HomeMy WebLinkAboutPB Minutes 2008-06-03FILE ?�
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PLANNING BOARD
TOWN OF ITHACA
REGULAR MEETING
215 NORTH TIOGA ST
JUNE 3, 2008
7:00 P.M.
Board Members Present: Rod Howe, Chair; George Conneman, Larry Thayer,
Susan Riha, Hollis Erb and Fred Wilcox
Absent. Eva Hoffmann and Kevin Talty
Staff Present: Paulette Neilsen, Deputy Town Clerk; Susan Brock, Attorney for
the Town; Jonathan Kanter, Director of Planning; Mike Smith, Environmental
Planner; Dan Walker, Town Engineer (7:10pm)
Others Present.
Melinda Stanizewska, Coddington Rd
Katherine Wolf & Annette Marchesseault, Trowbridge &Wolf
Bill Wendt, Cornell Transportation Director
Andrea Riddle, Montessorl School
Steven Moolin, Beardsley Design Associates
Bill Wendt, Maple Ave
Call to Order
Chairperson Howe called the meeting to order at 7:01 p.m.
Persons to be Heard
Melinda Staniszewska, Coddington Road
I am continuing with my quest to see Coddington Road improved between Hudson
Road and the College East Entrance, and I continue to have petitioners sign as I meet
them passing my home. Nowadays it's summer students or local residents, and I'll
present that to you as a full page at the next meeting.
Just this afternoon I spoke to Ed Marx, County Planning Director, and we reviewed the
results of the City of Ithaca Planning Board meeting, which I attended last week. I
presented my concerns about the path being a duplication of service already existing on
Coddington Road. Paving is there, lighting is there, and the number of feet of path
versus the number of feet of the existing Coddington Road and Garden Drive
is ... there's very little difference. Not to mention the fact that students can only choose
to go one way or the other and the College will not be solving the problem of students
and residents needing to walk and bike along Coddington.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 2
I approached... Mr. Marx had said to me that if...l am trying, as an individual person to
get the parties involved, the City, the Town and the County. There is the issue of the
intersection of Hudson and Coddington which isn't clearly marked or sidewalk properly,
and there's the issue of the distance between that intersection and the College, which is
heavily traveled. Mr. Marx said this afternoon that if I approached... if approached by the
Town, he would support their interest in a proposal to sidewalk and bike lane the
Coddington block that I am trying to focus attention on.
I have a handout here which I presented the map portion to the City at their meeting and
then I included a letter that I have written to the editor for the Ithaca Times of today.
(Passed out to Board) The map really just shows the intersection and how there are
three stop signs, how there is a proposed crosswalk from the College path to the
Recreation Way but nobody has ever defined a crosswalk from the triangular section,
which is City, and it goes across to Coddington ... I've seen people cross ever which way
and I think the crosswalks should be marked...) think we ought to pay attention to
sidewalks and I think we ought to even include bus shelters. Now that people are
possibly going to be taking more public transportation, the students already congregate
to go to class and to return. There are lots of students living in the South Hill area. I
think that should all be considered in this entire project.
Just for me to read the letter to the editor, I passed it out to you, so I hope you will pay
attention to some of the points I am trying to make ... the College already owns 65% of
the properties along Coddington, they say that they're doing their path because we
aren't doing anything on our part. And so I think we have a duplication of efforts here.
The Recreation Way closes at 8pm so there's no contiguous use and if they really want
some sort of path at the end of the completion of the Athletics & Events Center, I think
that should be where the emphasis should lie. Thank you very much.
Chairperson Howe — I think that we've always felt that this is an issue that needs
coordination amongst different municipalities or entities, but it wasn't our role to initiate
that dialogue. So I don't know if the right parties are talking about this issue and the
intersection, and Coddington Road ... Does anyone know if that's being initiated in an
intermunicipal level?
Board Member Wilcox — If I may ... Melinda, if I could get you back up to the microphone,
because we were talking before the meeting ... you mentioned to me that you will be
back here next week when the Town Board meets [yes], you are speaking to County
officials, Ed Marx, possibly others, [yes], and then you also mentioned to me that you
were going to get in touch with Will Burbank as an elected official to the County, [yes].
So I think those are the players, the elected officials who control the purse strings and
Ed Marx who I believe, besides being the Commissioner of Planning, is also the Head
of the Department of Public Works in the County, I think he wears that hat as well,
whose recommendation would be important if the County is going to allow some sort of
construction of a sidewalk along that stretch of road.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 3
Chairperson Howe — I concur with Fred that you're talking to the right people who will
then...
Board Member Wilcox — Who control the money...
Ms. Staniszewska — Right, except we really need the participation of Ithaca College.
We need to reach them. I've written a letter to Peggy Williams, even though she is
stepping down as President, she is remaining to fundraise for the Athletics & Events
Center, and should have some input, possibly into a collaborative effort here...
Chairperson Howe — I can't speak for the College, but I can't imagine if there was a
meeting called together that Ithaca College wouldn't be willing to send somebody...
Ms. Staniszewska — That's what I ask.
Board Member Riha — I thought there already was a plan to expand and put in bike
paths along Coddington Road.
Mr. Kanter — I wouldn't say there's a plan.
Board Member Riha — So it's not like Hanshaw? They never got to that stage?
Mr. Kanter — Not at all.
Board Member Riha —Okay. So the County has no plans to put in any....
Mr. Kanter — There have been preliminary concept discussions; it has not gone farther
than that.
Chairperson Howe — Thank you. Is there anyone else
Planning Board? I forgot to mention that Eva and Kevin
but we still have enough members to move forward.
Chairperson Howe announces the next agenda item,
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PB 6.3.08
Pg. 4
We have a brief presentation, and then if we have questions we have a chance to ask
the agent.
Steven Moolin, Beardsley Design Associates
Yeah, I wanted to thank you for the legal notice because it named me as "agent" and for
the first time in 30 years as an architect, my son thought I was very cool. And I'd like to
thank Mike Smith too because I called him back on April 17th and that's how I am here
today. So, Anything you see up here tonight is in the packets that you've already
received, the 11x1 Ts and the other things, but, very briefly, the program, the Onology
Program, is currently conducted up at the Geneva Ag Station and so this addition is to
accommodate that program until future provisions can be made on the main campus.
The location is along Dryden Road here, on Crisp Apple Drive here. The addition is on
the south side of the building facing away from Route 366, Dryden Road and there was
a question that Mike Smith had forwarded me about the impervious area, which was
when we originally looked at impervious area, we looked at it in terms of the building,
so, in terms of the building, what we're actually doing is we are building on, well, as you
can see here, we have gravel drives and gravel yards on all sides of the building which
is currently impervious area, but when you look at the addition to the building, you look
at an area that is currently semi - enclosed back here, we're taking that down and putting
a building in that place. When you look at the building plan, there's a , on your 11x17's
there's a bold dash line here, that's a footprint of this existing semi- enclosed area. So
what we're doing is we're tearing that down, building there plus this additional square
footage. So there's approximately, with this and a concrete apron out front, which is,
frankly, a housekeeping device for the use of the building, approximately 2,000
additional impervious square feet. As far as the building is concerned. As far as the
site is concerned, however, we are building on existing gravel so we are not adding to
impervious square footage. That is really the extent of my presentation. It is not a large
addition, it is in keeping with the use of that P -9 zone and when we evaluated the
building from a building code stand point, we looked at the most restrictive use of the
entire building, which is mercantile, and we used the square footages there to allow for
a non - separated use building.
Chairperson Howe — And I think I read that when it's no longer being used as part of the
Onology, it will just be used by the Pomology Department.
Mr. Moolin — That's correct. And that was one of the reasons for choosing a more
permanent structure rather than a metal building. Use a masonry building. But using a
masonry building with a metal roof also is in keeping with the existing building
construction and as an attempt to be, frankly, unadorned small addition to the building.
Chairperson Howe — Are you aware of any environmental issues?
Mr. Moolin — No I am not, no.
Chairperson Howe — Questions?
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 5
Board Member Wilcox — I have a couple. In your letter dated May 2Id, you point out that
the estimated cost of the project is $550,000.
Mr. Moolin — I was doing that to be conservative for the fee for tonight's meeting...
Board Member Wilcox — You're putting together a 2,000 square foot addition, how can
is cost $500,000 +?
Mr. Moolin — Well, the buildings that I have built recently were between $200 and $250
a square foot once we get permits and the like in so the total cost of the building
structure is there. We're also, you know, a prevailing wage rate job too.
Board Member Wilcox — Amazing. I thought that was a typo, frankly.
Mr. Moolin — No, no Sir, no.
Board. Member Wilcox — I really, given the construction ... alright. My other question is,
on the sort of west side of the building is a liquid nitrogen tank, and you might want to
use an overhead photograph, might be the best way to show it, uhhmmm, it's the side of
the building on which the very narrow part of the addition will extend ... yes...it would
appear right now that the tank truck that comes to fill that probably enters from the front,
goes to the west side of the building, stops, unloads the liquid nitrogen, and then could
proceed around the building and then back out to the road, this addition will block that,
or change the access to that nitrogen tank.
Mr. Moolin — It will change the access to it, yes.
Board Member Wilcox — How will the truck unload with the addition being there?
Mr. Moolin — I don't know.
Board Member Wilcox — It's an important question.
Mr. Moolin — I believe one of the things the owner is doing is also looking at replacing
that facility too, the liquid nitrogen.
Board Member Wilcox — It's not the answer I want to hear now. I would expect Cornell
and you to have already figured out how you're going to deal with that situation given
the addition.
Mr. Moolin — I know that one of the things that the owner had looked at when we went
out and kind of paced off the site, is the ability to move around the entire building
because we're really not, we're not encompassing that entire roadway. We probably
have about 10 feet on one side.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 6
Board Member Wilcox — I visited the site this afternoon and that's when I noticed the
issue. You haven't convinced me that you've thought about it and have a solution for it.
Mr. Moolin — I think we can get back to Mike if there is any more information that we
have to get to you.
Board Member Thayer — How often do they have to be fueled?
Mr. Moolin — I believe it's a monthly filling. But that was not a major program issue
for ... and we had the staff involved who use that facility too.
Board Member Wilcox — It may not be a program issue, but it's a site plan issue which is
the responsibility of this Board.
Mr. Moolin — I understand.
Board Member Wilcox — Is there a representative of Cornell here, by the way?
Just...did anybody accompany you from Cornell? Just out of curiosity. I ran into a
gentleman out back, his name was Curt, who works at the building, he gave me a tour,
he answered my questions, and I want it on the record that he was very helpful and I
appreciated his assistance.
Chairperson Howe — So Fred, keep it in mind, in case you want that to be a condition
when we get to the...
Board Member Wilcox — Yeah, it's possible
an answer...
Mr. Moolin — Sorry.
Chairperson Howe — Hollis ... any questions?
I am somewhat frustrated they don't have
Board Member Erb — Not specifically about that...
Chairperson Howe — This ... if you have any questions, this is a good time...
Chairperson Howe — For purposes of being consistent from one application to another, I
thought we checked "commercial" at the Plantations building demolition because they
have a shop in the building.
Chairperson Howe - Your talking about on the SEQR form?
Board Member Erb — Yeah, so on the SEQR form I would have thought we would have
checked "commercial" again.
Mr. Kanter — They definitely have sales there.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 7
Board Member Erb — There definitely are lovely sales there. And there are residences
as close as the intersection to the east.
Board Member Wilcox — It's quite a distance. Game Farm Road?
Board Member Erb — Yeah. Is it too far for...
Board Member Wilcox — You know what, I don't...
Board Member Erb — I don't know what the rules are.
Board Member Wilcox — There are no rules.
Chairperson Howe — We've checked it.
Ms. Neilsen — Did you want "residential" also?
Chairperson Howe — Did you also say "residential" or just if .
Board Member Erb — Well I was, especially "commercial" for sure.
Chairperson Howe — Are you okay if it's just "commercial" that. we check?
Board Member Erb — Yeah,. if everyone else is.
Board Member Riha — So I am just following up on my email to Mike.. .56, gravel counts
as impervious surface? Gravel is considered an impervious surface then?
Mr. Walker — Pervious or impervious?
Board Member Riha — Impervious. I thought it would have been pervious.
Mr. Walker — Semipervious. We look at it ... if it's a parking lot it's less pervious than a
lawn area.
Board Member Riha — So how is stormwater handled in this facility right now?
Mr. Moolin — Well, what happens right now is that it runs off the roof, is gathered in
gutters, downspouts, and then splash blocks onto the surface.
Board Member Riha — So it's just kind of your basic surface...
Mr. Moolin —just like your house probably.
Board Member Riha — Well, I think Cornell should be doing a little better than that, but,
for now, it meets, I think, the requirements.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 8
Board Member Thayer — I'll move the SEQR.
Chairperson Howe — George. ..any questions...
Board Member Conneman — I wanted to say, I'll answer Fred's question about buildings
at Cornell. When you have the State involved in it, for example, when Cornell builds a
new dairy barn, that'll probably cost five —times as much as we would, a commercial
farmer, because they have to have all these architects and pay everybody off, whatever
that means, and so it's four or five times...
Board Member Wilcox — Did that $550,000 strike anybody else as...
Board Member Riha — It is amazing.
Board Member Conneman — Knowing what the deal is, you can't do anything...
Board Member Thayer — I'm assuming it includes all the internal stuff.
Board Member Wilcox — Presumably, too, but. ..what are they, gold plated stuff?
Chairperson Howe — Larry has moved the SEQR resolution...is there a second?
Seconded by George. All those in favor ... so it was unanimous, there was no opposition
or abstentions.
ADOPTED RESOLUTION: PB RESOLUTION NO. 2008 - 048
SEQR
Preliminary and Final Site Plan
Cornell University Pomology Building Addition
Tax Parcel No 63 -1 -11
Town of Ithaca Planning Board, ,tune 3, 2008
Motion made by Larry Thayer, seconded by George Conneman,
WHEREAS:
1. This action is consideration of Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the
proposed addition to the Cornell University Pomology Cold Storage Building
located at 128 Crisp Apple Drive (Cornell University Orchards off Dryden Road),
Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 63 -1 -11, Planned Development Zone No, 9. The
project involves constructing a 2,700 +/- square foot addition on the south side of
the existing 11,800 +/- square foot Pomology Cold Storage Building to house an
enology teaching lab and cider press. Cornell University, Owner /Applicant;
Steven F. Moolin, R.A., Beardsley Design Associates, Agent, and
2. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board is acting
as Lead Agency in environmental review with respect to Site Plan Approval, and
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 9
3. The Planning Board, on June 3, 2008, has reviewed and accepted as adequate a
Short Environmental Assessment Form (EAF) Part I, submitted by the applicant,
and Part II prepared by Town Planning staff, drawings titled "Watershed
Boundary Plan" (L -101), date stamped May 5, 2008, "Foundation, First Floor,
Framing & Roof Plans" (A -101), dated March 7, 2008, "Elevations & Details" (A
201), dated May 9, 2008, prepared by Beardsley Design Associates, and other
application materials, and
4. The Town Planning staff has recommended a negative determination of
environmental significance with respect to the proposed Site Plan Approval;
NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED:
That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby makes a negative determination of
environmental significance in accordance with Article 8 of the Environmental
Conservation Law and 6 NYCRR Part 617 New York State Environmental Quality
Review for the above referenced actions as proposed, based on the information in the
EAF Part I and for the reasons set forth in the EAF Part II, and, therefore, a Draft
Environmental Impact Statement will not be required.
A vote on the motion was as follows:
Ayes: Howe, Conneman, Thayer, Riha, Erb and Wilcox
Nays: None
Absent: Hoffmann and Talty
The motion passed unanimously.
Chairperson Howe — If you want to have a sear, we'll open the public hearing. This is a
public hearing on the preliminary and final site plan approval for the proposed addition
to the Cornell University Pomology Cold Storage Building. Is there anyone who
would ... and I am opening the public hearing at 7:20p.m ... is there anyone who would
like to address the Board on this issue? I'll leave that open for a couple minutes. Are
there further questions? It looks like you have a...
Board Member Erb — I don't know if this is a necessary clarification or not, but on both
the SEQR that we just voted on and on this, sheet L101 is referred to as having a May
51 2008 date stamp, and I've been all over the sheet and I can not find a date stamp.
Mine says unstamped. Has the word 94 unstampedif . And I don't know whether that's
important to anything. (Everyone looks) No, Lone - zero -one it refers to. I tried to catch
his....
Mr. Moolin — The term unstamped....
Chairperson Howe — Can you use the mike please...
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 10
Mr. Moolin — The term 16 unstamped" in this case means that we do not have a
professional seal on it yet, and no, I don not find a date on that drawing either.
Board Member Erb — The word is in the "date" slot.
Mr. Moolin — Yes.
Chairperson Howe — Any other comments? We will close the public hearing at 7:22
p.m, and see if we have any language we would like to add to the proposed resolution.
Would you like to propose something Fred?
Board Member Wilcox — I'm sure Susan's on top of it already... she's not laughing.
Ms. Brock — So Fred, do you want a condition...
Board Member Wilcox — Normally in something like this, we would want to see evidence
presented, I guess, the approval of the Director of Planning, at this point, that safe
access to the liquid nitrogen storage tank is provided, something like that.
Mr. Kanter — Well, let me just ask a question, because it looks like, on the aerial photo,
there is there are two ways of accessing the tank now. My assumption would be with
the addition going behind it, there still would be access to it from the lower side.
However, .. .
Board Member Wilcox — If I may. ..(Fred goes to the illustration board and explains what
he means). So the entrance is here and right now they could probably pull up, let's use
this one, they could pull in, stop and go around this way, which is very safe, the tanker
never has to back up. With the addition in place, and I don't know what they are going
to do with the dumpster here, but with that addition in place, are they going to come in
this way and pull in and back up ... I'm just worried about them backing in this front area
because apparently, they can't go all the way around. That's my concern
Mr. Kanter — Yeah, I guess that would depend on how large that truck is that delivers it
also because it may be that going in, backing up to it and coming out is absolutely no
problem, depending on when they do it because that parking lot is not usually full, in
fact, there usually aren't cars in it unless its open for retail.
Board Member Wilcox — Which that's my...l think we've all seen the trucks, they're
large, milk- tanker truck sized, you know, large fuel - delivery truck sized and clearly, it's
safer for them to not have to back up.
Chairperson Howe — I think it's reasonable to add a condition, and I missed whether you
were comfortable with the Staff reviewing whatever, or would you want them to come...
Board Member Wilcox — No, I'm comfortable with the Staff doing it if they're willing to
accept that responsibility. Yeah, yeah...
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 11
Mr. Kanter — Sure. Why don't we say whatever we're saying, subject to review and
approval of Director of Engineering and Director of Planning.
Ms. Brock — How about "submission of plans or other information satisfactory to the
Town's Director of Planning and Director of Engineering showing adequate access to
the liquid nitrogen tank" and let me amend that by saying, showing ... uhhh
adequate... okay... we'll put that at the end... "showing adequate access to the liquid
nitrogen tank by delivery vehicles."
Board Member Wilcox — What do we mean by "adequate "? I mean safe ... I don't like the
word "adequate"... we can leave adequate but my primary concern is safety.
Ms. Brock — Alright, .. "adequate and safe "? Okay. so that would be condition c.
Chairperson Howe — And while we are doing changes, are there other changes? Do we
have to address this issue of the date stamp...
Board Member Wilcox — So should we change reference to that L101 as being undated.
Ms. Brock —And that shows up in the 3rd whereas clause and the 1St resolved... we'll say
undated....
Mr. Walker — I noticed on these plans there really are no site - grading plan or site plan
on here ... so, I'm assuming that they are going to put a driveway all the way around that,
so I don't see that as a big issue.
Board Member Wilcox — But again, if that's what they are going to do, then that should
be on the plan that we have...
Mr. Walker — Well ... (inaudible) ... no building permit shall be issued until an adequate
driveway is shown on the plan. I mean, you look on the elevation of the rearview of the
proposed addition and it looks like there's about a 25 400t wide driveway to the left of
the new addition...you see there's quite a bit of gray area ... they haven't done a very
good job of revising site plan, these are building plans, not site plans...
Chairperson Howe — Do you have any other changes?
Ms. Brock — No, I think the language I proposed actually would cover what Dan was
talking about.
Chairperson. Howe — Would someone like to move the resolution? Hollis.... seconded?
I'm always afraid I missed a step ... I did close the public hearing... Fred... all those in
favor ... it was unanimous.
PB 6.3.08
Pg, 12
ADOTED RESOLUTION: PB RESOLUTION NO, 2008 - 049
Preliminary and Final Site Plan
Cornell University Pomology Building Addition
Tax Parcel No 63 -1 -11
Town of Ithaca Planning Board, June 3, 2008
Motion made by Hollis Erb, seconded by Fred Wilcox.
WHEREAS:
1. This action is consideration of Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the
proposed addition to the Cornell University Pomology Cold Storage Building
located at 128 Crisp Apple Drive (Cornell University Orchards off Dryden Road),
Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No, 63 -1 -11, Planned Development Zone No. 9. The
project involves constructing a 2,700 +/- square foot addition on the south side of
the existing 11,800 +/- square foot Pomology Cold Storage Building to house an
enology teaching lab and cider press. Cornell University, Owner /Applicant;
Steven F. Moolin, R.A., Beardsley Design Associates, Agent, and
2. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board, acting as
lead agency in environmental review with respect to Site Plan Approval has, on
June 3, 2008, made a negative determination of environmental significance, after
having reviewed and accepted as adequate a Short Environmental Assessment
Form Part I, submitted by the applicant, and a Part II prepared by Town Planning
staff, and
3. The Planning Board, at a Public Hearing held on June 3, 2008, has reviewed and
accepted as adequate, drawings titled "Watershed Boundary Plan" (L -101),
undated, "Foundation, First Floor, Framing & Roof Plans" (A -101), dated March
7, 2008, "Elevations & Details" (A 201), dated May 9, 2008, prepared by
Beardsley Design Associates, and other application materials, and
NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED:
1. That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby grants Preliminary and Final Site
Plan Approval for the addition to the Cornell University Pomology Cold Storage
Building located at 128 Crisp Apple Drive, as shown on the drawings titled
"Watershed Boundary Plan" (L -101), undated, "Foundation, First Floor, Framing
& Roof Plans" (A -101), dated March 7, 2008, "Elevations & Details" (A 201),
dated May 9, 2008, prepared by Beardsley Design Associates, subject to the
following conditions:
a, submission of one set of the final site plan drawings on mylar, vellum, or
paper, signed and sealed by the registered land surveyor(s), engineer(s),
architect(s) or landscape architect(s) who prepared the site plan materials,
to be retained by the Town of Ithaca, and
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 13
b. submission of record of application for and proof of receipt of all necessary
permits from county, state, and /or federal agencies.
C, Submission of plans or other information, satisfactory to the Town's Director
of Planning and Director of Engineering, showing adequate and safe access
to the liquid nitrogen tank by delivery vehicles.
A vote on the motion was as follows:
Ayes: Howe, Conneman, Thayer, Riha, Erb and Wilcox
Nays: None
Absent: Hoffmann and Talty
The motion passed unanimously.
Chairperson Howe announces the next agenda item.
Generic Environmental Impact Statement (T =GEIS)
Chairperson Howe — We were handed additional material this evening, much more
compact ... than the materials of a couple of weeks ago, many of us were dutiful and
brought in our notebooks and I believe that tonight ... many of you are probably like me
where I may have opened and started looking... there will be plenty of opportunities for
us to more thoroughly discuss ... I think tonight is a chance for us to have... orientation
think is probably the right word, and then of course if you have some questions already,
you can ask questions.
Katherine Wolf & Annette Marchesseault, Trowbridge & Wolf, Agents for Cornell.
Ms. Wolf — So I think you characterized it quite well, Rod and I think I would also like to
emphasize that people shouldn't feel pressured to get every detail nailed down tonight.
I think there will be many opportunities to have your questions answered. I think I
mentioned last time that the transportation planners can be available at the next
meeting, if you'd like, to answer your questions as well and we anticipate that there will
be many opportunities to review the material.
What I'd like to do tonight is, I have a few comments and then I've put together some
talking points that we could go through, this outline together, briefly. There's just a few
things that I thought would be helpful if I brought them to your attention and of course
we are happy to take questions and feel free to interrupt me at any time and ask
questions.
We put together an outline of things we thought might be helpful as you embark on this,
just to clarify some things.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 14
Again, just to remind you, this is adequacy review, so that means, really, your job, your
task at this point in time, is to verify that the TGEIS does in fact contain everything
outlined in the scoping document. That is your primary charge at this point in time. You
are not conducting an adequacy review on the TIMS, just to sort of clarify that piece of
it. I think one way you might think of this is if you were receiving a site plan review
application that had a environmental impact statement with it, in a way, the TIMS could
be sort of thought of, that would be the site plan. So you are doing the adequacy review
on the SEAR process, not on the TIMS. I think that the TIMS very closely parallels
section 5, the mitigations, so I think that as you're reviewing the mitigation section, that's
really, probably you're going to find that's the most logical time to also be reviewing the
TIMS. I think the distinction between the TGEIS and the TIMS is really the TIMS
represents those mitigation measures that are being proposed to be carried forward as
action items, if you will, by Cornell University. And so the TIMS is really viewed as sort
of the strategic transportation plan for the next 10 years. So these are the action items
by Cornell University. It is a draft and it will not be completed until we have completed
the SEQR process. So it is anticipated that there may in fact be revisions to the TIMS
as well, based on what comes out of this process.
Let's see, what else do I want to talk to you about ... I think L J guess maybe with that,
maybe we could take a look at the talking points that I have provided and we'll just kind
of go through this and I will try to move through this fairly quickly and again, feel free to
stop me with questions.
First of all, just the general organization of the TGEIS. Fairly obvious, but, the first
section of course is the Executive Summary. The, well, preceding that of course is the
final scoping document, so that's in there as well, for your reference. Chapter 2 outlines
the action, Purpose, Need and Benefit. And Chapters 3, 4, & 5 the Existing Conditions,
the Potential Impacts of Population Growth, and Potential Mitigations are really
structured in a parallel fashion. They each address in the same order, bikes and peds,
vehicles, transit, etc. etc, and again, the TIMS very closely resembles the Mitigation
section.
The Action described in Chapter 2, 1 think ultimately, ultimately we decided that, we've
all had a lot of discussion about what the action is, and I think that ultimately we decided
that the action is really future site plan review and other approval applications that come
before this and other Boards that will utilize the TGEIS. So it's really future applications,
that's the primary, future actions are really the primary subject, and then in addition,
there is the TIMS which we believe would not be formally accepted by the Planning
Board, again, because it really is sort of an internal action plan for Cornell University but
it's something that you can perhaps accept or receive. So those are really the 2
components of the action.
Board Member Riha — So I had a question about that because some of the actions
involve, obviously, parts of the Town and so, how does that work? Because Cornell
could obviously do certain things, like some of the policies they've taken with providing
PB 6.3.08
Pg, 15
Freshman with free bus passes and things within the campus, but then, a lot of this has
to do with making changes in some aspect in the Town.
Ms. Wolf — You're referring to the TIMS now?
Board Member Riha — Yeah, and the last chapter.
Ms. Wolf — The mitigations... right...
Board Member Riha — Right, because you look and say "oh, that looks interesting" but...
Ms. Wolf — That's correct. Well, I think that mitigations are, well, not all of the
mitigations will happen. Not all of them will be implemented as in most strategic plans,
some things move forward and some don't and it's a clearly stated intention of the
University to work with the partners... there has been a lot of collaboration to date and in
fact, I think that the, those items, those components that have been moved forward
have already, we've heard a lot from municipal leaders and transportation planners in
the community, I think there's been a lot of consensus already, and agreement, that
these are components or elements that should move forward. So, there's already been,
that's part of what has taken this process so long. I think it's been very inclusive and
broad based and a lot of input and so, it's true, they can't do it alone, and some things
might not happen because a partner is unwilling or doesn't want to. So, again, it will be
a process that evolves, that's also why there are 5 year updates to the TIMS, that things
can be reassessed. You know, maybe, what didn't work or what wasn't successful and
so are there other things that perhaps need to happen or perhaps become a higher
priority because of that.
Board Member Riha — Yeah, so, just what I wasn't quite clear on, and maybe Jonathan
knows the answer, is whether by essentially accepting this plan, then the Planning
Board is saying that this is a vision of how transportation should look like in the Town of
Ithaca for the next 5 years or...
Mr. Kanter — Well, no, because we already have that. We have our Transportation
Plan...
Board Member Riha — Exactly...
Mr. Kanter -- ....which is our vision of how transportation should be in the future. But we
can look at this as a supplement to our Transportation Plan in some ways, but I think
more so, we would look at it more as a resource document that the Planning Board, the
Town Board, and others can use when you make future decisions. So I think the key
would be what we come up with in the Findings Statement in terms of the Planning
Board's findings, you can say as much or as little as you want to and you can put as
much weight into this or as little as you want to. And likewise, whatever statement we
might make about the TIMS could range from acceptance, you know, we have received
the document, thank you very much, or it could even have some more, a stronger form
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 16
of supporting statement or something like that. And there could, in the Finding
Statement, there can be all kinds of language about what we would want to see happen
in the future.
Chairperson Howe — Well, and does this suggest some sort of ongoing, inter-
governmental agency and government communication? Because there's a lot of that
that had to come together for this, and to get back to Susan's point, I'm hoping that
somehow there a structure for using that framework to do this periodically.
Ms. Wolf — And I think that's a good point, and I think that's already been discussed.
There's a Resource Committee that we have been working with throughout this process
which is a group of, we view them as technical advisors, Jonathan is on that Resource
Committee, as are engineers and planners from all of the surrounding municipalities
and DOT as well as Fernando DeAaregon who is the Executive Director of the Ithaca -
Tompkins, ITCTC, Tompkins Transportation Council, and I think it was ... that
organization currently coordinates transportation for this region. And so I think it's been
pretty much agreed that that is the logical body to continue to coordinate these efforts,
the multi - municipal efforts that are suggested in the TIMS so that they're coordinated
with other things that are going on regionally. I mean, they really are very much in the
driver's sear in terms of grant applications for federal aid, so all of these have to be
coordinated in the context of that, and so I think, I think there's been discussion about
having a subcommittee that works on the implementation component from ITCTC.
Okay. Then, moving on on the Talking Points then. Item C, the Travel Survey, I just
wanted to point out to you that the scope ... if you look at the Scoping Document, it refers
to, it says that part of our method will be to conduct a web -based survey. I think in the
TGEIS we refer to that as a travel survey. So, a travel survey was designed and
conducted and I think I presented soma of the findings of that at some of the previous
meetings, there was a very high response rate so we feel very confident of what we
learned. It provides a good baseline of the mode split. Why people commute the way
they do commute. What it might take to change their commuting patterns. And the
Executive Summary of that travel survey is one of the appendices in your Appendix.
And we also used the information in the Survey, there were questions in the Survey,
people had, people responding had to tell us how they actually came to campus and so
that was very helpful in understanding where people were coming from and that
information was utilized then in the traffic analysis. So, with that in mind, I also just
wanted to... there's a couple of diagrams in here that I think can be somewhat
daunting...if you want to turn to page 248 in your document, and then, actually, I am
drawing your attention to the diagram on the right -hand side, Figure 424 -A1 and the
following page, 424 -A2. I just wanted to explain these diagrams to you ... I think if it's
explained to you, it's quite easy to understand, but it's maybe not so obvious otherwise.
So, utilizing the Travel Survey, and then this was cross - checked and verified against
geo -coded address data, but utilizing that information, we were able to identify where
people are living and what corridors they arrive on to campus. So for example, if you
look at Route 13 coming in from Dryden, the number in black tells you that 15.4% of the
Cornell driving population, actually, this is the important part of this diagram ... if you look
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 17
at the name of the figure... Origin Area of Existing and Future Cornell Driving
Population. So it's only, so for all those people who actually drive to Campus, so this
isn't people who take the bus, or walk or bike, it's not the entire Cornell Population, it's
the driving population, because this was utilized as a base for our traffic analysis. So, of
the driving population, 15.4% of the existing driving population reside in that sort of tan
wedge and arrive along Route 13. And these wedges, of course, expand way off the
map. Of the future additional population growth, okay, we expect that 18.7% of just that
future growth, will come in on Route 13.
Chairperson Howe — At. ..What scenario though are you using for that?
Ms. Wolf — That's under all scenarios. And so...
Board Member Thayer — So that's a maximum you're talking?
Ms. Wolf — Whatever the future growth, additional growth is. So we've got three
scenarios.
Board Member Thayer — Right, that's why I asked.
Board Member Erb — So under all three growth scenarios, you have the same
distribution of locations of origin...
Ms. Wolf — Correct. Correct.
Board Member Erb — So the fact that,--,if it's the higher growth scenario, it's not suddenly
going to shift, to come in from a different location.
Ms. Wolf — That's correct. That's correct. However, some locations, for example, so
the point here is that we did not assume the same level of commuting, we did not
assume the same distribution and this is based on an understanding of where housing
is likely to develop, more housing... there are certain areas, for example, if you look on
the map and you look at Cayuga Heights, okay, and Cornell Heights, for one thing, we
don't really expect more housing growth there. We don't really expect a lot of the future
additional population growth to be located there, because we don't really expect that
there's going to be, it's pretty built up, so, so we don't, we haven't attributed hardly any
trips of the growth to those neighborhoods.
Board Member Thayer — So that's why 96 and 79 are much more, in percentage,
increased.
Ms. Wolf — Correct. It takes a little getting your brain around... Now, okay, if you're
ready, we'll go to the next page ... weIre looking ... the previous page separated existing
and future, now we're saying, now we've thrown them all together and we've said of the
entire Cornell driving population again, again, we are only talking about those who are
driving, the top number, and we can look at Route 13 again, so again, 15.4% of the
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 18
existing driving population is coming in on Route 13. Under scenario one, excuse me,
under scenario one, which is no Cornell growth, so therefore, it's the existing number,
15.4% under no Cornell growth, will come in on Route 13. Under scenario two, 15.5%
of the Cornell driving population will come in on that corridor. Under scenario three,
15.7 of the entire driving population comes in on that corridor and under scenario four,
16% of the entire driving population comes in along that corridor.
Board Member Thayer — So why doesn't it equal 18.7?
Ms. Wolf — Well, yeah, this is ... I don't know why we put that first diagram in there...
because the 18.7 is only of the additional population. Then when the ... it's a blended
number.
Ms. Wolf — Does everybody else understand that distinction?
Board Member Conneman — It seems that the difference between 15.5 and 16 isn't very
great. That's a pretty narrow thing to measure.
Board Member Thayer — All of them are very narrow.
Board Member Conneman — I mean, that's so narrow, you could flip a coin.
Ms. Wolf — Well, I mean, what it's telling you is that those corridors that are the
predominant corridors are going to continue to be the predominant corridoors. I think,
we don't expect to see in the next 10 years some major population shift, right, it's really
going to be that small I think. There are minor shifts, but it's not like we expect there's
going to be some new, major population center and all the growth is going to go there.
And when you take the number of growth that we are talking about ... first of all, for
example, in scenario 3 for example, which is 1,500, that's the total population growth,
they don't all drive. So it's an even smaller number than that, because a certain
percentage of them take the bus, walk, bike, so you've got a smaller number, and by the
time you distribute them all around....
Board Member Conneman — So don't get excited about the numbers. That's my
conclusion when I looked at this.
Ms. Wolf — Right.
Board Member Wilcox — When you started this project, what was the price of gas? Let's
pick a number, $2.50 a gallon, now it's $4.00. Has anybody had discussions about how
that change in the price of a gallon of gas has impacted either the data that you have
collected or the conclusions you have or will draw from the work that you've done?
Ms. Wolf — Yeah, well it's gone up since we went to press, I think ... It's a bit of a moving
target isn't it. We certainly had discussions about that. I think it's acknowledged in here
in a general way. Did we quantify that? No.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 19
Board Member Wilcox — I understand it's not on the scoping document, I understand
that.
Ms. Wolf — I don't know if you want to address that Bill.
Bill Wendt, Cornell Transportation Director
Fred raises a good point, and I think as you read through the document and its TIMS
you will see that we're proposing to do an annual update, a report, that will update the
Planning Board on a regular basis as to the population and how it exists at Cornell and
as to the participation levels. So for instance, Countywide right now, the TCAT Board
heard this week that ridership is up 3 %. That seems small, but we have a big
percentage of ridership now, and that's pretty much the idea, to keep you informed over
the next decade on a year4o -year basis where we can take a point in time and report to
you have different it is and what kind of progress is being made. Because the price of
gas is certainly going to have an impact.
Ms. Wolf — Okay. So those were the only diagrams that I was going to point out to you
and I am happy to go through that again in the future if you'd like.
I think the other thing that we did ... moving on on the talking points then to letter D, we
did want to remind you that we had extensive public input. Of course that is above and
beyond the public hearings that we will have as part of the SEQR process and the focus
of that input was on neighborhood livability. I think we can say very confidently that that
input very much influenced and is reflected in the document in terms of identifying
deficiencies in the transportation system. Identifying problems in neighborhoods
Suggestions that were made for mitigations. I think all of that has very much been
intergraded into the TGEIS and I think it reflects a lot of sentiment in the community in
terms of a lot of the sections in the TGEIS. There were, in terms of sort of formally
organized public forums ... we had 7 of them. Four were public open houses specifically
focused on neighborhood livability and there were two in the Spring of '06 and two in '07
and my goodness, now it's '08. Those were sponsored by the University Neighborhood
Council and the Ithaca Neighborhood Council and there was extensive outreach to get
people to those workshops. I'm not going to go through all the detail, but the first one
was really to listen to their concerns and the second one was really to get comments
and feedback on preliminary proposals. We also had one public open house focused
specifically on bike and pedestrian issues, and we had two public forums with the
Disabilities Advisory Council. Those were held at City of Ithaca Common Council
Chambers and we had pretty extensive outreach to the disability community, the larger
disability community.
There was also a TGEIS website where people could comment, and all of the
comments that we received at these public forums, both in written or comments in terms
of making comments on maps that we had there, these are all in the Appendix B so
every single comment that was made, was recorded and those are all there.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 20
Board Member Riha — I had another question ... so, in the TGEIS website, because I
haven't gone to it. ..Is this information available? I'm thinking ahead in terms of our own
public hearings, how are people going to...
Ms. Wolf — Good question. At this point in time,. the TGEIS is not there at this point in
time. At this point in time it's really a Planning Board undertaking. Jonathan did pose
the question to me, you know, would we want to put it on the website for the public, to
make it available to the public. I think that's probably you're call. Certainly at the time
it's released for public comment, it will definitely be put on the website. That will be
done for sure, and then usually we, usually it's put at the Public Library, we put it usually
at all the libraries at Cornell University and there may be other locations...) don't know...
maybe the TCAT office ... I think we will identify other locations and then those will be
advertised, that these are locations where you can go to look at a hard copy, and it will
definitely be on the website then.
Board Member Riha — Because I would think that a lot of people who have attended
these previous meetings will want to see what you came up with and comment on that.
Ms. Wolf — Absolutely.
Board Member Riha — Especially for their neighborhood. It's going to be a huge file...
We'll need a pretty reasonable way that people can access what some of these plans
are when they want to see what's being proposed for their neighborhood.
Ms. Wolf — I think they are trying to identify any places that are convenient as possible
and probably, you know, Public Library ... more than one copy...
Ms. Marchesseault — I just want to interject that the maps that we put together and most
of the information that we put together for the workshops was posted to the website.
So, after the first workshop that was posted to the website and then a year later, what
we synthesized and what we saw as potential mitigations, we put those graphically on
maps, and those were posted to the website. So that information has already been
made available and it's just the TGEIS that's not, the formal TGEIS that's not up yet.
Board Member Riha — But especially having those maps seems like it would be, the
public would really like to see them, I bet.
Board Member Wilcox — We have the benefit of having just gone through an
Environmental Impact Statement process so we understand that we have to review for
adequacy and assuming that it is adequate, i.e addresses in some way the items that
were in the Scoping Document, it can be released to the public, or that is often when it
is released to the public for their review and comment.
Board Member Riha — Okay.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 21
Mr. Kanter — We actually have a couple of extra copies at Town Hall and the office that
people are certainly welcome to come in and look at at any time. It's there for the public
to see, it's just that not having been accepted by the Board yet, it certainly could
change.
Board Member Riha — Right.
Ms. Wolf — Then, in addition to the fairly extensive public forums that we organized,
letter E, there was other public outreach. Again, I talked about the ITCTC, that's our
local, regional transportation planning organization and we made numerous
presentations to the Planning Committee, different components of the ITCTC and then
we had many requests, .the Tompkins County Advisory Board...there were many other
bodies that requested presentations, informational presentations, and we always
provided those, and again, Appendix C has a list of all of the meetings that we had and
where we presented this project.
A little bit different than letter F we are calling Coordination Efforts. These were really
sort of almost partners in a way. We coordinated very closely with the Cornell Master
Plan, many people on the Cornell Staff were involved in both projects and we met
repeatedly with the consultants of the Master Plan and we would talk about mitigations
that we thought would be beneficial and then many of those were carried forward as
proposals as part of Master Plan. So we were very much working to, toward common
goals.
TCAT, similarly, the comments Bill was just making, transit is a very important
component of this so we worked very closely with TCAT all the way through the
process, from information gathering and sharing. All of our findings were shared with
them before they were carried forward with other groups because it was something that
as very beneficial to them and we had multiple coordination meetings with their staff and
presentations to TCAT.
Board Member Conneman — I wanted to go back to the Mast Plan. I only got up to
about 250, but it seems to me that the Mater Plan and TGEIS should be inter- related,
but I think there is a definition in here of Cornell Campus as being the Campus where a
lot of things that are going on, unless you are counting what they call East Village as
part of the Campus, has that really been taken into account? I didn't see this anyplace,
if you really do something with East Village or whatever you want to call it...You built an
office building out there, all this kind of stuff. .seems to me ... so far that hasn't been
mentioned. if it's mentioned someplace, tell me where so I can read it.
Ms. Wolf Well, the TGEIS did not ... I need to remind you...the TGEIS is not dealing
with specific project proposals. We're dealing with population growth, and we don't
know the timeline of when something like the proposal for the East Village will actually
be implemented and in fact, we would expect that the build -out of that would occur not
within the next 10 years. Right. This is ... the TGEIS is a 10 -year horizon. That was
our, the time period that we were looking at. We were looking at population growth at
PB 6.3.08
Pg, 22
Cornell over the next 10 years. The Master Plan is really looking at a 30 -60 year time
horizon, okay, so, now, having said that, I can tell you that the high growth scenario, so
the high population projected as part of the TGEIS, exceeds population growth
anticipated as part of the Master Plan. So, the growth anticipated as part of this
Generic Environmental Impact Statement should address growth that could occur within
the next 10 years as a result of the Master Plan. But we did not examine specific
projects. Those, anything that, any specific project that is undertaken will have to come
before this Board as a specific site plan application and you'll have to under go your
own specific SEQR review of that and then you can use this as a resource to
understand it in the big picture and the broad context.
Board Member Conneman — I understand that, but it still seems to me that there is a
relationship.. 'we 0 re not talking about any specific project, we're talking about a series of
projects that are out there in one area. It would seem to have a terrific impact on
transportation and everything else.
Ms. Wolf — Well certainly when we looked at the growth, the population growth, we had
to think about where are those cars headed to and coming from ... where are they going
to ... so where is this commuting population going to and from ... and so, we had to
speculate, we had to look at the Cornell Campus and we had to speculate where most
of these cars likely go to and from over the next 10 years and so, certainly that was in
our mind that it's being, that growth is being anticipated at East Hill Plaza, and so there
was...l think in terms of thinking about the origin and destination, that was weighted
somewhat more heavily to reflect that.
Board Member Conneman — Well I am still puzzled but we can pursue that some other
night.
Ms. Wolf — I guess then, just finally here, the Resource Committee and I think I have
already touched on this, we did work, throughout this process, although most intensively
on the front end of this process, with this Resource Committee which included
representatives from DOT, the ITCTC, City of Ithaca, Village of Lansing, Town of
Dryden and other surrounding municipalities and that was a great resource for bringing
to us information on projects that are contemplated and issues and concerns of
surrounding municipalities and really providing input on what they thought were
important components of the study. They brought raw data, they shared information,
and so they were sort of sounding board and provided some technical guidance. So
that information as well is summarized in Appendix D.
So, I think that's really what I had prepared in terms of providing a bit of an over view. I
know there's a lot of information here and it's probably a little overwhelming, but again, I
would be happy to take questions.
Chairperson Howe — Are we, June 17 th, is this tentatively on the agenda?
PB 6.3.08
Pg, 23
Mr. Kanter — Tentatively on the Planning Board Agenda I think now until forever..]
guess one ,question we do want to talk about we think whether at that point we think it
would be valuable to have the transportation consultants come and be available to
answer questions. It may be too soon, but..
Chairperson Howe — One of the things that I know I will have to be walked through a
little bit more is the levels of service. There's lots of information here and of course, I
live in Forest Home so I picked up a couple of things and... I was sort of surprised at
some of the levels of service in terms of being better than I experience in Forest Home.
Is that really true? So there might be other things like that where we would want to dig
in or sort of have a little more complete presentation. So I don't know, if you have some
ideas where you feel....
Ms. Wolf — Rod, if I could point out one thing, and just a little reminder too
that... obviously you have to be able to understand the information, but we need to
remember that at this point, we're not debating the level of service, that's a more
substantive... after we've determined adequacy, and the charge at this point is have we
done everything that the Scoping Document says we do.
Board Member Riha — Right. So for that questions, it doesn't seem like we need the
transportation planners.
Chairperson Howe — Yeah, I don't, I mean, I'm not feeling that you...because they're
from ... You'd have to bring them in from...
Ms. Wolf — Norht Carolina. They are going to be up here that week so it's a reasonable
thing to do, but again, it's...
Board Member Riha — But for the Transportation Planners... we'd be asking them more,
I would think, how they approached this. What was their kind of driving principals when
they were thinking...
Board Member Wilcox — Well we can ask Katherine that too. I'm sure she knows the
answers to that as well.
Board Member Riha — What do you think they could tell us Katherine, that we might not
be able to get from you all?
Ms. Wolf — I have to agree in general, I do think for adequacy, it may not be necessary.
Again, we're happy to provide that, if you would like that...
Board Member Wilcox — If they're in Town, we should have them here ... I'd love to have
them here just in case...
Chairperson Howe — Sure...
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 24
Mr. Kanter — At this point, just as Katherine has been running you through the content
and format and how and where to find things in the document, it might be helpful to just
hear the transportation consultants' description of what they did and how they did it and
if there are questions about methodology, that may have something to do with
adequacy because the Scope does talk about how things are supposed to be done. So
it might be helpful, if they are going to be here anyway, it might be nice...
Chairperson Howe — I agree. If they're going to be here anyway...
Board Member Riha — If they were here, could we ask them questions outside of just
addressing adequacy? Because I guess one of the things that would interest me, if
they're professional transportation planners, how they think our transportation issues
compare to maybe, and how we're trying to address them, compare to other similar
communities. But that's not really scoping...
Mr. Kanter --. No I think we certainly could use their expertise for providing a good
framework for what we're looking at, so if things like that sound certainly like a good
idea.
Ms. Wolf — I think you can ask them anything. I guess I would, you know, obviously
you'll want to, there will be other opportunities in the future, so you shouldn't feel that
you need to ask them every question, but I would certainly expect that when we get into
the substantive review they will definitely be here.
Mr. Kanter — Just, again, looking ahead at what we have on June 17th, there are a few
other items so I don't think we want to spend more than 40 -45 minutes on the TGEIS at
that meeting. So that might help you figure out....
Chairperson Howe — I forget, I think you passed out a timeline at some point...
Ms. Wolf — yes, and according to that timeline, I believe we are showing that the next
two Planning Board meetings would be working sessions. So June 17th and then I think
it's July 1st and then we've suggested on that timeline, that July 15th be that you would
determine adequacy. So that would be two working sessions if we follow that timeline.
Then...right.
Chairperson Howe — and I like the fact that we're breaking it up, because it's a lot to
absorb.
Board Member Conneman — Want to feel good about yourself Katherine, be sure to look
at page 436 which is Chapter 6 which says "there are no unavoidable adverse impacts
from the proposed action." That is a perfect world is what that means. And if that's
even part of the English language. Not even Alan Greenspan can do that.
Chairperson Howe — Any other questions we want to ask at this point...
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 25
Board Member Wilcox — I might nitpick around the edges, but I'm impressed with the
presentations over the past couple years ... this is not a shot, I have just started looking
at it and there is such a wealth of material, and maps, and charts, and I ma truly
impressed with the amount of work that went into it. I can understand why it took so
long to do it. You have given us your schedule on how you would like us to proceed,
but we have a lot of work to do.
Ms. Wolf — We understand that.
Board Member Riha — In the past, Susan Brock, (inaudible) with the scoping, you know,
looking over the scope but this seems huge. Are you going to review all...
Ms. Brock — Yes.
Mr. Kanter — And to a large degree Susan and I have been, for the last, almost the last
year...this was actually in an earlier draft form which Susan and I and a few other
people have been constantly working on.
Board Member Riha — So Susan will give us her take on this on maybe the July 17th...
Board Member Erb — Actually, if you're talking about when she says did we actually
cover this, we need that sooner than the July...
Chairperson Howe — And some of that should fall on our shoulders too..
Board Member Erb — Of course...
Board Member Riha — But Susan looks at it from a slightly different perspective, more
than slightly...
Chairperson Howe — So you'll be sure to let us know if there are areas that...
Board Member Riha — That we should be looking at.
Ms. Brock — Do you have any serious doubts about that?
Board Member Riha — I'm just saying it might be good to have some guidance if there
are areas that you think we should particularly look at given how huge it is. If you think
there are some areas that you think we should focus on.
Ms. Brock — Well, the problem is it all builds, every chapter builds on, is built based on
the information in the previous chapter. So it's really hard to say, "just focus on this."
But, I think if you just sit down and really start looking at it, it won't be as daunting as
you think it is. Ask George...
Board Member Conneman — It really isn't...
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 26
Board Member Riha — I'm having a fun time looking through it, but what I haven't done
is go back and look at all the scoping things and
Board Member Conneman — If you make your comments on what you think isn't there,
or may have been considered in maybe some other place, that's how I did it...
Ms. Wolf — You got through the whole thing George?
Board Member Conneman — No, no, no, no, I got to page 250. 1 have some questions
about elaborating on some of the things you said. For example, one example would be
"bicycle education ", I don't know what that means. I have my own view of how impact
bicycles are going to have and what education means.
Ms. Wolf — Well you might find that when you get to the mitigation section, there's more
detail...
Board Member Conneman — Well it still didn't tell me what was going to be in the
course ... this is how you pedal, instead, this is how you obey the rules of the road, that's
a different thing. I've certainly said this many times before.
Board Member Riha — I guess my concern, getting back to the adequacy decision, since
the scoping document is 17 pages long ... it could take us a lot of time to go through
page by page....
Ms. Brock — I'll do that. I don't mean to say that you shouldn't do it, but just so you
know, I will be doing that.
Mr. Kanter - We all should do it and we will all do it, Staff will do it, Board Members will
do it...
Chairperson Howe - There, we all have an assignment...
Board Member Riha — Maybe we should split up the pages...
Ms. Wolf — Okay, so what I understand is that....
Board Member Wilcox — Where's the Cliff Notes....
Chairperson Howe — Hold on, we're almost done and we have to move on to another...
Ms. Wolf — So my understanding is that we should have the transportation planners
here next time and that they should be prepared to give a brief, maybe 20 minute or so,
overview of what they did, and then ... and knowing that they are going to be here,
maybe you could focus your questions to that a little bit more.
Chairperson Howe — Did everyone follow that? Okay. Thank you very much.
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 27
Chairperson Howe announces the next agenda item.
SEAR Determination for the modification of the Final Subdivision Approval of
Ithaca Estates Phase II East King Road.
The Board moves into executive session to discuss the proposed acquisition of real
property where discussions might affect the value of the property.
ADOPTED RESOLUTION PB RESOLUTION NO. 2008 - 050
Move to Executive Session
Planning Board
June 3, 2008
Motion made by George Conneman, seconded by Susan Riha.
Be it resolved that the Town of Ithaca Planning Board go into Executive Session at
8:20 p.m, to discuss the proposed acquisition of real property where discussions might
affect the value of the property.
A vote on the motion was as follows:
Ayes: Howe, Conneman, Thayer, Riha, Erb and Wilcox
Nays: None
Absent: Hoffmann and Talty
The motion passed unanimously.
The Board returns to regular session.
ADOPTED RESOLUTION
PB RESOLUTION NO. 2008 - 051
Return to Regular Session
Planning Board
June 3, 2008
Motion made by Hollis Erb, seconded by Susan Riha.
Be it resolved that the Town of Ithaca Planning Board return to regular session at 8:38
p. M.
A vote on the motion was as follows:
Ayes: Howe, Conneman, Thayer, Riha, Erb and Wilcox
Nays: None
Absent: Hoffmann and Talty
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 28
The motion passed unanimously.
Return to: SEQR Determination for the modification of the Final Subdivision Approval of
Ithaca Estates Phase II East King Road.
Anyone have any questions about this SEQR proposal? There isn't any discussion,
would somebody like to move the resolution... moved by Susan, seconded by Hollis.
Any discussion? Any changes? Does anyone see any changes that need to happen to
the Short Environmental Assessment Form?
Board Member Wilcox — I think Jon Kanter knows how to fill one out, ..everyone laughs).
Board Member Erb — Well, there is now a functioning hotel and stuff on the corner...
Chairperson Howe — Do you want to add commercial...
Mr. Kanter — I purposely left it off so you could change it.
Board Member Erb — Thank you, I feel so useful now.. .
Chairperson Howe — All those in favor, ..it's unanimous.
ADOPTED RESOLUTION: PB RESOLUTION No. 2008 - 052
SEQR: Modification of Final Subdivision Approval,
Ithaca Estates Subdivision Phase II
East King Road
(With Particular Reference to Tax Parcel No. 43 =1 -3.21)
Planning Board, June 3, 2008
Motion made by Susan Riha, seconded by Hollis Erb,
WHEREAS:
1. This action is consideration of Modification of Final Subdivision Approval for the
Ithaca Estates - Phase II Subdivision, approved by the Town of Ithaca Planning
Board on December 1, 1987, located off East King Road, and in particular with
respect to Tax Parcel No, 43 =1 -3.21, Low Density Residential Zone, adjacent to
the Montessori School. Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21 consists of 1.76 +/= acres, and
was intended as part of the original subdivision to be conveyed to the Town of
Ithaca as a proposed park. This conveyance has not occurred. The proposed
modification is to have the parcel conveyed to the Town as general purpose land,
rather than as a park. Evan N. Monkemeyer, Owner; Town of Ithaca Planning
Board, Applicant; and
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 29
2. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board is acting
as Lead Agency in environmental review with respect to this Modification of
Subdivision Approval, and .
3. The Planning Board on June 3, 2008, has reviewed and accepted as adequate a
Short Environmental Assessment Form Part I and Part II prepared by the Town
Planning staff and other application materials, and
40 The Town Planning staff has recommended a negative determination of
environmental significance with respect to the proposed Modification of
Subdivision Approval;
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED:
That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby makes a negative determination
of environmental significance for the reasons set forth in the Environmental Assessment
Form Part II referenced above, in accordance with the New York State Environmental
Quality Review Act for the above referenced action as proposed, and, therefore, an
Environmental Impact Statement will not be required.
A vote on the motion was as follows:
Ayes: Howe, Conneman, Thayer, Riha, Erb and Wilcox
Nays: None
Absent: Hoffmann and Talty
The motion passed unanimously.
Chairperson Howe — And now we'll move to the public hearing at 8:41 p.m.:
Ms. Brock — Rod, I think it would be useful, for the record, just to state what the action
is. If you want, you can read the resolution or something like that, but I think we should
do that.
Chairperson Howe — Yeah, because we just put the agenda out there, it doesn't go into
full detail ... So I'll read the first paragraph of the proposed resolution:
This action is consideration of Modification of Final Subdivision Approval for the Ithaca
Estates - Phase 11 Subdivision, approved by the Town of Ithaca Planning Board on
December 1, 1987, located off East King Road, and in particular with respect to Tax
Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21, Low Density Residential Zone, adjacent to the Montessori School.
Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21 consists of 1.76 +/- acres, and was intended as part of the
original subdivision to be conveyed to the Town of Ithaca as a proposed park. This
conveyance has not occurred. The proposed modification is to have the parcel
conveyed to the Town as general purpose land, rather than as a park.
PB 6.3.08
Pg, 30
That's the modification that we are voting on. Do we, are there any members of the
public who would like to address the Board this evening?
Andrea Riddle, Montessorri School
What is "general purpose land "?
Ms. Brock — It's land that's not park land.
Mr. Kanter— It's not restricted, basically.
Ms. Brock — Which is a phrase that John Barney, previous Attorney for the Town, 1 had
this discussion with Jonathan Kanter also, and apparently, this is a phrase the Planning
Board has used in other resolutions over the years to refer to land that's not restricted
as park land.
Ms. Riddle — What does the Town normally use "general purpose land" for'?
Ms. Brock — It can be anything, within its purposes to use the land for.
Board Member Wilcox — They could store equipment on it, they could declare it as
excess property and sell it possibly...
Chairperson Howe — Other questions, comments?
Ms. Riddle — I guess that's all I need to know at this point, thank you.
Chairperson Howe — Anyone else who would like to address us, ,we'll close the public
hearing at 8:24p.m. Any additional discussion? Would somebody like to move...
Board Member Wilcox — so moved.
Chairperson Howe ....Fred... seconded by Larry. Are there changes? All those in
favor...
Board Member Wilcox - I'm sorry, when is the Town Board going to take this up?
Ms. Brock — Well, it's possible that it will take it up at its meeting Monday, but more
likely it will be July.
Chairperson Howe — All those in favor .... it's unanimous.
P8 6.3.08
Pg, 31
ADOPTED RESOLUTION: PB RESOLUTION NO. 2008 - 053
Modification of Final Subdivision Approval,
Ithaca Estates Subdivision — Phase II
East King Road
(With Particular Reference to Tax Parcel No. 43 =1 -3.21)
Planning Board, June 3, 2008
Motion made by Fred Wilcox, seconded by Larry Thayer.
WHEREAS.
1. This action is consideration of Modification of Final Subdivision Approval for the
Ithaca Estates - Phase II Subdivision, approved by the Town of Ithaca Planning
Board on December 1, 1987, located off East King Road, and in particular with
respect to Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21, Low Density Residential Zone, adjacent to
the Montessori School. Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21 consists of 1.76 +/= acres, and
was intended as part of the original subdivision to be conveyed to the Town of
Ithaca as a proposed park. This conveyance has not occurred. The proposed
modification is to have the parcel conveyed to the Town as general purpose land,
rather than as a park. Evan N. Monkemeyer, Owner; Town of Ithaca Planning
Board, Applicant; and
2. For various reasons, Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21 has not been conveyed to the
Town, and the Town of Ithaca has been working with the owner of that parcel to
find a better location for a park to serve South Hill residents, and
3. In 1997, both the Town of Ithaca Planning Board and Town Board adopted
resolutions finding that Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21 would be better suited for future
uses other than as a Town park, and
4. The owner of Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21 has indicated that he is willing to convey
that parcel to the Town as general purpose land without restricting it to park
purposes, and
5. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board, acting as
lead agency in environmental review with respect to Modification of Subdivision
Approval, has on June 3, 2008, made a negative determination of environmental
significance, after having reviewed and accepted as adequate a Short
Environmental Assessment Form Part I and Part II prepared by the Town
Planning staff, and
6. The Planning Board, at a Public Hearing held on June 3, 2008, has reviewed
materials pertaining to this action, and has discussed the matter,
PB 6.3.08
Pg. 32
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED:
1. That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby confirms that Tax Parcel No. 43-
1 -3.21 would be better suited for future uses other than as a Town park, because
of its location, limited access and environmental characteristics, and
2. That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby modifies the Final Subdivision
Approval for the Ithaca Estates — Phase II Subdivision dated December 1, 1987,
to require that Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21, consisting of 1.76 +/- acres, be
conveyed to the Town of Ithaca as general purpose land, rather than as a park,
subject to the following conditions:
a. Acceptance by the Town Board of the conveyance of Tax Parcel No. 43 -1-
3.21 to the Town of Ithaca as general purpose land rather as a proposed
park, and
b. Submission to the Attorney for the Town of the deed conveying Tax Parcel
No. 43 -1 -3.21 to the Town of Ithaca along with other necessary
documents to complete said conveyance, with such documents subject to
review and approval of the Attorney for the Town.
A vote on the motion was as follows:
Ayes: Howe, Conneman, Thayer, Riha, Erb and Wilcox
Nays: None
Absent: Hoffmann and Talty
The motion passed unanimously.
Other Business
Comprehensive Plan Committee report.
Code & Ordinances report.
Planning Committee report.
Next Agenda
Susan Riha and Fred Wilcox will not be at the next meeting.
Upon motion, the meeting adjourned at 9:03 p.m.
Deputy Town Clerk
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
215 North Tioga Street
Ithaca, New York 14850
Tuesday, June 3, 2008
AGENDA
7:00 P.M. Persons to be heard (no more than five minutes).
7:05 P.M. SEQR Determination: Cornell University Pomology Building Addition, 128 Crisp Apple Drive.
7:05 P.M. PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the proposed
addition to the Comell University Pomology Cold Storage Building located at the 128 Crisp Apple
Drive (Cornell University Orchards off Dryden Road), Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 63 -1 -11,
Planned Development Zone No. 9. The project involves constructing a 2,700 +/- square foot addition
on the south side of the existing 11,800 +/- square foot Pomology Cold Storage Building to house an
enology teaching lab and cider press. Cornell University, Owner /Applicant; Steven F. Moolin, R.A.,
Beardsley Design Associates, Agent.
7:20 P.M. Discussion and orientation regarding the draft Cornell Transportation- focused Generic Environmental
Impact Statement (T- GEIS).
8:00 P.M. Executive Session to discuss the proposed acquisition of real property.
8:15 P.M. SEQR Determination: Modification of Final Subdivision Approval, Ithaca Estates — Phase II, East
King Road.
8:15 P.M. PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Modification of Final Subdivision Approval for the Ithaca
Estates - Phase II Subdivision, approved by the Town of Ithaca Planning Board on December 1, 19872
located off East King Road, and in particular with respect to Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21, Low Density
Residential Zone, adjacent to the Montessori School. Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21 consists of 1.76 +/-
acres, and was intended as part of the original subdivision to be conveyed to the Town of Ithaca as a
proposed park. This conveyance has not occurred. The proposed modification is to have the parcel
conveyed to the Town as general purpose land, rather than as a park. Evan N. Monkemeyer, Owner;
Town of Ithaca Planning Board, Applicant,
8. Approval of Minutes: May 20, 2008.
9. Other Business:
10, Adjournment.
Jonathan Kanter, AICP
Director of Planning
273 -1747
NOTE: IF ANY MEMBER OF THE PLANNING BOARD IS UNABLE TO ATTEND, PLEASE NOTIFY
SANDY POLCE AT 273 -1747.
(A quorum of four (4) members is necessary to conduct Planning Board business.)
TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING
Tuesday, June 3, 2008
By direction of the Chairperson of the Planning Board, NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN that Public Hearings will
be held by the Planning Board of the Town of Ithaca on Tuesday, June 3, 2008, at 215 North Tioga Street,
Ithaca, N.Y., at the following times and on the following matters:
7:05 P.M. Consideration of Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the proposed addition to the
Cornell University Pomology Cold Storage Building located at the 128 Crisp Apple Drive
(Cornell University Orchards off Dryden Road), Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 63 -1 -11,
Planned Development Zone No. 9. The project involves constructing a 2,700 +/- square foot
addition on the south side of the existing 11,800 +/- square foot Pomology Cold Storage
Building to house an enology teaching lab and cider press. Cornell University,
Owner /Applicant; Steven F. Moolin, R.A., Beardsley Design Associates, Agent.
8:15 P.M. Consideration of Modification of Final Subdivision Approval for the Ithaca Estates - Phase
H Subdivision, approved by the Town of Ithaca Planning Board on December 1, 1987,
located off East King Road, and in particular with respect to Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21, Low
Density Residential Zone, adjacent to the Montessori School. Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -3.21
consists of 1.76 +/- acres, and was intended as part of the original subdivision to be
conveyed to the Town of Ithaca as a proposed park. This conveyance has not occurred. The
proposed modification is to have the parcel conveyed to the Town as general purpose land,
rather than as a park. Evan N. Monkemeyer, Owner; Town of Ithaca Planning Board,
Applicant.
Said Planning Board will at said time and said place hear all persons in support of such matter or objections
thereto. Persons may appear by agent or in person. Individuals with visual impairments, hearing impairments or
other special needs, will be provided with assistance as necessary, upon request. Persons desiring assistance must
make such a request not less than 48 hours prior to the time of the public hearing.
Jonathan Kanter, AICP
Director of Planning
273 -1747
Dated: Friday, May 23, 2008
Publish: Wednesday, May 28, 2008
Wednesday; May 28 „2008 J'THE ITHACA JOURNAL`:
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Jonotbim' kdnter, AICP
Director of'Planning
I ;2731747,
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Mdy 23; 200
Publish Wednesday,
Town of Ithaca
Planning Board
215 North Tioga Street
June 3, 2008
7:00 p.m.
PLEASE SIGN -IN
Please Print Clearly, Thank You
Name
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TOWN OF ITHACA
AFFIDAVIT OF POSTING AND PUBLICATION
I, Sandra Polce, being duly sworn, depose and say that I am a Senior Typist for the Town of
Ithaca, Tompkins County, New York; that the following Notice has been duly posted on the sign
board of the Town of Ithaca and that said Notice has been duly published in the local newspaper,
The Ithaca Journal,
MATH
7:00 P.M., as per attached.
Location of Sign Board used for Posting: Town Clerk Sign Board — 215 North Tio a Street.
Date of Posting:
Date of Publication:
May 23, 2008
May 28, 2008
Sandra Polce, Senior Typist
Town of Ithaca
STATE OF NEW YORK) SS:
COUNTY OF TOMPKINS)
Sworn to and subscribed before me this 281h day of May 2008,
Notary Public
CONNIE F. CLARK
Notary Public, State of New York
No. 01 CL6052878
Qualified in Tompkins County
Commission Expires December 26, 20 10