Town of Ithaca
k. Revision of the Final Site Plan to include appropriate striping, signs,
and traffic signal phasing, if necessary, for a pedestrian crosswalk
on Route 96 at the point where the proposed concrete walk
terminates at Route 96; and
1. Revision of the Final Site Plan to label at least one handicap
accessible parking space at. the Community Center; and
m. Revision of the Final Site Plan to show the re- location of
Stormwater Wetland #1 farther back from. NYS Route 96 (along
with, any accompanying design modifications) if necessary to
accommodate the future highway right -of -way widening strip to be
reserved referred to in Condition 1.j, above under Preliminary
Subdivision Approval, subject to a determination by the Director of
Engineering and Director of Planning, in consultation with the New
York State Department of Transportation; and
n. Revision of the Final Site Plan to extend the sidewalk (to be
constructed during Phase. lb construction) along West Hill Drive to
the westerly end of Overlook Circle. and connecting to the Phase lb
development area, with the understanding that the sidewalk will be
extended along the future extension of West Hill Drive for the
Phase 2 subdivision, if so required by the Planning Board; and
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED:
That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby finds that the provision of public
transportation is an important element to ensure the successful operation of the
proposed affordable housing development, and that it would be safer and more
efficient for TCAT (Tompkins Consolidated Area Transit) to modify its existing
bus routes to enter the proposed site driveway and pick up and discharge
passengers at the proposed bus shelter and turnaround area shown on the
Preliminary _ Site Plan, thereby encouraging residents to use the public bus
system and ensuring their safety in so doing. The Planning Board, therefore,
..
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
MARCH.4, 2004
APPROVED MARCH 16, 2004
requests that the Town Supervisor, Town Board and staff pursue with the TCAT
Board. of Directors the possibility of providing bus service on site directly at the
proposed bus shelter and turnaround, rather than providing bus stops on Route
96, as suggested by TCAT staff in their letter dated September 11, 2003. .
A vote on the motion resulted as follows.
AYES: Wilcox,, Hoffmann, Conneman, Mitrano, Howe.
NAYS Talty
ABSENT: Thayer.
The motion was declared to be carried.
AGENDA ITEM: ADJOURNMENT
Upon MOTION, Chairperson Wilcox declared the March 4, 2004 meeting of the
Town of Ithaca Planning Board duly adjourned at 10:00 p.m. .
Respectfully Submitted
Lori Love
50
PLANNING BOARD 3/4/04 ATTACHMENT. - - _ T�
I t h a c a
neighborhood Housing
Services
February 19,'2004
Mr. Fred Wilcox III, Chair
Town of Ithaca Planning Board
600 Warren Rd., Apt: 9 -1 E
Ithaca, NY 14850
Re: Overlook at West Hill
Dear Mr. Wilcox:
115 West Clinton Street Ithaca, NY 14850
P: (607) 277 4500 F: (607) 277 4536
On behalf of the Board of Directors of Ithaca Neighborhood Housing Services, I am
writing to urge you and your fellow Planning Board members to give speedy approval to
the environmental review, site plan and zoning change recommendation for the Overlook
at West Hill project. This development is desperately needed to increase the supply of
affordable housing in the Town of Ithaca.
For more than 26 years, INHS has been addressing the housing needs of the working
poor in our community. During this time, we've come to recognize the many challenges
that lower.income people face in trying to obtain decent and affordable housing. In our
experience; these challenges have never been greater. The combination of low wages,
rapidly rising housing costs, and more people seeking housing have conspired to create
an overwhelming affordability gap for people with modest means. The demand for decent
housing is great among all income groups, but lower income people bear the greatest.
burden because they cannot compete in this market.
Recognizing this need, INHS has been steadily adding to its portfolio of affordable rental
units. We now own 116 units in the City of Ithaca and would like to add many more.
Unfortunately, the opportunities to develop more multifamily housing in Ithaca are
extremely limited due to a lack of available land.
The Overlook project represents a unique opportunity to add 128 units of high quality
and very affordable housing to our local housing stock. This project targets the people
who most need help; those in the lowest quartile of income groups. It also guarantees
that this housing will.remain affordable for at least 50 years. INHS intends to buy and
operate this housing at the -end of the initial 15 -year regulatory period, maintaining local
control and responsiveness.
It takes a healthy degree of personal courage to stand up to people who claim to support
affordable housing but who actively fight it with every means at their disposal. Please
keep in mind that this housing is designed to help hard working people bring stability
and dignity to their lives. The people who will live at Overlook are all around us, and we
depend on them to make our lives better. They are teacher's aides, nurses, sales clerks
and mechanics; cooks, carpenters, secretaries and librarians. They work for our
government, our businesses and our educational institutions. These are our friends and
N ghboM &O
r"&QTFDFn hAFMAPP
EOUAL 12) OPPORTUNITY HOUSING
OPPORTUNITY
r �
neighbors, and we fail to see how a "concentration" of these residents would be
detrimental to any community.
We very much appreciate the Town of Ithaca's past efforts to respond to the. need for
more affordable housing in Ithaca and urge you to continue this fine record of
achievement. This project deserves your support and we urge you to grant it.
Please read this letter .nto the public record of the public hearing for this project
scheduled or February 26, 2004.
Very truly yours,
MEMO
■■
PLANNING BOARD 3/4/04 .ATTACHMENT # 2
[SILVA I W Ni /
M.fAILV
www.tompkinschamber.org
February 23,.2004
Mr. Fred Wilcox III, Chair
Town of Ithaca Planning Board
600 Warren Rd. Apt. 9 -1E
Ithaca, NY 14850
Re: Overlook at West Hill
Dear Mr. Wilcox:
I am writing to urge the Town.of Ithaca Planning Board to support the Overlook at
West Hill project by giving your approval to its development.
The Chamber of Commerce has heard repeatedly from business leaders, government
officials and citizens of Tompkins County that the lack of affordable housing is our
most urgent problem. All of us appreciate the high quality of life that makes Ithaca
such.a wonderful place to live, but the high cost of housing is making it more and
more.difficult for working people with modest incomes to enjoy these benefits. Many
are living in housing that is poor quality, overly expensive or distant from their jobs.
Every business in Tompkins County relies on a workforce of able and talented
people, but we increasingly find that the high cost of housing is an impediment to
retaining workers.
The need for more affordable housing has been front page news in local
newspapers for years now. This is problem that doesn't lend itself to easy or
inexpensive solutions. The Town of Ithaca should be commended for encouraging
the development of more affordable housing, but those good intentions will be
meaningless if it doesn't seize the opportunity to actually allow the creation of more
housing. The Overlook project will not come close to solving all of our housing
problems, but it will provide a meaningful addition to our supply of affordable
apartments.
I don't envy your task of considering the many competing interests that come into
play when reviewing a project such as Overlook. However, I urge you to balance the
voices of the project's opponents with a clear recognition of the needs of the Town's
lower income residents. In the Town of Ithaca, over 57% of the renters are paying
rents that are a financial burden to them. For the lowest income people, this burden
can be extreme and it results in having to make choices among those things that
most of us consider necessities: food, heat, clothing or shelter.
The Town of Ithaca has been a leader in promoting sensible, well - planned
development. The approval of the Overlook project will continue that tradition and
will provide badly needed benefits to those who need it the most.
904 East Shore Drive • Ithaca, NY 14850 • Phone: (607) 273 -7080 • Fax: (607)272 -7617
Mr. Fred Wilcox .
Feb. 24, 2004
Page 2.
I very much appreciate your consideration of my request. Please be assured that the
Chamber will continue to support available, affordable and suitable housing
throughout our community. 'We will be writing to and speaking with elected officials
and appointed committee members about this issue many times in the coming
months.
Kindly read this letter into the record at the Planning Board's public hearing on
February 26, 20044
Sincgrely,
lean McPheeters
President
CC:
Town of Ithaca Planning Board Members
Eva. Hoffman
4 Sugarbush Lane
Ithaca, NY 14850
George Conneman .
197 Christopher Lane
Ithaca, NY 14850
Tracy Mitrano
20 Chase Lane
Ithaca, NY 14850
Lawrence Thayer
7 Perry Lane
Ithaca, NY 14850
Rod Howe
126 Judd Falls Rd.
Ithaca, NY 14850
Kevin Talty
115 Lexington Dr.
Ithaca, NY 14850
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
215 North Tioga Street
Ithaca, New York 14850
Special Meeting
Thursday, March 4. 2004
AGENDA
7:00 P.M. Persons to be heard (no more than five minutes).
7:05 P.M. CONTINUATION OF PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Preliminary Subdivision
Approval, Preliminary Site Plan Approval, and a recommendation to the Town Board regarding the
Zoning Change for-the proposed residential development, Overlook at West Hill, located at 1290
Trumansburg Road (NYS Route 96), Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 244-14.2, Residential District
R -15. The proposal consists of two phases of residential development, consisting of 128 affordable
rental apartment units in 16 buildings and a community center in Phase I on a 24.5 +/- acre portion
of Tax Parcel No. 24 -4 -14.2, and 15 lots for single - family, market rate homes in Phase II on about
19 acres of the subject property. The current owners would retain about 5 acres containing the
existing medical practice fronting on Trumansburg Road. The applicant is currently requesting
consideration of rezoning. the 24.5 +/- acres for affordable rental apartments from R -15 Residence
to MR Multiple Residence and preliminary subdivision and site plan approval for the Phase I
apartments. Song Ja Kyong, Owner; Aris Investments, Applicant; Grace Chiang, HOLT Architects
and Peter. Trowbridge, Trowbridge& Wolf, Landscape Architects, Agents. This is a continuation
of the Public Hearing that was opened on February 26, 2004.
3. Persons to be heard (continued from beginning of meeting if necessary).
4. Approval of Minutes: February 17, 2004 (previously distributed).
5. Other Business.
6. Adjournment.
Jonathan Kanter, .AICP
Director of Planning
273 -1747
NOTE: IF ANY MEMBER OF THE PLANNING BOARD IS UNABLE TO ATTEND, PLEASE NOTIFY
SANDY POLCE AT 273 -1747.
(A quorum of four (4) members is necessary to conduct Planning Board business.)
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
NOTICE OF CONTINUATION OF PUBLIC HEARING
Thursday March 4, 2004
By direction of the Chairperson of the Planning Board, NOTICE IS. HEREBY GIVEN that a Public
Hearing will be continued by the Planning Board of the Town of Ithaca at a Special Meeting on Thursday,
March 4, 2004, at 215 North Tioga Street, Ithaca, N.Y., at the following time and on the. following matter:
7:05 P.M. Consideration of Preliminary Subdivision Approval,. Preliminary Site Plan Approval,
and a recommendation to the Town Board regarding the Zoning Change for the
proposed residential development, Overlook at West Hill, located at 1290 Trumansburg
Road (NYS Route 96), Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 24 -4 -14.2, Residential District. .
R -15. The proposal consists of two phases of residential development, consisting of
128 affordable rental apartment units in 16 buildings and a community. center in Phase I
on a 24.5 +/- acre portion of Tax Parcel No. 24 -4 -14.2, and 15 lots for single - family,
market rate homes in Phase I1 on about 19 acres of the subject property. The current
owners would retain about 5 acres containing the existing medical practice fronting on
Trumansburg Road. The applicant is currently requesting consideration of rezoning the
2415 +/- acres for affordable rental apartments from R -15 Residence to MR Multiple
Residence and preliminary subdivision and site plan approval for the Phase I
apartments. Song Ja Kyong, Owner; Aris Investments, Applicant; Grace Chiang,
HOLT Architects and Peter Trowbridge, Trowbridge & Wolf, Landscape Architects,
Agents. This is a continuation of the Public Hearing that was opened on February 26,
2004.
Said Planning Board will at said time and said place continue to hear all persons in support of such matter
or objections thereto. Persons may appear by agent or in person. Individuals with visual impairments,
hearing impairments or other special needs, will be provided with assistance as necessary, upon request.
Persons desiring assistance must make such a request not less than 48 hours prior to the time of the public
hearing.
Jonathan Kanter, AICP
Director of Planning
273 =1747
Dated: Friday, February 27, 2004
Publish: Monday, March 1, 2004
- t
The Ithaca Journal
Monday, March12004`A4
Y TOWN,OF- ITHACA
PLANNING_BOARD ;1
Thursday,
Marchr4, 2004
i By, direction Iof Ae Chou
person: of, the,*ePlanning,
tBcard, NOTICE IS':HEREBY
I GIVEN that :`!Public Hetirr
ing will becontinued b I; the;
;Planning;Bod�d;of the, Town
of. Ifhaca.al; a:Special;'Meet-
ing on 7hursday;;M arc
h 4 .
2004; at'2,15 - North- - iogo=
Street Ithaca;` N.,-at sffie,
following time•'and'=on ate
follow r
ing matte.
7e05 onsiBeration
of;P. eliminar Subdivision;
A'pprovdl;?'Veliin inciry %Site `
Plan,.Approval and,a rec-
ommendation to' -the Town.
Board;, 3egardingthe,Zoning
[Charige'jor =theta= proposed]
jresidentidl development,'.
i/_7__I__ I.•'.Li a /__t'' •11..x15'
4:2
7
>f. •Tax Parcel
p. 668 - 15`16ts
market rate'
e Ilson'ali out
'
ifie" subject"
`current a`' n-
mansourg tKaaa.�.r erne
plicant ps _';currently re•:
:shnq;: conside ation =,'aft
omng the 24 5' ±/ acres
'affordable;rentol a "par4;
nts from 'R'15 ,Residence
/v1R ;'M ultipie;l'Residence�
J* . preliniinary'subdivision'
I site•'plan ._approval for'
Phase Y `apartments.,
ig..Ja.:Kyonb, -,Owner;':
Trowbridge & Wolf, `land
'scope "Arch�'t,ects,' -Agents. i
This is a; cod 1nuation of the'
Nblic,�,Hearing:: that;'_was•.
1a 'ed,,-cn- Tebrua"ry' "26;
2004.
-.Said Planning Board!will-
otisa dctime and soid'.ptace'
continue twheat all. persons!
n. support of'such motte "r or
ibjections thereto: . Persoris
nay; appear -by :agent, or, in
4needs,-willbe provdei'.with.
assistance.- As necessary,.
Upon request. Persons desir-
ing ' assistance' must make
r:such :a.requestnot. less than
,481 ours prior to the'time bf
the public hearing.
Jonathan Kanter,. AICP
Director of Planning
273 -1747
Dated:- Friday,
jFe'brua ry'' 27; 2004
IPublisli: Monday,
.March l; 2004 fit;
TOWN OF ITHACA
PLANNING BOARD
SIGWIN SHEET
DATE: Thursday, March 04, 2004
(PLEASE PRINT TO ENSURE ACCURACY IN OFFICIAL MINUTES)
PLEASE PRINT NAME PLEASE PRINT ADDRES.S /AFFILIATION
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TOWN OF ITHACA
PLANNING BOARD
SIGN -IN SHEET
DATE: Thursday, March 04, 2004
(PLEASE PRINT TO ENSURE ACCURACY IN OFFICIAL MINUTES)
PLEASE PRINT NAME PLEASE PRINTADDRESS /AFFILIATION
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TOWN OF ITHACA
AFFIDAVIT OF POSTING AND PUBLICATION
I, Sandra Polce being duly sworn, depose and say that I am a Senior Typist for the Town of
Ithaca, Tompkins County, New York; that the following Notice has been duly posted on the sign
board of the Town of Ithaca and that said Notice has been duly published in the local newspaper,
The Ithaca Journal.
Notice of Public Hearings to be held by the Town of Ithaca Planning Board in the Town of Ithaca
at 7:00 P.M., as per attached.
Location of Sign Board used for Posting: Town Clerk.Sign Board — 215 North Tio ag Street.
Date of Posting:
Date of Publication:
February 27, 2004
March 1, 2004
Sandra Polce, Senior Typist
Town of Ithaca.
STATE OF NEW YORK) SS:
COUNTY OF TOMPKINS)
Sworn to and subscribed before me this 1 st day of March 2004.
r
I�
Notary Public
DEBORAH KELLEY
Notary Public, State of New York
No. O1'KE6025073
Qualified in- Schuyler County
Commission Expires May 17, 20 U7