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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1993-02-22-PB ■ TOWN OF ULYSSES - PLANNING BOARD MEETING TRUMANSBDRG TOWN HALL FEBRUARY 22 , 1993 PRESENT : Chairman , David Tyler ; Planning Board Members : Budd Stover , Dan Smith and Gregg Hoffmi. re ; Secretary : Roxanne Smith . OTHER PRESENT : Mary McLallen , Charles Oafs , Tom Reitz , Ruth Kahn and one other gentleman . Chairman David Tyler called the meeting to order at 7 : 45 P . M . , and requested that the minutes of their last meeting of Decem - ber 11 , 1992 be approved . The letter to William Hogan is in e ssence the minutes of that meeting as there was no record keeper present . The letter reflected the decisional meeting o n the American Legion PUD application . Dan Smith made the motion to approve the minutes . Budd Stover seconded the mo - t ion , there was no discussion , all were in favor , the motion passed . The minutes are now all up to date . Alex Rachun had intended to be present at this meeting but was unable to attend due to conjunctivitis . Krys Cail is out of town until the 11th of March and Gerri Keil is out of town until the 2nd . There was no communication received from Dick Garner . David suggested that this meeting would be spent in discussion of t he matter that has now been referred back to the Planning Board . Budd queried as to whether anything had been written up as a result of Krys Cail ' s suggestions at the December 3rd meeting . Dan stated that they seemed to be back ‘ at that point as a result of the Town Board meeting . Everyone agreed . D avid summerized that the Town Board tabled their considera - t ion of the PUD and requested the Planning Board to consider a new use in the zoning ordinance to describe a designation like the Am .:. rican Legion and to state the conditions where it could go . Dan said that at the December 3rd meeting they were pressed for time towards the end and they didn ' t get into the specifics of the Residential Zoning Ordinance . Dave thought t hat Krys ' s concept was looking to take the more intense use o ut of the first level of Residential and put it into a sec - o nd level . The less intense Residential would be one or two f amily dwellings . " M through P " would remain in - the R1 . The R2 would consist of " F through L " and things such as a social club , daycare and many things that haven ' t even been mentioned before . Daved did want to point out one thing procedurely . The Planning Board was asked to look at one specific parcel , t he PUD . Now they ' ve asked us to come back and look at the e ntire Zoning Ordinance . If the Town changes the Zoning Ordin - ance it becomes a legislative function that becomes townwide . The development district is just one parcel . One solution is t o make an across the board change in the Zoning Ordinance which provides for the social club or whatever you want to call this specifically . A gentleman from the audience raised the q uestion are you limited in changing the zoning until the com - pre'nensive plan has been enacted ? Dave replied that they wern ' t n ecessarily restricted in changing the ordinance . The problem is after they go ahead and create an R1 and R2 , where to locate them . The Master Planning Committee is the body to recommend where to locate them not the Planning Board . Dave mentioned t hat Alex had relayed that in the next few weeks the maps will be ready and that the Master Planning Committee will be able t o meet . Dave stated that it is important to recognize that once something life this is put in as a permitted use , even with a special per - mit with specific conditions that there is still only one Residen - tial Zone . As long as the conditions are met this social club 1111 Town of Ulysses 2 P lanning Board Meeting February 22 , 1993 could be placed anywhere within the zone . The PUD is a legisla - t ive process . If the Town rejects it , the person has no claim against the Town for not Granting it . If granted , a spot zon - ing challenge can be made , but if not what does this do to the zoning ordinance ? The Town Board is reluctant to follow through with a PUD . Is there another way to accomplish this without a P UD and without doing damage to the zoning ordinance in general ? O ne way to go would be to place it in a B1 or B2 zone or in a Residential with a Special Permit . Another alternative would be to look at all the items in the Zoning Ordinance that require a Special Permit and develop something that would handle them across the board . Dan queried was the Special Permit defined any - where in the Zoning Ordinance ? Budd mentioned the only thing he found was on page 3 section 8 . David said that is really a pre - amble . D ave stated that frankly he was disappointed that the Town Board did not act on the PUD one way or the other . The Plan - ing Board may not be prepared to tinker with the Zoning Ordin - ance to achieve the Town Board ' s desire . The Town Board has tabled the issue and given the Planning Board 60 days to develop a new use to the zoning ordinance . Dan said they could create a Special Permit making it allowable using the definition of the social club using Section 1 of Article IV . Then . it should come t o the Planning Board not the BZA . The question was raised should all Special Permits be rewritten ? David asked that if the American Legion problem didn ' t exist here and the topic came up for consideration would you put it in Residential ? Dan responded that he would probably have to look around and see what other districts have done . Dave mentioned that his office had alot of zoning ordinances kicking around and h e checked into it . They were all over the lot . The village of L ansing kept it out of Residential and put it in . the low impact business zone . The Town of Lansing has a Rural . Agricultural zone . The Rural Agricultural zone allowed it but not the Rural Residen - tial . ( Town of Ulysses has fewer categories than the other dis - tricts . ) ' . • D avid shared his thoughts on how important it is to look at the concept . If the American Legion didn ' t exist , but . the Planning B oard had been advised that they needed to be prepared for a similar situation whyre exactly would it be placed ? That ' s the q uandry the Planning Board is in . D an asked pave about the letter Alex Rachun received from Helen McLallen ( private citizen ) that David had copies of . David stated he had not had an opportunity to read it . ( Everyone was given a copy of it . ) D an asked David what he would consider the property from the Town Village line out to Gregg ' s . Did he think it was Residential or Rural /Agricultural / Residential . He said to really consider it , not just looking at the road frontage but also the size of the lots , the density and amount of agriculture . Is there some clear cut definition of what Residential is queried Dan ? Dave stated t hat that was a good question . He ' s more concerned with what the developing trend is , not what is there now . One house per 10 acre lot may not constitute a true Residential stated Dan . Dave said his definition would be based on two things . 1 . What is there now ? 2 . What has been the trend in the recent period ? Is it an area that is going into Residential or is it an area that is going to stay Rural / Agricultural . He said there has been an • increase in Residential where the American Legion grants to go but as you go zy Town of Ulysses 3 P lanning Board Meeting February 22 , 1993 further out it peters out to Rural / Agricultural . If more Resi - dential goes in there what is the impact of water and sewer contamination on the surrounding properties asked Dan . Isn ' t there more impact form a greater number of smaller parcels t han just one large parcel ? Dave responded that that is the H ealth Department ' s area of expertise and that their rules are ✓ ery stringent . Dan disagreed stating that a lot of things blamed on agriculture is actually coming from residential . Dave t hought that probably applied to older neighborhoods . Dan said t here is a world of difference between a house sitting on a 1 acre lot as opposed to a house sitting on a 10 acre lot . That ' s a choice made by the individual as to how much land they want surrounding their home stated David . Dan wondered if that would have a different application in the Zoning Ordinance though . In o ther words would a larger lot make it fall into a different Residential section ? Should they differentiate ? A member of the audience said that that has been addressed . It ' s called " Charac - ter of Neighborhood " . David ' s gut reaction ( after driving out and looking over the area proposed for the American Legion ) was that the trend was toward Residential . Curry Road houses appear t o be of a more recent vintage , with a few older homes ; further o ut he didn ' t have that feeling . Unfortunately they do not have t he benefit of a master plan . D an Smith said that he felt that they should not have to split the Residential into two sections . David disagreed and felt t hat it should have been addressed a long time ago . By allowing things to happen without a plan it becomes ad hoc . A master plan is needed . The first issue ( forgetting the American Legion ) is where would you place this ? Dan responded a lesser density Residential . After discussing philosophically the ramifications of not having gradations in the Residential Dan changed his position stating t hat he had not really thought it all through and that perhaps D avid was correct . It was agreed that it might be a good idea to check out the other munincipalities and do some comparisons . In continuing the discussion on Residential David suggested h aving a general clause that states any use not mentioned spe - cifically ought to have a classification to head off problems . A gentleman in the audience wondered who would define the usage ? IIe felt the American Legion falls under the restaurant use now . D avid agreed that it was at least analogous , it was an entity t hat serves the public , or a segment of the public . David stated that he would like more input . Alex Rachun unfortun - atley will be away until the 15th of March . When questioned Gregg felt he wasn ' t prepared to offer any suggestions . Budd stated t hat Krys ' s ideas might prove to be too cumbersome . Dan said that N ot - For - Profit isn ' t even mentioned in the Business District . D avid questioned whether there should be a distinction for Not - For - P rofit organizations . He felt that wasn ' t really the issue . The issue is what is the impact of this social club in the com - munity ( on roads , character of neighborhoods , etc . ) . As Krys h ad stated earlier to David Not - For - Profit organizations still have to meet all the required building codes , health and safety ✓ equirements . They are not exempt . It ' s important to evaluate what this particular thing will do to the community . Dan said you h ave to define it in the Zoning Ordinance . David queried Budd did h e like the idea of doing it quick and dirty with the existing Zoning Ordinance and placing it in a Bl or B2 ? Budd said that ' s an option . D avid asked if he should bring in the ordinances from the other XIV Town of Ulysses 4 P lanning Board Meeting February 22 , 1993 municipalities ? It was agreed he should . Briefly looking through the Village of Lansing it was discovered. that they called it an indoor recreation club and it was classified as a High Density Residential . David felt the easiest way with what they have on the books would be with a B1 or B2 . A general catch all would be placed in the ordinance for the required definition . Dan suggested that the divided Residentials be specific as to what could not go in there . The next Planning Board meeting will be March 15 , 1993 at 7 : 30 P . M . at the Town Hall . Tom Reitz stated that another issue that the Planning Board was asked to address was the B2 Zone for Pleasant Grove . David had received no communication on that issue . They ap - plied for a PUD awhile ago . The Town Board would like the P lanning Board to consider this a B2 Zone . Tom said he ' d make sure all the information was gotten to David and members of the B oard . Budd asked if they had withdrawn their PUD . application . Tom replied no . David wants to resolve the social club issue before moving to the Pleasant Grove project . D avid mentioned that the New York State Office of Rural Affairs is having a conference on planning board activities o n the 21st of April at TC3 . The fee is $ 10 . 00 per person . D avid asked if the Town Board would consider sending 6 or 7 members ? Tom said he ' d recommend that the Planning Board attend it if possible . The mock planning board . meeting would be useful . The Town Board meets on the 2nd Tuesday of the month . The Master Planning Board will probably behaving a meeting soon and David recommended all attend that could . Tom Reitz mentioned that County Planning is looking at things more closely , and that they are no longer a rubber stamp operation . They ' re going through a transition now in their re - location from the Biggs Building to the Old Court House . D avid entertained a motion to adjourn . Dan Smith made the motion , Budd Stover seconded . There was no discussion , the motion passed . The meeting adjourned at 9 : 15P . M . i i