No preview available
HomeMy WebLinkAboutPB Minutes 2007-09-18FILE DATE REGULAR MEETING TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 18, 2007 215 NORTH TIOGA STREET, ITHACA NY 14850 7:00 p.m. PRESENT Chairperson: Fred Wilcox Board Members: Eva Hoffmann, George Conneman, Rod Howe, Larry Thayer, Kevin Talty and Susan Riha, Alternate Board Member: Hollis Erb, STAFF: Jonathan Kanter, Director of Planning; Dan Walker, Town Engineer (7:25); Mike Smith, Environmental Planner (7:30); Susan Brock, Attorney for the Town; Paulette Neilsen, Deputy Town Clerk. OTHERS PRESENT: Kathryn Trowbridge, Trowbridge & Wolf George Breuhaus, Architect with Ithaco, 950 Danby Road, Suite 220 Robert Nead, Ithaca, 950 Danby Road Bill Palladino, 295 Main Street, Buffalo, NY John Confer, 651 Hammond Hill Road, Brooktondale Rich Couture, 104 West Danby Road Scott Abbett, 1088 Monroe Avenue, Rochester, NY Rich DePaulo, 126 Northview Road Ross Hathoway, 178 Lexington Drive Chris Shapiro, 601 East State Street Jim Bruno, 153 East King Road David Herrick, TG Miller Engineers and Surveyors CALL TO ORDER Chairperson Wilcox declares the meeting duly opened at 7:05 p.m., and accepts for the record Secretary's Affidavit of Posting and Publication of the Notice of Public Hearings in Town Hall and the Ithaca Journal September 10, 2007 and September 12, 2007 together with the properties under discussion, as appropriate, upon the Clerks of the City of Ithaca and the Town of Danby, upon the Tompkins County Commissioner of Planning, upon the Tompkins County Commissioner of Public Works, and upon the applicants and /or agents, as appropriate, on September 12, 2007, Chairperson Wilcox states the Fire Exit Regulations to those assembled, as required by the New York State Department of State, Office of Fire Prevention and Control. PERSONS TO BE HEARD There was no one wishing to address the Board at this time. Chairperson Wilcox announced the next agenda item at 7:07 pm. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 2 PRESENTATION AND UPDATE regarding the Cornell Transportation- focused Generic Environmental Impact Statement (T- GEIS). Kathryn Wolf, Trowbridge & Wolf, LLP, Presenter. Ms. Wolf — Thank you. I am here representing Cornell University. Our firm is the lead consultant on the Transportation- Focused Generic Environmental Impact Statement and I just wanted to give you, really, just a little update on where we are on the process and how things are progressing and when you can expect to see the document. Because we are ... it is a little later than we had hoped to submit it, but, I think .there's, we've been getting a lot of input from a lot of different groups and I think ultimately it's going to be a better document for it/ We have been spending the summer really writing the draft document. We do have a first draft that has been completed and that has been circulated to a pretty broad group, for review and comment, including some members of both the .Town Planning Staff as well as the City Planning Staff as well as some other transportation planners in the community. And we've got a lot of good comments back. We're working now to try and respond to those and kind of fill in the gaps. So, in addition, you may recall that at the outset of this project, we undertook a fairly extensive web -based survey of all Cornell faculty, staff, and students and we had a pretty phenomenal response rate to that web - based survey. Forty -six percent responded, only 25% was required for it to be statistically significant. So that survey provided a lot of very good information and direction for the development of a lot of the proposals. Again, the focus of the mitigations is getting people out of their cars and so the focus is really on developing programs and incentives that would get Cornell commuters into other forms of travel and so the survey was very informative in terms of what would be required to get people to do that. So now that we've developed a set of proposed programs and incentives, many of them are very much at the concept level; but, now that we've developed this set of programs, we felt that it was important to take this now to the Cornell Community, who will be asked to really participate in these programs. So for the next 4 -6 weeks, we have a whole series of meeting set up internally at Cornell with faculty, staff and students to really talk to them about the program ... the mitigations that are.,. have sort of floated to the surface, if you will, as a part of this project, and we felt that that was really important, to get their input. You know, if we hear ... if some red flags go up or we hear from them that maybe we're off base in certain areas, we may have to go back and sort of modify our approach to certain things, but the hope is that we've really got them behind us when we bring the document to you for your adequacy review. And we want to sort of air the dirty laundry, or whatever, there first, so that that's not happening during ... that we have ironed those issues out as much as we can first. So, that's happening while we complete the document over the next 4 -6 weeks, so, think really we're looking at approximately late October early November for actually submitting the document to you for adequacy review. So that's really where we're at, I will just mention, I think I pointed this out earlier this summer when I shared some of our analysis with you ... You'll recall that we're looking at 4 different growth scenarios. The first is what we call "no Cornell growth" but assuming that other traffic in the area does continue to grow. So that's sort of the base line and then there is sort of a low -, medium- and high - growth scenario for Cornell population. The analysis ... the good news is that the analysis tells us that we believe we can mitigate both the low growth PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 3 and medium growth scenarios completely through getting people out of their vehicles. Again, we're talking about transportation impacts so, by getting people out of their vehicles and into these other programs, we would hope that we would not see declines in level of services, because those cars would not be added to the traffic stream. So the analysis tells us that we believe that we can mitigate fully through alternatives, the .low - growth and medium - growth scenario and partially the high growth scenario. It's also true that Cornell doesn't really expect that the high growth scenario would ever happen, so, it appears that we should be able to fully mitigate in what they reasonably expect any growth that would occur in the next 10 years which is the timeframe that we're looking at. And of course all the details of this will be spelt out in the document when you receive it. I think, I guess just maybe one of the other things that has really floated to the surface as ... oh, I guess just a couple of things ... So, we're really working now on developing a very detailed list of specific improvements related to things like bike and pedestrian improvements for example, transit, park- and -ride, vanpools and I think, those of course will be of great interest t all of you to see which projects have really been identified as priorities for implementing in the next 10 years. Many of these projects will be things that have already been proposed as part of your transportation plan, for example, or you know by other bodies, but ... there was a sort of a synthesis using our professional judgment, what we heard fro the community and what the analysis showed us to really come up with a list of projects, really, that we would identify as priorities for the next 10 years. In addition, the park- and -ride has really emerged as being one of the key strategies. The belief is that if we can establish park- and -ride lots around the perimeter of the urban core, and if people are utilizing the park- and -ride lots, not only Cornell commuters, but these would be open to anybody in the Ithaca community, to utilize the park- and -ride lots and then having bus service that would be express, service to downtown and the campus, that is one of the primary strategies in making this effective. And I think at this point, I will just leave it at that and I am happy to entertain any questions. Board Member Howe — Kathryn, what's the ... is there any dialog with the Master Plan that's also sort of unfolding. Ms. Wolf — Actually that's a good question, I should have addressed that. Yes, we are ... we meet with a Master Plan Team most of the times when they're here in Town. We regularly make a point to have our transportation planners, we of course have a transportation planning group on our team, so we make a point to have them here in town, our transportation planners for the TGEIS at the same time the master plan team are in town and we meet on a regular basis to talk about what they're finding, what we're finding, and you know, ask them if they can investigate things further or if they could consider certain things. They ask the same of us and so I think we're moving more and more to being very coordinated in our proposals. I think both teams has fundamentally, underlining, similar principles in terms of wanting to promote pedestrian alternate forms of transportation. Wanting sustainable, really wanting a sustainable kind of transportation plan that emphasizes transit and so they would like to see fewer cars PB 4 -18 -07 Pg. 4 on campus, we're dealing with ... so if we can get people to park their cars at park and ride, carpool, vanpool, whatever the strategy is, that's going to mean there are fewer cars on campus and so that helps their campus environment so it really works in tandem. Also, things like land use ... one of the things that's come out of our study is that, you know, some people said if they could live, if there were a greater range of housing options closer to campus, then they could walk, or bike, or you know, use transit, and so the master plan has identified some locations where housing might a developed so I think that really supports that aspect of our plan. So yes, we are very much coordinating and I think, it's actually pretty exciting how they are coming together and compliment each other. Board Member Howe — Just so I'm clear, does the adequacy review...does this document get formally approved when all is said and done? What's the kind of vote that needs to happen, or does it just become kind of a guiding document? Does anyone have to formally vote on it? Or, if there is a decision that it adequately reviews what was set out to be, that's the end gain? = Ms. Brock — Well this will end up being used in a couple of different ways. There will be a set of mitigation strategies that will come out of it... Board Member Howe — Right. .I just didn't know if the document itself had to be voted on at some point? Ms. Brock— The EIS? Board Member Howe — Yeah. Ms. Brock — You don't vote on an EIS, you make findings, and then use those in conjunction with any approvals that you might be making. So, as future projects come forward that are contemplated under this EIS, you know, if the growth from those future projects is within the scope of what was contemplated in this EIS, you would then use the findings that you made to draw conclusions about impacts and.. .the impacts of the project. Board Member Howe — That's what I thought, I just wanted to make sure. Ms. Brock — And other agencies, who have their own approvals, likewise, will use the document to make their own findings and then make their decisions as well. But there may also be mitigation strategies that may be formally adopted, I don't know if by this body or by the Town Board, or perhaps certain strategies by one body and some by another, that might be a statement of activities that should be going forward. We need to see what those strategies are to decide,, Jo determine who would be the ones to make the approvals of them. There may be statements of policy and things like that that the Town Board or Common Council, for example, might be adopting. Mr. Kanter — Yeah, I was just going to add that the action which is being evaluated in the T -GETS is the Transportation Impact Mitigation Strategies or TIMS as Cornell likes PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 5 to call it, they like to abbreviate these things, because when we set out on this process, there had to be .an action identified to be reviewed in the environmental process and that action was, basically, the TIMS or some form of mitigation strategies. Actually, the question i was going to ask Katherine is whether you could maybe, at this point, give us a preview, a little bit, of what TIMS is going to look like or what it is going to be like, or how it will relate to the GEIS because I think that will be something that the Board will be seeing for the first time, as will some of us others who have been involved in the process, but, it might help to just kind of... Ms. Wolf — Well, essentially the TIMS, well, let me back up. The TGEIS includes the whole kitchen sink in terms of mitigation. You know, we considered all kinds of things. Then we said, okay, if we're going to be mitigating this level of growth, in 10 years, what are the projects, or what are the mitigations that would be. ..what are the mitigations that would be most effective at mitigating that growth and which would be the priorities. In 5 years and in 10 years. So, we then, so the TGEIS has the whole kitchen sink, some of which probably would never happen, some of which might not even be good ideas for various reasons, but were considered. So there's a whole kitchen sink of possible mitigations in the TGEIS. Then, based again on community input, input from the resource committee, professional judgment, what the analysis told us, all of that, we've culled from there what we believe are the strategies that should be undertaken in the next 10 years and ... both to mitigate the growth, but also, you know, Cornell is saying, this is the right thing to do and we're committed to a sustainable transportation plan and so the TIMS is essentially, will essentially be the direction for the University's transportation planning for the next 10 years. So, it's really culled those key strategies in all of the primary areas. So for pedestrians, there will be a list of what we believe are the most important things. Some type ... you know.. including sidewalk connections in specific locations, crosswalks, incentive programs... we're talking about, one of the recommendations is for Cornell to look into the possibility of actual cash incentives for anybody who agrees not to bring their car to campus. So if you choose to walk, you choose to bike, you can come and sign up and actually get a cash payout for not. ..So again, it's intended to be very incentive driven as opposed to disincentive. So there are specific incentives that are spelt out and those are part of the Transportation Demand Management Program, the TDM Program at Cornell. There's .infrastructure proposals for. bikes, for peds, for roadways and intersections. Some of.those are also proposed, even thought that isn't the focus of the project, our traffic analysis of existing conditions showed that there are about 10 intersections right now that are performing poorly, and it might be a good idea to go ahead and fix those, you know, regardless of any growth. So, those kinds of things are included as well. So the actual traffic and intersection analysis, where we've identified some existing problems, those have been listed as priority projects, where that seems to make sense. So there are very specific recommendations for sidewalk connections, bikeway connections... One, again, these are all in the draft stage, but just to give you a flavor, you know, one suggest. ..and they are focused on for example, one is extend the East Hill Recreatio so that you'd have that direct connection from the, the Cornell campus, connectivity to Cornell, of course, so i Way from the Town line into Varna of the population of Varna directly to PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 6 So, we really, we looked very, we looked at the whole perimeter of the campus. That was definitely one focus and where are the gaps in connectivity, and where could you be, you know, where are things that can be done easily... they're not all easy by any means, but those are obvious ones ... So how can we increase connectivity for all modes, bikes, peds, and then there's a whole series of specific proposed improvements for transit, some of which are already being progressed, and the TDM programs. Does that answer your question? Alternate Member Erb — I still find myself a little confused. Big surprise....At the time that we hear the report and somehow simple receive the report or accept the report, are we committing to the policy but not to any projects? Are we simply committing to consider the report when future projects come before the Board? What is our actual role? Chairperson Wilcox — Who wants to take it? Mr. Kanter — I think that's largely going to be up to the Town Board, the Planning Board, the City of Ithaca, the County, the State and Cornell and many others, as to what actions each agency or organization are going to determine are going to be appropriate... Chairperson Wilcox — Given their level of oversight of various activities or proposals, etc... Mr. Kanter — I think as we've envisioned it throughout the process, it could range from anything to simply a planning document that anybody can use, which could be endorsed, accepted, adopted, approved, by anybody, to an actual implementation program where different entities could sign on to commitments for doing certain things at certain times if certain thresholds are met, for instance, so, that, you know, I don't think.we're going to know that until we actually significant environmental the document. Ms. Wolf — Also, if I could just make a comment, I think, and again, we're all, this is kind of new so we are all learning ... I could see potentially ... I think the TGEIS itself and the TIMS, each would function somewhat differently. The TGEIS, I think, will be, really sort of a reference for you for reviewing future, when future project proposals come to you, the TGEIS, which has the full analysis, is really, then you can refer to that and look at what the analysis said about that level of population growth and so, that's really a planning tool. The TGEIS is really a planning tool, in a way, and will be of assistance, hopefully, when you review future project proposals, not just even at Cornell, but other projects. So I think of the TGEIS as sort of a planning tool. The TIMS is sort of a ...it's a strategic plan, in a way, for transportation, Cornell's transportation program, but it also includes things that could be done by other bodies. Not everything can be done by Cornell because they don't own all the roads and sidewalks and etc. So that's more of a strategic plan and I think that most things in the strategic plan that are not under Cornell's direct control, would still, when it actually becomes a project, then it's probably going to undergo its own review and discussion at that time. To some degree. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 7 Chairperson Wilcox — And the TGEIS will provide information, presumably, about specific... will help us make determinations about individual projects, is the way I look at it as well. Alternate Member Erb — Much the same way we have used one person's traffic study in the same neighborhood, for somebody else. But, I mean, we've done that... Board Member Hoffmann — Well the TGEIS stands for transportation, in this case, and this is a little different but we do have an area, the area where the orchards are, the Cornell orchards, which has had a Generic Environmental Impact Statement prepared and the way I understand it works, is, it was prepared to look at the generic impact of all kinds of projects that could happen in that area where each one, perhaps, did not have a huge impact but if you put them all together it has a big one. So therefore, it made sense to have a Generic...take a look at it from a generic point of view, and the document then, as I understand it, is used when individual projects come in, first with Staff looking at it and making sure that it, nothing exceeds whatever levels were set as the highest possible noise level and things like that. And I assume this is going to work in a similar way, but with a few extra twists to it. Ms. Wolf — Yeah, I think that's right. Board Member Hoffmann — I had a question actually, about the park and ride system that you're talking about. Have you actually been able to identify areas where park and ride lots could be? Would be? ... In good spots, and are those pieces of land available? Ms. Wolf — Well, there are ... we have identified locations where we ... general locations and more specific and in terms of the second question, are there ... is there land available... the answer to that varies, and sometimes it's not known ... the negotiations haven't taken place. But I can tell you the five locations that have been identified... Somewhere near Ithaca College on 96B, somewhere near Cayuga Medical Center, somewhere near Pyramid Mall, I guess they don't call it Pyramid Mall anymore, do they...Near NYSEG, and then in the southwest shopping area, meaning near Wegman's. So the idea is that sort of captures the primary and all the way around the community and also sort of works well in two directions. If there were park and ride at Wegman's for example, that works well for reducing trips because then people might just go directly to do shopping, etc, etc. So I think that actual negotiations...) know that there have been discussions, and Cornell has been talking to Ithaca College, for example, I think quite extensively, and they are very interested in this program and also being a major user of park and ride, as is the City of Ithaca. The City of Ithaca is very interested in this, and so, the idea is that there would be perhaps two stops, downtown and at Cornell and again, this would be open to all employers and again, the negotiations on this have just not taken place. But certainly, parcels have been discussed, but, I really can't talk about that. Chairperson Wilcox — All set Eva? Any other questions? Comments? Thank you Catherine. You said late October, early November? A few 60 -hour weeks, 80 -hour weeks ... thank you very much. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 8 Chairperson Wilcox — Before we move on to the next item. I saw some students walk in the room, and students generally want signatures ... I will not sign them now, because what I learned is, if I sign them now, people leave early. If we're still going at 9:30, 1 will come out there and take care of signing your forms for you then you can leave: I don't want to keep you here until 10:00 or 10:15 if we go too long, but neither do I want you to sneak out early. So, I'll come back over there. I think there are two or three back there. Chairperson Wilcox announces the next agenda item at 7.35 p.m. SEAR for the proposed liquid nitrogen storage tank located 950 Danby Road George Breuhaus, Architect with Ithaco, 950 Danby Road, Suite 220 Robert Nead, Ithaca, 950 Danby Road Mr. Breuhaus -- So I am actually in the building that we are talking about. With me is Robert Nead, who is the General Manager for Ithaco. Ithaco is looking to put in a 9,000 gallon liquid nitrogen storage tank because they need to duplicate space conditions. They make valves and sensors... Mr. Nead — Actually, they are for satellites satellite. Guidance control for satellites. We make sensors and actuators for Mr. Breuhaus - So the purpose for this is, when they need to test these devices, they need to flow liquid nitrogen through a chamber to duplicate conditions in space. So this doesn't happen regularly, it happens intermittently, but when they do it, they need a lot of nitrogren for a 10 hour period of time... Mr. Nead — Ten days, at 24 hours, depending what the cycle is going to be. Mr. Breuhaus — So, what we are looking at is, currently there is a swale that comes down that drains this whole area, comes down to a culvert that is here, along the building. You've got pictures taken, too, just so you have them, but we superimposed the tank so you see what it looks like right now, and what the tank would look like. Keep in mind that that has no planting in front of it, but what you start to see is that, because of the slope of the hill coming down, by and large, the tank is hardly noticeable at all, as your coming up the road by the south, by the curve in the building, you can't hardly see it. It's probably most noticeable by the entrance to Ithaca College. So what we are talking about doing is taking, regrading and reworking the drainage line so that now it will be fully pipe graded and (inaudible) ...pipe down to where it comes out now, the water would continue in the path that it already does. We would then dig into the hill some, put a concrete retaining wall into the hill, to hold that back, because we need a level area, which, if you look on the plan for the, on A2, it has the plan for the tank and the vaporizers and there are certain clearances that they require around those things, so the retaining wall becomes both a guard rail and also holds back the hill. That in turn, the open areas in the front, the trucks would come in and back down the existing concrete walk, concrete drive that is already used for truck traffic right now for deliveries... pull off to the side and fill the tank. There is a requirement that the driver be PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 9 able to get to both the back of the truck and to the tank for safety reasons and to be able to control the loading of the tank. It is anticipated that the tank would be loaded third shift. Right now, in the slab, there is a sensor that actually is a transmitter, so most of these trucks are coming out of the Buffalo area, they come down to Cornell, Advion, there are a number of users that are using liquid nitrogen, they can actually monitor, punch it in on the truck and see what the level of the tank is, but when they are actually doing the tests, this tank will need to be filled every other day, at most. So, it is anticipated that this would come in, a lot of times they are running late at night, it would get done late at night, because it would take about an hour for the truck to be parked there to actually offload 5,00 — 6,000 gallons of liquid nitrogen. Liquid nitrogen is actually inert, it's not flammable, not corrosive, it's not an oxidizer... Basically, it will run through the chamber and after it's done, it gets ventilated out into the atmosphere as gas. So, what we've included in the package, is what the existing site looks like, what we're proposing to do, details of the slab and the walls and stuff. We also, there's currently some forsythia here, if you look at the pictures, there are some ratty pine trees in here, and oak trees, there's 3 oak trees down along the site ... weIre looking to add some spruce, probably 6-8 feet to start, they're going to be approximately planted 12 or 14 feet above the slab anyway, so, the trees are effectively 20 feet, the tank is 29, the building is 30, so, the tank does not extend above the top of the building and the trees will cover most of it over time, obviously they will fill in. Then the concrete wall actually acts as a guard barrier ... it's been known, when Ithaca plays Cortland, to .have kids in this area, so one of the concerns is kids running down the slope and falling in the pit so the wall of the retaining wall is actually guardrail height above the slope. That, in turn, has forsythia planted in front of that so you don't see the wall and then the trees act as a further screen. Chairperson Wilcox — Environmental issues that you're aware of? Mr. Breuhaus — None. Chairperson Wilcox — Questions ladies and gentlemen? Board Member Thayer — Does that offload like a gas tanker with a rubber hose type thing? Mr. Nead — You're talking about the transfer of the liquid nitrogen from the truck to the tank? Board Member Thayer —Yeah. Mr. Nead — Yeah, it's a reinforced hose because the tank ... liquid nitrogen is cold and also is under some transfer pressure. That's the reason the tank and the truck need to be nearby, so you have a safety... ability for the driver or the handler to operate those valves incase anything would leak. Mr. Breuhaus — The liquid nitrogen itself is actually run through a vacuum jacketed pipe and the piping for this is very expensive, it runs $200 -$300 a foot. So to take it out of PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 10 the tank and take it to the spot in the building, it's done, it's actually about a 5/8 inch diameter hose, or pipe, but then it's got a jacket around it, it's kept under a vacuum so you don't get condensation and the cold doesn't radiate. Chairperson Wilcox My offices are at the Cornell Research and Technology Park on Brown Road and we have two of them, we have the new one, the new one at Advion at 19 Thornwood and I think there is another one across the pond from us... Mr. Breuhaus — You've got one at 22 Thornwood and then you've got one at 36, around the back, and the one at 36 Thornwood is roughly the same height as what this is. Chairperson Wilcox — I see the trucks show up every once in a while and I've never seen an issue from these things. I've always wondered about them, because obviously they have gas in them and they are under pressure, but I've never seen an issue. Trucks show up, fill em up, leave and you'd never know they were there. Alternate Member Erb — The issue that I see, potentially here, is that third shift sounds to me like the middle of the night, and an hour of a truck engine running and maybe or maybe not making beeping noises and having some pumping noises going, I would like to know how loud this operation is going to be and whether it is going to be heard by the nearest residences. Mr. Breuhaus — Noise wise, it's not a noisy ... I mean, the truck probably makes more noise than the transfer of the fluid... Alternate Member Erb — Well, I wouldn't be happy with a truck running... Mr. Breuhaus — Well, technically, a truck's not supposed to be running for an hour, so, I mean, a lot of the municipalities have a nightly law, I don't know whether the Town does, but typically ... I doubt they would run for an hour, not with the price of fuel. There is no real residence anywhere around there. Alternate Member Erb — I know, I just didn't know how far away anything might be heard. Mr. Breuhaus — Longview's probably the closest to that side and its got to be a mile up the road. Board Member Hoffmann — I thought there were some individual residences further north... Alternate Member Erb — Yes, just downhill... Mr. Breuhaus — But the building acts as a block right in front of it, as a screen... Chairperson Wilcox — As a screen for any of the noise... Board Member Talty — Are these tanks currently, or are they traditionally purchased or are they leased? PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 11 Mr. Nead = They're leased. Board Member . Talty — Okay, so I noticed in the documentation 20111 1 believe, so at that point, if you were to relocate, it would be up to the folks that you purchase the liquid nitrogen from to remove the tank. Is that correct? Mr. Breuhaus — Correct. I mean, as a matter of fact, Andy Scriabba's here and he has a building in the Village of Lansing where when Advion moved they had a 6,000 gallon liquid nitrogen tank...so after they moved, the company comes, pumps out the nitrogen back into the truck and then takes the tank. Mr. Nead — And they will want to remove that tank because ... they are only ... the lease price is minor compared to the revenue they will get from the liquid nitrogen, so they will want to relocate that tank to some other customer... Board Member Talty — Well that's why I wanted to know if you guys purchase it or do you rent, because that would make a big difference, based on what you are saying. Chairperson Wilcox — Any questions with regard to the environmental review? Board Member Thayer. I'll move the SEQR. Chairperson Wilcox — So moved. Board Member Hoffmann — I do. I noticed in the resolution that it talks about the color of the tank and that it be, I think it said it's supposed to be... Mr. Nead -- They are typically white... Mr. Breuhaus — I mean, it's basically that color, and the building is offwhite ... In some ways this works out well, we want the tank to be white because we want to keep it as cool as possible, no solar gain, so, keep everything cold, and the building is almost the same color as the tank. Board Member Hoffmann — But I wasn't sure, looking at the photographs, it looks as if there's a section of wall where the tank is going to be that's sort of grayish -blue rather than white ... is that a shade... Mr. Breuhaus — That's the tone of the shadow. The building itself is a cream colored building. Board Member Hoffmann — Now the tank that's drawn in here looks gray rather than white, but you're saying it's supposed to be white... Mr. Nead — Yeah, that's just a photograph that we received. The tank will be, and I said typically white, it's not a brilliant white, but it's white, so you don't get any solar gain, because the nitrogen that is in that tank is going to be liquefied and... Board Member Hoffmann — Right, but it's supposed to blend in with the color of the building, according to the resolution, I believe. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 12 Chairperson Wilcox — No, the resolution says that the color will match what's in the pictures. Board Member Hoffmann — Okay, well that's a problem then because the pictures show a different color. Chairperson Wilcox — They're white. These tanks are white. Board Member Hoffmann — Well I think maybe we should clarify in the resolution what we want it to be. Chairperson Wilcox — Airgas white, or, I don't know what the color is, but they're all white. Alternate Member Erb — In this picture, there is also a sign on the tank. Board Member Hoffmann — Yes. Chairperson Wilcox — Airgas puts their name on them don't they... Board Member Hoffmann — Would it be possible to have the sign facing away from the road? Chairperson Wilcox — I don't have a problem with it, it's so small. I've seen...) believe it's green, that's their color... Mr. Breuhaus — The problem is, I'm sure ... they put it ... there's a certain way the tank has to go because the valves have to ... you can't spin the tank to hide the lettering on the tank. I don't know, we could look into seeing whether or not we could paint them out... Board Member Talty — I don't have an issue with the sign either, but I'd be willing to bet that that sign is not going to face the wall. Mr. Breuhaus — I'm willing to be that they put it where the valves, so you can't bury it behind. Alternate Member Erb — I don't have an issue with the sign if it's no bigger than this. Mr. Breuhaus — They are not big signs, because ... I'm sure they hear the same complaint from every municipality. Alternate Member Erb — That's why I wanted to mention it. I didn't want it to suddenly magnify. Board Member Hoffmann — Yes, and also, we don't really know how large the sign is and if it does fit with our sign ordinance, that's another issue. I am willing to bet that the company makes tanks with signs on all kinds of sides because they are not going to go, PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 13 all of them, on this side of a building, so I think it's possible to get a tank with the sign I acing a different way. I have another question, and that is, spruce are you planning to plant? O r perhaps, which might be interesting. you mentioned planting spruce. What kind of are you planning different varieties of spruce, Mr. Breuhaus — No, it will be one type of tree, and it's a Black Spruce, or... Board Member Hoffmann — I would like to make sure that it's a spruce that will do well here in our climate, that it's not an exotic import that might... Mr. Breuhaus — No... Board Member Hoffmann -- ...fade out in a few years. Mr. Breuhaus — No, I mean, it is in Ithaco's interest to make sure that the spruce is living and screening so that they don't hear complaints. Board Member Howe — I'll second... Chairperson Wilcox — I have a motion from Larry Thayer, seconded by Rod Howe ... One change, if I may, that I would like to make to the SEQR, Short Form, and second, how's the land presently zoned, the applicant called it special development zone, I want to change that to Planned Development Zone #12, which is the actual zoning in that area. Alright. If that's acceptable, I have a motion and a second with regard to the environmental review ... Any further discussion? ... there being none ... all those in favor please signal by saying aye ... Anybody opposed? ... No one is opposed.... There are no abstentions... the motion is passed. 1. ADOPTED RESOLUTION: PB RESOLUTION NO. 2007 - 097 SEQR Preliminary and Final Site Plan Ithaco Space Systems — Liquid Nitrogen Storage Tank 950 Danby Road Tax Parcel No. 39 -1 A A Town of Ithaca Planning Board, September 18, 2007 MOTION made by Larry Thayer, seconded by Rod Howe. WHEREAS. 1. This action is consideration of Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the proposed installation of a liquid nitrogen storage tank for Ithaco Space Systems Inc. located in the South Hill Business Campus at 950 Danby Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No, 39- 1 -1.1, Planned Development Zone No. 12. The proposal involves the installation of a 9,000 gallon, +/- 29 foot tall liquid nitrogen storage tank located on the southern corner of the building. The tank will be enclosed with concrete retaining walls and chain link fence and will include new PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 14 landscaping. South Hill Business Campus, LLC, Owner /Applicant; George W. Breuhaus, Agent, and 2. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board is acting as Lead Agency in an uncoordinated environmental review with respect to this project, and 3. The Planning Board, on September 18, 2007, has reviewed and accepted as adequate a Short Environmental Assessment Form (EAF) Part I, submitted by the applicant, and Part II prepared by Town Planning staff, drawings titled "Partial Site Plan — Existing" (EC -1), "Partial Site Plan — Proposed" (A -1), "Proposed Floor Plan" (A -2), "Proposed Elevations" (A -3), and "Details" (A -4), dated August 6, 2007, prepared by George W. Breuhaus, Architect, and other application materials, and 4. The Town Planning staff has recommended a negative determination of environmental significance with respect to the proposed project; NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED. That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby makes of environmental significance in accordance with Article Conservation Law and 6 NYCRR Part 617 New York Sta Review for the above referenced actions as proposed, based EAF Part I and for the reasons set forth in the EAF Part I Environmental Impact Statement will not be required. A vote on the motion resulted as follows: a 8 to 0 I, negative determination of the Environmental Environmental Quality n the information in the and, therefore, a Draft AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Thayer, Howe, Talty and Riha. NAYS: None ABSTENTIONS: None Chairperson Wilcox announces the next agenda item at 7: 51 p.m. PUBLIC HEARING PRELIMINARY AND FINAL SITE PLAN APPROVAL for the proposed installation of a liquid nitrogen storage tank for Ithaco Space Systems Inc. located in the South Hill Business Campus at 950 Danby Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 39- 1 -1.1, Planned Development Zone No. 12. The proposal involves the installation of a 9,000 gallon, +/- 29 foot tall liquid nitrogen storage tank located on the southern corner of the building. The tank will be enclosed with concrete retaining walls and chain link fence and will include new landscaping. South Hill Business Campus, LLC, Owner /Applicant; George W. Breuhaus, Agent, Chairperson Wilcox — Questions Ladies and Gentlemen with regard to Site Plan? Chairperson Wilcox — I want to talk about the path the truck will have to take to get there. Its a little circuitous, number one, and that doesn't bother me. It's the apparent PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 15 distance that truck's going to have to back up, because it's going to have to back up through the parking lot and then down that concrete... Mr. Breuhaus — That was a concern...We actually had Airgas come with the truck, with the driver, and do it, and asked for their input, and, they're happy with it. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, I'm guessing that could be ... 700 -800 feet they're going to have to... Alternate Member Erb — At night, in January... Mr. Breuhaus — If you think about where these tanks traditionally are, I mean I've seen some on the Cornell campus and I don't know how they wind through the winding drives to get down in there with the big truck, but they do, and the ones that are in a lot of, you know, chemical plants or whatever, they're constantly backing up, but that was an issue and we.actually had, actually brought the truck twice, because my other concern was getting the truck in off of Route 96 and they said they could come down, so they actually came down and we had their Regional Manager actually down three times. Chairperson Wilcox — I'm sure they would prefer not to back up, and that is a long distance... Mr. Breuhaus — But the point is, you've got to get the back of the truck to the tank and there's a limit of about 15 feet so that the driver can monitor the pressures and the temperatures as they discharge the... Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, I think if you were designing the building from scratch you wouldn't do it this way, but when you retro fit a building, unfortunately, we wind up in these situations which aren't necessarily the best. That's another reason for having the deliveries at off -hours is the truck would have a lot more room to back up rather than just the distance between the loading with the parking lot on both sides. That's my only, that's my only concern with regard to it. But as the papers said, Airgas has been there and they're comfortable with the ability of their truck to back up and... Mr. Breuhaus — Yeah, and as I said, we actually had the driver who will probably do it... Chairperson Wilcox — That's my only question. Anything else? Eva... Board Member Hoffmann — Could I ask for a suggestion from Susan Brock on how one could modify paragraph c, under 2, in the resolution to make sure that the tank is not gray, with the walls being white. Ms. Brock — It sounded as if the tank is white, so we simply could say the color of the tank shall be white. Board Member Hoffmann — Okay. Alternate Member Erb — With the sign no larger than is implied in the picture... PB 9 -18 -07 'Pg. 16 Board Member Hoffmann — So one would strike the rest of the sentence. Ms. Brock —Yes.. Chairperson Wilcox — We're getting ahead of ourselves a little bit. Any other questions of the applicant at this point? I need to give the public a chance to speak gentlemen. Chairperson Wilcox opens the public hearing. There was no one wishing to address the Board at this time. Chairperson Wilcox closed the public hearing at 7:56 p.m. Chairperson Wilcox — I'll bring the matter back to the Board. All set? Board Member Hoffmann — I have one more comment. We were told that the tank is likely to be removed, if there is not going to be any liquid nitrogen used at the site any more, but should we add, like we have done in other approvals, a paragraph saying something like, the tank shall be removed if it is not used for 12 months after this .period from 2007 — 2011 is over? Chairperson Wilcox — I like the idea because we do...let me get the gentlemen back up here. It's always in our best interest and the Town's best interests to make sure that these are removed when they are no longer used, and I think the Board would probably like to put something in the resolution but I want to phrase it in such a way that is reasonable so that if the tank has not been used for a period of 12 months, it needs to be removed, but I don't know about your schedule in terms of when -the parts are manufactured and when they are tested, so, if it's possible that you could go 12 months between actually using the nitrogen, that might not be the appropriate... Mr. Nead — No, the only issue would be if we ever had a repair situation with one of the parts coming back. The testing that we are going to do for this contract period, the tests are going to run for about 10 days of hot and cold, so the tank will be in use over that 10 day period, about 3 or 4 times a year because we are batching these units. A 12 month period of the tank not being used, probably 18 months might be a safer statement to that, just to make sure. We usually extend the 12 month warranty that's on condition of acceptance at the customer's site. A unit could come back after .... I guess 14 months after we tested it, certified it and shipped it out. So I think an 18 month period would be reasonable and we would not object to that statement of non -use. Chairperson Wilcox — And that's consistent with your own production testing and delivery cycle. Does that sound good? Board Member Talty — That sounds great. I just don't know ... I mean, they're not assuming ownership of this tank. Chairperson Wilcox — That's correct. Board Member Talty — I mean, they're leasing the tank, so really, I mean, if they were to leave that facility, the onus is really on the gas company. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 17 Chairperson. Wilcox — Well I'm thinking that if they, if the contract expired after 5 years and was not renewed or whatever, and Airgas, for whatever reason, didn't feel the need to quickly come out there and retrieve their tank. We might have some leverage with Ithaca, to have some leverage to get Airgas to come out and retrieve their leased tank. That's kind of what I am thinking here. Board Member Hoffmann — Well it's Ithaco that's in front of us. It's not the Airgas company that's in front of us... Board Member Talty — Yeah, but my point is, I mean, first of all, I doubt that they wouldn't retrieve the tank anyway, because that's a lot of money, those tanks, but,' at the same time, if they were to leave the area, I don't know what kind of recourse you would have to come after them if they are not out of the area. Right. Chairperson Wilcox - Well, I assume ... We may not have much recourse, but clearly, the intent-is to make sure that once the tank is no longer in use that it be removed. It is some ... it's not a large eyesore, but it is a little one. But to have it removed. Alternate Member Erb — It's also consistent with other things. The brewery was going to own their tank but we asked them for a similar statement. Board Member Hoffmann — And the other thing is, sometimes when we have not put things in the resolution, it's been a problem of a different kind. Alternate Member Erb — I mean, suppose something happened, Kevin, to this tank and it suddenly became damaged and unusable at the fittings, at the end of their grant. We would want them to have an incentive for getting it out of there still. Board. Member Talty — And that would be? Like at that time if their at the end of their term, I don't understand what type of leverage you have at that point. You have no leverage, because it's not their tank. Chairperson Wilcox — We have.... Board Member Hoffmann — But they are the ones who have the contract with the owner of the tank. So they can arrange something. Board Member Talty — That could very well be. Chairperson Wilcox — I agree with you. We would have more leverage with Airgas because it's their tank, I understand that, but, I think we are making our intent known that when it's not being used and there is no intended use in the future, we would like it removed, absolutely. Mr. Kanter -- Just one added point, that Ithaco actually is leasing the space from the South Hill Business interest, so I think it certainly is to the interest of the overall building, the complex, to remove any things that aren't of use any more, and in effect, the condition that would be applied to this site plan approval, applies to the South Hill business campus owner because the tenants are applying under the consent of the PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 18 owner and so, this actually, it runs from the tank owner to the tenant of the building to the owner of the building. Chairperson Wilcox — The lessee, yeah ... so we might have some leverage from the owners of the building,. All right ... would someone like to move the motion as drafted ?... so moved by George Conneman ... seconded? ... seconded by Susan Riha. Okay. Changes? Susan Brock... Ms. Brock — As we previously discussed, paragraph c, on page 2 shall now read: The color of the tank shall be white, and add a paragraph d, :. if the tank ceased to perform it's originally intended function for more than 18 consecutive months, the owner /applicant shall remove the tank and associated equipment and facilities by no later than 90 days after the end of the 18 month period. Chairperson. Wilcox — Acceptable Susan and George? (yes) Can I suggest... you said that they will remove the tank ... how about that they will have the tank removed? Can make that minor suggestion, since they don't own the tank. . Ms. Brock — Well, I think the term shall remove the tank encompasses that. Chairperson Wilcox — It's inclusive? Okay. So we'll leave it the way it is. Anything else? There being no further discussion... all those in favor please signal by saying Aye ... anybody opposed? ... are there any abstentions? ... there are none ... the motion is passed. ADOPTED RESOLUTION: PB RESOLUTION 2007 - 098 Preliminary and Final Site Plan Ithaco Space Systems — Liquid Nitrogen Storage Tank 950 Danby Road Tax Parcel No. 39 -1 -1.1 Town of Ithaca Planning Board, September 18, 2007 MOTION made by George Conneman, seconded by Susan Riha. WHEREAS. 1. This action is consideration of Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the proposed installation of a liquid nitrogen storage tank for Ithaca Space Systems Inc. located in the South Hill Business Campus at 950 Danby Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 39- 1 -1.1, Planned Development Zone No, 12. The proposal involves the installation of a 9,000 gallon, +/- 29 foot tall liquid nitrogen storage tank located on the southern corner of the building. The tank Will be enclosed with concrete retaining walls and chain link fence and will include new landscaping. South Hill Business Campus, LLC, Owner /Applicant; George W. Breuhaus, Agent, and 2. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board, acting as lead agency in an uncoordinated environmental review with respect to the project has, on September 18, 2007, made a negative determination of environmental PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 19 significance, after having reviewed and accepted as adequate a Short Environmental Assessment Form Part I, submitted by the applicant, and a Part II prepared by Town Planning staff, and 3. The Planning Board, at a Public Hearing held on September 18, 2007, has reviewed and accepted as adequate, drawings titled "Partial Site Plan — Existing" (EC -1), "Partial Site Plan — Proposed" (A -1), "Proposed Floor Plan" (A -2), "Proposed Elevations" (A -3), and "Details" (A -4), dated August 6, 2007, prepared by George W Breuhaus, Architect, and other application materials, and NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED: 1. That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby waives certain requirements for Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval, as shown on the Preliminary and Final Site Plan Checklists, having determined from the materials presented that such waiver will result in neither a significant alteration of the purpose of site plan control nor the policies enunciated or implied by the Town Board, and 21 That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby grants Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the proposed Liquid Nitrogen Storage Tank for Ithaco Space Systems Inc. located at the South Hill Business Campus at 950 Danby Road, as described on drawings titled "Partial Site Plan — Existing" (EC -1), "Partial Site Plan — Proposed" (A -1),. "Proposed Floor Plan" (A -2), "Proposed Elevations" (A- 3), and "Details" (A -4), dated August 6, 2007, prepared by George W Breuhaus, Architect, subject to the following conditions: a, submission of one set of the final site plan drawings on mylar, vellum, or paper, signed and sealed by the registered land surveyor, engineer, architect, or landscape architect who prepared the site plan materials, prior to issuance of a building permit, and b, submission of record of application for and receipt of all necessary permits from any county, state, and/or federal agencies, prior to issuance of any certificate of occupancy, and C, the color of the tank shall be white, d. if the tank ceased to perform it's originally intended function for more than 18 consecutive months, the owner /applicant shall remove the tank and associated equipment and facilities by no later than 90 days after the end of the 18 month period. A vote on the motion resulted as follows: AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Thayer, Howe, Talty and Riha. NAYS: None ABSTENTIONS: None The Motion passed. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 20 Board Member Talty — Based upon my previous recusals, I am going to effectively recuse myself again from this particular proceeding. Chairperson Wilcox = You will sit there and... Board Member Talty — i can sit here just fine. I promise I won't make any faces at Bill. I .promise. Chairperson Wilcox — Okay. And Hollis will fill in as the alternate on this particular item. Chairperson Wilcox announces the next agenda item at 8:05 p.m. PRELIMINARY AND FINAL SUBDIVISION APPROVAL for the proposed 2 -lot subdivision located at 330 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 62-1- 3.2, Community Commercial Zone. The proposal involves subdividing the +1- 5.959 acre lot into two parcels consisting of a +I- 1.703 acre parcel, containing the existing Rite Aid Pharmacy, and a +1- 4.256 acre parcel located off Mitchell Street which would be available for future development. 1093 Group, LLC, Owner /Applicant. Bill Palladino, 295 Main Street, Buffalo, NY We're here, I'm here today to propose the re- subdivision of our lot at Pine Tree and Mitchell in to 2 separate lots. One being the Rite Aid lot which would consist of 1.703 acres and then the remaining lot, which would be roughly 4.256 acres. As you see on the plan here, the lot would be subdivided in this area here, this would be the larger piece and this would be the current Rite Aid piece, right there. Because of its future uses, financing issues and the possible future sale of the property, we'd like to complete this subdivision. With regard to the subdivision, there are some issues that obviously have to be rectified before we would be able to proceed. We still have some remaining issues with regard to our C of O which we are currently working on. One being the crosswalk and some additional signage. We're still waiting for the DOT, not the DOT, the County, to install. The water issue, I believe, has been rectified at this point from what I've been told, in the building. The, I think with regard to the Planning Board, those are the 2 main issues that we are looking at there. With regard to the building permit itself, in the Town, our engineer is going to be up here, hopefully next week, to look at the vegetation in the middle area and the silt fence that is still existing. He is also going to take a review of the pond and the stormwater issues with the pond, potential issues, if there are any issues, just pursuant to the Town Engineer's review. And also our landscaper will be up here. He was supposed to be up here 2 weeks ago, sort of been stalling or delaying, but he will be up here to look at what was initially (inaudible) around the pond and what is dead and he will be replacing that and he will be doing, looking at the whole property, which is left, in terms of mowing, cutting, and putting it in proper order. It's sort of ... I'm embarrassed at the way PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 21 it looks right now and I have been advised that it looks the way it did and it will be corrected. If not next week, the following week. With regard to the subdivision, obviously we had a few different agreements with regard to our access, the pedestrian walk, the storm pond.. those will all be modified pursuant to the changes that you see here. The access agreements will pretty much stay as written, being those easement areas, they're really not affected. With regard to the pedestrian walk, which ever part of the walk is on whichever parcel, that potential owner, new owner, us, will be responsible for still maintaining that walk. With regard to the storm pond. By percentage, the stormpond will be maintained and any repairs ever need to be done will be done by both the parties and /or us as a single party, being the two parcels. So the two parcels, by these agreements, are still, will continue to be tied together in many ways and sort of function and operate as one parcel, pursuant to the agreements in place, which will be hopefully submitted next week to the Town Attorney for their review. Any questions? Chairperson Wilcox - Susan is making faces at me... Board Member Riha — Well, yeah ... I'm new to this, but, if ... presumably as part of the stormwater runoff plan, this was considered one parcel and the stormwater retention pond and the whole stormwater plan was designed with that in mind. Mr. Palladino — Correct. Board Member Riha — But now it's going to become 2 parcels with part of the stormwater retention plan that involves the first parcel, basically, possibly being kind of sold off. To potentially... Mr. Palladino — Because of the easement agreements and maintenance agreements that we do have, they will still operate as one parcel and whoever, if we were to sell off the other piece, whoever the other owner is, would be pursuant to these agreements, would be forced, we'd be forced to work together to maintain the property. We've done this in many different areas as other developers have done. It's not unusual. Chairperson Wilcox — Susan, would you like to add anything to that? I mean, this is not unusual to me. I don't like them, but it's not unusual with these cross agreements where one property is used to provide service on another property or to provide... whether it's access or stormwater detention or similar other services. Ms. Brock — Is there an Operation and Maintenance Agreement with the Town right now? That's in place? Mr. Palladino —Yes, PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 22 Ms. Brock — Okay. Yeah, I don't know if we have any other situations like this where we actually have signed agreements and then part of the parcel containing significant components of the stormwater management system are actually then owned by a different owner. I'm not sure if we actually have that precedent right now. So I think we are going to have to work through this and figure out how to make sure that all of the requirements are met, that we have somebody we can go back against to make sure that all of the stormwater management functions are carried out as they are supposed to be. Chairperson Wilcox — Do you see this as a legal hurdle? Ms. Brock — I think it's certainly a legal issue that we will have to address, yes. Chairperson Wilcox -- Yeah. Okay. Mr. Kanter — I mean, one question, as with anything that comes to the Board for Preliminary and Final Approval, is it's the Board's option to grant only Preliminary Approval and .bring it all back to the Board to work it out. You know, with the, with a "simple two lot subdivision " ... (laughter)... which I'm not sure if this is or not, you can also consider Preliminary and Final Approval subject to all these things that we listed in the resolutions. So I think that's something that we can talk about more. Chairperson Wilcox — We also, have the leverage of...the resolution as drafted would not allow me to sign the subdivision plat until all of the site plan elements are completed to the satisfaction of the Town, so we have some leverage over Mr. Palladino and the companies that he represents here to get those things completed_ Whether it's the crosswalk on Pine Tree Road or some of the other elements that have been mentioned. Mr. Palladino — What we have also done in the past and we just did in Lake George, we had a similar situation as here, with the stormwater design on an adjacent parcel that we most likely will sell off, we've maintained as I guess, if you want to call it, the primary user of it, we have maintained the absolute obligation with the Town although the other party would be obligated also. And there's penalties in it where if, for instance, if it wasn't being, since it is on the other parcel, if we were to sell off what we call the parcel B, where the stormwater pond is and there did become a problem in the future and the new owner of Parcel B refused to repair the violation, they would obviously be cited as we would be because we are partial owners, but we'd be, I guess as the primary user we would be more on the hook and we would have the ability to go in and fix the problem and re -bill and fight it out with the owner of Parcel B to get reimbursed for those costs to maintain and bring it back into compliance. That's how we have done it in other areas and like I said, it's not something that's unusual, things such as this, but to get, to make you comfortable, obviously my attorneys can talk it over with you further to get the proper language which makes you comfortable. Ms. Brock — I'd be interested in seeing a copy of those agreements. Mr. Palladino — Yes. You should, I think you have copies already. Ms. Brock — Of the Lake George agreements? PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 23 Mr. Palladino — Oh, the Lake George, that's fine. Board Member Howe — Plus of course it depends on what gets built, if anything gets built on Parcel B in the future, which could change the stormwater management. Mr. Palladino — Correct and anything that does get built will most likely modify the pond in some regard and in pursuant to our agreements, we'll both operate under whatever needs to happen. Alternate Member Erb — but of course changes to the pond we would be taking into consideration at that time. Mr. Palladino — Correct. Chairperson Wilcox — Should a proposal to site something on what's called Parcel B. Mr. Walker — I think, actually, I think the pond was sized for pretty much full impervious surface that would be allowed on that Parcel B. Originally the design was based on just the Rite Aid parcel, but, and then they were going to expand the pond when they built Phase II but we said just build the whole thing to deal with the whole site upfront, then we don't have to go back and rebuild it so the pond should be adequately sized for the whole site unless they paved absolutely everything over or our regulations change in the future. Mr. Palladino — Yeah, well, whatever new development came, obviously they would have to run the calculations again and they'd have to meet the criteria that was set originally for the pond. Ms. Brock — Dan, was the stormwater sheet - flowing into that pond or was it being piped into it? Mr. Walker — It is being piped into it from the parcels on the Rite Aid parcel and then a portion of Parcel B that is east of the asphalt driveway that comes off of Mitchell Street and then the sheet flow is coming from the ... portion of Parcel B that is to the west of the driveway, basically flows down into the pond now. And we did have a few little problems in that last heavy rain where some of the catch basins need to be cleaned out...the water is going around the catch basins, past them and then down Mitchell Street so that's and O&M and we contacted the owners and they're correcting that now. Chairperson Wilcox — Any other questions, comments, with regard to the Environmental Review? Eva, Board Member Hoffmann — Well, my comment would be that without causing any hardship, I understand there is maybe some hardship already, financial hardship, however that was caused, I would like to actually not move ahead on final approval until at least we address the issues with the Rite Aid development and preferably the other things are available for us to review. It's not that I don't trust Staff to do it, but I think it is our responsibility to do it and I would like approval. So that would be my preference. Chairperson Wilcox — Anybody else? Board Member Conneman — I would agree long time to solve the crosswalk issue and approval and then have it come back. PB 9 -18 -a7 Pg. 24 us to see it again before we have a final with that, because I think that it's taken a it seems to me we want to give preliminary Chairperson Wilcox — Mostly nods of the heads ... There is an interest on our part in assuring that what we approved before regarding the Rite Aid is completed. Clearly that's in our best interests and the Town's best interests to ensure it gets done.. If this Board would like to grant only preliminary and then have the applicant come back with the evidence that those elements have been taken care of, I'm fine with that. Personally, I think we have enough leverage with the fact that I can not sign the plat granting the subdivision approval until they satisfactorily complete them, and that's the leverage we hold over them and until I sign the plat then they can't file it with the County and they can't legally subdivide the property. So there's that leverage as well. Board Member Riha — But I. think it also would be good for Susan to look at this other agreement... Alternate Member Erb — It's only going to become messier. Chairperson Wilcox — And I have no interest, by the way, in reviewing a legal agreement. There ... I rely upon the experts, but again, if this Board would like to just grant preliminary, subject to these conditions being met before final is granted, that's... Alternate Member Erb — SEQR and preliminary. Chairperson Wilcox — I can live with that. Bill won't be happy, he's got to travel down from Buffalo again, but he likes the ride. As long as it's not snowing. All right. So are we comfortable with just preliminary at this point? Okay, okay. Ms. Brock — but of course the SEQR covers all of the approvals you'll be giving. So as you are considering SEQR, you're considering Preliminary and Final approval, Chairperson Wilcox — That's right. Oh, and by the way, some of you might have noticed that during the meeting I went out and gave Bill something and he handed it back to me. That was, I got his signature on the Short Environmental Form as you may have noticed it wasn't signed. So we now have a signature on the original. Would someone like to move the SEQR motion ... so moved by Rod Howe... seconded... seconded by Hollis...you got it...you got it, ...any changes Susan Brock... Ms. Brock -- No. Chairperson Wilcox — No. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 25 Mr, Kanter I guess we want to eliminate the references to and Final. You could actually just say subdivision approval... Chairperson Wilcox —Let's be very careful about this so we get them... Mr. Kanter — Like Susan mentioned, when you are doing the SEQR, you are doing it for the subdivision. Chairperson Wilcox — Correct. Mr. Kanter — And the action that we are doing tonight is Preliminary Subdivision Approval so we want to reference those places in the resolution to that effect. Board Member Hoffmann — So all references to and Final should be crossed out... Ms. Brock — No. Board Member Hoffmann — Oh. No, right... Mr. Kanter — Then I would take out Preliminary and Final and just say Subdivision Approval because then it's misleading as to what they are then going to be granting in the next resolution, so I would just say Subdivision Approval. Ms. Brock — Okay. Chairperson Wilcox — I'm waiting for the Town Attorney to nod her head... Mr. Kanter — That is the SEQRable action as per the "Assistant Town Attorney" who asks that the Town Attorney acknowledge that's correct...(laughter)... Ms. Brock — That'll be fine. Chairperson Wilcox— Okay. Let's make sure we have the changes for the record. I Jet's go through them... Ms. Brock — In the title of the resolution, delete Preliminary and Final and paragraph I of the Whereas, on the first line, delete Preliminary and Final.... Chairperson Wilcox — And I think that's it, right...those changes are acceptable Rod and Hollis? ... yes they are... okay... that works for you....okay ... there being no further discussion... all those in favor signal by saying aye...any opposed... no one is opposed...there are no abstentions, ,Hollis, we know for the record that Hollis is voting, the SEQR motion is passed unanimously. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 26 ADOPTED RESOLUTION. PB RESOLUTION NO. 2007 - 099 SEAR Subdivision Approval, 1093 Group, LLC Two -Lot Subdivision 330 Pine Tree Road Tax Parcel No. 62 -1 -3.2 Planning Board, September 18, 2007 MOTION made by Rod Howe, seconded by Hollis Erb, WHEREAS: 1. This action is consideration of Subdivision Approval for the proposed two -lot subdivision located at 330 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No, 62 -1- 3.2, Community Commercial Zone. The proposal involves subdividing the +/- 5.959 acre lot into two parcels consisting of a +l- 1.703 acre parcel, containing the existing Rite Aid Pharmacy (Parcel A), and a +/- 4.256 acre parcel located off Mitchell Street which would be available for future development (Parcel B). 1093 Group, LLC, Owner /Applicant, and 2. This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board is acting as Lead Agency in conducting an uncoordinated environmental review with respect to Subdivision Approval, and 3. The Planning Board on September 18, 2007, has reviewed and accepted as adequate a Short Environmental Assessment Form Part I, submitted by the applicant, and Part Il prepared by the Town Planning staff, a survey map entitled "Subdivision Map Showing Lands of 1093 Group LLC, No. 322 -350 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca, Tompkins County, New York," prepared by Darrin A. Brock, LS, dated 8/2/2007 and revised 81812007, and other application materials, and 4. The Town planning staff has recommended a negative determination of environmental significance with respect to the proposed Subdivision Approval; NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED: That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby makes a negative determination of environmental significance in accordance with Article 8 of the Environmental Conservation Law and 6 NYCRR Part 617 New York State Environmental Quality Review for the above referenced action as proposed based on the information in the EAF Part I and for the reasons set forth in the EAF Part II, and, therefore, neither a Full Environmental Assessment Form, nor an Environmental Impact Statement will be required. A vote on the motion resulted as follows: AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Thayer, Howe, Riha and Erb. NAYS: None PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 27 ABSTENTIONS: None RECUSED: Talty The Motion passed. Chairperson Wilcox announced the next agenda item at 8:20 p.m. PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Preliminary and Final Subdivision Approval for the proposed 2 -lot subdivision located at 330 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 62- 1 -3.2, Community Commercial Zone. The proposal involves subdividing the +i- 5.959 acre lot into two parcels consisting of a +1- 1.703 acre Parcel, containing the existing Rite Aid Pharmacy, and a +1- 4.256 acre parcel located off Mitchell Street which would be available for future development. 1093 Group, LLC, Owner /Applicant. Chairperson Wilcox — Where does the name 1093 come from? Mr. Palladino — My son's birthday. Chairperson Wilcox - Cool. Very Good. Thank you. Questions for Mr. Palladino with regard to the subdivision. There being none. Thank you for already sitting over there. Ladies and Gentlemen, this is a public hearing, Board this evening on this particular agenda item microphone. We ask that you provide your name interested to hear what you have to _say. if you wish to address the Planning once again, we invite you up to the and address and we would be most Hollis, is there anybody out there with their hand up who would like to speak? Alternate Member Erb — I see no one. . Chairperson Wilcox — There is one gentleman there... John Confer, 651 Hammond HIII Road, Brooktondale Good evening. You may know the storm drainage pool near Pine Tree and Mitchell, on the southeast corner. As all things which are downstream, everything flows into it, including a lot of unsightly trash and I don't believe that anybody feels an obligation to clean it out. And I would wonder if this could be a matter of mutual agreement among those people responsible for the pool, storm pond, to clean out the trash that flows into it in flood. I drive by that one near Wendy's repeatedly and it looks really ugly at times and would appreciate it if it were cleaned. Chairperson Wilcox — Are we talking about the stormwater retention ponds at the intersection? Mr. Confer — Well, all stormwater retention ponds accumulate things because they flow into them because they are downstream. That's one that is close and visible so I use it as an example. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 28 Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, I drive up through there pretty regular, it depends on which way I decide to go to and from work and I noticed that there' the stormwater ponds at the intersection, which I think are on County land... Mr. Walker —Those are County properties... Chairperson Wilcox — That's County property and it is up to them to come and do that. I know that the Burger King is responsible for picking up trash within a quarter mile of their site, I believe, is what they agreed to do and what we included... yeah... and then Bill, you've come across some problems with yours already and we need to make sure that your pond does it's job. Thank you sir. I appreciate it. Anybody else? There being no one, I Will close the Public Hearing at 8:24p.m. Board Member Riha — Is this pond within a quarter mile of the Burger King? Chairperson Wilcox— I would hope that the Burger King approval was that they would pick up trash either on their property or on public right -of -ways. Mr. Kanter — Not on other peoples property. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, not on other people's property. I can't remember the exact wording but, Mr. Kanter — If we said that, it wouldn't be enforceable anyway. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, but the point ... a lot of people were worried about the trash along Ellis Hollow Road and Pine Tree Road and they, as I remember, they readily agreed to pick up the trash within a quarter mile. Alternate Member Erb — and they have been. Board Member Riha — But I can just see ... I mean, this being kind of in a commercial area, that you could accumulate trash a lot more quickly than a stormwater retention pond in a residential area. I'm just wondering if there's any plan in place to clean it out more often. Mr. Walker — That's part of the operation and management agreement for the pond ...to remove debris and you know, all the sediment that builds up and that the Town would, requires an annual inspection report of that and also if people notice, we get any complaints, we would go and make sure that the landowners... Board Member Riha — I can see the debris and sediment in there every year, but just trash, if it's a place where there is a lot of trash and trash is accumulating every few months... Mr. Walker — Right and we don't have the enforcement staff to go around every property, every nook and cranny every day but as we notice things, them up to the commercial owners and private owners too. Chairperson Wilcox — Those of you that live over there... Mr. Walker — So Hollis, when you see garbage, call us up and we'll go out. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 29 and look at we do bring Chairperson Wilcox — But you're experience is, you've either seen the Burger King employees out there, or... Alternate Member Erb — Yeah. I've seen ... I have seen crews out there and I have seen trash disappear. Well, in the sense that it has been there and then it has not been there. Chairperson Wilcox — Could be bears at night ... (laughter)... Alternate Member Erb — No, but I've noticed something and it never stays long. Chairperson Wilcox — Okay. That's good. Board Member Hoffmann — I haven't seen any crews out, but then I don't see much trash either. And I would have expected to see more trash out, around... Chairperson Wilcox — Of course, you get a good rain and it all goes into the stormwater pond and into the drains... Alternate Member Erb — I've actually seen somebody fishing trash out of the pond that is on the County property at the intersection. I have actually seen that. I: don't think they were fishing for the muskrat, I saw them lifting out trash, so. Board Member Howe — I'll move the resolution. Chairperson Wilcox— So moved by Rod Howe. Board Member Thayer — I'll second it. Chairperson Wilcox — Seconded by Larry Thayer, Board Member Hoffmann — I have a question about the last little paragraph. Point E, at the very end of the first line, there is something missing, I think. To the effect the he consents? Ms. Brock — It should read "to the effect that it consents ". So delete "the he" and insert "that it "... Mr. Kanter.— Or they. I think it was supposed to say that they, but either way.... Board Member Riha — And we are only doing Preliminary Approval. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 30 Chairperson Wilcox — Yes, so Susan was just about ready to, Susan Brock was ready to give us the changes... Ms. Brock — In the title of the resolution, delete the words "and Final" so it's Preliminary Subdivision Approval. In Paragraph 1 of the first ... I'm sorry, in the Whereas section, Paragraph 1, in the first line, delete "and Final" so that it reads " Preliminary Subdivision Approval". Under the Resolve clauses, Paragraph 1, on the second line, delete the words "and Final" twice, they occur both towards the beginning of the line and at the end of the line. And on the third line, the word checklists should now be singular "checklist" so that the first part of that sentence reads; "That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby waives certain requirements for Preliminary Subdivision Approval as shown on the Preliminary Subdivision Checklist. The rest of that sentence will remain the same. In. the second paragraph, on the first line, delete the words "and Final" so that it reads; It Preliminary Subdivision Approval ". On page 2, delete entirely paragraphs a) and b) because those will be conditions for the Final Approval and aren't appropriate at this stage. Renumber the remaining paragraphs that right now read c, d, and e, as a, b, and c. The end of what we now are calling Paragraph a), right now states "prior to. the signing of the plat by the Planning Board Chair" replace that with; "prior to Final Subdivision Approval". So this paragraph will now require submission of revised easements, agreements and approval by the Attorney of the Town prior to Final Subdivision Approval. And the new paragraph b), the third line, delete... keep the words "prior to" and delete "signing of the subdivision plat by the Planning Board Chair' and insert "Final Subdivision Approval" and add a semicolon so that that phrase reads; "prior to Final Subdivision Approval". And paragraph c) ... I'll just read that, "submission of a Certificate signed by the Mortgagor(s) if any to the effect that it consents to the subdivision plat and the dedications and restrictions shown on the plat and then add the following; coma, "prior to Final Subdivision Approval." Chairperson Wilcox — Those changes acceptable Rod, and I forget who else ... and Larry, thank you. Okay. Does that work better for you? That should work a lot better for you. All right. Any further discussion? There being none, all those in favor, please signal by saying aye ... anybody opposed? ... no one is opposed... there are no abstentions ...the motion is passed. We're halfway home. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 31 ADOPTED RESOLUTION. PB RESOLUTION NO. 2007 - 100 Preliminary Subdivision Approval 1093 Group, LLC Two -Lot Subdivision 330 Pine Tree Road, Tax Parcel No. 62 -1 -3.2 Planning Board, September 18, 2007 MOTION made by Rod Howe, seconded by Larry Thayer WHEREAS: 1. This action is consideration of Preliminary Subdivision Approval for the proposed two -lot subdivision located at 330 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 62- 1 -3.2, Community Commercial Zone. The proposal involves subdividing the +/- 5.959 acre lot into two parcels consisting of a +/- 1.703 acre parcel, containing the existing Rite Aid Pharmacy (Parcel A), and a +/- 4.256 acre parcel located off Mitchell Street which would be available for future development (Parcel B). 1093 Group, LLC, Owner /Applicant, and 21 This is an Unlisted Action for which the Town of Ithaca Planning Board, acting as lead agency in conducting an uncoordinated environmental review with respect to Subdivision Approval, has on September 18, 2007, made a negative determination of environmental significance, after having reviewed and accepted as adequate a Short Environmental Assessment Form Part I, submitted by the applicant, and Part II prepared by the Town Planning staff, and 3. The Planning Board, at a Public Hearing held on September 18, 2007, has reviewed and accepted as adequate a survey map entitled "Subdivision Map Showing Lands of 1093 Group LLC, No. 322 -350 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca, Tompkins County, New York," prepared by Darrin A. Brock, LS, dated 8/2/2007 and revised 8/8/2007, and other application materials, NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED. 1. That the Town of Ithaca Planning Board hereby waives certain requirements for Preliminary Subdivision Approval, as shown on the Preliminary Subdivision Checklist, having determined from the materials presented that such waiver will result in neither a significant alteration of the purpose of subdivision control nor the policies enunciated or implied by the Town Board, and 2. That the Planning Board hereby grants Preliminary Subdivision Approval for the proposed two -lot subdivision located at 330 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 62- 1 -3.2, Community Commercial Zone, as shown on the survey map entitled "Subdivision Map Showing Lands of 1093 Group LLC, No. 322 -350 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca, Tompkins County, New York," prepared by Darrin A. Brock, LS, dated 8/2/2007 and revised 8/8/2007, subject to the following conditions: PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 32 a. Submission of revised agreements and easements pertaining to Tax Parcel No. 62 -1 -3.2 and adjacent parcels for review and approval of the Attorney for the Town, including but not necessarily limited to, easements for ingress and egress that provide cross access and access to Pine Tree Road and Mitchell Street among the adjacent commercial parcels in this area, agreements and easements relating to shared parking, the operation, maintenance and reporting agreement for the stormwater system, and the operation and maintenance agreement for the walkway, and approval of said documents by the Attorney for the Town, prior to final subdivision approval, and b. Completion and /or correction of the following elements of the Rite Aid development pertaining to Tax Parcel No. 62 -1 -3.2 and relating to compliance with the approved site plan, prior to final subdivision approval; modification of the crosswalk on Pine Tree Road to correct potential safety issues, stabilization and establishment of proper sediment and erosion control measures on the undeveloped area on Parcel B (Phase II development site), modification of the stormwater collection system on Parcels A and B to ensure the proper channeling of surface runoff into the stormwater pond, proper maintenance (e.g., mowing and weed control) on Parcel B, and replacement of trees and shrubs that have died in the vicinity of the stormwater pond on Parcel B, and C, Submission of a certificate signed by the mortgagor(s), if any, to the effect that it consents to the subdivision plat and the dedications and restrictions shown on the plat, prior to final subdivision approval. A vote on the motion resulted as follows: AYES: Wilcox, Hoffmann, Conneman, Thayer, Howe, Riha and Erb. NAYS: None RECUSED: Talty The Motion passed. Chairperson Wilcox announces the next agenda item at 8:31 p.m. SKETCH PLAN REVIEW Review of a sketch plan for the proposed Ithaca College Temporary Metrological Tower located at 144 King Road East between King Road East and the Ithaca College Campus, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -4, Conservation Zone. The proposal involves clearing approximately 0.8 acres of vegetation for the construction of a +/- 164 foot high metrological tower. The tower will be used to collect data such as wind speed, wind direction, and temperature for a period of time ranging from 3 months to 2 years. The study is to determine the feasibility of installing a wind turbine on Ithaca College owned lands in the future. Ithaca College, Owner /Applicant; Scott Abbett, Sustainable Energy Developments Inc., Agent. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 33 Rich Couture, 104 West Danby Road Scott Abbett, 1088 Monroe Avenue, Rochester, NY Chairperson Wilcox — I assume you have a presentation to make. Mr. Couture — I will start off with a small presentation. Chairperson Wilcox — the floor is yours. Mr. Abbett — I work for a windpower consulting company, Sustainable Energy Developments and we have been hired by Ithaca College to perform a technical assessment for a windpower installation on Ithaca College owned properties. Essentially it is a study which we are seeking and funding for as well, to assess the viability and the outcome of possibly putting a single turbine on college -owned properties to produce power for the school itself, not power to be sold on the grid, but to actually offset the schools own consumption of power. As a part of this study, we would like to measure the wind speeds on the, on Ithaca College owned lands so, in order to do that we would like to install a meteorological tower. It's 164 feet high, basically industry standard height for this size tower, type of tower. The purpose of this is to get onsite data that we can use for our technical assessment. Essentially, we are looking for, as mentioned, a range of time in order to measure the data because... we're unsure, it can take as little as 3 months, as much as a year, to get a long -term correlation in order to use, to figure out what the actual windspeed would be at that site and what the output of the turbine would be. There would be land needed to be cleared in order to install this tower. The tower itself is a guywire tower. Would be held up via guywires. It is a tilt up tower, essentially using a ginpull, the tower is tilted up and there are little more specifics of that in the sketch plan itself. Access to the site would happen via the north, from Ithaca College, going up a gas pipeline right -o -way for Dominion Gas. I have spoken with a gentleman by .the name of Terry Hillard at Dominion Gas and he has given me verbal permission to use that right - of -way to access the site. And that is pending a site visit with him to look at the actual location of the pipeline so that any crews going up there would avoid any pipelines when ever possible. Equipment needed to install this tower would be essentially a pickup truck that would go up there. There would be no need for heavy machinery. The actual tower itself sits on a baseplate, there's no concrete involved, pouring or that nature. There's various types of anchoring that can be used which really depends on the soil types that we encounter at the actual site. Essentially, that is what we would like to do. There is some environmental concerns in the area regarding some rare species of sedges that are located on the site. The study which was done ... Nancy Osman and Robert Wesley identified some ... a rare species. We have talked with Ithaca College and in particular John Confer, who is here, present today, and he has devised what he thinks is a plan to relocate those sedges during this PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 34 period of clearing that area and that they can be kept somewhere else for the period the tower is up. Once the tower is removed, they could be replanted back in that area, and this particular type of sedge, apparently, I'm not a botanist, but it apparently does grow better when it has more light so the clearing of the area would actually help that particular species to thrive in that area. I guess that's more or less the plan that we have. Chairperson Wilcox — Can I go first? I got lots of questions. You mention how, at least you're planning right now to get access to the site, and Mike, you walked that site, I walked it today, it's wet. It was wet today, very wet today, and it hasn't rained since Friday night, so, there's gonna have to be some improvements done on that access road.... Mr. Smith — I think from what they were just saying, they wouldn't be coming in from King Road, they would be coming in from the campus... Board Member Thayer — Ithaca College side.. . Chairperson Wilcox — Oh you're coming in ... you said from the north ... okay. . a Mr. Abbett — If you go up behind the Terrace Residence Hall... Chairperson Wilcox — Past the existing communications tower? Mr. Abbett — Correct, there's a gas pipe road that goes all the way... Chairperson Wilcox — Very good. Documenting that path, that access road, what you may or may not have to do to improve it ... I don't know whether you have to bring in fill or gravel or something. I'm concerned about the logging activity that may have to go on and the equipment you may need to .log that site, given the trees that are there right now, in order to have the room to lay the proposed tower down before you set it up and ensure that the guywires are not, the trees do not intercept the guywires and their placement. So that's a concern for me. Also, Mike, you pointed out in your email, you point out the stone wall, which we use visually to find the site ... When I see stone walls out in the middle of fields, it makes me wonder what used to be there. What used to be there? I don't know if that was a stonewall between 2 farmers' lots or not but the other question is, do we need to look at an archeological ... Do we need to do an archeological survey of the area. I hate to say dig, but again, the wall indicates the presence of human beings at some point, and don't know the significance of that wall, or other walls in that area, but that's the most prominent one. Clearly your going to have to clear a path to get to the site from the other roads that are there, the other roads that trucks or other vehicles can travel, but you're going to have to clear to get into that site. Mr. Abbett — I can actually address that. In the initial sketch plan, if you refer to page 3, the map where it's got a blue line showing the actual gas pipeline right -of -way, that is a more accurate representation of the area that we would be clearing. The area that is PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 35 currently marked off now is more or less an oversight on our part. We went out to mark it, I didn't physically go, my team and people from Ithaca College went. out, and actually moved the site about 200 feet to the northeast of where this depiction is So, essentially, the site that we would like to pursue is the one that's depicted on this picture, which is going to be directly off that pathway, so, there will be no need to clear any additional access to the site itself. Chairperson Wilcox — The other concern I have is, this is zoned Conservation Zone, and we have, I think there has been. ..lchtyological Associates has done their work. We also have the work that was done by, I'm trying to remember the names, Nancy Osman ...and they are in reasonably good agreement. So we have, I have this conundrum now of, there are the potential for rare plants in this area. We have the mention of the Sedgewood in that area, and are we being asked, or am I being asked to trade one environmentally friendly thing, meaning, possibility of a wind turbine for another environmentally friendly thing which is the Conservation Zone to protect that area, and think, for me, someone will need to address that. I can't see destroying something that is environmentally good to build something else that is environmentally good. So that needs to be addressed, I think. So that we...if there is the possibility of retaining the uniqueness and what's special about the Conservation Zone in that area, while at the same time being able to put up this tower to test the wind conditions and directions and speed, I think that's what you need to show me. I don't want to be in the position where I have to trade one for the other, because I don't think I would. That's my comment. Alternate Member Erb — We're. gonna want visual impacts... Chairperson Wilcox — Very good, very good,, we're gonna have to float some balloons or something up in the air and then take pictures... absolutely... given the height and I... you have to go to the other hills. You've got to go to ... whether it's East Hill or West Hill, to make sure that the impact there is measured because, as Rick can tell. you, given that Ithaca is the, the Town of Ithaca is the "doughnut" around the City, we are the hills, sometimes the visual impacts are not from, the most important visual impacts are not from 100 feet away or 1,000 feet away, they're on the other side of the valley looking across. Alternate Member Erb — It's the viewscape way out. Chairperson Wilcox — So putting up some balloons or something large enough so that you can photograph it from the appropriate sites, including on the other hills in the Town, possible the other hills outside the Town will be very important to judge the visual impacts. Mr. Couture — Just ... if I could ... just to give you are proposing is approximately 165 feet tail, the that's.been put up on Ithaca College property is looking at getting permission to put up is abou, width of the tower itself and the device that we (Mr. Abbett holds up his hand and indicates fist horizontal also, further decreasing its visibility) some perspective...The tower that we communications /emergency 911 tower 195 feet tall and this tower that we're 6 inches around. I mean, that's the want to put on it, the anemometer, is, size and shows that it will actually lay PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 36 Mr. Abbett — So essentially, from a far enough distance, the 6 inch tower, believe it or not essentially is invisible. Mr. Couture — I understand what you are saying but I just wanted to share that information with the Board so you have some perspective. Board Member Riha — But this would -be the site if it was feasible, this would be where you would be placing a permanent one. Mr. Abbett � Most likely. Right now we're at the beginning of this. We are looking at all the land and this is the area that we chose to put up the tower because just from looking at the owned properties, looking at the elevation,. you know, we wanted to get a measurement at that site. So I can't say exactly where we would recommend, but, it would probably be somewhere around that area, correct. Chairperson Wilcox — How tall though, might, how tall might a wind turbine tower be in this. location if the testing shows that it's feasible? Mr. Abbett — Ah ... 225 feet plus, depending on the size. It could be up to 300 feet in the air, to the blade tip, you know, depending, we're looking essentially anywhere from 1 megawatt to a 2'/2 megawatt turbine and assessing what the impact that would be. Board Member Riha — So in that case, Fred, doing the balloons for this little temporary tower doesn't make sense, because it isn't relevant to the... Chairperson Wilcox — Well it's going to be there, potentially for 2 years... Board Member Thayer — But if it's invisible at a certain number of feet... Board Member Riha — But they are really small, those anemometers... Chairperson Wilcox — The fact is the tower is going to be 164 feet, my guess is it will be above the existing tree canopy... Board Member Thayer — Oh yeah, but if it's only that big around, you won't see it, across the lake, or across the valley. Board Member Riha — I don't think you're going to see it. Board Member Hoffmann — I'm not sure. Alternate Member Erb — Okay, so let's make sure we don't and is this going to be enough over the tree canopy that we're going to have another blinking red light up there, also, at night. Mr. Abbett -- Due to the height, that would be needed. Mr. Couture — Yeah, the FAA requires anything over 200 feet has to have a light on it. PB 4 -18 -07 Pg. 37 Alternate Member Erb — Okay. Board Member Conneman — Is the 300 feet above that too? You have to have a light on if you do put a windfarm there, or whatever you want to call it? Mr. Abbett — Any structure over 200 feet has to be fit, according to FAA code. Board Member Conneman — So there would be lights on the eventual thing if it proved out to be ... what you would request. Mr. Couture — We would have to put on a single blinking light, yes. Board Member Howe — But they are really two separate issues. Chairperson Wilcox — Right. Alternate Member Erb — is your equipment self - contained recording equipment or is this any form of a transponder and you know it's not going to interfere with the communication tower? Mr. Abbett — What it is, and I have, I had, there's one picture in the actual proposal and I have some more, unfortunately I didn't make 20 copies, but, essentially it's a self - contained unit. There's a box, a logger box, that collects all of the data at the bottom of the tower, essentially about this size, (he indicates approximately 5 "x5 "). There is a solar panel on the front of the box that charges the batteries. There's no electric connection to the tower itself and all the data is sent via a cellular communication device not unlike a normal cell phone communication device which sends that data, emails it our company, so no one has to actually go there and retrieve the data, it's sent to us and it's self- contained. Board Member Thayer — It looks as if there are a lot of guywires. Is that a problem for birds, perhaps? Have you had any experience with that? Mr. Abbett — I can't say we've had any experience with that being a problem. We've installed 300+ towers in the Northeast in the last 5 years and it has not been a problem so far. Board Member Thayer — What do you anchor the guywires? How do you do that into the ground? Mr. Abbett — There's a number of different ways depending, on the soil in the area. One would be a screw -in anchor which more or less is a bar that comes down to a curl thing that literally just screws into the ground and then it's removed afterwards. Another way is what's called arrowhead anchors. It's an anchor that is shaped like an arrow, like that, with a big pull attached to it. It is jack- hammered into the ground and the pull is removed so the wire is held by the anchor itself underneath. Another way is the rock anchor. Essentially if there is a large boulder in the area that can be used, they will drill a hole into that stone and then they'll put a piece of metal into it that has 2 hinges and its' squeezed together, and it creates an outward force that holds it into it. And the last PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 38 and probably not feasible option for this is using just concrete blocks that are put on the ground. Those are the 4 main ways that we do it. Alternate .Member Erb — Some of those sound difficult to remove from the spot. Mr. Abbett — The screw -in anchors are removable, the arrowhead anchors are left in the ground, the piece of metal for that anchor is left in the ground. The rock anchors are removable and the concrete blocks are removable. Board Member Hoffmann — I have a number of comments. I didn't go up and.look at the site now, but I've been up there quite a bit while we were looking at it for preparing the papers and the information to create a conservation zone there because of the. South Hill Swamp and I don't know if some of you who are fairly new on the Board are familiar with the South Hill Swamp,., I'm not surprised it was wet, it's a swamp. South Hill Swamp is a very interesting one because it's located at the top of a hill and it has a rim, it has a rim around it that holds the water and it has all these very interesting and unique characteristics and plants. I understand why this proposal calls for putting this temporary tower, and perhaps a permanent one at this point because it is the highest point of the hill and you can see the contours on this drawing which shows the Westman ... Wesley Ostman drawing of the Conservation Zone. But, in fact, it's just north of the most valuable part of the South Hill Swamp area and the Conservation Zone. And, there are, as you can see by the colored areas, there are very interesting plant communities further north of that too. What concerns me most about this at the moment is, clearing so much to be able to put this tower up in this very sensitive area, and (...When you say that one can dig up sedges and relocate them and then plant them back, I would like to hear from an expert, perhaps Mr. Confer would be willing to talk to us about this, it doesn't sound like something you do with wild plants successfully, so I am very curious about that. You mentioned the height of this tower compared to the communications tower. But, what I would like to know is, what is the height difference on the ground where the communications tower is placed and where this is proposed to be placed because the communications tower is much further north and there is quite a drop there, on the hillside. That would be interesting to know because I should think even though this tower, even the temporary one, is not as tall and not as visible by its diameter, I think it could be very visible as a bigger tower, if that turned out to be the spot where you wanted to put this tower. And it might also be visible by the fact that you clear out all the trees around it, from far away. I understand that this is a good thing to do. To try to use wind power as an alternative energy source. But to do it in one of the most valuable, or right near one of the most valuable areas in our, one of our most special Conservation Zones, is just not right to me. So like you said, one needs to weigh the advantages and disadvantages of each of those things and I would like. to see an alternative location used which is not so close to this very sensitive area. Chairperson Wilcox — Would it still be in the UNA? Board Member Hoffmann — I don't know. It depends on where and what other sensitive plants are there. But that's for them to look at and come back to us with some PB 9 -18 - ©7 Pg. 39 alternative, better suggestion. But I don't like this one at all, for the reasons that I stated. Alternate Member Erb — I would also like to hear some clear plans on removing this structure after 2 years. Chairperson Wilcox — After 3 months to 2 years. Alternate Member Erb — Yes. Chairperson Wilcox — Let me revise something I said before. I said floating some balloons and. taking some pictures would be reasonable. Given that the fact that it's only 6" in diameter, maybe just a photo simulation of what it would look like might be sufficient and if you could get some pictures from the other hills and simulate... Board Member Thayer — How far away you can actually see this. That would be interesting.. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, given that it's only 6" in diameter and given it's color, yeah, show me that you can't really see it. I like Eva's suggestion about how high is this thing going to look. The fact that it's roughly 30 feet shorter than the communications tower doesn't mean it may not appear higher given the various elevations. I also want to point out, I think We need to be very clear here, that this Board could grant the approval to put up this temporary tower, but that doesn't commit this Board in the future, or Boards after this one with other people, it doesn't commit that Board to approving a wind turbine. I mean, it's possible you come back in and want 225, that's what you said, 225 — 300 feet and the Board is constituted at that time, or the zoning laws at that time, may make it so that you do the research and then you don't get the approval, and you understand that, of course. Mr. Couture — Yup. Chairperson Wilcox —That any approval does not commit us to the future. We certainly can not do that and would not do that to another Board. Alternate Member Erb— Why, in fact, is this test tower so much shorter than the proposed... than the tower it is supposed to be testing? Mr. Abbett — Well they do have (inaudible) towers, actually, right now, this is a 15 year... (inaudible) 200 feet is now the industry standard for windfarms and measuring. Essentially we match our studies and our measurements to the investment of the project. A large windfarm is going to put up a number of towers higher in the air., as close to the height as they can to the height of the center of the wind turbine. For this, for example, we're putting up this tower to measure the data and, typically you would measure it for 2 years, we're giving ourselves flexibility, but we're looking to get a correlation of data, a short term stream of data to be correlated to a longer term data and we can get a comfortable set of what that wind resource is. We're able to, we actually have an anemometer that., three different heights on the tower, and what that PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 40 allows us to do is calculate something called shear, which is something that, you know, what the difference is from this to this, this to this, and therefore we can determine what the wind speed would be at much higher heights on the tower. Alternate Member Erb — So you're proposing to extrapolate beyond the observable data. Mr. Abbett — correct. Board Member Riha — But the log of the wind speed profile is extremely... Alternate Member Erb — Predictable? Board Member Riha — Yes. And you're outside the surface boundary there. They're trying to get it up above the vegetation.. It's like the standard thing to do. Board Member Talty — I have a couple of questions. Go ahead George ... I have multiple questions. Board Member Conneman — Well I was going to say it seems to me that we have to know something about what these eventual towers might look like because they might just be really ugly from every place. Mr. Couture — I just want to clarify, if things work out and we find this to be a great location and it is approved by the Town, we only want to put up one wind tower. We're not proposing that a wind farm go up behind Ithaca College property. I just want to make sure that everyone in clear on that. Eventually we would like to put up just one wind turbine. Mr. Kanter — One big one. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, one tall one. Board Member Thayer — And they do stick way up there. Ugly. Alternate Member Erb — I mean, I would rather it were a taller tower based in a less sensitive location. That's the truth. Board Member Conneman — Well how much electricity can you generate with one wind tower? Alternate Member Erb — well you said 2 megawatts? Board Member Conneman — A lot with... Mr. Couture — We would try to take a look at a turbine that would go 1 Y2 to 2 megawatts. Alternate Member Erb — And that represents what of the Ithaca College... PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 41 Mr. Couture — It would represent roughly between 7% and 10% of the amount of I that we use in a given year. Board Member Talty — And how long would that take for you to recoup the cost of the turbine? Mr. Abbett — That's what the study is actually. ..the purpose of... .Board Member Talty — You must know ... you're a professional, you must know that. Mr. Abbett — I mean, we have initial assessments yeah ... around 10 years, could be 12, plus or minus a couple of years. Board Member Talty — Okay, because that was one of my questions, George. And the other question I have is; I have seen multiple occasions where these turbines are broken. Multiple times. Or they're not functioning at all. So, does that incorporate what you're telling me on recouping the loss? Or is that maximum output? Mr. Abbett — You mean broken as in not running or not windy and not spinning? Board Member Talty — Broken means broken. Not able to work. Mr. Abbett — Well, I mean, it's in the best interests of Ithaca College and us to have a working project. We have an operations and maintenance plan to keep the turbines spinning. Should something happen to it, essentially, in order to get that money back they have to make sure it's working and producing power. Board Member Talty — But it might ... my point is that, if there is a high maintenance cost, it may not be feasible to continue the project over its lifetime in order to recoup the money that they have invested into it. Do you understand what I mean? So I don't want something that this Board approves, and then all of a sudden they disband the project. Do you understand what I'm saying? Mr. Abbett — Yes. And, you know, we're getting a little ahead of ourselves but, you know, there would be bonding involved and there would be some sort of, something in place that would make sure that turbine would be removed should it not continue to turn or something happened to it. Board Member Talty — You're right. I can assure you. The other thing is; are all turbines props? Are they all propped? Mr. Abbett — No there's, there's something called a vertical axis turbine as well, which more or less turns around something like this, (demonstrates horizontal turn) instead of like this (demonstrates vertical turn). This 3- bladed design that we typically look at, it's called the Danish design, is what the industry has typically fallen back to time and time again as far as the most efficient for wind produced power. But there are other ... not... in this size class, there really isn't vertical axis turbines. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 42 Board Member Talty — Just as a general comment. Being on the Board for 7 years, I can not believe that we are considering this, given every other single project that has come in front of me, that has to do ' with any type of height, in the. Town of Ithaca community ... we are constantly monitoring and giving overall descriptions and opinions of things that are much less obtrusive than this particular item, whether it's the test or the final product itself. And I understand the need for alternative sources of power but... will never vote for this. I can assure you: Given to see how these wind turbines are in other parts of the country. So I just want you to know that up front. Chairperson Wilcox — Umm ... Before we go on ... it's possible that you may now have to recuse yourself... Board Member Talty - That's fine. Chairperson Wilcox -- ...from any other. discussion of this... Board Member Talty — That's fine. Chairperson Wilcox - -... based upon what you just said. Board Member Talty — That's fine because I will not vote for the... Chairperson Wilcox — You have pre - judged, and I think George got into the same thing... You've now prejudged... you may not be able to... Board Member Conneman — I didn't prejudge anything. The issue is trade offs and that's not position. The trade off is how much electricity you really get and the trade off of how you invade the sensitive areas. It's a trade off. That's what the game's all about and all of economics in life. That's not a conflict of int... Chairperson Wilcox — No, no I meant the issue we got into with the proposed hotel. That's what I was saying. Remember when we had the proposed Remmington Inn? Board Member Conneman — Oh, yes, yes, yes... Chairperson Wilcox — And you issued... Board Member Conneman — But I wrote a letter... Chairperson Wilcox — No, no, I understand, but the problem was you made a statement... Board Member Conneman — Don't bring that up again. Chairperson Wilcox —Well, I have... Board Member Conneman — What does that have to do with anything? Chairperson Wilcox —The point is.... PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 43 Board Member Conneman — That has nothing to do with anything. Chairperson Wilcox — Hold on. Hold on. The reason I bring it up is Kevin just did the same thing. That's why I'm bringing it up probably should not, and may not participate essentially just did the same thing. That is; the information was available. and that's why I am saying to Kevin, he in any further discussion here, because he he prejudged the application before all of Board Member Talty — Well I will not vote for any type of testing apparatus. Chairperson Wilcox — I think I need you to be quiet too. Board Member Conneman — All I'm saying is that trade offs is a measure of a lot of things in life and that's what we look at. We look at what's good and what's bad and what you trade for one (inaudible) for another. That's an economic principle that people use all the time and that's it. I mean, I don't know, we don't have the data yet. Now, understand the reason why...there's a lot of wind blowing around. At least we have another developer in Town who has talked about all the wind that is available. I guess naturally... is that right? Do you have a... Mr. Abbett — Correct. There's websites with published wind data and that is usually our starting point and when I cited a potential payback for this project, I was using that wind data that is published. And that data is done in rather large rectangles and done over a rather large period, large areas so, essentially that makes a great starting point, but when you are talking about spending upwards of a million plus dollars on a wind turbine, you really want to get that onsite data that you can actually come with a solid determination of the economics of the project. The turbine you have, the data you might be referring to is John Ranchid, he has a 60 meter tower, which is one of the larger ones than we are proposing here. That's installed about 10 miles west of Ithaca. Board Member Conneman — Thank you, yes. Alternate Member Erb — Is there any potential for wind whistling past these guywires and the tower itself to be audible to the neighborhood? Mr. Abbett — The proposed site right now is over 1,500 feet from any nearby neighbors... Alternate Member Erb — So it's far enough away that it's not going to happen? Mr. Abbett — I can't deny that there might be, standing next to the tower itself, that there might be wind noise coming off the wires but... Alternate Member Erb — Heard at the residences? Mr. Abbett — No. At that distance there is no way there would be audible noise from the wires. And there is no additional noise from the tower itself. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 44 Board Member Hoffmann — I must say that I have been thinking about what you said, Hollis, about the height of the testing tower not being the height of an eventual, real, permanent tower, and I guess I don't quite understand why you don't test a taller tower to be able to really get the results you need. Mr. Abbett — It's more cost prohibitive to put up a tower that's say 70 -80 meters in the air. You're talking about clearing half the.hill. You know, we, this tower is I guess the smallest size we think we can get a comfortable number with and there is solid science behind the correlation of data and sharing that data upwards, so, it's just not feasible on that site, in my opinion, to get a taller tower and we feel, given the size of this project, that we can get comfortable enough with our data, with that size tower. Alternate Member Erb — But if... Chairperson Wilcox — Hold on ... Susan was saying something about the ability to extrapolate. Board Member Riha — Right, well, I worked on flux tower in the Amazon taller than this but ... the way wind speed changes as a function of height is something that is well know and especially if you have multiple sensors, you can get a very good relationship of how wind speed is going to change... Chairperson Wilcox — And therefore extrapolate and get it reasonably accurate. Okay. Board Member Hoffmann — But doesn't it also depend on what's around the tower... Board Member Riha — But that's why they're... that's why the tower is as tall as it is. They take that into account. The impact that the surface is going to have on the wind turbine. Alternate Member Erb — I think I just heard a statement that a taller tower would require clearing half the hill. Which makes me wonder ... even though this is for the test tower ... that really sent my skin crawling, when you said a taller tower would require clearing half the hill. Because ... I'm anticipating your next request for the actual wind turbine... Mr. Abbett — What I meant by that is, you go higher in the air, you need to get those guywires out farther from the tower. The actual turbine itself is erected from the base up. It's not an outward clearing, I mean, you have to access the site and have enough room to get that crane equipment in there, but, what I was referring to is larger towers end up getting a lot, much wider base and your talking about guywires going out from them. Chairperson Wilcox — That's an important point. Let's consider that. The footprint you provided us is a non - symmetrical diamond shape and that's because of the footprint of the guywires but also the need to lay the, to build the temporary structure on its side and hoist it up. A wind turbine, should one ever be built there, would be constructed using a crane, putting probably 10400t section on top of 10 -foot section, maybe larger sections... PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 45 Mr. Abbett — That's correct. Chairperson Wilcox — Okay so therefore wouldn't require, necessarily a larger footprint just because it was taller. Mr. Abbett — That's correct. Chairperson Wilcox — Okay. Board Member Howe — I'm really struggling with how, I mean, to me, I think the research is really valid and I'm trying to separate out, okay ... you Ive already stated there's no guarantee that if the research is successful that we would vote on ... so I'm really separating those out. Maybe that's no the way I should be approaching... Board Member Thayer - It seems like we are way ahead of the process. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, we are way ahead of ourselves, but we tend to do that, but the issue here is sketch plan review for a temporary tower 3 months to 2 years that will measure the conditions so that a determination can be made and at some point they may come back again for a tower. Alternate Member Erb — Yeah but... Chairperson Wilcox — Hold on ... (tape switch) Board Member. Hoffmann — Sometimes we call it planning ... (laughter).. 0 Board Member Thayer — That's true. Chairperson Wilcox — We've got to move on. Alternate Member Erb — I think I would really like a very clear delineation of the rim of the swamp and where does this site and its fall zone are going to be, relative to that rim. I think that's really important here. Chairperson Wilcox — I think we've covered, I'm sorry, someone else? I think we've covered most if not all of the things Michael, Mike Smith mentioned in his memo to us. The only exception might be the environmental assessment form and the long environmental assessment form may be appropriate... Mr. Smith — It wasn't really clear. I'm not sure, when I was looking at the long form, what additional information you would actually get out of that versus the other. Chairperson Wilcox — The short just... Mr. Smith - It seems like the additional information they would be providing... PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 46 Chairperson Wilcox — Would be provided no matter what, .whether it's part of the assessment form or just part of the materials that we have available when we do the environmental assessment. Mr. Smith — Right, and a lot of the long form really wouldn't apply to this type of project. Ms. Brock — The long form does have a visual assessment component that would be useful for this Board. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, we could just borrow the visual assessment from that and similar to the other information that we would require in order to make a determination. So maybe short form would be appropriate with visual assessment addendum and with the other information that we have stated that we would like to see. Mr. Kanter — And then the idea, whether it's short or long form because this would be, apparently, and unlisted action, as far as we can tell ... From there, once you get more information, then you have to decide whether you want to neg -dec it or pos -dec it, meaning, does it have a significant impact on the environment. If positive, then it would go an environmental impact statement. Alternate Member Erb,— Fred, can we get the issue of the wall? Chairperson Wilcox — Oh, the issue of the wall, yes, yes... Alternate Member Erb = Under the short form. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, yeah, but they can do that separately. It's entirely possible that those were farm fields up there, who knows when, and that was just the wall between the 2 parcels of the different farmers and if that's what it was, that's fine. There are houses there, then, you know, there could be all sorts of good archeological stuff there. Alternate Member Erb — Some of it is re- growth forest, after all, but... Mr. Kanter — You can, just to follow up, you can get to any of these issues that you've talked about through the short or the long ... the form doesn't really matter, it's the substance of the review. Chairperson Wilcox — Yeah, absolutely. Board Member Hoffmann — Anyway, I think I remember Mr. Monkemeyer saying, at some point, in one of his various proposals that he's come in with, that there was farm land there. Board Member Conneman — The chances of farmland being there is very great because... Board Member Riha — Because in 1930, 1940, eighty -five percent of the County was farm.... PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 47 Board Member Conneman -- ...because what you have is the lower part, which is now Ithaca College, being fields that were... they were cutting hay, and crops were planted up above there would be woods, but there would also be pasture, so they would build a, they would clear the field, put a stone wall for pasture. So that doesn't mean that... Board Member Thayer — some of those trees have been there for a long, long time for pasture. That one near the center of the site is like a 3 -trunk job, that big around... Board Member Conneman —Trees grow up. Chairperson Wilcox — We'll find out, what uses were...anything else Michael., we've covered everything you think? Mr. Smith — I think. Mr. Kanter — Do you want to refer to the 2 letters from the County, just for the record? One point that I think is in both of those that we didn't really talk about ... We did talk about the natural area characteristics a little bit, and rare and scarce species, but, I think one of the points that we really didn't focus on is the actual value of the Pitch Pine habitat itself or whatever the category is that Wesley and Ostman called it. It sounds like ifs more than just some individual, rare species. It's really the value of the whole Pitch Pine Oak community that they identified. So, I think it's going to be more than just transplanting some sedges. Chairperson Wilcox — I think that was more the point that I brought up before... Board Member Riha — Fred, Jon, I think she said that that was the only location of Pitch Pine in the County or even in the bigger area... Mr. Kanter —Yeah, on that hill, there are several different varieties of it on that South Hill Swamp area, yeah. Chairperson Wilcox — And this is an issue they need to address, is should it be moved? Can this area be protected? Can the number of trees displaced, I shouldn't say displaced, cut down, be minimized to such an extent that we as a Board feel comfortable? I don't know, but they need to look into this. Like I said, I'm not willing to trade one environmental asset for the construction of another environmental asset. Board Member Hoffmann — There's another point, also, that I just thought of. The area where the main part of the actual swamp is, is owned by Cornell University and I was wondering if anybody has contacted Cornell University about this proposal, because I am sure they would be very interested in knowing. Mr. Couture — Eventually we plan to talk to people from Cornell but we were just coming here tonight for sketch plan review to get feedback from the Planning Board as to areas that we would need to cover and answer for you. So we have not approached Cornell yet, we thought we'd come here first. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 48 Chairperson Wilcox — I want to point out that I didn't see anything on the proposed site that was wet, it was the access road that was wet. Alternate Member Erb — Mr. Whitmore does also mention the bird and bat impacts as well as visual, in his last paragraph... Chairperson Wilcox — I have a lot of editorial comment that I want to make about this letter, but I'll do that later. Ms. Brock —Well Fred, just following up a little bit on that. We did hear a little bit about guywires ... Do we want to require more information from the applicant about the effect of guywires on birds and bats? There is a local person, Bill Evans, who's actually done a lot of research on this, for example, and there are a number of documented instances where guide cell towers where birds, you know, large numbers of birds have collided with the guywires, so ... I leave it up to you to decide what, if anything, you want regarding this issue, but there are some who believe that it is a real issue. Board Member Hoffmann — Well, it's especially an issue then the tower is lit, because on foggy, rainy nights, all of the droplets in the air will reflect that light and the birds will get confused and they will fly around and around and hit the wires. Chairperson Wilcox — So do you think it's an issue, given that it won't be lit? Alternate Member Erb — Well I would like to hear from an expert that it would not be an issue. Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you. Done. Add another thing to your list. Board Member Hoffmann — There was something else...this is an Abbett question... Is this a metrological tower or a meteorological tower? Mr. Abbett — A meteorological actually. Board Member Hoffmann — so it has to do with studying weather and such, like meteorologist do? Mr. Abbett — Correct. Board Member Hoffmann — Okay, maybe we should... Mr. Kanter — However, the work metrologic has to do with measurement of things, so in that sense, this is the correct use of that word as well. Board Member Hoffmann — Well I looked the words up, actually, in the dictionary and metrology is the science of measures and weights. Meteorology is the science dealing with the atmosphere and it's phenomena including weather and climate. Mr. Kanter — We had the some... PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 49 (multiple people talking, indistinguishable) Chairperson Wilcox — We're running out of time ladies and gentlemen. There is a gentleman back there who's been dying to speak so I am going to give the public a brief chance to speak, which we do when we have sketch plan. Thank you gentlemen, have a seat, and I will give anybody in the public a chance to just offer some brief comments before we let you. I you're not going to. go Rick are you? You got to stick around. Chairperson Wilcox — Ladies and gentlemen, before you starL, this is not a, public hearing, nonetheless, we will give the public a chance to speak, which is what this Board often does, so, sir, have a seat, just your name again would be fine, since we already have your address... John Confer, 651 Hammond Hill Road, Brooktondale I retired very recently fro Ithaca College. I retired as Coordinator for the Environmental Studies /Environmental Science Program having created both. I have spent 37 years in what can truly be called backbreaking.work in the middle of the worst mosquitoes and black -flies in advancing environmental stability and biodiversity. It's been my life and I have, on some summers, when I did not have any funding, invested $15,000 of my own life savings, after taxes, to support my own research. I have lived environmental conservation for longer than many of the people expressing concerns about the environment have lived. There is no old growth forest on South Hill. Neither of the surveys have ever claimed that there was old growth forest. There are a couple of patches in which there are forests which have old growth attributes, which to an ecologist, is a vastly different thing than old growth. All of the forest there were cut and are no more. than 100 years old and coming back in succession. The Pitch Pine Oak Forest community in which this site is located is classified by the Natural Heritage Program as an S =4 community. It occurs at over 1,000 occurrences in New York and is apparently secure in its existence. It's one of the very common sights, ecosystems in New York. I have, actually, contacted, sorry Rick, to contradict you, Nancy Ostman, who is now retired from Cornell and Bob Wesley, who does, who's associated with Plantations, who have come out with my classes on South Hill and said, yeah, it would be a nice, idea to try to move the Sedges during the construction work, to a temporary site, grow them in the temporary site and put them back afterwards. These are the people that you have hired to look at the plants and decide that there are rare and endangered plants there and they have given me personal agreement, and you may ask them, I have spoken with Bob and Nancy about hiring them to mark every rare and endangered plant on this site and to involve students in the educational process, of moving them into a nursery that is fenced off from deer. I have spoken with the Chair of the Archeological Department who told me that he was really very distressed ... I think he used a more colorful term... He was very distressed that his department was not consulted when this Board approved the observation tower because they thought there were archeological sites there and absolutely mandated that the archeological, that the anthropology department, with its archeological orientation, be involved in the survey of the proposed site to see if there are any archeological .sites there, not that he expected to see them. Carigs is a sun - loving species. It does not like the Clearing the canopy, if anything, would be advantageous South Hill, the site that we are proposed for the tower beyond the rim, around the perched (inaudible) swamp. stormwater, have any contact with the Perched Swamp over 800 feet from the Perched (inaudible). PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 50 forest . canopy closing over it. to it . The drainage basins on construction is on the dep...is It would not, geologically, the Wide Oak Swamp. The site is Bird mortality, because I am an ornithologist and have had a series of grants from private State and Federal agencies to conduct research work...one of the research projects that I have done with Bill Evans, is, to look at mortality at the towers on King Road, considerable higher with long- duration lights on them. I had two student, one each year, go out every foggy night for a complete fall and we found, over two, years, two dead birds. Most of the mortality at towers occurs with towers higher than those on King Road and our tower would be lower than that. The lights ... the lights are a problem, indeed they are a considerable problem when they are on constantly. When they blink, as they do at Maple Ridge, at Lowviile, the lights themselves do not attract birds and that would be the kind of light on the wind tower, should that be ultimately constructed. Bill Evans just gave a talk last night and made notice that the Laboratory of Ornithology in which he repeated that observation, that blinking lights do not attract birds. The height of the towers ... there is no getting around it...it will be the most visible thing in Tompkins County. It will be a symbol of Tompkins County trying to find a way to get away from global warming and the vast destruction of the earth's ecosystem. And there are those people who I know of who say that these towers are attractive and indicate a commitment to sustainability and an alternative lifestyle and there are those people who hate them. I am reminded of a friend of mine, living in Ithaca... Chairperson Wilcox — Can I ... I got to keep you focused because we are running out of time and we still have one more thing to do. Mr. Confer — One more comment... who's son died of pediatric asthma induced by smoke from coal- burning power plants, and when you judge the aesthetic appeal or lack of appeal of wind power towers, I wish you would consider the 60,000 people who die in the United States from emissions from coal powered plants when we are anticipating increasing the rate of coal, electric generations from coal fire, electric plants at 1.4% for the next 20 years, with the alternative of using wind as an energy source. Thank you. Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you. Anyone else wish to speak? Rich DePaulo, 126 Northview Road I think they are going to need the wind generator to offset the electricity they use for all the new lighting on the athletic fields that they are proposing to build up there. But nonetheless, the reason I came up here was that, in checking the feasibility of residential windpower, I came upon a feasibility study that was done for EcoVillage and I don't know if any of you are familiar with that, but I know ... I direct this more toward the project developer, that I was wondering if that information was not known to them, I would certainly be willing to forward that as it probably contains a lot of information that PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 51 Might eliminate the need to do a duplicate work. So, I think there have been studies around here and at least some fundamental data might already be known, so... Beth Ellen Clark Joseph, 926 Steam Mill Road, Danby I have a prepared statement here, in support of the Ithaca College meteorological tower. I am a faculty member at Ithaca College and I've been looking at this idea for about 4 or 5 years now. I wanted to state, a statement that John and I prepared... Says that we applaud President and Peggy Williams for signing the TALVAR Declaration and the President's Climate Commitment which together commit our campus to build a more sustainable future. The environmental assessment of the construction. of the tower, to measure wind speeds on South Hill on Ithaca College lands is one step forward in our Comprehensive Environmental Plan. The results of these wind measurements will be one part of an assessment of the potential for wind power in this whole region and will help us educate students. about the process for reducing our footprint on natural ecosystems. As educators, we strive to illustrate the balance between social and environmental concerns related to energy consumption, the most vital challenge we face in the future. As members of the faculty at Ithaca College, we are excited and proud that the College is actually considering clean energy sources for its future. Thank you. Chairperson Wilcox — Can I have a copy? Is that possible? Thank you. Anybody else? Yes sir... David* ... how long do you need? Five minutes...okay....yeah, sure... Jim Bruno, 153 East King Road I am here just to, I just found out about this recently and I'd like to state that if there is a 300 foot wind turbine on South Hill, I'd consider it a beautiful thing if I looked out my window and saw it, My only concern was more from, is there any impact in terms of the noise from the turbine. I found out tonight that this tower is 1,500 foot from the nearest residence. I guess my only question, just, I know we're not talking about putting the turbine up tonight, but, the piece of information I wanted to get was, at 1,500 feet from the nearest residence, and particularly mine, at a 300 foot high turbine, is there a noise concern that I have to be concerned with? And that's it. Thank you. Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you sir. You might have been the person across the street who saw us all parking on ... yeah, near the pipeline ... we all marched in to look at the site. Did someone else raise their hand? Yes, yes sir. I should remind everybody that the friends of Ithaca College are waiting patiently to talk about their Athletic and Events Center, so, we are trying to get to that, so.. sir, please... Ross Hathoway, 178 Lexington Drive I was just wondering why it has to be where it is. Maybe you could put it on a building somewhere. I don't really know much about it but I just thought about it... Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you Ross. Will you make sure you day hello to your mom tonight when you get home. I worked with his mom for many many years. Alright. Yes. Chris Shapiro, 601 East State Street PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 52 I want to address the gentleman's question over there, about the noise from the wind turbine. This summer I worked on the Maple Ridge Wind Farm up in Loweville and actually lived on the Windfarm in a farm house. I was somewhere around 1,000 feet from the turbine at a level distance with no trees in the way. Also, the wind up in Lowerville is considerably stronger with a wind estimate probably somewhere around 10meters per second, I'm not sure the exact .wind estimate but I know around our estimates here, and it's much windier there which increases the sound of it. I had the window open and I was easily able to sleep whereas on East State Street I have the window closed and a couple of noise makers there, and I can still barely sleep. So, I just wanted to let you know that from a personal perspective, it is very comfortable to sleep and it's, I mean, I was not disturbed at all. Chairperson Wilcox — Thank you. We are getting ahead of ourselves aren't we. No, that's fine. Anybody else? Alright. Rick and ... who's the other gentleman:..) can't find him back there ... Are you guys all set? You got what you need? All set? Very good. We thank the public, we thank you very much and we will see you when you come back. Okay. We've got one more item tonight. I'm going to sign the students forms ... David....you need a couple of minutes to set up ?... Chairperson Wilcox announces the next agenda item at 9:32 p.m. UPDATE Presentation and update regarding the proposed Ithaca College Athletic a Events Center proiect. Ithaca College, Owner /Applicant; Richard Couture Rick Couture, Ithaca College David Herrick, TG Miller Engineers and Surveyors Mr. Herrick — I want to thank the Board for allowing this informal opportunity to bring back to you some adjustments, modifications, alterations, considerations, of alternatives to what we originally presented to the community earlier, very early this year. To my right is a copy of the Site Master Plan that was the basis of judging the project and considering significant impacts and the focus of our study for mitigation. To my left is the most recent development of a site plan that incorporates what we found to be alternatives in the development of the EIS studies. So, we have, principally, changes in the configuration of the building, and of the parking, and of the proximity of those properties on Coddington Road. You will recall from the original December '06 Master Plan, we had aggregated all of the parking in closer proximity to the Athletic & Events buildings and again, looking at alternative strategies for minimizing proximity to the neighbors, also looking at wetland avoidance, we came up with the plan to my left, which shows distributive parking across the campus. It does change the footprint of our site disturbance to be not just one locale but numerous locales across the campus. So, I will do the best I can here to point out where the changes are. Again, keep in mind that what we had shown as relatively large, single parking plan has now been reduced to one where there is parking immediate to the building on the east. More parking PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 53 adjacent to the building on the west and also, located adjacent to the Health & Fitness Center and in front of Boothroyd Hall which in some way mimics the existing condition that is there now which is known as M -Lot, if you're familiar with that portion of campus. We're also looking at modifications to what's known as Z -Lot, which is the Emerson fill site. There will be a modification of the existing C -Lot, and to go across the campus to the west, there will be an expansion of an existing S -Lot, next to the stormwater pond and further to the west, there is an opportunity to use some existing impervious area, modified to support parking. Right now, the location here adjacent to the turnabout in the main entrances, is the tennis courts and we are proposing new tennis courts adjacent to the track, and we can reclaim that area for parking as opposed to maintaining the tennis courts there. The F -Lot, which is near Dillingham Center, is currently temporary office space and those buildings that are a little more permanent than temporary, but with the completion of the Gateway Admin Building, there will be the opportunity to get rid of those facilities. So we are looking at expanding the parking at F -Lot at this end of campus. So, as a result of looking at alternative parking strategies, we have distributed it across the campus, which has some campus benefits, and it also helps to remove the footprint .of the original parking scheme from the Coddington Road neighborhood. The building footprint for Phase I of the project is essentially the same. It is the northern most appendage of these building spaces, and that is very consistent in its size and its scope and its placement on the site. The balance of the buildings, the future phases, that tend to run in east -west direction because, again, of separation distances and concerns with existing wetlands, are now more north -south oriented and, to the program, we have added ... I want to be careful there ... we haven't added to the program ... in lieu of the tennis court program being directly contiguous to the A &E Center, we have broken it off and located that building in the very last space south of the perimeter road. The perimeter loop road was another concern expressed by the residents in terms of proximity to the homes, and, our original plan anticipated that to the north, the perimeter loop road would drop down below the Emerson Suites and ultimately connect up to the driveway that serves the Campus Safety. The more contemporary plan eliminates that extension north of Emerson and now places it between the existing Z -Lot and the end of the dormitories here. So it's pulled the proximity further up hill and away from the neighboring properties. Ultimately, the loop road will find its way up to the end of J -Lot and this is going to be, again, a Phase III investment that will actually complete the entirety of the exterior loop around the campus. So those are the principal changes that we've been working on since we were last here to work through and agree on the Scoping document. Chairperson Wilcox — Can you bring the map ... that one...yeah...it's easier to compare the two. Thank you Dave. Mr. Herrick — So at this point we are closing in on a delivery date for the Draft Environmental Impact Statement, but felt that it would be worthwhile to bring this back PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 54 to the Board for one more look and opportunity to comment on the direction that we are moving in. There is a massive number of studies behind the work that you see here. There's a lot of other issues that were developed and raised through the Scoping Document that we will be able to address, but I felt that. it would be beneficial to bring this to you for one look before we go through the formal process of compiling that Environmental Impact Statement because it is ... it's considerable in scope and volume. Board Member Thayer — I would say thank you for listening. Chairperson Wilcox — Let me make sure we're clear. This is not a give and take to provide feedback. I mean, we sent them off with the Scoping Document, they're doing the Environmental Impact Statement... this is a courtesy to us, one because we want to know and two, I think they want to show off ... they want to show off what they've accomplished, and I don't blame them! They want to come in here and give us some good news and we want to hear it and the public wants to hear it so...We can ask questions, but again, our purpose here is not to sway them in some way. They're gong off and doing the work that we have already charged them with doing. But nonetheless, we can certainly ask questions if we want. Board Member Hoffmann - Two questions. This parking area here that you have shown, is that actually an expansion of the existing parking that we saw when we were up there on the site or.... Mr. Herrick — It is. Board Member Hoffmann — Okay. So it's not just that. ..it's a formalization of what was already informal parking... Mr. Herrick — That's correct. It's working within the footprint of what has been disturbed to date, but it's formalizing the parking. It is adding spaces and that is going to be the Colleges preferred location for long -term freshman parking and it will accommodate all of that need. Board Member Hoffmann — And my other question, that's the last one, is, this is all surface parking again and we had requested that you look at parking structures with several levels. Mr. Herrick — Correct. Board Member Hoffmann — Have you any of that here? Mr. Herrick — We have looked at that, and you will see a proposal for some structured parking in the document. It's not represented in this imagery because it's actually beneath one of the buildings. Board Member Hoffmann — Okay. Thanks, Alternate Member Erb — I was unclear by your statement, as I recall the old plan, there was some additional parking to what you already had in that plan. Are you saying that PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 55 there is even more surface parking now? Or are you just acknowledging that there was additional surface parking planned all along? Mr. Herrick — Well, the counts and this will become clear once we finalize our plan, but the counts are actually less than what we came to you with in December. We're still looking at a roughly 300 -space addition to the campus inventory, and I think before we had a larger number than that. Chairperson Wilcox — Members of the public... informally... yeah... go. Public — Can you show where Coddington Road is ... and then where the... Mr. Herrick — Which one would you like to look at? Public — The one you think you're going to build. Mr. Herrick — Door #1 or Door #2... Public Is that the one you figure you're going to try to... Mr. Herrick -. Coddington Raod is right here. Public — Where's the entrance off Coddington Road to Ithaca College? Mr. Herrick — Right here. Next to this detention pond. Public — And that will be the same entrance? Mr. Herrick — Correct. It's reworked a little bit, but it's the same general location. Public — And where's Juniper? Chairperson Wilcox — Off the map. Public — So there's no entrance across from juniper that would be connected all to that? Mr. Herrick — There is a bikeway that is proposed ... a walkway /bike path that is proposed in a subsequent phase to connect up to Coddington opposite Juniper. Across.. . Public — and where will that come out? Mr. Herrick — There's a spit of land that the College owns... Public — I live exactly across the street from there. So that's... they're planning a bike path there? Mr. Herrick — The plan is for a pedestrian path at that location to come out at Coddington, correct. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 56 Public — And how big ... a normal sized bike path or... Mr. Herrick — It will be somewhere between 8 — 10 feet in width. Something that Mr. Couture — Something like South Hill Walkway. Chairperson Wilcox — Mind you, we'll get the final plans at some point. Public — Right, but there's no plan for an entrance there for cars or anything? That's good. Mr. Herrick — No. Public — Do you have a map that represents what's there now? I saw that at the initial scoping session... Mr. Herrick — Well, I think I can demark here, in some way, what the limit is. ..this is Boothroyd Hall, that exists. This is the Garden Apartments. There's a line that essentially follows between that would indicate the old ... the old boundary between the Raponi property and the College property. Now, the existing gravel lot that exists which is the M -Lot extension, is principally right here. Public — Okay. What's that cleared area behind the (inaudible): Mr. Herrick — That would be a new javelin, discus and hammer throw area. Public — (inaudible) Chairperson Wilcox — That was a rhetorical question wasn't it... Public — I have a question about the loop road, actually. I don't see a loop road extending that far... Chairperson Wilcox — Let me caution, this is not a give and take, this does not provide feedback. This is them telling us where they are. You're welcome to take this but one, we're running out of time, two, they're doing this out of courtesy, three, they have a scoping document which has given them their marching orders. Public — Before there was a loop road that extends several hundred yards to the south (inaudible) ... I am asking for a response from (inaudible).... Mr. Herrick —That I s the limit of the loop road, right there. Public — Okay. Mr. Herrick — This is the water tower site. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 57 Public — (inaudible) ... that looks like a larger water area now. Is that a small pond or a large pond ...(inaudible)... Mr. Herrick — It's going to be a detention basin. Public — (inaudible ) Mr. Herrick — Yes, we do. Public — (inaudible)...the water will go... Mr. Herrick — The smart alecy answer is downhill. (laughter) No, we're very aware of the outfalls of the hillside watersheds that come down to the Coddington Road and we know that we need to mitigate the changes in hydrology from all of this disturbance. Public - (inaudible) ... underneath the back entrance there. It looks like (inaudible) ... most of it comes down, well, some of it comes down by my driveway, but I was just curious if there's a place where that's going to go to when we have a lot of rain. Mr. Herrick — There will. The outlet of that basin will have to be coordinated with the County's improvements too that may come at some time in the future. Public — (inaudible— Mr. Herrick — Well, we will definitely be digging up the majority of the entrance drive, probably form the sign all the way back in. I am expecting that if you look closely at this drawing, you can see how those alignments come together and it's probably going to be right up to the Coddington Road edge. Public — Is the javelin field proposed to be lighted? Mr. Herrick — No. Public — Excuse me, how far is it from whatever the last building is, the red one is, to Coddington Road? Mr. Herrick — From here to there? Public — I guess it's the tennis courts... Mr. Herrick — It's 300 feet. Public — 300 feet. Public — And that will be lighted? Mr. Herrick — Yes. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 58 Public — Boy that's a lot of trees ... that's a lot of area where that big pond is. You're going to clear out all the trees... Chairperson Wilcox — Wait a minute ... we need to thank them for taking this opportunity, and putting up, by the way, with this sort of Town Meeting form which I am letting go on here, which I normally don't. I thought it would work pretty well and they are being very accommodating to this, so I thank you. Yes. Public — (inaudible) Mr. Herrick — Yeah, the dark circles here help to identify where some of the parking improvements are going to be made. There will be certain landscaping required and provided... Public — So that's meant to represent trees and... Mr. Herrick — Yeah, correct: Public I have to say it addresses a number of our concerns. (inaudible) .......... i am still concerned with the hydrology in that area but... Mr. Herrick — Well, I didn't point out, there are numerous locations where changes in the siting of buildings is going to impact hydrology and one of them is here. You know, based on our previous discussions, we now of the situations along the backyards and we actually are going to come up with a new facility that will support the redefinition or redrawing of Z -Lot. Public — Is that also supposed to indicate some screening along C- Lot ... sort of along... Mr. Herrick — Right here? That's actually what we're proposing for a stormwater feature. Chairperson Wilcox — I don't think we are picking much up of this discussion anyway. No, we're picking you up David, we're not, we're probably not picking up the questions very well, but that's fine. Public — I'd like to say I applaud their effort, moving the parking lots and (inaudible) makes a huge difference and it's going to save that (inaudible) and I think your new design is infinitely better than your last one. I still would rather (inaudible) .... but I think you're doing a wonderful job, I am very pleased, thank you. Mr. Herrick — Along the line of Phasing, there will be, presented as part of the Phase I plan, the pool addition, which originally was anticipated to be in a subsequent phase, so we will be coming to you with the A &E Center and then the Pool Annex. So it's 2 years off... Public — (inaudible) ... improving that Z -Lot, is there going to be a change in the lighting there? That's been a concern of those of us nearby. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 59 Mr. Herrick — Yes. If we're going to invest in reorganizing and enhancing the parking then landscaping and lighting are going to come along with the new configuration. Mr. Kanter — I think some sort of lower lighting there than normal might be appropriate there because the hill is so high up, it was so built up, so maybe more lower lights might be better than fewer higher lights. Chairperson Wilcox — When do you anticipate submitting the Draft Environmental Impact Statement? I'll take.a range... Mr. Herrick — Well, our initial (inaudible) was July 15, and ... (laughter) ... It would be early October, mid - October. We want to get in ahead of the TGEIS ... we certainly want... Chairperson Wilcox — So let's say within a month, okay ... and that's when we will really get the details about how the proposal has changed. Alternate Member Erb — Would it be alright to ask now where the bus, where the major bus parking is going to be? Mr. Herrick — Yes and it's on the plan, it's right here in front of the drop -off area. It's long, deep diagonal parking. Chairperson Wilcox — I also want to remind you ... thank you very much for accommodating the way we are doing it right now ... when we eventually get to reviewing the Draft Environmental Impact Statement and making a determination whether it's complete or not, and getting the public input, we're going to go back to the more formal, you sit there one at a time and speak, they seemed willing and it seemed to be a good way to work this tonight, but, at some point we'll have a larger roomful of people and we'll have to be a little more formal in the way that we do things, but I thank you for coming. Any other questions? From... Alternate Member Erb — Will the Town Attorney be angry at us if we applaud? Chairperson Wilcox — I don't want to applaud yet... Ms. Brock — Yes, I would be angry. Chairperson Wilcox — The devil's in the details. Public — Is there any plan to do anything to Coddington Road? Chairperson Wilcox — The County is ... the County is considering improving Coddington Road. Public — I ca the northern first phase is believe it will been worked n speak to that if you want because I portion of that project is now being Troy Road to the Town line south be in the next TIP cycle for the n remi, am heavily ... the southern, excuse me, segmented in seven portions. So the TIP funding has been applied for, irthern portion, but the details haven't The project was neg -deced tonight, I have many (inaudible) issues PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 60 about that, but in theory, it happens, we were told, at least 5 years from now. That portion of the road, so ... (inaudible)... Chairperson Wilcox — Troy south is the easy portion to deal with. It's Troy back to the City limits it's the more difficult part of Coddington Road, which is this part right here, which the County is struggling with, given the lack of shoulders and the other issues in that area. Public — I just wondered if it would be possible to get, either at the Town offices tomorrow, or. ..Board members hand their copies out.... Chairperson Wilcox — It's time to go home isn't it ... YOU 're all set? Hold on'. .ladies and gentlemen, members of the public, you're all set? Questions have been asked, comments have been made.. take the copies with you and we'll see you when ... well if you turn it in within the next 3 or 4 weeks, we'll schedule the public session at some point for review. Very good. Thank you all very much. We have a couple more business items then we can get out of here. APPROVAL OF MINUTES Chairperson Wilcox — I hereby move approval of minutes form August 21St...seconded by Larry ... August 21 st ... we'll do them separately just in case....any discussion... all those in favor raise your hand... I have everybody except Eva.., those opposed ... abstentions ... Eva abstains... Ms. Brock — If Eva abstains, that means Hollis will vote... Alternate Member Erb — Hollis was there and was the voting member... Ms. Brock — So she should be able to vote... Chairperson Wilcox — That's right, it's 7 -0 because under the local law, if you abstain, I have to go to the... Ms. Brock —and she did vote... Chairperson Wilcox — And she did vote, so, that's right, you abstained, so I have to go to her ... 7 in favor, none against...thank you very much. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 61 ADOPTED RESOLUTION: PB RESOLUTION NO. 2007 = 101 APROVAL of MINUTES of AUGUST 21, 2007 TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD SEPTEMBER 18, 2007 MOTION made by Fred Wilcox, seconded by Larry Thayer. WHEREAS: The Town of Ithaca Planning Board has reviewed the draft minutes from August 21, 2007, and NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED: The Town of Ithaca Planning Board approves the minutes, with corrections, to be the final minutes of the meeting on August 21, 2007. A vote on the motion resulted as follows: AYES: Wilcox, Conneman, Thayer, Howe, Talty, Riha, and Erb. NAYS: None ABSTENTIONS: Hoffmann The Motion passed. Chairperson Wilcox — I hereby move the approval of the minutes of September 4th ... seconded by Larry...any changes... Board Member Hoffmann — Yes, I will still abstain because I wasn't there, but .I have my comments... Chairperson Wilcox — Eva abstains ... all those in favor, including Hollis ... there are no abstentions... the motion passes. ADOPTED RESOLUTION: PB RESOLUTION NO. 2007 = 102 APROVAL of MINUTES of September 4, 2007 TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD SEPTEMBER 18, 2007 MOTION made by Fred Wilcox, seconded by Larry Thayer, WHEREAS: The Town of Ithaca Planning Board has reviewed the draft minutes from September 4, 2007, and NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED: The Town of Ithaca Planning Board approves the minutes, with corrections, to be the final minutes of the meeting on September 4, 20071 A vote on the motion resulted as follows: PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 62 AYES: Wilcox, NAYS: None ABSTENTIONS: Conneman, Thayer, Howe, Talty, Riha, and Erb. Hoffmann The Motion passed. OTHER BUSINESS Chairperson Wilcox — Larry, you and I are going to Saratoga? Board Member Thayer — Not me. Chairperson Wilcox — Oh, George is going to Saratoga, for the New York Planning Federation Annual Conference... NEXT MEETING AGENDA Mr. Kanter — Cornell Sailing Center,. Final Approval; Conifer Village, Modification for a New Bus Turn Around Area; and the Moore Property on East Shore Drive. It was built slightly in a location not approved, so, you'll have to deal with that one. Chairperson Wilcox — How could that have happened... We'll find out. Mr. Kanter -- We'll find out and we'll have some commentary about the regulations themselves because it's pretty difficult to measure under water. Chairperson Wilcox — This is the one that we approved that didn't require any variances, or did, this was... Board Member Thayer — This was the easy one... Chairperson Wilcox — This was the easy one, sort to speak... Board Member Thayer — But it didn't work... Mr. Kanter — Let's see ... there may have been a portion of it that might have needed a variance... Ms. Brock — His lot might have been so narrow he couldn't meet the site setback requirements, but he didn't ask fora greater length... Mr. Kanter —It has to go back to the Zoning Board as well. I mean, it's a minor shift, it's just... Chairperson Wilcox— It's a shift. More than 3 feet or whatever it is... Mr. Kanter — Well, no, just because it was a variance and the condition was to have it at least 10 feet from the location, you can't use the 2 or 3 foot shift. Chairperson Wilcox — Gotcha. What else is on? PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 63 Mr. Kanter — That's it. Chairperson Wilcox — That's it ... wow ... boy...alright. Chairperson Wilcox — Anything else? Any other Business? Board Member Hoffmann — I brought along some pictures for those of you who may not have been up near East Hill Plaza and seen the trees that were cut down ... I will pass them around, because next time, if that lot is subdivided, a new owner might well be Cornell, who knows, and Cornell owns this property where they cut down a couple of, or three actually, perfectly lovely trees ... I assume Cornell authorized it ... there was this little guy with a pickup truck who cut down the trees and these are the remnants. I took the photo on April 5 t Chairperson Wilcox —This is the residential house... Board Member Hoffmann — Now you can just see some sawdust on the ground, you can't see that the trees were cut down, but his shows the wood lying on the ground. Chairperson Wilcox -That isolated rental property sitting there at the corner... Board Member Hoffmann — It's interesting, what happens is, people cut down the trees first and then they come in maybe, with a proposal for what to do with the land. Board Member Conneman — You mean they cut down the trees and... Alternate Member Erb — I have a question for the Attorney for the Town. There are nights when the Alternate Member sits, when there's actually somebody absent, and it's very clear then, that the Alternate Member should have a vote on the minutes. There are other nights where the Alternate Member votes during part of the meeting because of recusals, but not during the entire meeting. because someone is absent. And we just accepted my vote because I did in fact vote on part of last meeting, but I did not sit the, well actually, I sat for Eva the entire meeting, but tonight, I sat for only a part of the meeting... Ms. Brock — But you're present for the entire meeting so you're still qualified to vote, is my considered opinion. Alternate Member Erb — Okay. Whereas, a meeting in which I do not, where the alternate member does not vote at all....would be ... even if present... would that be a meeting in which the alternate member does not then vote on accepting the minutes? I'm just asking... Chairperson Wilcox — You know what... minutes... you can read the minutes, if, and people differ on minutes ... some people will abstain if they weren't at a meeting. Alternate Member Erb — Yes. PB 9 -18 -07 Pg. 64 Chairperson Wilcox — and that's fine. If somebody abstains, then the alternate, under the local law, passed by the Town Board, then votes. Now, let's be honest. The alternate could abstain too, and then there's no place to go. Alternate Member Erb — I just wanted to know how... Mr. Kanter — I think procedurally though, the way the law is written, is that it's the Planning Board Chair's responsibility to announce when the alternate is voting or acting as a voting member. And if it's and in and out thing, then you also should announce... Chairperson Wilcox — I should announce out, yeah...you're right. I should make it very clear when you're in, and I think we did that when Kevin recused himself. But l also have to remember when you're out, yeah, you're right, and I will try to make that clearer. Alternate Member Erb — And so, I'm just, seriously asking, when it comes to the votes on the minutes... Chairperson Wilcox — You can vote any way you want. I mean, it's personal preference. My only purpose is to get 4 so they are approved. Alternate Member Erb — I understand. I just wanted to be procedurally correct because I won't be the only alternate that shows up... Chairperson Wilcox — You probably made a good teacher's pet when you were younger too... Ms. Brock — That was out of order... Chairperson Wilcox — Of course it was out of order, why do you think I said it....laughter... Board Member Howe — Are we done? Alternate Member Erb — I was usually the one that the teacher had tutoring somebody else in the back of the room... Chairperson Wilcox — Motion to adjourn... ADJOURNMENT Meeting was adjourned, upon motion, at 10:05p.m. Submitted, by, Paulette Neilsen Deputy Town Clerk TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD 215 North Tioga Street Ithaca, New York 14850 Tuesday, September 18, 2007 AGENDA 7:00 P.M. Persons to be heard (no more than five minutes). 7:05 P.M. Presentation and update regarding the Cornell Transportation- focused Generic Environmental Impact Statement (T- GEIS). Kathryn Wolf, Trowbridge & Wolf, LLP, Presenter. 7:30 P.M. SEQR Determination: Ithaco Liquid Nitrogen Storage Tank, 950 Danby Road. 7:30 P.M. PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the proposed installation of a liquid nitrogen storage tank for Ithaco Space Systems Inc. located in the South Hill Business Campus at 950 Danby Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 39- 1 -1.1, Planned Development Zone No. 12. The proposal involves the installation of a 9,000 gallon, +/- 29 foot tall liquid nitrogen storage tank located on the southern corner of the building. The tank will be enclosed with concrete retaining walls and chain link fence and will include new landscaping. South Hill Business Campus, LLC, Owner /Applicant; George W. Breuhaus, Agent. 7:45 P.M. SEQR Determination: 2 -Lot Subdivision, 330 Pine Tree Road. 7:45 P.M. PUBLIC HEARING: Consideration of Preliminary and Final Subdivision Approval for the proposed 2- lot subdivision located at 330 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 62- 1 -3.2, Community Commercial Zone. The proposal involves subdividing the +/- 5.959 acre lot into two parcels consisting of a +/- 1.703 acre parcel, containing the existing Rite Aid Pharmacy, and a +/- 4.256 acre parcel located off Mitchell Street which would be available for future development. 1093 Group, LLC, Owner /Applicant. 8:00 P.M. Review of a sketch plan for the proposed Ithaca College Temporary Metrological Tower located at 144 King Road East between King Road East and the Ithaca College Campus, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 43 -1 -4, Conservation Zone. The proposal involves clearing approximately 0.8 acres of vegetation for the construction of a +/- 164 foot high metrological tower. The tower will be used to collect data such as wind speed, wind direction, and temperature for a period of time ranging from 3 months to 2 years. The study is to determine the feasibility of installing a wind turbine on Ithaca College owned lands in the future. Ithaca College, Owner /Applicant; Scott Abbett, Sustainable Energy Developments Inc., Agent. 8:30 P.M. Presentation and update regarding the proposed Ithaca College Athletic and Events Center project. Ithaca College, Owner /Applicant; Richard Couture, Agent. 9. Persons to be heard (continued from beginning of meeting if necessary). 10. Approval of Minutes: August 21, 2007 and September 4, 2007. 11. Other Business: 12, Adjournment. Jonathan Kanter, AICP Director of Planning 273 -1747 NOTE: IF ANY MEMBER OF THE PLANNING BOARD IS UNABLE TO ATTEND, PLEASE NOTIFY SANDY POLCE AT 273 -1747. (A quorum of four (4) members is necessary to conduct Planning Board business.) TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING Tuesday, September 18, 2007 By direction of the Chairperson of the Planning Board, NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN that Public Hearings will be held by the Planning Board of the Town of Ithaca on Tuesday, September 18, 2007, at 215 North Tioga Street, Ithaca, N.Y., at the following times and on the following matters: 7:30 P.M. Consideration of Preliminary and Final Site Plan Approval for the proposed installation of a liquid nitrogen storage tank for Ithaco Space Systems Inc. located in the South Hill Business Campus at 950 Danby Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 39- 1 -1.1, Planned Development Zone No. 12. The proposal involves the installation of a 9,000 gallon, +/- 29 foot tall liquid nitrogen storage tank located on the southern corner of the building. The tank will be enclosed with concrete retaining walls and chain link fence and will include new landscaping. South Hill Business Campus, LLC, Owner /Applicant; George W. Breuhaus, Agent. 7:45 P.M. Consideration of Preliminary and Final Subdivision Approval for the proposed 2 -lot subdivision located at 330 Pine Tree Road, Town of Ithaca Tax Parcel No. 62- 1 -3.2, Community Commercial Zone. The proposal involves subdividing the +/- 5.959 acre lot into two parcels consisting of a +/- 1.703 acre parcel, containing the existing Rite Aid Pharmacy, and a +/- 4.256 acre parcel located off Mitchell Street which would be available for future development. 1093 Group, LLC, Owner /Applicant. Said Planning Board will at said time and said place hear all persons in support of such matter or objections thereto. Persons may appear by agent or in person. Individuals with visual impairments, hearing impairments or other special needs, will be provided with assistance as necessary, upon request. Persons desiring assistance must make such a request not less than 48 hours prior to the time of the public hearing. Jonathan Kanter, AICP Director of Planning 273 -1747 Dated: Monday, September 10, 2007 Publish: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 We dnesday,Septemberl2 20071THEITHACAIOUR,. Town of Ithaca Planning Board 215 North Tioga Street September 18, 2007 7:00 p.m. PLEASE SIGN4N Please Print Clearly, Thank You ii ' M k R i A Al RO C�i ,&S t 41va toss �L, w e1 tf- �J�%1 y rd Address /, i I , "", :>I 1.41, A P �a &i tic h J-7. lV i 5'di 1 )eAsIlil Al 79 Lax_, I Z 6 N� rte„ , ,., RGt . /aC /s� 3 /OM 9 jda le L `, L' Sfean/) 401 Road hxc) NV 5 \l 4C4, k) TOWN OF ITHACA AFFIDAVIT OF POSTING AND PUBLICATION I, Sandra Polce, being duly sworn, depose and say that I am a Senior Typist for the Town of Ithaca, Tompkins County, New York; that the following Notice has been duly posted on the sign board of the Town of Ithaca and that said Notice has been duly published in the local newspaper, The Ithaca Journal. Notice of Public Hearings to be held by the Town of Ithaca Planning Board in the Town of Ithaca Town Hall 215 North Tioga Street Ithaca New York on Tuesday, September 18, 2007 commencing at 7:00 P.M., as per attached. Location of Sign Board used for Posting: Town Clerk Sign Board — 215 North Tioga Street. Date of Posting: September 10, 2007 Date of Publication: September 12, 2007 Qg�c, Sandra Polce, Senior Typist Town of Ithaca STATE OF NEW YORK) SS: COUNTY OF TOMPKINS) Sworn to and subscribed before me this 12`h day of September 2007, Notary Public CONNIE F. CLARK _ Notary Public, State of New York No. 01 CL6052878 Oualified in Tompkins County Commission Expires December 26, 20 ��