HomeMy WebLinkAboutPB Minutes 1972-02-08 TOWN OF ITHACA PLANNING BOARD
SPECIAL MEETING
February 8th , 1972
Present : Mrs . Barbara Holcomb , Chairman , Fred Scott , Robert Scannell ,
Arnold Albrecht , Daniel Baker , Jack Lowe , Monty Harris ,
Peter Francese , Nancy Fuller , acting secretary .
The meeting was called to order at 7 : 40 p . m . by Mrs .
Holcomb . Since this was a Special Meeting , no minutes were read .
The first order of business was a presentation by Mr .
Howard Warfielld , representative of Marine Midland Bank . Mr . Unnis
and Mr . Milligan , associates , requesting approval of plans and signs
for a branch of Marine Midland to be located near the corner of Judd
Falls and Elli :� Hollow Roads . They presented plans for the building
which are on file in the Town Office . They also displayed a colored
picture of the Time - Temperature signs proposed to be erected . The
sign itself is 7 feet high and 5 feet 6 inches wide , and is on a 10
foot pole . The signs can be stationary or revolving .
At .the conclusion of the Bank ' s presentation , Mrs . Holcomb
reviewed the previous discussions of the Ideman Laundromat building
with referenceto the two - storey building . The Marine Midland bank
will replace this building .
Mr . Robert Scannell moved that the Town Planning Board
rescind the original plan for Mr . Ideman ' s Laundromat that had a
second storey commercial area . Seconded by Mr . Harris . Carried
unanimously .
There followed a discussion with the officials from Marine
Midland re parking . There was the comment by Mr . Lowe that this Bank
was approved by the State Banking Authority , and that this is a
commercially zoned area . As to ditches and curbing , it was noted
that this is the County ' s right - of - way .
Mr . Fred Scott moved that the Town Planning Board recommend
to the Town Board that we accept the Site Plan from the Marine Midland
Bank , with the notations that Peter Francese has made on the plan ,
listed as follows
1 . That the: narking along Judd Falls Road be changed
so that parking is not closer than 30 feet from
the Judd Falls Road .
2 . That plantings along both Mitchell Street and Judd
Falls Road be low enough so that they do not obstruct
the sight lines for automobile traffic leaving the
bank to Mitchell Street ole Judd Falls Road ,
3 . That this motion for site plan approval does not
include approval for any signs .
Seconded by Mr . Scannell . Carried unanimously .
2 )
The next question was signs . Tars . Holcomb suggested that
the Planning :Board continue the discussion about signs at the
meeting of February 22nd , 1972 .
The next item of business was the proposed Zoning Ordinance .
Mrs „ Holcomb announced that this was the time for open
discussion of the Zoning Ordinance . She informed the public that
this was not a formal hearing . A formal hearing will be held after
the Zoning Ordinance has been presented in its final form . She
then opened the meeting for a question and answer period .
Mr . Sam Peter read a statement to the Planning Board
whereby he alleged that the residents of South Hill have paid the
highest taxes of anyone in the Town of Ithaca . Also , that the South
Hill residents have suffered the construction of a restaurant and
the development of the Monkmeyer property . He now feels it is an
" insult " that the Town is planning to put in a mobile home trailer
park .
Mrs . Holcomb responded by pointing out that neither Mr .
Monkmeyer nor Mr . Wiggans has made a request for a trailer park .
She made it clear that the Planning Board is suggesting the " R - 5 "
zoning .
At this point Peter Franoese tried to make a presentation
to the public describing why the planning board is proposing this
change . He was unable to make his presentation because of many
interruptions . Mr . Charles Timber and Mr . Peter directed many
questions at Mr . Francese .. M.. . Scannell asked that the public
remain quiet while Mr . I'nancese. made his presentat -ion .
Mr . Francese cescr -i_ be the. legalities cf the requirements
for mobile homes . N.e. ;toted that, the Qf ice of l' :-- ming Coordination
has recommended -', hat mo. ile hcr.•: es be provided j' or , He stated that he
felt such a provision was necessary for the survival of the Zoning
Ordinance , The� % e is eXisting water and sewer . He cited travel time
to available employment and the fact that Route 906B is a major
roadway .
the conclusion of his remarks , Mr . Frank Howell spoke
of his concerns for rt:hA South Hill area . He agreed that it would
seem proper to i1a. lre for mobile homes , but he questioned
the appropri. a: ter_ e .; s di st; ric is on Soya j : h Hill .
Pdr . Pater caor ke & i,?ho owned the l nd , 11r . Francese said
that there were several people involved btlt he did not know all
their names .
Mr . D:lh s Mated wi; hat "M. was cLre of the owners directly
involved and woaldered why it could not rema :;_ n " P. - 15 'r .
• Mr , William Harding stated that he thought the public was
getting into spE' cifics that they did not need to get into . He said
that he had information about zoning requirements and recommendations
• ( 3 )
and the Town Planning Board was making the problem deeper than
necessary , He! did not feel that the pressure to create mobile
home zones was as deep as the Board ha.d said ,
Old gentleman .from Comfort Road , He stated that he would
regret to have a mobile home park within 25 feet of his property .
He felt that there might be a need for only one area such as this
in the Town and suggested West King Road ( actually Sand Bank Road ) ,
Mr . Gostinian referred to the " R - 5 " area on the proposed
map and said that it was West King Road . He thought that the pro -
posed map was a final map .
Mr . Wall of Danby Road . He stated that he owns some of
the property involved , and asked where can the mobile homes go ? The
land , he said , is already covered by homes starting at the Town
Line and proceeding North . The only possibility could be the area
owned by Mr . Bethan ( on Sand Bank Road ,
Mr . Dick Compton spoke , He stated that he lives in the
City , but he has a lot of land across the road from the R - 5 " area
in Danby . He made a formal presentation . He presented a map over -
lay with " R - 15 " yellow , " R - 10 " orange , and red for " R - 5 " , He added
another over - lay showing the business area by spots . The business
spots were not near the two mobile home areas , He spoke for a long
. time urging the public to present their feelings quietly and care -
fully .
Mr . Peter asked Mr . Francese about the legality of mobile
homes and how he arrived at the conclusion that zoning them out is
not legal .
Mr . Compton stated that there is no legal requirement for
a zoning ordinance . He also stated that there is a protection if
zoning is made for mobile homes ,
Dorothy Zeh questioned the use of the argument by the
Planning Board that traffic conditions were appropriate for the area
to have a trailer park , and she asked the Planning Board to recall
that the Marine Midland Bank was denied because of traffic conditions .
Mrs . Holcomb clarified this point by stating that the
proposed bank was on a different section of Danby Road where the
traffic problem was quite different ,
One man said he was sure there would be a loss in property
value should a trailer park be installed in the areas ,
Mr . Frank Howell spoke at length about the feelings of the
.people of South Hill , and particularly himself , as being considered
_ second - class citizens . He personally was tired of such treatment .
He wanted it known that South Hill was not a junky area .
Mr . Dick Bourgeaux was concerned about the density question ,
In view of the Monkmeyer project he felt that this would create a
( 4 )
very heavy population within a small area .
. Mrs . Holcomb called the attention of the public to the Map
and the areas marked " P- 1 " . This is a land identification zone .
This is land over which the Town Board and the Planning Board have
no control . A. great deal of the area on the map is a " 12- 1 " zone ,
e . g . , Cemetery , Cornell University , Ithaca College , schools , hospital ,
churches , etc .
Mrs . John Kelley also said that she is tired of being a
second - class citizen . The traffic on Route 96B is continuous now
and a trailer court would make it even moreso . She pointed out that
the bank was not approved because of traffic .
Dr . Blauvelt of Danby Road , a professor at Ithaca College
stated that she had chosen to live on that part of South Hill because
it was a pleasant residential area near to the place where she was
employed . There were many other residents of that area there for the
same reason . She stated that she would regard her house as an
unsuitable residence should a trailer park be put in .
Mr . Timber asked why the Planning Board proposed extending
Compton Road ,
Mr . Harding pointed out to the Board that there was another
question that had not been discussed . There was being planned quite .
• a collection of proposed ring roads . In view of the proposed net -
work , the traffic could be quite different ten or fifteen years from
now . So , why not determine some " R - 5 " areas in the very extensive
" R - 15 " areas ?
Mr . -Poresky asked for a buffer of 100 feet . Mrs . Holcomb
pointed out that; such a buffer was there and she described it . It
is on page 16 .
Someone asked , "What is the procedure now ? l
Mrs . Holcomb replied as follows : There will be a continua -
tion of the discussion of the Zoning Ordinance at the next meeting ,
February 22nd , 1972 . The Planning Board will then work over the
proposed ordinance in light of the suggestions which have been made .
When in final form the Zoning Ordinance will be presented and a
formal public hearing . will be held .
Mr . Poresky asked if the plan can be subject to permissive
referendum . The question will be looked into .
Mrs . Beverly Livesay posed a question to the public . Could
there by any . other alternative to the question of mobile home parks ,
perhaps low income housing ?
Mr . Bethan replied that this would simply be another bill
to be laid on the! public .
Mr . Poresky suggested that they keep the density of the
mobile homes area, extremely low such as 10 , 000 feet .
1
( 5 )
. Mr ;n . Holcomb pointed out that it is presently 5 , 000 feet .
Mr „ John Vasse replied to someone ' s question of whether or
not the parks could be placed on West Hill . He drew everyone ' s
attention to the octupus . And he asked , why . not out East ?
Mr . Hywel White came with a prepared statement . He stated
that the prime question is the one of roads . The eastern end of
the proposed Forest Home By - Pass goes through woods . He would like
to be sure his alternative proposal will be kept in mind .
Mr . Vasse suggested a connecting road between West Haven
Road and Bundy Road . This way you could get to the hospital easier .
Mrs . Zeh thanked the Board .
At this point Mr . Herbert Mahr presented a formal proposal
for community zoning , a copy of which is attached and made a part
of the minute ;3 .
Mr . Francese thanked Mr . Mahr for this presentation and
added that he was very favorably impressed . There were some
comments from the audience . The Board was told that this kind of
approach has been used in other communities such as St . Louis , Tucson .
Coventry ( England ) . Mr . Scannell thought that the cost for the
• ring road would be prohibitive because of the hills in Ithaca . It
would be necessary to construct overheads .
Someone suggested that mobile home parks be a floating
zone .
Now , the meeting moved on to the discussion of the Sign
Ordinance .
The question was asked if billboards are legal on the
Danby Road . There are three . Mrs . Holcomb stated that those bill -
boards erected prior to 1958 are legal .
There followed a discussion of the proposed sign ordin -
ance .
Mrs . Holcomb reviewed the history of the FBC sign and
now the P & C :sign . The present ordinance is very limited with
regard to signs . There is great uncertainty as to how to proceed
to correct things which have already happened .
As a solution to this problem , Mrs . Holcomb proposed that
this tam law read : - - - - - - be removed or altered within one
year of the effective date . ( Section 17 )
Various signs , P & C , FBC , motels , would be nonconform -
ing uses .
Mr . Ed . King , attorney , stated that there is a legal
question here . There is no ordinance now , so one year could be
confiscatory .
w
s
i
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• Afl'. er discussion the proposal was accepted . There was
discussion oj' several different parts of the ordinance as to miss -
pelled words ,, clarification of wording , a few changes here and
there .
Mr . Scott moved that the Town Planning Board recommend
that we go with the Sign Ordinance as it has been amended .
Seconded by Mr . Baker . Carried unanimously ,
There then followed a discussion of the East Hill Plaza
signs and how they should conform with the sign ordinance as it may
be proposed .
Mr . Ed . King presented a formal proposal for the approval
of the existing sign and the pylon signs at the entrance .
Mr . Harris moved the following : The Planning Board notes
that neither of the sign proposals presented by Kennilworth
Associates for the two East Hill Plaza pylon signs and the FBC
store signs would meet the requirements of the proposed new sign
ordinance and recommends that the signs proposed be changed in size
so that they are in conformity with the proposed sign ordinance .
Seconded by Mr . Scott . Carried unanimously .
Mrs . Holcomb moved that the Town Planning Board recommend
to the Town Board that the site location proposed for the two
pylon signs is acceptable so long as it conforms to the provisions
of the proposed sign ordinance . Seconded by Mr . Scannell . Carried .
unanimously .
There was a motion to adjourn by Mr . Francese . Seconded
. by Mr . Lowe . Carried unanimously .
The :meeting was adjourned at 11 : 30 p . m .
Respectfully submitted ,
Nancy M . Fuller
Acting - Secretary .
•
17
_7
A Zoning Ordinance ?
. 1 . Road- Network ( Target - Date 1980 ? )
A designated set of "major ighways " : 55MPH ; limited access
( in the future ; see below ) . This set will connect commuters from
outlying towns with major employers ( Cornell , Ithaca College , etc . )
land the City . This set will connect major shopping areas and
industrial areas with each other and with Through- Highways .
, This set should be made public and should be known to every
S ,
1 potential buyer or developer .
Details : No more new contruction with access to major high-
ways (planned or existing ) should be permitted . Existing
housing or small industry ( gas stations , fruitstands , etc )
should be given time and encouragement ( tax credits ) for
phasing out or . " turmmng away " from mayor highway to feeder
roads in " communities " .
This whole ptoblem of existing contruction along designated
major highways is very serious and should be debated at
great lenght - - I3ut , note that without a plan of well - publi -
• cited major high-ways trffic would go all over town , in
addition to going through these designated azeas anyway .
A designated set of " secondary highways " ; these roads will
border communit: ies ( see below ) : Speed limit 3o MPH ; posted
: NO - thru - street. New dvelopment along these roads should be
, carefully zoned for " distance " and where possible develop -
iment should be discouraged in favor of " turning aruond "
; i towards feeder roads .
15 MPH ; within " communities " [ �.
Third class highways :
/
The road- network will allow every resident of the town to
get -via a short 15MPH stretch- - to a short 3oMPH road and then
to the 55 MPH net . This access tb a fast road would be much
faster than now , it will bother a minimum of other people
land it will still work in 15 years when the whole place is
? filled up with people .
Stt
2
2 . Communitiesl��^Nt ;
I . The Town of Ithaca will be subdivided into " communities " ct% ►ietjoilh� r � 6r. 1a ,
All communities will be zoned the same way . The whole spectrum
of modes of living ( one - or two family homes , small apart -
ments , large apartments , prefabs , low income housing , housing
) for the elderly , mobile homes ) etc ) will be allowed within each
icommunity , but: with definite minimum and maximum limits for
; each mode . The limits would be set by the Town Board , could be
4changed , but only for all communities in the Town equally .
In existing; communities that are completely built - up , non-
( existing modes; of living should be encouraged as properties
change hand or owners want to convert , everything within the al -
( lowed maximum and minimum limits .
This proposal will ensure the right of every town resident
to choose the mode of living he likes in the part of town he
• Mikes best , without encroaching too much on the right of
i
11another person who wants to be free to choose the way his
1neighbors should live .
' In consultation with present residents , prospective major
I11developers and tenants ( if known ) a plan should be drawn up
• ' ' for each community ( at a time specified by the Town Planning
!Board or at them latest by 198o ) to set aside land for a
" community - grounds :'
Details : All details of lot - size , size - restrictions for
cluster housing , etc . , of the present or proposed . zoning
ordinande should be carried over into regulations to , apply
within communities . Because max . and min . limits are set
already in general , it might be easier to enforce these
regulations .
If at all possible communities should have only one or two
exits into secondary or major highways ; within each community
speed limits on third class roads should be 15 MPH , enforced
by "bumps " across the roads . If at all possible , feeder roads
paralleling secondary or major highways should be built *
this would turn houses away from the major road towards the
cotrnnunity . Lets live as a society , not as individual highway
gazers .
1 ( I'{ Ilktb11UW1 : Sit �: � 7 � `/ � . wi , l " �I � IIt. � � � " Ij ��/), � J . / 1It' rillla . t4t .1 � .
l ,��a
it , li'/ 6C t1 ' I� i 1, tl Q1l i. a � 'f vY` �lrN �1 La li.. / ! { Il Ilk 11 / I . l � 'a�� 1 1` i l r � l'l � :' •'l
The community - grounds should be used for activities involving
all residents . Mixing of the aged with the kids , of students
. with " established " adults , teenagers taking interest in the
younger ones to teach them sports , occasional picknics or a
small fair , all this should be encouraged by planning . For
this purpose the Town Planning Board should visit each comm
munity and plan with them : Benches for older people , A stand
of woods inside the community might be preserved , foot pathy
many of these things could be encouraged as community acti
vities .
Further questions invove : Should utilities be underground
in communities ? Water and sewers ? Bicycle paths?
Wide - ranging plans for mass - transit in the 1980 ' s or 90 ' s
might be helped by planning pickup stops for each community now .
3 . Shopping Centers , Industry
Major shopping areas (B - areas ) and industry should be situated
at or near the intersection of TWO major highways . This
allows easy access by workers , shoppers , and out - of - town
1! 1; eople . Delivery trucks proceed from shopping center to
,1shopping center via major highways . .
No construction should start in an area until the two major
(highways straddling the area are FINISHED . .
Details : Only one or two exits , if possible with an extra
• lane , or to a " i. ecessedrshopping or industrial area . Under
ground utilities , excessive lighting , shrubs , etc ?
Light industry should be particularly attracted by the easy
workers and major highways . More thou
; access to wo � ht should g
a
be given ( and more planning space provided ) to place industry
� k
i . in the Town .
'Fel e
Presented to the Town of Ithaca Planning Board on ..1a $
1972 . ( dy ,0r, Ar,birql A10LAr0