HomeMy WebLinkAboutPB Minutes 2003-12-16FILE
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TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
TUESDAY, DECEMBER 16, 2003
The Town of Ithaca Planning Board met in regular session on Tuesday, December 16,
2003, . in Town Hall, 215 North Tioga, Ithaca, New York,: at 7:00 p.m.
PRESENT: Fred Wilcox, Chairperson; Eva Hoffmann, Board Member; George
Conneman, Board Member; Tracy Mitrano, Board Member; Larry Thayer, : Board
Member; Rod Howe, Board Member; Jonathan Kanter, Director of Planning; John
Barney, Attorney for the Town; Dan Walker, Director of Engineering; Susan Ritter,
Assistant Director of Planning; Michael Smith, Environmental Planner,
EXCUSED: Kevin Talty, Board Member; Christine Balestra, Planner,
OTHERS: Joe Scaglione, 1223 Trumansburg Road; Jerry and Pat Hall, 1307
Trumansburg Road; Dan Mitchell, 108 Crest Lane; Diane Hardy, American Red Cross;
.Chris Papamichael, Aris Investments; Frank Santelli, TG. Miller, PC; Grace Chiang,
HOLT Architects; Joseph McEnerney, 131 Hopkins Road; Ann and Andy Byrne, 137
Hopkins Road; Miles Cigolle, .HOLT Architects; Paul Mazzarella, INHS; Mark Lee, 31.5
Blackstone Avenue; Jim Penwell, Streeter Associates; Peter Trowbridge, Trowbridge &
Wolf; Margot Chiuten, Trowbridge and Wolf; Luanne M. Prosperi Stefanucci, 1223
Trumansburg Road; Mary E. Prosperi, 1223 Trumansburg Road; Roger DuPuis, 1223
Trumansburg Road; Gordon & June Walden, 121 Hopkins Road; Amy Dake, SRF
Associates; Don Crittendon, 173 Bundy Road.
Chairperson Wilcox declared the meeting duly opened at 7:06 p.m., and accepted for
the record Secretary's Affidavit of Posting and Publication of the Notice of Public
Hearings in Town Hall and the Ithaca Journal on December 8, 2003 and December 10,
2003, together with the properties under discussion, as appropriate, upon the Clerks of
the City of Ithaca and the Town of Danby, upon the Tompkins County Commissioner of
Planning, upon the Tompkins County Commissioner of Public Works, and upon the
applicants and /or agents, as appropriate, on December 10, 2003,
Chairperson Wilcox read the Fire Exit Regulations to those assembled, as required by
the New York State Department of State, Office of Fire Prevention and Control.
AGENDA ITEM: PERSONS TO BE HEARD
Chairperson Wilcox opened this segment of the meeting at 7:06 p.m.
Diane Hardy, American Red Cross — 1. wanted to mention that our business is
continually booming. Each year we have a record number of people who are in home
shelters. .
Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
Chairperson Wilcox — Are your comments specific to the affordable housing proposal
before us tonight?
Ms. Hardy — We support any affordable housing.
Chairperson Wilcox — It would probably be appropriate that your comments be made
during the public hearing.
Ms. Hardy — Okay. Thank you.
Chairperson Wilcox closed this segment of the meeting at 7:07 p.m.
AGENDA ITEM: SEAR Determination: Ithaca Beer Co. Expansion Modification,
606 Elmira Road.
Chairperson Wilcox opened this segment of the meeting at 7:07 p.m.
Jim Penwell, Streeter Associates — As with the last application, this change to the layout
on the site plan from the previous application has no environmental impacts as stated in
the attached letter to the application form. As before, this building is completely going
on an existing impervious surface. We are not changing the drainage characteristics of
the lot. We are not removing any vegetation. We are not adding any additional
pollutants to the atmosphere or water. All the general requirements are within the
prescribed limits. We are merely reorienting the building on a paved surface as it is.
Chairperson Wilcox — Questions? I would caution you not to say that there are no
environmental impacts. Of course there are environmental impacts. I think in this case
they were thoroughly discussed when you were here before when we granted you the
initial approval. Comments? Would someone like to move the SEAR motion?
Board Member Thayer — I'll move the SEAR.
Chairperson Wilcox — So moved by Larry Thayer. Seconded by George Conneman.
Comments of staff? All those in favor please say aye.
Board — Aye. Motion carried unanimously.
PB RESOLUTION NO. 2003 -102: SEQR, Site Plan Modification, Ithaca Beer Co.
Expansion, 606 Elmira Road, Tax Parcel No. 33 -3 -2.1
MOTION made by Larry Thayer, seconded by George Conneman
WHEREAS:
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
1. Consideration of Site Plan Modification for the proposed 3,255 +/- square foot
addition to the Ithaca Beer Company located at 606 Elmira Road, Town of Ithaca
Tax Parcel No. 33- 3 -2.1, Light Industrial District. The modification includes
changing from a 48' x 66'(3,168 SF) addition as approved by the Planning Board
on October 7, 2003 to a 35'x 93' (3,255 SF) addition located along the rear of
the existing building. Yunis Realty, Inc., Owner; Dan Mitchell, Ithaca Beer
Company, Applicant, and
2. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board is
legislatively determined to act as Lead Agency in environmental review with
respect to Site Plan Approval, and
3. The Planning Board, on December 16, 2003, has reviewed and accepted as
adequate a Short Environmental Assessment Form Part 1, submitted by the
applicant, and Part II prepared by Town Planning staff, plans titled "Property
Location, " (Tax Map No. 33), "Survey Map No. 606 Elmira Road, " dated February
13, 1998, prepared by T. G. Miller P. C., "Site Plan," (DWG A1), dated 10 -28 -03
and revised 12- 02 -03, and Elevation Drawings, (DWG A2) dated 9 -15 -03 and
revised 12- 02 -03, prepared by Streeter Associates, Inc., and other application
material, and
4. The Town Planning staff has recommended a negative determination of
environmental significance with respect to the proposed Site Plan Approval;
NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED:
That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby makes a negative determination of
environmental significance in accordance with the New York State Environmental
Quality Review Act for the above referenced action as proposed, and, therefore, an
Environmental Impact Statement will not be required.
The vote on the motion resulted as follows:
AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Mitrano, Thayer, Howe.
NAYS: None.
ABSTAIN: None.
The motion was declared to be carried unanimously.
PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Site Plan Modification for the proposed
3,255 +/- square foot addition to the Ithaca Beer Company located at 606 Elmira
Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 33- 3 -2.1, Light Industrial District. The
modification includes changing from a 48' x 66' (3,168 SF) addition as approved
by the Planning Board on October 7, 2003 to a 35' x 93' (3,255 SF) addition
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
located along the rear of the existing building. Yunis Realty, Inc., Owner; Dan
Mitchell, Ithaca Beer Company, Applicant.
Chairperson Wilcox opened the public hearing at 7:08 p.m. and asked if any member of
the public wished to be heard. With no persons present to be heard, Chairperson
Wilcox closed the public hearing at 7:10 p.m.
Chairperson Wilcox — Discussion?
Board Member Hoffmann — I don't have any problem with it.
Board Member Thayer — I don't either.
Chairperson Wilcox — The soil samples indicated that the rear of the lot could not
support the building?
Mr. Penwell — In the back portion of the lot, there is a very steep embankment. This lot
was initially filled from the road level to back. There is about 20 feet of fill that starts at
the edge of the paving line and terminates at the rear property line. Results of the soils
investigation did not want us to impose the load of the new building so near the top of
the slope. So, they requested that we move the building in so that we were at least 26
feet off the property line. We had to drop the foundation depths slightly to make up that
room and to square up the building. The previously proposed plan went 66 feet across
the back of the building. Now it comes the entire width of the rear of the building,
approximately 90 feet deep.
Chairperson Wilcox — And you received a variance from the ZBA?
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you very much.
Board Member Mitrano — I'll move it.
Board Member Howe — Second.
Chairperson Wilcox — I have a motion by Tracy Mitrano and seconded by Rod Howe.
Board Member Thayer — It looks better than the original one, actually.
Chairperson Wilcox — There being no further discussion, all those in favor please signal
by saying aye.
Board — Aye. Motion carried unanimously.
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
PB RESOLUTION NO. 2003 -103: Site Plan Modification, Ithaca Beer Co.
Expansion, 606 Elmira Road, Tax Parcel No. 33 -3 -2.1
MOTION made by Tracy Mitrano, seconded by Rod Howe
WHEREAS:
1. Consideration of Site Plan Modification for the proposed 3,255 +/- square foot
addition to the Ithaca Beer Company located at 606 Elmira Road, Town of Ithaca
Tax Parcel No. 33- 3 -2.1, Light Industrial District. The modification includes
changing from a 48'x 66'(3,168 SF) addition as approved by the Planning Board
on October 7, 2003 to a 35'x 93' (3,255 SF) addition located along the rear of
the existing building. Yunis Realty, Inc., Owner; Dan Mitchell, Ithaca Beer
Company, Applicant, and
2. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board, acting as
lead agency in environmental review with respect to Site Plan Approval, has, on
December 16, 2003, made a negative determination of environmental
significance, after having reviewed and accepted as adequate a Short
Environmental Assessment Form Part I, submitted by the applicant, and a Part ll
prepared by Town Planning staff, and
3. The Planning Board, at a Public Hearing held on December 16, 2003, has
reviewed and accepted as adequate, plans titled "Property Location," (Tax Map
No. 33), "Survey Map No. 606 Elmira Road," dated February 13, 1998, prepared
by T. G. Miller P.C., "Site Plan," (DWG A 1), dated 10 -28 -03 and revised 12- 02 -03,
and Elevation Drawings (DWG A2) dated 9 -15 -03 and revised 12- 02 -03,
prepared by Streeter Associates, Inc., and other application material, and
NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED:
1. That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby waives certain requirements for
Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval, as shown on the Preliminary and Final
Site Plan Checklists, having determined from the materials presented that such
waiver will result in neither a significant alteration of the purpose of site plan
control nor the policies enunciated or implied by the Town Board, and
2. That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby grants Preliminary and Final Site
Plan Approval for the proposed 3,255 +/- square foot addition to the Ithaca Beer
Company located at 606 Elmira Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 33- 3 -2.1,
as shown on the plans titled "Property Location," (Tax Map No. 33), "Survey Map
No. 606 Elmira Road," dated February 13, 1998, prepared by T.G. Miller P.C.,
"Site Plan," (DWG Al), dated 10 -28 -03 and revised 12- 02 -03, and Elevation
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Drawings (DWG A2) dated 9 -15 -03 and revised 12- 02 -03, prepared by Streeter
Associates, Inc., and other application material, subject to the following condition:
a. submission of an original of the final site plan on mylar, vellum or paper, to
be retained by the Town of Ithaca, prior to the issuance of a building
permit.
The vote on the motion resulted as follows:
AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Mitrano, Thayer, Howe.
NAYS: None.
ABSTAIN: None.
The motion was declared to be carried unanimously.
Overlook at West Hill, 1290 Trumansburg Road
Chairperson Wilcox — Ladies and Gentlemen, let me give you a brief review of what we
are going to try to accomplish this evening and the order in which it will proceed. The
applicants will be given the opportunity to provide a presentation to the board and to the
public. We will most likely address many of the concerns that the public has, that the
board has, that the staff has. When they have completed their presentation, the
Planning Board will have the opportunity to ask the applicant an array of questions,
voice concerns and provide comments. When that has been completed, we will then
give the public a chance to speak. At that time, I will ask you to raise your hand. I will
recognize you in no particular order and ask you to come to the microphone and give
your name and address. I do no like to impose time limits, therefore, I ask that you
keep your comments to the point. Try to stay on topic, that would be considerate to
other members of the public who are here, members of the board and staff and Town
Attorney. If we should, get through the environmental review and if the board should
make a negative determination of environmental significance and if time allows,
because we try to end at 10:00 p.m., then there will be a second public hearing on
dealing with site plan approval, subdivision approval, and this board's recommendation
to the Town Board on the request for zoning modification. That is how we are going to
proceed. I ask that you bear with us and I ask you to be quiet, considerate, and
everyone will have a chance to be heard this evening. We will see how far we get this
evening.
PUBLIC HEARING: SEAR Determination regarding subdivision approval, site
plan approval, and a recommendation to the Town Board regarding a zoning
change, Overlook at West Hill, 1290 Trumansburg Road. (Attachments #1, #2 and
#3)
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Chairperson Wilcox opened the public hearing at 7:15 p.m.
Chairperson Wilcox — This evening's proceedings are being filmed by a member of the
public. Please be aware of that. Mr. Scaglione has that right.
Attorney Barney — Well, no. Mr. Scaglione has the permission to film, but he does not
have the right.
Chris Papamichael, Aris Investments — My firm, Aris Investments, is proposing Overlook
at West Hill, which is a planned residential development. It consists of 128 affordable
rental homes, which is targeted for low to moderate income families and 25 for sale
market rate homes, which will target a higher income bracket. I thought I would be brief
in my presentation so that my engineering and architectural staff would have more time
to talk, but the one point that I would like to solidify, which I think is the most important
aspect of this development for everyone is to understand the need for affordable
housing here in Ithaca. I would like to reiterate some statistics that we talked about in
the earlier planning meeting. according to our third party market studies, less than 50
percent of the households in the Town of Ithaca currently own their own homes. Among
the renter households, more than 50 percent pay more than 30 percent of their income
to rent. About 23 percent pay more than 50 percent of the income to rent. When
applying the generally accepted standard of housing affordability, a household should
pay no more than 30 percent of their income towards housing. This status points to a
severe housing affordability problem in the Ithaca market. In fact, the study determines
that even when excluding existing affordable housing developments, the 128 units
proposed will only satisfy 11 percent of the total demand in the affordable housing within
a 5 mile radius of the proposed site. Moreover, this study estimates that approximately
20 percent of residents within the same immediate area would qualify to live in the
proposed community.
We believe the Overlook at West Hill is a well- conceived, high - quality development that
meets the housing needs of a wide income range of Ithaca residents in the matter that
it is in -line with development within the Town's Comprehensive Plan. One thing that we
have changed since the first proposal is that we are proposing to develop the affordable
phase in two separate phases of 64 units. The main reason behind this is that the
Notice of Funding Availability through Division of Housing in Community Renewal has
been issued, which caps the amount of credit that will be allocated each year for each
project. We feel the project is more feasible under 2, 64 -unit developments rather than
the 128 units in the single phase. At this time I would like to hand the floor over to
Peter.
Peter Trowbridge, Trowbridge & Wolf — I will try to project loud enough for the
microphones.
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We have had two public workshops at the hospital in the last month and a half to try to
extend out to the public, shareholders, and neighbors. As most of you know, the
preliminary location for the project is directly across from the Cayuga Medical Center.
This is developed for an intersection at the Cayuga Medical Center. The first phase of
construction would include a new road ... (inaudible).
We have reviewed with Brian Wilbur the issue of developing this in two parts. He is
quite satisfied ... (inaudible). The overall site plan has developed ... (inaudible). There is
a lower area with three, small neighborhood areas of buildings each having small,
private green space. It is required that all parking be ADA required or designed. The
parking grade is at 2 percent. It cannot exceed 2 percent. All walkways have to be
compliant with no more than a 5 percent grade ... (inaudible). There is 1.3 parking
spaces designed per dwelling unit. We do have lighting within each row ... (inaudible).
The driveway will be maintained as a private road.
(Inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was Not speaking into a microphone.)
There will be lawn area and meadow. The meadow will be very typical. For the last 20
years I have managed something similar on my property. We mow it in November after
it no longer has any birds ... each year it comes back.
(Inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was Not speaking into a microphone.)
As you know, prior to the start of the project, this was primarily an agricultural field.
There is a detailed study that shows an area of shrubs ... (inaudible).
(Inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was Not speaking into a microphone.)
There is an access drive that goes up to the Town water tower. There are trees that will
be part of the preexisting buffer. The vegetation that exists along the southern
boundary, what will remain of the Kyong property and the housing, will also be retained.
At the time of the original submission, there was a quite of bit of excess material that
would need to be handled on site. The plan has been revised so that there will be cut
and fill on site. There is no material that will be taken off the site. What we have done
is adjust some of the grade on the overall site. In addition, have provided ... (inaudible).
Board Member Hoffmann — Can I ask you to explain that a little bit more while you have
that up? In particular, I would like to know if the two developments or phases are going
to be on one level piece of land or is one a little higher than the other.
Mr. Trowbridge — One is much higher than the other. What you are seeing are homes
that would be on the upper level. The upper level clears ... this level down here is
roughly at 930. The homes up here are roughly 50 feet higher, about 980.
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
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(Inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was Not speaking into a microphone.)
Board Member Hoffmann — How does that compare to the original proposal?
Mr. Trowbridge — The new proposal doesn't change any of the grades in the area of the
buildings. What we have done is add more fill to the hillside here ... (inaudible).
Board Member Thayer — Does is raise the overall height of the buildings from the
original?
Mr. Trowbridge — No. The building height won't change at all.
Board Member Thayer — The height of the building doesn't change, but the elevation
that they are built on is changing.
Mr. Trowbridge — There is a cut and fill balance for Phase la. When we get into this
other area, the excess cut material will be pushed up over the ridge until the building is
down to where they were in the preliminary proposal. We just found a way to distribute
it on site.
Board Member Thayer — What is the height of that new mound that you are putting
there?
Mr. Trowbridge — It does not exceed 18 inches above the existing grade. (Comments
inaudible)
Board Member Thayer — That is the area where the single family homes are going?
Mr. Trowbridge — That is right.
Board Member Thayer — That won't affect the height of those ... just by a foot or so?
Mr. Trowbridge — (Comments inaudible)
Male Voice — Inaudible question with inaudible response from Mr. Trowbridge.
Board Member Hoffmann — Let me just make sure that I understand it because I thought
that you said that the Phase I would be built at an elevation of 930 feet flat within that
site. Then you said that Phase II would be built at an elevation of 980 feet with a 50 foot
difference.
Mr. Trowbridge — That is correct. That has not changed.
Board Member Hoffmann — But there is a plan with a site section...
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
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Chairperson Wilcox — You had the site section up, Peter.
Board Member Hoffmann — The section looks essentially flat between Phase I and
Phase II.
Board Member Thayer — Yeah, you don't see 90 feet there.
Mr. Trowbridge — This is just Phase II. What you are seeing is that highest grade.
Board Member Hoffmann — Okay. I see that now. I should have realized that.
(Inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was Not speaking into a microphone.)
Board Member Hoffmann — I'm glad that I understand that now because I think it is
nicer, actually, than what I thought.
Mr. Trowbridge — We have talked with the traffic engineer about the intersection at
Cayuga Medical Center. In the presentation packet you were presented with
materials... (inaudible).
Chairperson Wilcox — The New York State Department of Transportation was provided
with a copy of the traffic evaluation report. Last Wednesday, December 10, the Town
and you received a letter from DOT with their comments after having reviewed both the
drainage and the proposed traffic mitigation measures. Having said that, you may go
ahead.
Amy Dake, Traffic Engineer with SRF Associates — First, I will go over our traffic study
briefly and what was done to date. Then I will discuss the visual. We prepared a traffic
study in September for the proposed property. The first thing that we did was collect
traffic volumes on Route 96 and at the intersections of Hayts Road and Bundy Road
and at the Medical Center driveway. The scope of the study was prepared in
accordance with New York State standards and we contacted the Town to identify any
additional concerns. We have tried to address those in our report.
After identifying the existing conditions, we then went on to identify background
conditions, which basically means that there will be growth in the traffic volume whether
or not this project materializes and is built. What we identified based on historical data
is that there is a growth rate in the area of about half a percent per year. Given that the
project will be built over a 4 year period, we identified that the growth rate over 4 years
would be about 2 percent total growth.
In addition, we were informed by the Town that there was another development to the
north of this that was proposed with some additional housing. We layered that on top of
the global growth rate that we applied to traffic in the area. Since then, we found out
that the proposed development was denied and will not be built.
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Chairperson Wilcox — It was withdrawn.
Ms. Dake — That said, our background growth is actually a little higher than could be
expected if that development is not built. We then projected traffic volumes for the
proposed development, which is 128 units of multiple family housing and an additional
25 units of single family housing. That traffic is generated based on Institute of Traffic
Engineers' Standards, which is a national standard. Additionally, we have done many
studies of residential development in the local area, both Ithaca and Rochester areas
that support the National data. We then distributed this traffic based on existing travel
patterns in the area from looking at the existing traffic, where we know the existing
employment centers to be, what the existing highway network looks like and based on
site access. We came up with full development traffic volumes, which basically means
that we took the existing traffic conditions and layered on the background growth and
the proposed development in the north, and then added the proposed traffic for this
project on top of that to come up with full development condition at the time that this
project was fully built out.
We then performed capacity analysis in accordance with State and National standards,
which identified that the levels of service of all of the intersections in the study area
would operate at average level of service or better in all areas. There was very minimal
impact. The only change in level of service occurred at Bundy Road, which was from a
B to a C. We identified that the background level of service B was almost at the point of
being a level of service C. So the real impact of the development on that was very
small.
We also did safety investigations and we reviewed an existing safety investigation in the
area that New York State Department of Transportation had done and what their safety
investigation identified was that most of the accidents in the area were related to animal
collisions and they identified some solutions including extending the Deer Zone signs,
upgrading signs at Bundy Road, Hayts Road, and Dubois Road intersections. Clearing
brush near the Hayts Road intersection and upgrading some weathered signs in the
area. Looking at the actual patterns of accidents that the State identified, we didn't
identify and discernable clusters or accident patterns that would indicate any kind of
safety deficiencies.
We also prepared a subsequent analysis based on some concerns of the residents. In
a letter dated November 10th, where we looked at the intersection of Buffalo Street and
Taughannock Boulevard and we had some p.m. peak hours existing turning count data
that was available at that intersection. We compared that with data that we collected at
Bundy Road. Given that there is a distance between Bundy Road and that intersection,
there is intersections in between and there has been a couple of years in between when
the counts at the two intersections were taken. When we compared the two traffic
volumes, we found that the traffic volumes were within 5 percent. Five percent is the
typical variation in traffic from day to day. Traffic if you count on a Monday can be much
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lower than if you count on a Friday. What that means is that there hasn't been any
significant growth, which is also supported by that half a percent growth rate per year.
Therefore, we were able to go ahead and compare what the impacts of this
development would be on that intersection. What we identified was that this
development at full development will add 59 vehicles to the intersection during the a.m.
peak hour and 71 during the p.m. peak hour. This equates to an intersection increase
of 3.3 percent, which falls below the numbers I mentioned about the daily fluctuation in
traffic. It is probably not even noticeable. In addition, between Bundy Road and
Taughannock Boulevard Intersection, the section volumes on Route 96 going north and
south would see an increase in the 5.5 or 5.3 percent during the p.m. peak hour, which
again falls within the daily traffic variations.
With that said, I'll discuss this a little bit. The letter from DOT that we received basically
agrees with our traffic study. (Ms. Dake stepped away from the microphone and her
comments were not audible)
Chairperson Wilcox — For the record, what has DOT proposed be done with the
intersection?
Ms. Dake — DOT would like left turn lanes in both directions.
Mr. Kanter — Just to make that statement a little clearer, DOT has said that they will
require left hand turn lanes.
Chairperson Wilcox — Questions?
Board Member Thayer — I have several. On the intersection itself, since you are
suggesting that quite a few people that are going to be in the apartments are going to
work at the hospital, they are going to have to walk across that intersection rather than
drive in. It is part of the information. I'm just saying there is no way anybody can walk
across that intersection. I'm just wondering if there is anything... were going to suggest
sidewalks up to the intersection. How are they going to walk across it without a walk
lane?
(Ms. Dake stepped away from the microphone and her comments were not audible)
Board Member Thayer — I think there is going to be pedestrian traffic there. And in this
excerpt that you gave us, it said that the peak hour volumes were collected on Tuesday
and Wednesday, August 26t" and August 27t ", which is when school is not in session.
Both Cornell or any of the Ithaca Public School. It is a drastic difference in the traffic
flow.
Ms. Dake — I have to check, but I believe Cornell was in session.
Board Member Thayer — Well, Ithaca Public Schools definitely would not be in session.
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(Ms. Dake stepped away from the microphone and her comments were not audible)
Board Member Thayer — The school traffic does make a big difference on that road.
There was another indication that the July 1999 machine count gives it a total of the
average daily volume. That was prior to Alterra, which also added some volume of
traffic in that area. So that seems to be really not up to the present as far as the figures
go.
(Ms. Dake stepped away from the microphone and her comments were not audible)
Chairperson Wilcox — Can we get access to those? I have to look at the applicant. I'm
not sure who else would pay for them.
Board Member Conneman — You said that you used National data (inaudible). What
study supported the National data? We would like to see those.
(Ms. Dake stepped away from the microphone and her comments were not audible)
Chairperson Wilcox — We will also at some point give the Town Engineer a chance to
comment should he desire. We can do that later.
Frank Santelli, TG Miller Engineers and Surveyors — We did the storm water
management study and the utility design for the development. I'd like to go over the
storm water, I guess, first. Currently, the site is pretty much all vegetated. We are
going to be disturbing more than 5 acres of land and the project will have to comply with
the New York State DEC SPDES Storm Water permit for construction activities. We
have put together sediment and erosion control plans that are in the report.
The site drains over land down to the Trumansburg Road drainage way along the west
side of Trumansburg Road. The analysis for the study is the first cross culvert on
Trumansburg Road, which is about 1200 or 1500 feet down the road. What we've done
is as you can see from the erosion and sediment controls, typically we provide a
number of temporary measures during the construction phase that include first of all
diversion swales. If you look on the erosion and sediment control plans, typically we are
cutting swales at the uphill side above the development to keep runoff from crossing
through where the construction activities are taking place. Secondly, silt fencing, rock
check dams, inlet protection to keep the silt, any silt that is coming off the site out of the
storm sewer system as it gets constructed. Areas that are disturbed will be seeded and
mulched and generally speaking all these are sort of best management practices that
are required by the DEC permit. In addition, part of the permanent storm water
management practice are the two storm waters that Peter talked about previously.
Each of those will be equipped with what we call a sediment trap. It is a temporary
structure, essentially a pipe riser backfilled with stone and filter fabric to
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keep... essentially the wetlands will be used essentially as fill in basins during the
construction phase to keep any sediment or eroded materials from leaving the site.
think Peter essentially described the ... he gave a good characterization of these
wetlands. We did something similar at College Circle recently. Effectively, the DEC
SPDES permit allows you two main practices. Essentially a wet pond is considered a
good practice for a site like this. The second one, essentially, is a wetland type facility,
which also provides removal of sediments through sedimentation, biological uptake and
so forth. I don't know if there are any questions at this point.
Board Member Hoffmann — Could you point out on the map where these wetlands are?
Mr. Trowbridge pointed out the wetlands.
Mr. Santelli — The lower basin closer to Trumansburg Road, that will get constructed
during the Phase 1a portion of the project and then the one in the middle would be
constructed during the Phase 1 b.
Board Member Hoffmann — Are there any presently? I see a pond being shown, but I
haven't seen any wetlands shown.
Mr. Trowbridge — The only place where there maybe isolated Army Core
wetlands... (inaudible).
Board Member Hoffmann — But the pond is still on this property?
Mr. Trowbridge — Yes.
Chairperson Wilcox — Any questions? Again, we can wait for Dan to comment until
later.
Mr. Santelli — Do you care to listen about water or sanitary? I could go over it quickly.
On the water, there are essentially three tanks on West Hill. One is the existing
Trumansburg Road Tank.
Chairperson Wilcox — Would you be more comfortable over there? It would help us and
everybody else. Or, if you could sit here and Peter could point that would work to. As
long as you speak in a reasonably, nice, full voice we will pick you up.
Mr. Santelli — This is what is called the Trumansburg Road Tank. The second tank on
West Hill is currently under construction at EcoVillage. The third tank is actually in the
Town of Ulysses on Sheffield and Iradell Roads. Essentially this tank with its
elevation ... (inaudible). The service area from the Trumansburg Road Tank
is ... (inaudible). Conceivably, 1a could be supplied by the Trumansburg Road Tank
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without any changes in the pressure there. Now because Phase 1 b is higher than 958,
we can not actually supply this area directly from the tank. (Comments not audible).
Chairperson Wilcox — Would that be sufficient for the sprinklers?
Mr. Santelli — Yes, I believe so. Yes. (Comments not audible). We have looked at a
number of possibilities. Essentially, we have narrowed it down to probably a couple
different options. One being to install a booster pump station probably in the
same ... (inaudible) ... and pumping up into the distribution main. (Comments not
audible). The second option is to connect to the pressure zone of the Ulysses Tank.
The closest point is at the intersection of Trumansburg Road and Dubois Road. It
would require probably either a ... station down Hayts Road and then up Trumansburg
Road or from the intersection across the open area along ... and Dubois Road.
Chairperson Wilcox — What is the distance to that intersection with Dubois Road,
roughly?
Mr. Santelli — 1300 to 1500 feet. It is about the same as from this intersection.
Chairperson Wilcox — Which ever option is chosen, it would have to be approved by the
County Health Department.
Board Member Thayer — If you have to build a pump there, would the Hopkins Road
residents reap any benefit from that at all? Is that a possibility, Dan?
Mr. Walker — You are going to get the benefit, anyhow. They would be getting a benefit
from a booster station because it would be limited to an area and I wouldn't recommend
putting houses up there...
Board Member Thayer — This isn't going to be owned by the Town? It is going to be
theirs?
Mr. Walker — It will probably be owned by the Town because there will be individual lots.
It would have to be public water supply. The advantage we have here is because these
houses are within 1,000 feet of the water main that has adequate pressure for hydrant
flow that there could be fire hydrants located at the entrance to the second phase of the
development that are within marginally acceptable limits of the fire department to be
able to keep fire flow there as opposed to the problem that we had on Woolf Lane and
Trumansburg Road where there are several thousand feet of pipe and the fire
department does not have adequate pressure.
Board Member Thayer — So, even though they can see a water tank on Hopkins Road,
as they always have, now the pump will be there, they still can't get water.
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Mr. Walker — I wouldn't recommend building a Town water main to be certified
hydromatic pump station for that big of an area. Again, you are pushing the water
further away and there is not fire protection. The only possibility and I'm not going to
recommend that we recommend hydromatic station anyhow because it is just
problematic, but there may be some other factors that for the 15 or 20 houses here with
the proximity to fire hydrants that do have adequate flow and pressure that this might be
one of the gray conceptual areas.
Chairperson Wilcox — The issue with the pump is what if it doesn't work, right?
Mr. Walker — Well, the issue with the pump is that you put a fire pump in to provide a
1,000 gallons a minute of flow is a very large expense, which is really... providing
domestic flow for 20 houses you can use a fairly small power pump and hydromantic
station. You have to have an auxiliary power supply keeping it to ... (inaudible). It is just
not has reliable as a half million gallon tank supplying water.
Mr. Kanter — I have a question about the water tank. I noticed in John Anderson's
memo that he sent us recently he asked about the possible danger from catastrophic
failure of the tank and how that might affect residents downhill from that. Do you have
any comments about that?
Mr. Santelli — (response not audible)
Mr. Kanter — He is not very specific.
Board Member Thayer — How old is that tank, Dan?
Mr. Walker — It dates back to the 1920's.
Mr. Santelli - (response not audible)
Chairperson Wilcox — Any other questions with regard to water? On to sewer.
Mr. Santelli — Sewer, what we are proposing is ... municipal main approximately 1200
feet from our property. The Engineering Department ... (inaudible).
Mr. Santelli was not in front of a microphone. His comments were not audible.
Chairperson Wilcox — Based on some of the letters that we have received so far, who
will build the sewer extension?
Mr. Santelli — It depends on who wins the bid.
Chairperson Wilcox — Who will pay for it? Is the Town going to pay for it?
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Mr. Santelli — No.
Chairperson Wilcox — I wanted to make sure that it is clear.
Mr. Walker — I can't speak for the Town Board, but my understanding from discussing it
with the Town Supervisor, the Town will be expecting the developer to front the whole
cost unless they can get contributions from adjoining landowners.
Chairperson Wilcox — Anybody else questions with regard to sewer?
Board Member Hoffmann — I realized there was a question about water here in a letter
from the County Commissioner of Planning about the parcel that the water tower is one,
which apparently was conveyed from the County to the Town and they are waiting for
the Town Attorney to...
Mr. Walker — There has been some delay in finalizing the legal transfer of the property
to the Town. The history of it is it was built by the State when they put up the Biggs
hospital complex. When the State deeded that property over to the County, they also
decided that they did not want to be in the water business so they turned the tank over
to the Town. Of course, we didn't follow through on all of the legal stuff. We have been
operating it as if we owned it and we feel we own it and we have our lot around it. So
we are just trying to clean up some of the final issues.
Board Member Hoffmann —What he says is that access to the parcel should be secured
during the review process for this project.
Mr. Kanter — It is basically in the hands of the Town Attorney. The conveyance is in
process.
Grace Chiang, HOLT Architects — Each building has four units on each floor for a total
of eight units. We have 1- bedroom, 2- bedroom, 3- bedroom units. (Inaudible, Ms.
Chiang was not speaking into a microphone.) The 2- bedrooms are all clustered
together. The second type is a 1- bedroom and 3- bedroom unit. The 1- bedroom and 2-
bedroom has one bath and the 3- bedroom has a bath and a half. (Inaudible, Ms.
Chiang was not speaking into a microphone.)
So what you are looking at here, are the two colors of siding that I just showed you.
There is a darker color and a lighter color. The lighter color here would represent trim
here and the blue color would be trim around the ... (inaudible). Then the window
themselves would be white. (Inaudible, Ms. Chiang was not speaking into a
microphone.)
From the beginning we have talked about cluster housing... more density in a smaller
area. We are trying to create a small neighborhood. Several people have already
talked about how we deal with the environment ... (inaudible). There are a lot of
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materials with organic compounds. (Inaudible, Ms. Chiang was not speaking into a
microphone.)
Chairperson Wilcox — Questions?
Board Member Thayer — Are there underground utilities? I see no poles or anything so
I'm assuming that the utilities are underground.
Ms. Chiang — Yes.
Board Member Hoffmann — I wanted to ask you if there is a reason why you only have
2- bedroom units in some buildings and a mix of 1- bedroom and 3- bedroom units in
others.
Ms. Chiang — We did it that way because we were able to get a very efficient plan
layout. (Inaudible, Ms. Chiang was not speaking into a microphone.)
Board Member Hoffmann — Well, I could see doing it other ways too. One level could
be ones and threes and the second level could be twos. But I understand that you want
to have utilities lined up efficiently. Okay. Will there be hook -ups for laundry in each
unit or will the only possibility for people to do laundry will be to go to the community
building?
Mr. Trowbridge — It will be in the community building. There is really not the space
within each unit.
Board Member Thayer — Where are the parking lots?
Mr. Trowbridge — The parking is situated all along the road throughout the
adjacent... (inaudible).
(Inaudible, Ms. Chiang was not speaking into a microphone.)
Board Member Hoffmann — I thought in the text I saw something about the accent colors
being different in different buildings, but you have only shown us the blue. Did that
change?
(Inaudible, Ms. Chiang was not speaking into a microphone.)
Chairperson Wilcox — Any other questions?
Board Member Thayer — Are you going to have curbs along the sidewalk so that when
the cars park they don't overlap the sidewalk?
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Mr. Trowbridge — I think in your package it is fairly detailed. I think all of the parking
spaces... (inaudible).
Mr. Kanter — Grace, could you pull out the drawing? The tool shed looking things in the
front of the buildings, are those mechanical rooms?
Ms. Chiang - (Inaudible, Ms. Chiang was not speaking into a microphone.)
Board Member Thayer — Garbage cans in there?
Ms. Chiang — No.
Mr. Trowbridge — (Inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was not speaking into a microphone.)
Board Member Hoffmann — Actually, I have a question about those dumpsters because
the detail was not that clear to me. Do the dumpsters have three or four sides?
Mr. Trowbridge — They have three sides and then as you approach them ... (inaudible).
Board Member Hoffmann — They are often really ugly, the side that is open and shows
you all the trash and garbage.
Mr. Papamichael - (Inaudible, Mr. Papamichael was not speaking into a microphone.)
Board Member Hoffmann — The drawing showed the screening as being some sort of
wooden structure. Will there be any plant materials around that, too?
Mr. Trowbridge — We are trying to make it appear ... (Inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was not
speaking into a microphone.)
Board Member Hoffmann — The other thing that I understand from what you were just
saying is that this road that loops through the housing units is going to be one -way.
Mr. Trowbridge — It is not one -way, but I think most people who are coming into the
project... it would be counterintuitive to go back ... (inaudible). It is not a one -way drive.
Board Member Thayer — So, the only exit will be off the Trumansburg Road until Phase
2 is developed?
Mr. Trowbridge — That is right. Again, we have reviewed it with the fire chief and it was
acceptable... (inaudible).
Chairperson Wilcox — Peter, while you are there. There is a short period of time where
the access to the water tank would be used or would be available for use.
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Mr. Trowbridge — That is correct... it would be gated. Then if for whatever reason the
main entrance was blocked, emergency vehicles could come up the paved access road.
(Inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was n of speaking into a microphone.)
Chairperson Wilcox — We have other developments with a secondary access road.
Mr. Walker — Yes, EcoVillage. It was originally gated, but they haven't had a problem
with people driving through it. It appears to be a very narrow gravel surface.
Chairperson Wilcox — It is there for secondary emergency access.
Board Member Thayer — I think I asked this question before, but if the zoning isn't
approved, has there been any thought about single family homes in the entire
development other than the one picture that you gave us?
Mr. Papamichael — We have not done extensive studies on planning the development
as fully single family. We think there is a greater need for affordable housing.
Board Member Thayer — I was just asking the question if it didn't get changed.
Mr. Papamichael — We would have to look at it in more detail at that time.
Attorney Barney — Comments not audible
Ms. Chiang — The upper level units and the lower level units are slightly different
because of the stair that goes up. The stair is actually inside the upstairs apartment so
it makes is larger. The one - bedroom of the lower unit is 700 square feet and the upper
unit is 788 square feet. The two - bedrooms are 830 downstairs and 918 upstairs. The
three - bedrooms are 1,020 downstairs and 1,100 upstairs.
Chairperson Wilcox — Peter, are you done? Any other questions at this point? Dan, did
you want to comment on traffic or did you want to start with storm water drainage? Lets
start with traffic. Have you reviewed the...?
Mr. Walker — I looked at the DOT letter ... left turn lanes in both directions and possibly
right turn lanes into the hospital. Their primary concern, I believe, is safety. While there
is not that much of a delay, the turning vehicle ... (not audible). With this project a left
turn lane would be a nice amenity. There is some delay in the morning and there is
some delay in the evening.
Board Member Conneman — What is the delay, Dan? Seconds or minutes?
Mr. Walker — What I've seen is two or three cars waiting to make a left turn into the
hospital at 7:30 in the morning with people, if the car is stopped and it is legal to do it,
riding on the right shoulder to go around them. That would create a potential problem if
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there was a car turning left into this project. There is no left turn there so people coming
up the hill do not try to go around the cars. There are a lot of people who do not have
much patience. The concept of the little islands to physically force people in the right
hand turn lane at the hospital entrance coming up the hill would probably protect most
vehicles, but there would probably be somebody driving over that, too. I'm really not a
specialist at traffic, so whether or not ... the traffic study shows that it doesn't really
require a left turn lane. They are looking at it from more of a safety issue.
Chairperson Wilcox — The State has the final say?
Mr. Walker — It is their road and they do the permit for curb cuts.
Mr. Kanter — I wanted to add that in the State DOT letter there was some comment
made about either error or correction that they would like to see ... (not audible).
Chairperson Wilcox — Storm water and drainage.
Mr. Walker — TG Miller has done a good job planning that out. I don't see any major
problems. They have two detention water quality treatment facilities. The semi -dry
wetland and... structures are the direction we are going in now for providing the... control
and the water quality control. I don't see any problems with that. The rate of runoff off
the site will basically be the same before and after. It has a pretty good flow through it.
Subsurface they are going to have to deal with soil issues as far as wetness in the soils
because anyone driving along there probably knows that the road ditch at this time of
year is pretty full. The fact that there is a building on there identified as a possible
spring house is an indicator that the groundwater ... (inaudible).
Chairperson Wilcox — Questions of Dan?
Mr. Walker — Just one comment on the water supply issue. Since the developer will be
building it, I do anticipate that the line will be extended up by the developer of the 5 -acre
parcel at the cost of the developer. The building locations are in some conflict with the
existing water main, but they have made provisions to relocate that, which is acceptable
to the Town. They are showing that most of the water mains that loop through the
project would remain there. The Town is willing to let the developer relocate the altitude
valve to the tank site to maintain the higher pressure. The third phase will have some
issues there with regard to water. From an engineering standpoint, the best place
would be to tap into that higher pressure zone. It is about 1500 feet of more water main
that they would have to put in to do that. It would be a little more costly initially, but I
would rather see a tie in rather than maintain another pump. The main issue that may
come up at the Town Board and you may have the same issue is that by bringing a
higher pressure source of water to Hayts Road would ... to facilitate the potential future
extension of water, oh, probably half way up Hayts Road or Sheffield Road is definitely
a planning consideration as far as the impact on that area. That higher pressure could
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serve Hopkins Road residents. At this point the Town has no plans even if the water
line ... to extend the water line ... (inaudible).
Chairperson Wilcox — Can you tell me what an altitude control valve is?
Mr. Walker — An altitude valve is basically to make sure the tanks doesn't overflow. It is
kind of like the valve in your toilet.
Chairperson Wilcox — But it was described as helping to balance two pressure zones.
Mr. Walker — Right. We have a higher pressure zone from the upper tank and that will
fill the lower tank. As that tank fills up basically, it works like float that will turn the water
off.
Board Member Thayer — So, even though the development is below the tank there is
not enough pressure? Is that the way I understand it?
Mr. Walker — No. It would be very minimal. The first phase, the lower phase, would
have marginal pressure. The Health Department wants to see 35 pounds of static
pressure on any new water main and that would exist on the lower main. The existing
unit that goes across is only about 20 pounds on the way down, the upper end of it is 35
or 30 pounds. The reason is that with 35 pounds of pressure, you have adequate fire
flow, but you have adequate static pressure to at least put 15 pounds of pressure on the
second floor of a house, which is the minimal required. Sprinklers are another issue, 35
pounds of pressure. Again, with sprinklers, a lower pressure just means you need
bigger pipes and more heads.
Chairperson Wilcox — We're still sitting here going, we have a tank right there and we
don't have sufficient pressure. Maybe I'm still not thinking of the elevation problem.
Mr. Walker — Basically, you have half a pound per foot of water in a tank, so a 30 foot
tank, you only have 15 pounds of pressure at the bottom of the tank and if your
buildings are only 20 feet below that, that would add another ten pounds.
Chairperson Wilcox — It's the fact that this area is so close in elevation to the tank?
Mr. Walker — Right.
Chairperson Wilcox —But physically, the nearer the tank-
Mr. Walker — The physical nearness allows, with a large diameter height means that you
have a high volume of water, so a fire hydrant right at the tank will provide 800 to 1000
gallons a minute when the tank is full.
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Chairperson Wilcox — Okay. If there are no further questions or comments, I would like
to give the public a chance to speak.
Mr. Thayer — Good idea, but we do have a lot of things to talk about: the concentration
of affordable housing on West Hill, the impact on the local school and so on, which I
would like to hear the public's comments on.
Board Member Conneman — I would like to ask Chris, eventually, about properties that
this organization manages or has built or whatever it is that we might go look at to see
how they exist. I don't know if this is the time Fred. It's up to you.
Chairperson Wilcox — I want to give the public a chance.
Board Member Conneman — I just want you to think about that.
Chairperson Wilcox — The impact on public schools, we have something on that. What
else was there?
Board Member Thayer — The concentration.
Chairperson Wilcox — Concentration on West Hill, thank you.
Board Member Conneman — The quality of the management and so on.
Board Member Thayer — The timing of the phases is interesting too, we haven't heard
anything about that, when they're going to build Phase 1 A or 1 B and when the single
family occupancy.
Chairperson Wilcox — I actually prepared something, when we get to it that's something
to talk about. I have impacts on public schools, concentration on West Hill and the
timing of the phases. All right, ladies and gentlemen, first of all thank you for sitting here
quietly and patiently. You will have your opportunity to address the Planning Board on
your issues, concerns, comments. I will ask that you raise your hand, I will call upon you
in no particular order, you have to come to the microphone, state your name and
address. If we have time, it is possible that if you forgot to say something, we might let
you come back a second time for an extra minute or something like that and provide
some information that you may have forgotten the first time. The bottom line is we want
to hear what you have to say and now is your opportunity to do it. Given that, just raise
your hands and the first hand up is the first person to come to the microphone.
Diane Hardy, American Red Cross — I just wanted to bring to your attention the need for
affordable housing. Last year, we had the most bed nights, which was a bed filled with a
person in that bed, that we've seen in the 20 year history of the program and it looks like
this year is going to beat that. In October alone, 1500 bed nights for 107 people. The
greatest obstacle for getting people out of the shelter is affordable housing. We see a
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number of families with children. Most of our people are working people and it definitely
is an issue for a lot of these people who are working in Ithaca and providing services.
Thank you.
Ann Byrne, 137 Hopkins Road — I want to read a letter from Carol and Tim Bordoni that
live on 124 Bundy Road. They couldn't be here tonight, as many of our neighbors,
because of lack of notice and the timing during the holiday season. I know they are very
concerned about this. (see attachment #1)
Now, I'm not as organized as they are so I hope that you bear with me as I begin this. I
have so many concerns. Sadly, when I spoke with my neighbors, many of them weren't
even aware of this project and didn't realize and were surprised at the speed in which
this was going forward. But in the Comprehensive Plan, you talked about land use and
the land use that you discuss said that it's supposed to compliment the established
neighborhood. This project does not compliment the established neighborhoods at all.
You're putting in a mini -city. That's how we view this. It's enormous. There are six
houses on Hopkins Road right now. You are putting in 153 units that are not
complimenting the established neighborhood all around. It also says in the
Comprehensive Plan that you want to discourage the conversion of local residential
roads. When I look at this road through here and the one that tops out onto Hayts Road,
near the cemetery, on a hill, not a good spot. Last Sunday I drove down there and there
was this SUV that was over - turned into the cemetery. I stopped, I was probably ten
minutes from that accident, you know the accident happening ten minutes coming down
the road. My heart just sunk. I knew that I was the first person at this accident. The car
was flipped over on it's side. The person had crawled out and I saw footsteps so I knew
nobody was injured that badly and got out of there. The police came down and we went
and looked for the guy. We were looking all over for who this belonged to. The police
said we just saw this, we don't know anything about it. That happens quite regularly
there, along with the deer. You can put up as many deer signs as you want, but the
deer, number one, can't read them, number two, it doesn't mean people are going to
slow down anymore. They are highly populated in that area. What I see happening is
people getting very frustrated turning onto Route 96 and, maybe taking that Hayts
Road, going through this apartment complex development, down to the light because
that may give them a chance to get out onto 96 traffic. As it is now, you can sit there on
Bundy Road for minutes and wait until you get a break. The way you get the break is
when the light changes for you and hospital traffic doesn't make a left as you're going in
the morning and you come out onto that traffic waiting for that break in the light and
there is going to be cars, now, turning right with that traffic light, we are going to be
sitting there forever. I do not go down Hayts Road because it is much harder to get out
onto 96. So, instead, because I live very close to Hayts Road on the property that this
development surrounds, I go to Bundy Road and I come down the hill on Bundy Road.
The other reason I come down Bundy Road is it's much safer. You can at least have
people see you when you can't stop at that intersection and Hayts Road you are dead.
So, I want to know what is to prevent this road from becoming what will be a conversion
of a local residential road into a major fairway. You already said that you come up by
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Bundy Road and Hayts to avoid traffic, so do I. In the morning, when I leave and go to
work and take my kids to school, I don't go down the 96 corridor, I cut up to go 79
because I save a little bit of time that way and that's not being discussed in this traffic
plan. So, what's to prevent this from happening? Are you going to have police there
telling people "you can't go through here? Are they going to put up a sign saying that it's
private, you can't use it? What's going to prevent that? Also the focus on the
development to avoid sprawl, I'm not so certain this isn't sprawl. Minimize the adverse
environmental impact resulting from this development and the biggest impact that I see
is that of traffic.
Protection of the historical sites, you have two of them right there. You're looking at
them, you have one on the corner and one across from that. Nobody talks about how
important it is to keep the integrity of the environment, when it concerns these historical
sites.
In the Comprehensive Plan, it talks about the reduced need for cars. As I see it, this
plan is going to increase car use, it's not going to decrease car use and, as many on the
Town Planning Board, when they came out to visit this site, did not walk up to the water
tower, they got a ride up, so they wouldn't even walk through this site when there is a
road for them to use because it isn't convenient, it is a hill, there is a lot of property and
can't foresee the people living in Phase 1 walking up to Phase 2, 1 foresee them
hopping in there car and driving up there. When you get the other development moving
along with the houses, if it ever happens, if they can ever get the water, I can't imagine
many people walking up to see those neighbors. They are going to jump in their car and
drive up there just like the Town Board members did from Route 96. They got in their
cars and they drove up.
Chairperson Wilcox — It was raining.
Ms. Byrne - It was raining, but I walked that day and I'm not certain that's the reason
that they hopped in the cars.
Chairperson Wilcox — I don't know, but it was raining that day. Sir, you'll have you
chance to talk, but we're not going to have people shouting out.
Ms. Byrne — West Hill development, when I looked into the Comprehensive Town Plan,
when it talked about the advantages and disadvantages about developing over there,
they're quick to point out all the advantages, but they didn't point out the disadvantages,
which are listed as increase traffic might lower service levels and have a negative
impact on the residential areas; never been addressed. Prime agricultural areas might
be developed; I have to often wonder here what is to come of this. You change the
zoning on this and you've got property next to it, are you going to change the zoning
there. Are you going to re -zone, now we made a mistake on the agricultural so we are
going to re -zone that as well? What is to protect this? I thought we were protected
because we had a zoning plan. You did this with the Perry Lane development, you did it
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with Alterra, I moved, I was told this is the way it's going to be zoned; we're not going to
change it. You just put through this proposal that got approved, that this wasn't
considered. This development was brought up during that, why wasn't that halted and
say you made a mistake, you really need this, because it isn't needed because it's
wrong and I think you know it's wrong. Also the negative disadvantages to this, more
traffic added to Cliff Street and the Octopus. Well, we all know the Octopus hasn't been
solved, it's just been moved and I have some information on that for you. Not very close
to existing stores or major employment centers, so we're building this development that
doesn't have municipalities close to that, another increased cause in traffic.
You have the potential adverse impacts in the environmentally sensitive areas and limits
on water and sewer capacity, which you've talked about, that's in the Comprehensive
Plan. I'd like to hear how you feel about those that are listed here that aren't addressed.
The traffic issue, I went down this morning to Route 96 because apparently, when I see
the traffic study, she does not understand our area at all. When I look at that and it says
that it's got an increase of .7 seconds per vehicle and an increase of 1.2 seconds per
vehicle, I am astounded by that and don't quite know how that figure was derived.
Looking at our problems that we have with our traffic, when I went down this morning
and just sat their from a quarter of eight until a quarter after eight, which isn't the peek
rush hour time because I couldn't get there, I had to get my kids off to school, I've got to
tell you that in the traffic study, it shows the level of service and the a.b.c. stuff that
you've got on your form there, level of service, driver discomfort, frustration, fuel
consumption and lost travel time. Okay, so when I sat down there, the observation that I
made this morning, and this is only on 96, as I said, I cut up on 79 (we still have issues
over there, the traffic is bad) every single light change at Pete's, either two cars or three
cars ran that light, ran that red light, every single change for a half hour straight. I've
found that at Pete's you had an average of four to five cars that made it through that
light and two or three others that ran it after it was already red because if you
understand that problem, you've got 89 making a left, when they make the left, they are
blocking the intersection. By the time the light changes and the few cars can get through
that next light because they are stopped at the third light, you have to stop at every
single one of those lights, they are not synchronized to go through. Every single one of
those, when 89 comes in, they block the intersection, they move through, these guys
get impatient, a couple cars go and then, by god, they are going to get through that light
because I'm sick of waiting because by the time I get down near Pete's, which there
was an accident this morning. Somebody got impatient and, you can't turn to go two
lanes, you've got to wait that single line over the bridge and then finally it opens up for
you. Somebody got impatient, ran a lady into a truck, took off, she crashed the car into
this truck and you've got this minor accident that happened there. I will also let you
know that a school bus ran that red light, absolutely astounded me, a full sized school
bus was the first off the mark and ran the light, got sick of waiting and just went through
it when it was red. I don't know about you, but I don't think that would be a level "a" or a
level "b" on that list. That, to me, defines frustration. That is not "a" quality, I'm sitting
there and I'm patient, we're not patient there and to add only .7 seconds is ridiculous.
The light change at one of those was 49 seconds or 59 seconds one time, so after all
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the cars get to Route 13, are you still with me here? When they went to turn left and
they have a green arrow, for crying out loud, I'm like this will be the big one, three cars
can get through that. I can't figure that one out, but three could get through that one.
Granted, this isn't the rush time. After we left this first meeting, there were times when I
sat up by Williams ( ?) there waiting in traffic to get down in the morning to hit the
intersection. This is common, just like it's common to sit at four o'clock, 4:30 at the high
school and come down 13 before you can make a left to get to the hospital. That scares
me. If I had an emergency and I didn't flag an ambulance to pay the five or six hundred
dollars it costs to get there, I'm not going to get there, get my kids the services that the
hospital can provide. This traffic issue is huge, it is really big and, unless you live over
there and live this everyday to see the anger in people and to watch how they run this
light and get mad in the morning and blow horns and finger people, it's frustrating and
you get frustrated and adding this many people is going to add to the frustration and
discomfort in the Town.
Today I went to the flu shot clinic and I was standing in line and I said "oh here's an
opportunity ", and so I started asking the people. There was one person out of all those
in the line that supported the project. I have forty signatures here that said please give
me your petition to sign. I has somebody who drove an ambulance that I couldn't every
get the words out fast enough to say no re- zoning and he said "hand it to me, I know
this is needed, but you desperately need this not to be re- zoned." There was a city
police officer who said "you need help over there so, definitely I will sign this for you."
The increase that it's going to make for us on our resources, there's only one fire
engine. It's going to add more people that you can't service already. As I understand it,
there's been a petition for two years to get a new fire truck. We're not getting that fire
truck. So now you're going to add more people and we're still not getting this service.
find that really horrid. The police as well. Linderman Creek; we've got problems there,
the police are being called to that, so you are going to add another congested area and
you're going to have more police that need to attend that and I think that's why that
police office said "you need help up there ". The impact on the school district is another
issue that the executive director of the Ithaca Neighborhood Housing wrote a letter to
Jonathan Kanter and that's what I am referring to here. I also spoke with Craig Evans,
whom he refers to in this letter, if I can get organized, here we go. One, he makes his
own determination, so I have made an assumption that there will be evenly distributed
across ages from zero to 18, he gives a figure. If that figure is even correct, based on
his assumption and his knowledge, which I think we need to scrutinize over, he's is
proposing, Craig Evans said that the school would be able to house these. Enfield
Elementary School has the capacity to absorb the additional students, this is largely due
to the fact that some parents living in this district open - enroll their children in other
elementary schools. There is a question right now in our school district whether they will
allow people to open - enroll their children anymore and they may have to open - enroll
them at a cost. Already there is a cost in that you have to deliver your kid and pick them
up, there is no transportation provided for you. What is the capacity? When I asked him,
he would not give me a figure. There is not a lot of room here and I will not tell you how
many people we suppose coming out of this apartment complex, we can't do that. He
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also told me that apartments in this area generate more children than homeownership.
So the study that was given to you by the director, it indicates that he was wrong. I'm
saying, well if you look at our reflection in our city school district, that may not be wrong,
so disregard it and go with what I say. I think you've got to look at it pretty closely.
Secondly, it is highly likely at Enfield that they could absorb 34 additional students.
There is a point in here once you get beyond all the numbers that is really startling to
me and this is what I talked to Craig Evans about; when you build on an environment,
such as this in this area, chances are that you are going to have kids with special needs
and they require special services. So, in here, it's listed in here that they really have a
problem with comments to the Ithaca Housing, I'll try to find it, that they can't
accommodate kids with special needs. Here we go, "more than 34 new students at
Enfield could be physically handled, but would compete with other district mandates
such as the use of space for special needs education." This is a common problem within
the Ithaca School District. Let me put a face on this for you. My son was in a
kindergarten class with a child of special needs, they did not have a place for him to go.
It was the class from hell. It was so bad that we had parents that were in that room
every single minute. It was disruptive. It disrupted the school. It disrupted the whole
environment, so much so that six families left the Ithaca City public schools because of
this incident. This is what happens when you can't find room for a child with special
needs. Enfield cannot accommodate children with special needs as much as Ithaca City
School District can't. So, although it's a side note on here, it's a pretty darn important
one. Is that how we want to treat people? In an environment that may produce more of
these as Craig Evans said to me "You know, I hate to say it, but these housing
developments usually get kids with special needs." For whatever reason, just saying
they can't accommodate that, that's a pretty important issue to look at and I hope you
look at it seriously.
The line of sight that they are talking about, I brought with me a picture of what we see
at our house. I invite you to come out. I'll walk you inside our house and show you what
we see. Their line of sight, I don't know if that is because they are going to excavate
down and dig and dig and dig and dig.
Chairperson Wilcox — Please address the Board and not the applicant.
Ms. Byrne —Well, I needed their answer. When you look at my sight -line here, as I
looked at the proposed plan on there, this tree will now be one of these buildings. The
area that they are talking about building in all here.
Chairperson Wilcox — Now we have a problem because we are going to have to do it
multiple times and that is not going to work very well.
Ms. Byrne — (Inaudible, Ms. Byrne stepped away from the microphone)
Chairperson Wilcox — Are you finished?
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Ms. Byrne — My other concern, when they talked about moving, I would like to know
where they are going to put that dirt because (inaudible). So they are going to add
more to that? They are going to dump all that? Where is the consideration for my
property on that one? As I understand it, the Town provides the water, right? On all of
this?
Chairperson Wilcox — I'm not sure what you mean by the Town provides the water.
Ms. Byrne — The development is going to pay for all this water?
Mr. Walker — They are going to pay for any infrastructure they need built.
Ms. Byrne — What does that mean exactly? Who pays for what?
Mr. Walker — If pipes have to be moved, they are going to pay for it. If a pump station
has to be built, they will pay for it.
Ms. Byrne — So the housing that is going to go in, they will pay for that?
Mr. Walker — They will pay for all the infrastructure.
Ms. Byrne — To come all the way over, the Town doesn't pay for any of that?
Mr. Walker — Not for the pump. We will take over operation and maintenance of it and
pay for that by selling the water.
Ms. Byrne — Once it's there. The way I see it, do you find a problem with that, that you
are going to build for all these people and not provide water for us, as I heard you say.
No, Hopkins Road doesn't get it. Hayts might.
Mr. Walker — Now wait a minute there. We are not building this, the developer is
building it.
Ms. Byrne - The developer is building it, but as a town, you don't have a problem with
not supplying water to us?
Mr. Walker — Well, you border an agricultural zone.
Ms. Byrne — You show me —
Chairperson Wilcox — Wait a minute, we have to change tapes. I can't allow a debate to
go on right now.
Ms. Byrne — It's not a debate, it's a question.
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Chairperson Wilcox — It was a question and it was answered, but now it's become a
debate.
Ms. Byrne — No, I want clarification. He said that I am bordering on an agricultural. Isn't
that piece of property bordering an agricultural too?
Mr. Kanter — No it is not.
Ms. Byrne- That's on Hopkins Road.
Mr. Kanter — No it's not. Hopkins Road, on the other hand is a different zone, west
Hopkins Road is an agricultural zone.
Ms. Byrne — I'm talking about the upper corner. Hopkins and Hayts. That's not
agricultural? Isn't that the same as my property?
Mr. Walker — They were the same at one point.
Ms. Byrne — Okay, that's what I am asking about. Well, Mr. Kanter seemed to get very
angry over that one. I'm looking for clarification on a corner, you looked very angry
when I am asking for that.
Mr. Kanter — Let's not get personalities involved in this.
Ms. Byrne — Well, I'm asking you. The Town will provide then, the sewer, the gas, the
electric right?
Mr. Walker — No, we don't' provide gas and electric. We provide sewer service after
they have built the infrastructures.
Ms. Byrne — Okay. We talked about the impact study that Mr. Thayer brought up about it
being dated later. The animal and habitat that lives there right now. There are animals
that live there. A blue heron comes to my pond, a crane come to the pond. There was a
rare bird that was identified by the director who runs the bird banding station that I took
a picture of that frequents the pond. There is a red - tailed hawk that roosts in that great
big pine tree that I imagine they are going to cut down to put the building on. At the last
Town Board meeting they we wondering where the red - tailed hawk was, I know it sits in
that tree over there. There's coyote, there's fox, there are plenty of deer there. What do
they propose when the deer munch down all of their landscaping? That might be
something that you want to look at. The schools we talked about.
Who can use the community center? In their plan, they talked about it being available
for public use, but it seems confusing there along with the play area. It's described as a
play area, but then it's also described in the same line that they are going to use it as a
bus turn around, so what is it? Is it a play area or is it a bus turn around? I don't see
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those two working well together, along with the parking. Up at College Circle
Apartments it's a real problem when we drive through there. You've got students that
are coming out into the way those cars are parked in front and I just look and see kids
walking out into there, I see that as kids are going to play on that road and they are not
going to be seen by cars backing up. The way that they are all lined up there, it seems
like a real hazard to me and if that could be changed, it needs to be. I probably forgot
something, so I know that you are going to let me come back, right? Thank you very
much for listening.
Chairperson Wilcox — I'm looking for a raised hand. Yes.
Joseph McEnerney, 131 Hopkins Road — I'm Ann and Andy Byrne's neighbor. I have a
set of concerns. Well, it's pretty much the same set of concerns that Ann explained.
First off, I guess the impact on the schools. Even if Enfield could handle more kids, it
would increase class sizes. Small class sizes is something most educators feel is a
better way to go.
Traffic, of course is a huge thing. We talked about rush hours and I actually think there
are three. At noon, they are almost impassable. Now, it's also true that the morning rush
hour and the evening rush hour are there, but I think there is really another one. I've
heard now discussion of the lows. I've heard numbers, I don't know if they are correct,
but if you look at traffic at peaks, that's one thing, but what about traffic over the whole
span of the day. Is it a thousand cars that is added to the load? Is it 1200? What is it? Is
there a min? A max? Has anyone asked these questions before? The way I hear it, Ann
pointed our you add .2 seconds or whatever it was to your delay. Well, gee, it seems a
lot worse than that to me. I think that when I had thought about the way that the zoning
was set up, what the Town was trying to do in designating that land as R -15, they got it
right, they got it right. Why change it? People have talked about wanting to live in a area
that's rural, that was my choice. I grew up in a large city, Philadelphia, this place is
heaven, there are fewer people. Fewer people means lower crime. All kinds of lower.
Lower this, lower that, lower the other thing. How far out do you have to move to avoid
the congestion, bring in, making concentrated, I realize that most of what I've heard
tonight has been a series of numerical analysis at one time or another. About pressure,
for altitude pressure or whatever.
Chairperson Wilcox- Would you like some water?
Mr. Mcenerney — No thanks. There is a human dynamic here and part of what I am
saying, I guess seems selfish, but what about us. We've been there paying taxes and
what about us. Many of the questions that have come up, in my mind have already been
asked and I can only add that I am dismayed that I haven't heard the Board ask many of
these questions. Thank you.
Chairperson Wilcox — We did not get your last name. Could you repeat it again?
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Mr. McEnerney — m- c- e- n- e- r- n -e -y.
Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you. Before I call on the next person, Ms. Byrne you read a
letter. Would you like to provide that letter to us for the record? Thank you.
Don Crittendon, 173 Bundy Road — I wanted to speak tonight because I do strongly
oppose this project and I encourage all of you members of the Planning Board to reject
it. It's not appropriate on many levels; traffic, environment, zoning, and disruption to the
way of life for people who live over in that area. This is a beautiful slope that we are
talking about. It over -looks Cayuga Lake. Not only do you see it from the west side, but
it's also going to be seen from the east side of the lake. Let's not kid ourselves, the
developer is saying the impact here is minimal, it's minimal, well, it's not. This thing is
huge, this is 128 units, 16 buildings and that's only the first part of it. I thought we kind of
went through this with Linderman Creek, you have one big development, then you do
another, dump some more housing in there, but apparently this kind of apartment
complex is very profitable, since they seem to want it so badly, but they're not really
interested in the single - family aspect of it and that's where I really have a problem with
it. This doesn't fit the character of the neighborhood at all. It's not really close to the
services that they need and it is going to have huge impact. Zoning was right. At the R-
15, it's okay and we'll take our chances with the R -15, but this is just too much. It's too
much of a burden on the property. Traffic, I'm not a traffic expert. Frankly, I wasn't really
impressed with the traffic expert the developer has, since I don't expect that traffic
developer to be paid to come and say "Well, this has a huge impact on this area." I'm
just using common sense. The octopus problem hasn't been fixed, it's just kind of been
shoved over here and there and West Hill is not ready for this type of development.
There can be a long line of cars even coming down the hill and it affects people even
getting out of Town because there are cars that want to take left turns into driveways
where a couple of the routes get cut up. If there is a string of cars that last for five
minutes coming down from the hospital area, the people can't take a left to get off Route
96, therefore it backs it all the way up beyond Pete's and the people who live over there
know this. The traffic is tight and why add to it. We don't want to see Route 96 become
a four -lane highway. We're struggling along with two lanes, but if you add the
development over there, that increases the traffic. Then you are going to want to have a
little min -mart, then this, then that and the next thing you know, we are going to have
these things out there, which aren't appropriate. I'm also concerned about the light
pollution that it is going to cause for the whole neighborhood. The disruption of the
animal life that lives there. The years of construction that this is going to take and the
noise. So, on many level, I really urge you to recognize this as a mistake and just say
no. Thank you.
Mary E. Prosperi, 1223 Trumansburg Road — I live next to Lakeside Nursing Home. I'm
not a public speaker, so bear with me. It takes me, on average, 15 to 25 minutes a day
to turn left out of my driveway to get downtown. There are days when I have to turn right
to go to the hospital, go in there, come out with the hospital light to get down the road.
During the summer when Hector Street was under construction, was being re- paved, it
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took 45 minutes to get from my home to the Science Center downtown. I still have to
work for a living so I have to leave earlier and earlier and I'm being forced to spend
more time on the road. I've been in my home almost 40 years, I've seen quite an
increase in traffic. A lot of noise. I'm concerned about all kinds of construction vehicles
coming through for the next few years. I am also concerned about the safety and
integrity of the neighborhood. Linderman Creek has many, many problems and I am
concerned about the resources that the Sheriff's Department is going to need. They are
going to have to be there more often. We know that they are at Linderman Creek fairly
often. We don't want that in our neighborhood. Thank you.
Andy Byrne, 137 Hopkins Road — I'd like to urge the Board to stay with the R -15 zoning
for the area. I think that it's the right zoning for the area. I think that is indicated by the
latest Town zoning plan and I think that it's a good plan and you should stay with it. I
think that it would be great to build low- income single - family homes on this site. I think
that would be a terrific use of the property. I think that it would be, I'm going to quote
from INHS, their website "When low- income families become homeowners, they
become stake holders in their neighborhood and are in a position to work with other
residents to ensure the stability of the neighborhood, which, in tern, ensures the value of
their property." Since Ithaca Neighborhood Housing is involved in this, we have not
heard from them at all. We have had zero contact with them, but it would be great to
have single - family low- income housing development there and be able to work with
them and create a very strong neighborhood for them and for myself and my family. I
want to ask if there's been a market value study done to see how this would impact the
property values in that area. I'm also confused on the traffic study. I don't understand
how an employee of the developer can do an unbiased traffic study. I'm going to ask if
the Town Board is going to do their own traffic study that would be less biased. It is
obvious that this person is not going to come and tell you anything but the fact that it
was not going to impact the traffic. Anyone who lives on West Hill, anyone who drives
the road knows that traffic is an issue. Whether it be 25 cars, whether it be 50 cars,
whether it be 100 cars, it's going to make it worse than it is right now. Part of the study
said that it was over 1000 trips daily on the road. That would be the increase. That, to
me, is going to have a significant impact on the traffic. I would hope that you would get a
more unbiased study done to make sure that the information is accurate.
would also like to address why it is 128 units. Can anyone tell me that? I'm asking a
question.
Chairperson Wilcox - They have proposed 128.
Mr. Byrne — But why that size? I know why, because that was the number of units that
would have been allowed on that property if they built single - family units. Correct?
That's why and you said in the other meetings that you would never allow them, as a
Planning Board, to put that many single - family units on that property. So, why are you
going to allow them to put 128 units in this development? It's too big. It's way too big.
There's lots of signs in this report telling you it's too big. The soil, talking about the soil,
moving the soil, that was an issue. Now they've come up with this solution to dump it in
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my back yard. I don't think so. Like my wife said, now we're going to have their water
draining in our back yard. Can you guarantee me that that water is not going to drain in
my back yard? I don't think so. Why 128 units? Because that's where the most money is
going to be made. Not because it is providing low- income housing. Not because they
are good guys. Because it's where they can make the most money. Can the property
support 128 units? No. It's too much traffic, there is not enough fire protection, the water
is an issue, the drainage is an issue, the runoff is an issue. It's too big. Please consider
that.
I also have a question, this is a construction question that maybe the engineer or
someone can answer for me. They said that they were going to put swales at the top of
the hill as a temporary measure, which again, is going to go in my back yard, so I would
like to know what a swale is. I don't know what it is. I'd like to have an answer to that.
Mr. Walker — Basically, it's a diversion ditch.
Mr. Byrne — A diversion ditch. So now I am going to have a diversion ditch back there as
well. Okay. I'd like to know where they are. I want to know exactly where they are going
to be.
Mr. Walker — I believe that they are going to be-
Mr. Byrne — I don't want it to be you believe. I want to know exactly where they are
going.
Mr. Walker — If you want to take some time, I can explain that to you.
Mr. Byrne — We can do that later. We all have a concern about the road in the project.
Because of the traffic on Trumansburg Road, I know how that road is going to be used.
The traffic from the apartments are going to come up that road, use Hayts Road, take
Hopkins Road to Bundy Road and get on 96 that way. That's the way that that road is
going to be used. They are not going to go from it on to 96 because it is going to take
too long. The traffic study indicates that. They are going to come up the road and they
are going to use Hopkins Road, which now gets four or five cars a day. It's going to be
the main road for that project.
I also had a question. Something was brought up about a five -acre site for commercial
development. It kind of slipped through and I am not sure what that meant. Can anyone
tell me what that was? It was brought up somewhere in this presentation tonight and I
am not sure what it is.
Chairperson Wilcox — I am not aware of any proposal in front of the Town or before this
Board of any commercial site.
Mr. Byrne — You guys didn't hear that tonight?
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Chairperson Wilcox — I heard what he said. What I'm telling you is that I'm not aware of
anything being proposed-
Mr. Byrne — But what was meant by that? That five -acre.
Mr. Walker — Well, Mr. Kyong has reserved a five -acre parcel.
Mr. Byrne — For his house, right? Is that what you are talking about?
Mr. Walker — Well, actually, it's a business right now.
Mr. Byrne — So that's what you are talking about, the area around his house. Okay.
Another issue that's been brought up is the fact that West Hill is becoming kind of the
prime location for low- income housing. The Tompkins County Affordable Housing
Resource Map for the Year 2003 indicates that that is true. I have a copy here if you
want to look at it. All the affordable housing, besides what's located in the City of Ithaca,
is on West Hill. Can you look at not creating a ghetto on West Hill? Can you try to move
some of this housing somewhere else in the Town of Ithaca? Why does it have to all be
on West Hill? You can take this map and look at it. All the low income housing in the
Town of Ithaca is located on West Hill. Look at it and see what you want. Please take a
close look at this project and at the zoning. The zoning, I think, is the most important
issue. Again, I think it is a beautiful piece of property. I'm sure that it will be developed in
some way and I think the R -15 zoning provides for development that would be adequate
and fit into our neighborhood.
Chairperson Wilcox — Anybody else? At this point, and I'm also looking at the hour, it is
staff's opinion in the memo that they have provided, it is also my opinion, that at this
point we don't have sufficient information to make an environmental determination,
number one. Number two, I'm sure that many of us have additional questions that we
would like to have addressed. Looking at the clock, we usually adjourn our meetings at
ten unless we decide to go beyond that and we do have some other items that we need
to deal with before we adjourn this evening. It would make sense at this point to, I'll
pose a question, would it make sense to keep the public hearing open and recess our
discussion of it at this point, allow the applicant to bring in additional details with regard
to the intersection based upon DOT, allow the applicants to address any other issues
that they want to provide additional details or additional studies or whatever. Then
reconvene when those materials are available for a reasonable amount of time, it is
usually about 30 days. We could pick up the public hearing for environmental review,
should we get through it, then open the public hearing for site plan, subdivision.
Mr. Kanter — I would ask John Barney's advice on, I guess there are two options, one is
keeping this hearing open and adjourn until a future date or closing this hearing and
then setting another SEAR hearing because there may be some modified information
and so and I guess the question is will that matter in terms of keeping this hearing open
or would it be better to consider it a new hearing?
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Mr. Barney — I would probably suggest closing this hearing. As you know, you are not
required to have a SEAR hearing at all. It's an extra opportunity.
Chairperson Wilcox — It's an extra opportunity, but it's an acknowledgement that the
environmental concerns are important as well.
Mr. Barney — I think what you might consider doing is holding, when you have additional
information, at that point, determine whether you want to hold a separate SEAR
Hearing. I don't think you want to hold this public hearing open indefinitely.
Chairperson Wilcox — Close this one and then -
Mr. Barney — You're going to have to advertise.
Chairperson Wilcox — We're going to have to advertise, yeah we're going to have to
advertise.
Given, the Attorney's advice, any comments over here, preferences. Close the public
hearing? When new material becomes available, we'll make a determination. I'm
inclined at this point to have another public hearing with regard to Environmental
Review, given the nature of the project and the controversy surrounding the project and
then move on. Peter, yes, please.
Mr. Trowbridge- Just a request to the Board (inaudible, Mr. Trowbridge was not
speaking into a microphone).
Mr. Kanter — One question about that. I suspect that some of the questions that some of
you might have had maybe wouldn't necessarily be additional information, but maybe
just definite clarification of information that was provided. In that case, I would prefer
doing that in a public session as opposed to just the staff. So, I'd say if there is
additional information Board Members would like for factual details or clarification of
details, that would be one thing, but if there's discussion or dialogue, that should not be
done through the staff. That's my opinion. It's always better, I think that have that kind of
dialogue and conversation where the public is here.
Board Member Mitrano — Maybe the one concern might be if some new issues come
up, which we would like to have information on so that they know that we would like that
information, we certainly could convey that to you.
Chairperson Wilcox — I haven't heard anybody tonight ask for additional materials, have
I? Or additional information? We certainly hear some topics that we think need further
discussion and we have materials that we have received. For example, we have heard
a lot about the Sheriff's Department, we've heard a lot about the Fire Department, but
we haven't really talked about the letter we have from the Fire Department or the
information that's been provided by the Sheriff's Department and whether or not that is
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
significant. We have information, but we haven't discussed it. If somebody would like to
see additional information and the Board thinks that it's —
Board Member Conneman — I think that enough people talked about traffic that we
could figure our what kinds of information these people would like to see.
Chairperson Wilcox — Would anybody else like to address the Board this evening? So
that we can record, I need to ask you to come to the microphone. And just to make this
easier for the recording secretary, just state your name again.
Mr. Byrne — I asked the question about the traffic study, whether you would initiate your
own traffic study, based upon the fact that there is a large concern about traffic
expressed by people that use the road and the only traffic study you have is from the
developer. Can you give me that answer tonight or not? Are you just going to let that go
or what do I do?
Chairperson Wilcox — I will respond to that the best I can right now. The Planning Board,
as part of it's deliberation, could ask the Town Board to spend the money to do a traffic
study and provide us with information. You are right, we are relying upon the applicants
and their paid consultants, but on the other hand, remember that the traffic study has
been reviewed by the New York State Department of Transportation Engineer and they
have issued an opinion on that traffic study. So, it's not simply their statement and we
are supposed to believe it. It's their statement and reviewed by other experts and Dan
has said he is not a traffic engineer, but he has also weighed in, to some extent based
upon his abilities. He's more of our water and sewer guy and road and everything else.
Mr. Byrne — But the State is reacting to a report with their data. So, all the State is doing
is looking at the data and reacting to that. Maybe another study will give them different
data.
Chairperson Wilcox — You may be right and you may not be right and I think it's
incumbent upon us to re -read the State's letter. I have the State's letter.
Mr. Byrne — The State can only react to what they are shown.
Mr. Barney —The question is really one of cost and the Town feels that we have
professional staff here that can review these reports with a fair degree of skepticism, I
don't know if you want to use that word, and determine whether they are reliable or not.
Do we want to spend thousands of dollars of taxpayer's money to go out and determine
whether a separate study that we feel would yield the same things as what we have
available in our resources here and what the DOT is providing, can we make a fairly
clear judgment in our minds of whether we need a traffic study or not. That is a decision
this Board has to make. So I don't think we can give you an answer tonight, but since
you have raised the issue, it is certainly something we will talk about.
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
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Mr. Byrne — So, will you tell me, like, in the next public meeting, will you give me the
answer that yes, we decided to or no we didn't?
Mr. Barney — I think the Board will discuss it and they will make a determination and
you're certainly welcome to sit and listen to that discussion and after that discussion,
you will find out.
Mr. Byrne — But that would happen in the open meeting?
Mr. Barney — Oh, yeah.
Chairperson Wilcox — All business is done here.
Mr. Byrne — Okay, that answers my question. Thank you.
Chairperson Wilcox closed the Public Hearing at 9:54.
Chairperson Wilcox — Do we wish to provide any feedback to the applicant at this point?
Board Member Thayer — The traffic study would be a Town Board decision?
Chairperson Wilcox — They have to allocate the money. Right?
Mr. Kanter — Well, there may be a question that SEQR, the State Environmental Quality
Review, actually allows the Town to collect fees from the applicant to conduct a study.
We have never done that, to my recollection. But that's not to say that we couldn't do
that. I'm not sure if that is only if they're doing an Environmental Impact Statement or
not.
Mr. Barney — I hate to speculate, I don't want to make an implication here that there is
something speculative about this. A judgment is being made here. I'm not criticizing this
study as being bad. The Board is aware that they paid for the study and therefore, you
are absolutely right, they are not going to going to bring a consultant that is going to say
this is a terrible project, you can't built it. On the other hand, that doesn't necessarily
mean that the study is wrong.
Chairperson Wilcox — That is one of many determinations that we have to make.
Mr. Barney — Things we've got to talk about and decide and we can look into it more.
Board Member Mitrano — One little, sort of tangent off of that is that some concerns I
heard go off into a variety of directions and it just might be useful to suggest that there
are organizations or individuals with whom you might want to speak. IF there is a
problem with traffic enforcement in certain areas, then the sheriff or whoever patrols that
city property line might want to be consulted. Maybe the City School District would be
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
interested to learn that one of their buses, if that was the origin of the bus, went through
a red light. If there is a problem with main streaming special children at the school and
that could be addressed, although I do not buy the argument that a certain income of
housing has more special needs children. There might be a whole other variety of areas
that could be pursued that are tangential to the period to so that when we talk about it
again we are talking about the specific application, rather than a whole wrath of
concerns that really affect other organizations.
Board Member Conneman — Some comments that were made, I think not directly, but
they were saying that, I interpreted them as saying that, they would like to know what
other kinds of developments Chris and these organizations have put together and
where they are located and, perhaps we can look at them. It seems to me that that
would be very helpful because the implication is, and I'm not saying whether they are
right or wrong, I'm not making a judgment. The implication is that these developments
are out of control, if you want to say that. I'm not saying that's true. I'm just saying that
that's the implication that some of the words, which I won't bother to use again. It seems
to me that that would be helpful to us to know about that, if Chris would be willing to
provide it.
Mr. Papamichael- It's not a request for additional information; it's just a clarification of
process of the re- zoning. Obviously the Board would need to make that determination,
but as it's set up, they would need to look for a recommendation from us? What is the
exact process?
Mr. Barney — First the SEQR is approved. Once that is resolved then the preliminary
site plan approval, coupled, usually, with their recommendation.
Mr. Papamicheal — So it is just tied directly to the-
Mr. Barney — No, they can decide to recommend against the re- zoning (inaudible)
If the recommendation is to re -zone and the Town Board concurs with that
recommendation, it is re- zoned, then it comes back to this Board for final site plan
approval.
Mr. Kanter — If I could add to that. I don't know how to say it kindly, but if there is a
strong inkling on the part of Board Members that they would not recommend the re-
zoning, this would probably be a good time to know before more time and money is
spent on more studies. I don't know if you want to respond to that.
Chairperson Wilcox — I am not prepared to make these determinations.
Board Member Mitrano — I certainly would listen to argument. I thought that was an
appropriate suggestion.
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
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Board Member Hoffmann — I have a couple of comments which I think are corrections
on a couple of things that we just heard from the public. I am not going to go into all of it.
Mr. Byrne showed us this map of, he called them low- income housing, but it's really
titled "Tompkins County Affordable Housing Resources in 2003" and he mentioned all
the low income housing in the Town of Ithaca is on West Hill, that is not true. There are
two places mentioned here that are in the Town of Ithaca that are not on West Hill. One
is number 14, the Ellis Hollow Apartments and the other one is number 16, Longview.
They are on East Hill and South Hill, respectively. They are listed in the same map that
Mr. Byrne was referring to. Mr. Byrne also asked why 128 units, which he feels is too
big of a development. The proposal is not for 128 units, it's for a total of 153 units and,
in our materials; we have a layout, which shows how many houses, single - family
houses, could be built on this land if they were laid out in the conventional way, with one
single family house, which could have two apartments, on each lot. That could have 152
units. So, the difference in the number of housing units, whether you do it one way or
the other, is just one.
Board Member Thayer — But we wouldn't allow that here.
Board Member Hoffmann — That may be, but I just wanted to correct the numbers that
he was mentioning. The other things I will discuss at another time.
Chairperson Wilcox — Besides I don't want to, I want to get all the information out that
we can tonight. I too, was concerned a little bit about the density and I have something
that I am going to hand out.
Board Member Thayer — I guess there is a question about affordable housing as
opposed to low income housing. Longview is senior housing and Ellis Hollow is, I guess,
another senior housing, whereas this project is definitely affordable housing or low
income. It's a different project.
Board Member Hoffmann — But, I can't believe that these other two projects would be
listed here if they were not classified as affordable, too.
Mr. Barney — (inaudible)
Board Member Hoffmann - And we haven't heard anything that says that there cannot
be senior citizens living in any of these units.
Chairperson Wilcox — I think we saw something that said senior citizens are unlikely to
live in these specific units.
Board Member Thayer — I understand there is another Section 8 project on Cliff Street
being proposed .
Chairperson Wilcox — Within the City.
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
Board Member Thayer — Within the City.
Chairperson Wilcox — What I have handed out to everybody is, I've looked at the
applicant's calculations, with regard to the number of units that could be situated on the
property in a typical, cookie - cutter like subdivision and maximize the number of lots. The
thing that bothered me was the fact that in the map that they provided, they assumed
open space of 1.6 acres and 3.7 percent. If you, instead, assume ten percent open -
space, instead of 3.7, which is generally about where we are, then I go from 76 lots
down to 71 lots, which, with a unit and an accessory apartment becomes 142 units, the
way I quickly calculated it. I don't try to lay out the property. I get 142 units.
Board Member Thayer — If each house has an apartment?
Chairperson Wilcox — If each house has an apartment. Now, what I don't' like about the
application is that the developer said "well, you can fit 128 affordable units, plus 25
single - family units, which is 153 and they compare that to 152. What they don't do is
point out that of the 25 single - family units that they proposed, each one of those could
have an accessory apartment and you'd wind up having 50 units. Then you have 50 and
128. So, I see a potential maximum of 178 in the total development. I have a problem
with that. I think that would be potentially, should we proceed with this, that then number
of units should be reduced, whether they deem them affordable housing or, potentially,
these single - family lots should be that much bigger. So, I have provided a copy to Peter
Trowbridge as agent for the applicant, you have a copy, staff has a copy, as well. Okay?
It would be unfair to keep this until the next meeting.
Mr. Kanter — Could I add one thing to that?
Chairperson Wilcox — Yes, you may.
Mr. Kanter — There is another calculation you would want to consider and that is if it's in
an R -15 cluster subdivision, using the cluster density factor of 3.51 (inaudible)
Chairperson Wilcox — Nonetheless, the maximum potent ional of this development is 178
units.
Mr. Kanter — Unless there was some restriction on the second area with the homes.
Chairperson Wilcox — They talked about 25 market -rate single - family homes, which,
with an accessory apartment is 50 units.
Do you need anything else this evening?
Inaudible voice from the audience
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
Chairperson Wilcox — You also know Peter, that, by right, does not necessarily pertain
to the number of lots that were created for various issues. On the other hand, what I am
essentially saying is maybe a reduced density might be a reasonable thing. Are we all
set for right now? Let me thank the applicant. I thank the public for being polite and
patient and I'm surprised you didn't speak, but that's your prerogative.
Inaudible voice from the audience
Chairperson Wilcox — I will do my best. Thank you all.
Ladies and gentlemen we have some more business tonight, so I would ask you to take
your business out into the lobby.
AGEND ITEM: Consideration of Approval of 2004 Planning Board Meeting
Schedule.
Chairperson Wilcox — Comments?
Board Member Thayer — It looks okay.
Mr. Kanter — There is one observation on April 6`" Just to let you know, it is Passover.
So, it's up to the Board's discretion if you want to cancel it.
Board Member Thayer — We can make that decision later right?
Chairperson Wilcox — Election day? Any discussion about meeting election day. Kevin
won't be here, but that's all we know, right?
Who wants to move it? So moved by George Conneman. Do I have a second?
Seconded by Eva Hoffmann. All in favor? Anyone opposed? Tracy are you in favor?
:=9 5 61i•CaI, STMOT '[n
Chairperson Wilcox — alrighty.
PB RESOLUTION NO. 2003 -104: Town of Ithaca Planning Board, Schedule of
Meetings - -- 2004
MOTION made by George Conneman, seconded by Eva Hoffmann
RESOLVED, that the Town of Ithaca Planning Board adopt and hereby does adopt the
following as its schedule of Regular Meetings for the Year 2004. Unless otherwise
notified, all meetings will be held on the first and third Tuesday of each month,
commencing at 7:00 p.m. and ending by 10:00 p.m.
FIRST MEETING OF THE MONTH SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH
W�
January 6, 2004
February 3, 2004
March 2, 2004
April 6, 2004
May 4, 2004
June 1, 2004
July 6, 2004
August 3, 2004
September 7, 2004
October 5, 2004
November 2, 2004
December 7, 2004
A vote on the motion resulted as follows:
Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
January 20, 2004
February 17, 2004
March 16, 2004
April 20, 2004
May 18, 2004
June 15, 2004
July 20, 2004
August 17, 2004
September 21, 2004
October 19, 2004
November 16, 2004
December 21, 2004
AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Mitrano, Thayer, Howe.
NAYS: None.
ABSTAIN: None.
The motion was declared to be carried unanimously.
AGENDA ITEM: Consideration of a Recommendation of Planning Board Chair for
2004.
Board Member Thayer — So moved.
Chairperson Wilcox — Any discussion? All in favor? Is anyone opposed? No one is
opposed?
PB RESOLUTION NO. 2003 -105, 2004 Planning Board Chair, Recommendation To
Town Board
MOTION made by Larry Thayer, seconded by Rod Howe.
RESOLVED, that the Town of Ithaca Planning Board recommends to the Town Board
that Fred Wilcox Ill, be appointed as chair of the Planning Board for the year 2004.
A vote on the motion resulted as follows:
AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Mitrano, Thayer, Howe.
NAYS: None.
ABSTAIN: None.
The motion was declared to be carried unanimously.
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
AGENDA ITEM : Approval of Minutes of December 2, 2003
Chairperson Wilcox — So moved by the Chair.
Board Member Hoffmann — I have some questions on the section where we spoke
about the hospital matters and since we were referring to minutes and words and things
that were said there were some things I wanted to know, like for instances on the
bottom of page 16, where it says "corresponding ", I think that was "responding ". I just
need to have it cleared with the rest of you.
Now this one here, on page 17 (inaudible)
Chairperson Wilcox — We are discussing the minutes here guys.
Board Member Thayer — Oh we are? You are, we can't hear anything.
Chairperson Wilcox — All those in favor, please say aye. Anyone opposed? No one is
opposed. Thank you. With corrections, of course.
PB RESOLUTION NO. 2003 -106: Approval of Minutes — December 2, 2003
MOTION by Fred Wilcox, seconded by Rod Howe
RESOLVED, that the Planning Board does hereby approve and adopt the December 2,
2003 minutes as the official minutes of the Town of Ithaca Planning Board for the said
meetings as presented with corrections.
The vote on the motion resulted as follows:
AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Mitrano, Thayer, Howe.
NAYS: None.
ABSTAIN: None.
The motion was declared to be carried unanimously.
AGENDA ITEM: OTHER BUSINESS
Board Member Thayer — Should we hang onto the Overlook stuff?
Chairperson Wilcox — Hang onto all of it. Someone's term is expiring at the end of this
year. One of us has to expire every year. My information is that you are looking to sign
up for another seven year sentence.
Board Member Hoffmann — Yes, can you believe that? I enjoy being here with all of you.
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January 20, 2004
Board Member Thayer — And we enjoy having you.
Chairperson Wilcox — So, you need to get a letter to Jon or Cathy or somebody and
then they'll make the determination.
Any other items at this point?
There is some difference of opinion as to whether we should make a determination or
recommendation as to who the Vice Chair would be or the Town Board to make the
determination of who the Chair of the Board would be.
Mr. Barney — The Vice Chair is elected by this Board.
Chairperson Wilcox — That's right, but, heaven forbid, that we pick Eva to be the Vice
Chair and the Town Board comes along and says —
(inaudible)
Chairperson Wilcox — So moved by the Chair. Seconded by Larry and George
Conneman and Tracy and Rod.
PB RESOLUTION NO. 2003 -107: Recommendation To Town Board:
Reappointment of Eva Hoffmann to Planning Board
MOTION made by Fred Wilcox, seconded by Larry Thayer.
RESOLVED, that the Town of Ithaca Planning Board recommends to the Town Board
that Eva Hoffmann, be reappointed to the Planning Board for a 7 -year term.
A vote on the motion resulted as follows:
AYES: Wilcox, Conneman, Mitrano, Thayer, Howe.
NAYS: None.
ABSTAIN: Hoffmann.
The motion was declared to be carried.
Chairperson Wilcox — Anything else?
Board Member Howe — I'm just curious about the comments that folks were caught by
surprise. Did we handle notification differently then we handled that other big one?
Mr. Kanter — We actually handled it more intensively than we had.
Chairperson Wilcox — If you think about it, the developer had two presentations at the
hospital, we had a sketch plan review.
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Town of Ithaca Planning Board
December 16, 2003 Minutes
Approved January.20, 2004
Board Member Conneman - At the second presentation at. Cayuga.' Medical, I went up
and at four o'clock there was nobody, at 4:45 there was nobody. Fred went up a little bit
later and there were four people.
Chairperson Wilcox — Alright. Merry Christmas, happy holidays. Thank you. all.
AGENDA ITEM% ADJOURNMENT
Upon MOTION, Chairperson Wilcox declared the December 16, 2003 meeting of the
Town of Ithaca Planning Board duly adjourned at 10:20 p.m.
.RRespectful °submitted,
l/ i �-t ` ul 'o'er:
Lori Love
Deputy Town Clerk
EN
December 16, 2003
Town of Ithaca Planning Board:
I am writing this to express my concern regarding the proposed zoning change allowing a
two phase residential development on West Hill (Kyong Property - 1290 Trumansburg
Road). This re- zoning plan would allow 128 rental apartment units with a community
center and 25 single family homes to be constructed.
I have many concerns about this project. I am worried about the increased traffic this
would produce. As anyone who lives .on West Hill is aware, traffic is already a huge
problem, and this project would only add to the congestion, potentially increasing travel
time by a great deal. I am also concerned whether there would be sufficient public
services available to the support increased demand, mainly police and fire personnel and
equipment.
The biggest reason we live where we do is because of the location. We wanted to be in a
location that was rural... away from sub - divisions, apartments, stores, traffic, and too
many people. I'm afraid that the proposed re- zoning, allowing this project to happen,
would take away from myself, my family, and all of us living in this area, the main reason
we love where we live.
A project like the one proposed could potentially have a enormous negative impact on
West Hill for many reasons. I am strongly opposed to the re- zoning of this area of West
Hill, and hope that my concerns are taken into consideration, and that the zoning change is
not approved.
Tim & Carol Bordoni
124 Bundy Road
Ithaca, NY 14850
December 16, 2003 Town of Ithaca Planning Board Meeting
Attachment 4l
December 16, 2003
Town of Ithaca Planning Board
Fred Wilcox — Chair
Town Hall — Ithaca, NY 14850
Re: Overlook project on West Hill - to be entered into public record page 1/2
As a 38 year resident of 1223 Trumansburg road, I am opposed to the
development of additional housing on the Kyong Property, less than 2500 feet
from my residence.
My reasons for such opposition are as follows:
1) Traffic. There is simply too much of it now. On an average morning, it takes
approximately 5 minutes to exit my driveway and turn left (southbound) on
route 96. The addition of another 200 housing units will contribute to this
problem. Lakeside Nursing employees are backed up at 3PM trying to exit the
shift change which is also the timeframe of the Cayuga Medical shift change.
2) Noise: The addition of more traffic brings with it, more noise. I hear an
average of 35 boom box stereo cars driving past my home on any given day —
24 hours a day. Also contributing to noise are loud mufflers and engines.
3) Drain on resources: The Ithaca Fire Department has 1 truck at this location to
serve all of west hill. The added development with low- income housing and
single rental units pose an added drain on resources. What about water and
sewer? Runoff?
4) Crime: Attached are statistics from the Linderman Creek / Conifer
developments for 2003 with a letter from the sheriff adding additional statistics
from 2002 =2000. A large number of complaints are generated due to domestic
disputes, false incident (911 hang -ups), larcenies etc.
5) Effect on assessments: Will this proposed development raise our
assessments or devalue our properties?
6) Discriminatory: Since 2000, we have seen 2 developments of this nature on
West Hill added to Chestnut Hill and West Village. Has West Hill become the
dumping ground for low- income housing? What has East Hill built in this arena
during this timeframe? Do any members of the town board / planning board
(besides Larry Thayer) have similar development in their neighborhoods?
December 16, 2003 Planning Board Meeting
Attachment #2
i
Letter to Town of Ithaca Planning Board 12/16/2003 page 2/2
I also have several questions I would like answered before this vote proceeds.
1) Regardless of the traffic impact study conducted by the applicant, has the
Town of Ithaca conducted their own study? If so, who conducted it? Where are
the results / figures? What time of day / part of the week was such study
conducted?
2) Has the Ithaca Fire Department / Tompkins County Sheriff been consulted for
their expertise on the impacts to their departments?
3) What percentage of this development (housing) will be designated low income
/ section 8?
4) Where are these residents coming from? Are they being displaced from the
city.to the towns? Are they being recruited from outside the area in order to
justify more social spending?
5) Why have the majority of residents in this neighborhood been neglected from
a town notification regarding this development? Are we being held to the
minimal 500' radius stipulation or are our elected officials who campaigned on
neighborhood involvement / quality of life issues, actually willing to practice
what they preach?
6) What type of building materials (roofing etc) will be used? Will we residents
have to smell tar downwind from this construction? Will the construction
cause traffic issues, blocked roads?
7) What additional infrastructure needs to be installed? Will this require
sidewalks? Sewer upgrades? Le., what are the short and long -term effects to
the taxpayers and residents?
8) How much blockage of the view of Cayuga Lake will residents on Hopkins
Road suffer as a result of this development?
I appreciate your answers in written form as soon as possible so they may be
communicated to the residents affected in the Trumansburg Road / West Hill
neighborhood. I also request the Town hold an additional informational hearing in
the West Hill Fire Station within 3 weeks to uphold the integrity of-the board, the
majority who championed democracy and open government, and neighborhood
involvement. To deny residents this meeting would be construed as having
something to hide from those who will be affected by this development.
Sincerely
Joseph Scaglione
1223 Trumansburg Road
To: Town of Ithaca Planning Board
Fred T. Wilcox -Chair
Dec. 15,2003
As I am unable to attend the December 16th Planning Board meeting, I am
requesting that my remarks pertaining to the proposed Overlook housing project
be placed in the public record as my personal comments and negative opinion to
the feasability of this project,as proposed .
have previously submitted in writing,as to what I and many of the neighbors.
saw as critical enviromental and safety problems that needed to be addressed.To
my knowledge,there does not seem to. be any desire on the part of this Board to
convey any sort of requirement of the developer to speak publicly to them.
I do not see any evidence of a comprehensive traffic study being
undertaken,nor a study of the impact this project will have on police or fire
protection.As you are undoubtably aware,there is only one fire station -with only
one engine available, unless there happens to be a multiple engine alarm in the
City which the West Hill truck must respond to!The Sheriff Dept does. not have
the needed number of patrol cars on the road and will be losing a Deputy with the
new county budget further reducing protection. If the statistics pertaining to the
number of Law Enforcement calls to the Linderman Creek project are any
indication,then it is reasonable to expect the same to be happening to this
project,given the proposed make -up of the low- income portion and the
experience at Linderman Creek.
I am most worried about the traffic impact.) do not accept the implication being
made that public transportation will be the preferred mode that the people who
would live in this project would adopt,nor to the statements that most of the
tenents will be employed at Cayuga Medical facilities.The T -Cat statistics show
the resistance of the public,at large,to give up their personal transportation
choices to come and go as they please.
I am afraid you folks are trying to put 10 pounds of project in a 5 pound bag! In
the name of housing,you are ignoring the drastic changes to the area
character,you are increasing the impact on the provision of infrastructer such as
water,sewer and utilities and changing an R -15 zone enviromental advantage
into something much different. It makes more sense to me to have this valuable
land to be used for single family housing and realize the provision of housing
without the myriad of the problems you are now creating.
Robert S. Romanowski
160 Bundy Road
Ithaca, NY -14850
Tel, 607 - 273 -2235
December 16, 2003 Planning Board Meeting
Attchment #3
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
215 North Tioga Street
Ithaca, New York 14850
Tuesday, December 16, 2003
AGENDA
7:00 P.M. Persons to be heard (no more than five minutes).
7:04 P.M. SEQR Determination: Ithaca Beer Co. Expansion Modification, 606 Elmira Road.
7:05 P.M. PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Site Plan Modification for the proposed 3,255 +/- square foot
addition to the Ithaca Beer Company located at 606 Elmira Road, Town of Ithaca.Tax Parcel No. 33 -3-
2.1, Light Industrial District. The modification includes changing from a 48' x 66' (3,168 SF) addition as
approved by the Planning Board on October 7, 2003 to a 35' x 93' (3,255 SF) addition located along the
rear of the existing building. Yunis Realty, Inc., Owner; Dan Mitchell, Ithaca Beer Company, Applicant, .
7: 10 P.M. Overlook at West Hill, 1290 Trumansburg Road,
7 :10 P.M. PUBLIC HEARING: SEQR Determination regarding subdivision approval, site plan approval,
and a recommendation to the Town Board regarding a zoning change, Overlook at West Hill,
1290 Trumansburg Road.
7:45 P.M. PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Preliminary Subdivision Approval, Preliminary Site
Plan Approval, and a recommendation to the Town Board regarding the Zoning Change for the
proposed residential development, Overlook at West Hill, located at 1290 Trumansburg Road
(NYS Route 96), Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 24 -4 -14.2, Residential District R -15: The
proposal consists of two phases of residential development, consisting of 128 affordable rental
apartment units in 16 buildings and a community center in Phase I on a 24 +/- acre portion of Tax
Parcel No. 24-4 -14.2, and 25 lots for single- family, market rate homes in Phase II on about 19
acres of the subject property. The current owners would retain about 5. acres containing the
existing medical practice fronting on Trumansburg Road. The applicant is currently requesting
consideration of rezoning the 24 +/- acres for affordable rental apartments from R -15 Residence
to MR Multiple Residence and preliminary subdivision and site plan approval for the Phase I
apartments. Song Ja Kyong, Owner; Aris Investments, Applicant; Grace Chiang, HOLT
Architects and Peter Trowbridge, Trowbridge & Wolf, Landscape Architects, Agents.
6. Consideration of Approval of 2004 Planning Board Meeting Schedule.
71 . Consideration of a Recommendation of Planning Board Chair for 2004
8. .. Persons to be heard (continued from beginning of meeting if necessary).
9. Approval of Minutes: December 2, 2003,
10. Other Business:
11, Adjournment.
Jonathan Kanter, AICP
Director of Planning
273 -1747
NOTE: IF ANY MEMBER OF THE PLANNING BOARD IS UNABLE TO ATTEND, PLEASE NOTIFY
SANDY POLCE AT 273 -1747.
(A quorum of four (4) members is necessary to conduct Planning Board business.)