Loading...
HomeMy WebLinkAbout1976-02-04 t GROTON ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS PUBLIC HEARING Held at the Town Hall Groton , N . Y . Wednesday , February 4 , 1976 at 8 : 00 P . M . PRESENT : G . Hoy - Chairman* D . Snell - Zoning Board of Appeals Officer* Janet Bell* J . Bell - Recording Clerk* F . Fouts * R . Bell Dorothy Higgins* G . Lawrence Bud Ostrander* R . J . Wilsen* * - Denotes those present . Mr . Hoy called the hearing to order at 8 P . M . and read aloud the Notice of Public Hearing which was published in the Journal and Courier on January 21 , 1976 , a copy of which is attached and made a part of these minutes . G . Hoy : Now if someone would like to explain the facts to us . B . Ostrander : The lot is 100 ft . wide and I guess zoning calls for 150 ft , and in 1950 the deeded lot was 100 ft . so couldn ' t buy any more land around it to make it what it ' s zoned for now . My understanding is if it was deeded in 1950 it ' s still a regular lot to put a single dwelling on . The Groton Business Association owns all the land around it , except for Avery ' s next door . The lot is 100 ft . wade by 348 . 5 depth . It was O . K . ' d by the Public Health Department right after I bought it and this is when they told me they would like 150 ft . frontage but seeing that it was deeded 20 years ago there wasn ' t much they could do about it so they gave me the permit for the septic system on the land at that time and I have the permit here with me I believe . (Mr . Ostrander showed the permit to the Zoning Board of Appeals ' members ) . D . Snell : A few years ago the Health Department didn ' t require 150 ft . but they require it now , same as the Town does . B . Ostrander : They required it at the time the permit was given out but said see - ing as how it was deeded 20 years ago and no way of getting another 50 ft . from anybody they would more or less have to give their permission and the drainage on the land is fantastic . G . Hoy : Your lot doesn ' t go over to the Old Stage Road , does it ? B . Ostrander : No , it ' s right off Chipmans ' Corners Road , G . Hoy : Where this house is here , that ' s on another lot ? B . Ostrander : Right . Coming from Groton would be this way , - -Avery lives right here and my lot is just ahead of his and the Groton Association owns the an 1 - Be Ostrander : rest around there . G . Hoy : And you have tried to get land ? Be Ostrander : I tried to from Milo and the Groton Association wasn ' t interested in selling 50 ft . I would have liked to have a little more frontage at that but the Health Department said I didn ' t need it since it was deeded way before , - - in the 50 ' s , - -which is why they went ahead and gave me a permit . In selling this lot to Mr . Wilson it ' s on the contingent that he can build a family dwelling which is why we are asking for the variance now . G . Hoy : Uh-huh . B . Ostrander : It has to be at least a $ 5 , 000 value dwelling and you couldn ' t even put an outhouse out there for $ 5 , 000 . It ' s a nice area . That ' s all I have to say . According to the regulations and zoning we need , or Mr . Wilson needs , a variance so he can build and I need it so I can sell my lot so he can built and I bought the lot to build on and he ' s buying it from me to build a house . Janet Bell : You are going to build yourself on that ? R . Wilsen : Yes , my interest is to put a single family ranch style home on it. which would be sold in the lower $ 30 , 000 bracket , - - strictly specula - tion . B . Ostrander : It would go along with the rest of the type houses out there . I have the abstract here and this is my line , and to show that it ' s a building lot of so many feet and so forth and that it ' s to build within 8 ft . north and south lines and 50 ft . from the road frontage . I guess Bill King owned the lot for 20 years . When I bought the land originally I was going to build out there but decided I didn ' t want to go into big financing at that time as I owned 2 houses in the Village so didn ' t feel I needed to go into any more . G . Hoy : This here would have to be reapproved , right ? Be Ostrander : I believe so , yes . I just showed you this to prove it was approved with the 100 ft . frontage . G . Hoy : How far back in the lot would you intend to build ? R . Wilsen : I have not placed the house on the lot yet . I ' m sure it would be in accordance with the rest of them . There ' s one other house on that side of the street . I think also the Health Department would come into this as to where to put the septic system and well . The first step is to get you folks to approve it and then go to the Health Department to get their approval before the building permit could be issued . I cannot tell you now how far back it would be . G . Hoy : Yes , I understand that now . There ' s one problem , - - even with good drainage , - - in time you might have to change the laterals and with such small frontage could be a problem there . These don ' t last forever and they do have to be rerouted . 2 - R . Wilsen : That could be . Is there any future planning for extension of sewer to that section ? D . Snell : Not that I heard of . Be Ostrander : Didn ' t the Groton Association want to build a trailer park out there ? At one time they were going to develop that whole area out there . G . Hoy : I think it ' s still in the planning . Be Ostrander : At that time I heard if they got the project they were going to get water and sewer out to there . It ' s all hearsay but that ' s what I heard . R . Wilsen : The septic system would have to be designed to the Health Department ' s standards . I understand the percolation is terrific . Be Ostrander : The percolation tests I had out there were , - - as fast as the water poured in there it was gone . The selling of the lot depends on whether we get the variance and also depends on whether we get the Health Department ' s permit and also Mr . Wilsen will go in and drill a well to make sure he can get water so we have a lot of things to hurdle here before we can actually even sell . I figured that the building lot permit should be really no problem because I bought the land in good faith that it would be a building lot and would like to sell it the same way . G . Hoy : Do you have any questions , Janet ? J . Bell : No . G . Hoy : Floyd ? F . Fouts : No . G . Hoy : I can ' t think of anything else we need to know right now . I guess we can adjourn this hearing if you have nothing more to add that will be all . Be Ostrander : How soon will we find out ? G . Hoy : We could possibly act on it tonight and we more than likely will . We want to discuss it a little while first and will let you know in the morning or as soon as possible . R . Wilsen : Do you have any other questions of me as the prospective buyer ? G . Hoy : Not that I can think of right now . It will be strictly speculation ? R . Wilsen : Yes . I ' m sure this would be something that would be a credit to the neighborhood , - -nothing that you would be ashamed of . Mr . Ostrander discussed the reasons he would like to get this straightened away and also said it would add to the Town ' s tax base much more than the $ 18 . per year he pays on it now . G . Hoy : We have guidelines we have to go by that are set up for us . If we bend over backwards on 50 fte like this there ' s possibly going to be lots of other problems that this could bring up . You see what We 3 SO G . Hoy : I ' m getting at ? Be Ostrander : At the time this was deeded that was all that was required , - - 100 ft . of frontage . That was the way they were lotted out . G . Hoy : The one on the corner is that ? Corner lots require more anyways , don ' t they ? Be Ostrander : I ' m sure the ones directly across the street are only 100 ft . frontage . Re . Wilsen : Do you have a tax map here ? D . Snell : Yes , but it ' s locked up in the vault . Be Ostrander : As I said before the Health Department said there was nothing we could do about it and now they want 150 ft . for any new lots but land that has already been deeded there isn ' t really much that they can do about it . G . Hoy : Why was this such an odd shaped lot ? Why so long? Be Ostrander : I have no idea . G . Hoy : Are there any up on the Stage Road at all ? Be Ostrander : I think the Association owns all the rest of that land outside of mine and Averys . Across the street there , = - they just built one house - - D . Snell : Rodee ' s . Wright has a subdivision up there . Be Ostrander : Where this was deeded back in 1947 there was nothing I could do and I did try to get more than 50 ft . G . Hoy : You haven ' t tried recently though ? Be Ostrander : No , because the last time I tried , - - G . Hoy : Even selling it to a prospective buyer if they know , - - if they should want to put anything on it they would have to get another variance . R . Wilsen : To build what on the lot ? G . Hoy : Anything else other than what you are going to build to begin with right now . Is there going to be a garage with the house ? R . Wilsen : Probably but in the event that there wasn ' t and they wanted to add one at a future date ? G . Hoy : That ' s right as long as frontage doesn ' t meet the legal requirements they would have to go through this again . R . Wilsen : Could Bud build on that now? G . Hoy : Not without going through this same thing . R . Wilsen : Even though he owned it prior to zoning ? G . Hoy : That ' s my understanding . - 4 - Be Ostrander : But even if a person wanted to build something else on it and ran it into the depth of the lot shouldn ' t be any problem , should there ? G . Hoy : No . D . Snell : You have to have a total of 20 ft . on the side lines , - - 8 ft . on one side and 12 ft . on the other . R . Wilsen : If it is a 50 ft . house and was put in the center of the lot and if a fellow that came and bought it wanted to build a 12 ft . garage would he have to come back? G . Hoy : Yes , - - as long as the frontage isn ' t legal he would still have to have a variance . Be Ostrander : Unless you put the house and garage all together then you wouldn ' t have to worry about it , - -right? G . Hoy : That ' s right . Be Ostrander : I hope you folks will O . K . the variance . G . Hoy : Well , we ' ll discuss it and let you know . The Public Hearing was adjourned at 8 : 28 P . M . Mr . Hoy called the Zoning Board meeting to order at 8 : 30 P .M . F . Fouts : Seems like they would have to build that just right . They can get as close as 8 ft . on one side . D . Snell : Well , like Rodees is 66 ft . if you get 20 ft . 8 ft . on one side and 12 ft . on the other there ' s 86 ft . You have 14 ft . to spare . G . Hoy : He has it to spare as far as that is concerned but lacks 50 ft . but the only thing is he has this deed to show it ' s been this size lot for this length of time and- -what are your feelingsoon _ it ? Janet Bell : What else can he do with it if he can ' t build on it and it was deeded back in the ' 50 ' s as a building lot , - - if he can ' t get any more land ? D . Snell : There isn ' t anything you can do with it . F . Fouts : It can just set there . D . Snell : Unless you rent it to someone for a garden . Janet Bell : He bought the lot in good faith . G . Hoy : He bought it long enough ago , - -he isn ' t trying to slip anything by us . D . Snell : I don ' t know whether you should ask an attorney what his opinion is on these lots that were given out before zoning . G . Hoy : How long do we have before we have to vote on this ? 10 days or D . Snell : I don ' t know . You have the regulations , I haven ' t . So 5 - G . Hoy : I know we have a certain length of time . We don ' t have to vote on it tonight . I think it would be a good idea to inquire a little bit as long as we know the situation now . I didn ' t realize he had the deed for as long back as he had . I just saw the For Sale sign and I thought , - - D . Snell : I knew that lot had been there for a long time , - - I think Gordon Mattoon owned it at one time . Janet Bell : He bought it in 1971 , - -when did zoning go in ? G . Hoy : In 1972 . Janet Bell : So , - - - G . Hoy : What do you feel , Floyd ? F . Fouts : I would like to have the other fellows here too . I think Dick and George ought to know about this too . Dana thinks there isn ' t much else we can do we should give it to them . What do you think ? G . Hoy : My opinion was , before I came down tonight , that they weren ' t going to get it without the 50 ft . but after listening to him and he did try to buy ity- - I ' d like to talk to Bucko and a few other people and get someone else ' s opinion on it . Janet Bell : How many houses in that area have been built on 100 ft . lots ? There must have been many houses that were built prior to the zoning , right ? D . Snell : I think the one right straight across - - Todds , - -I ' m sure that is a small lot . G . Hoy : I question a realtor coming in and wanting to build on a lot too small in an area like this . That is going to be one selling point that wouldn ' t go over very big , I would say . Janet Bell : But if there ' s ground around it , isn ' t going to make that much differ- ence . G . Hoy : But who ' s to say what the Groton Association will put in there ? Janet Bell : Maybe he ' s hoping to get rid of it before they start developing . G . Hoy : I definitely would like a little more time to think about it . How about you , Janet ? Janet Bell : Yes , I guess so . If no one feels very satisfied with their own thoughts maybe we might all better wait on it a little bit and think about it . I feel very sure in some respects but then in others I don ' t . I think it ' s a shame . G . Hoy : I think we owe him that much , - - to look into it a little bit before we go ahead and vote . We can enlighten ourselves a little more . F . Fouts : I think we ' re obligated to but on the other hand it would be better with a house on it then grown up in weeds if it ' s possible at all . D . Snell : That ' s low intensity up there . The regulations for low intensity say "Lots with no public sewer available . . . . . . . . . . . . . . " That gives you a Me 6 , D . Snell : little idea if the Health Department O . K . ' d . it because that is low intensity up there . G . Hoy : We do know there ' s gravel up there . F . Fouts : There ' s good drainage up there , no question about that . D . Snell : Now you take in agricultural , - - it doesn ' t read that way . I suppose they figure that out in farm land , - - G . Hoy : The area is there , - -you can get it if you pay enough . G . HOY : Does that change the situation any ? F . Fouts : We wouldn ' t be going far wrong according to that . D . Snell : Not if the Health Department O . K . s it . I would think it would be up to him to get the O . K . from the Health Department . G . Hoy : That ' s what he said but would have to update this application . D . Snell : Then they might hold out for 150 ft . frontage . Janet Bell : They didn ' t before . G . Hoy : Things are a little stricter now but so long as they said the soil and drainage is good it isn ' t so apt to plug up as other ones would in other areas . G . Hoy : Why don ' t we plan on meeting a week from tonight and �each one of us look into it a little bit more to satisfy ourselves so that we would be more sure of what we are doing ? D . Snell : You might be able to get Ben ' s opinion on it . G . Hoy : I think we have to act on another variance , - - the Darlings , - -we never did vote on that variance . D . Snell : I talked to them once and she said they decided not to buy anyways . They gave it up . But you should vote on it I would say to get it off your minutes . G . Hoy : Would one of you make a motion on it , - -whether to approve or disapprove the variance of Tom Darling ? F . Fouts : If they aren ' t interested any more , I move they we reject it . Janet Bell : I second the motion . Roll call was as follows : G . Hoy as Aye , J . Bell - Aye on F . Fouts - Aye . The motion was carried unanimously . Mr . Hoy adjourned the meeting at 8 : 45 P . M . Respectfully submitted , Jo eph ne Bell - 7 - 1 1No FOR OFFICE USE ONLY 1 APPLICATION FOR AREA VARIANCE Application No . Date Received (Z . B.A. ) To the Date County Referral L / 7 Zoning Board of Appeals Hearing Date— Date of Decision— r�? _ ( � 76 . _ Decision A . Statement of Ownership . The applicant(s)RICHARD . J . WILSEN ( pro osed buyer ) - BUD & SHIRLEY OSTRANDER ( present owners ) (is) (are) the owner(s) of property situated at the following address CHIPMAN CORNERS ROAD GROTON NEW YORK Town Farm Lot No, Subdivision Lot No. 121 - 1 - 2 Zoning . District Classification L The above-described property was •-acquired_ -by _.applicant(s) on Purchase agreement contingent on the use of the lot for building purposes . The agreement signed on 12 / 22 / 75 by Richard J . Wilsen , buyer and Bud and Shirley Ostrander , sellers . B. Request. Applicant(s) request(s) an area variance for the above-described property to permit the following : Richard J . Wilsen requests the right to build a one family , three bedroom . dwelling on : the present site . . as shown on the attached plan drawn to scale (see below for plot plan details) . C . Reason for Request. Note : The law requires that the following must be established in fact before a variance can be granted . (Ex- plain fully how your case conforms to the following conditions . ) 1 . Strict application of the provisions ' of the Zoning Ordinance would result in practical difficulties or un- necessary hardship inconsistent with the general purpose and intent of the Zoning Ordinance of the Zoning Ordinance of the Town of Groton forthe following reasons : The building lot size 100 ' x 3501 was purchased by Bud and Shirley Ostrander in 1971 . Zoning regulations now require at least 30 ; 000 _ sq . ft . and 1S0 ft , frontageconsequently_ the 100 ft . frontage on this lot does not comply . If Mr . Wilsen cannot use the lot for building_purposes he has no need for it and the Ostanders would not be able to sell the lot as such . r PUBLIC NOTICE �� HOMES TOWN OF GROTON PLEASE TAKE NOTICE that Dick Wilsen Real Estate, I rnc _ a public hearing will be held at 119 W . GREEN STREET the Town ' Hall , Conger, ITHAGA , NEW YORK 14850 Boulevard, Groton; New York by TELEPHONE RESIDENCE 844-9470 the Town Board of Appeals on the 607 272- 1 122 (APPOINTMENT ONLY) 4th day of February, 1976 at 8 : 00 P . M . on the application of Richard J . Wilsen for a variance RICHARD J . WILSEN , PRESIDENT of the Zoning Ordinance, Article LICENSED REAL ESTATE BROKER REALTOR VIII , Section 803, in regard to frontage . All persons interested - — -- - - - - - shall be heard. Gordon Hoy Chairman j-c-1-21 ICKunLs Y' RE9 _. INC. 106 Church Street Groton, N.Y. 13073 IJA RF/FLTORm f V� Telephone 898-3778 Associate Broker DOROTHY HIGGINS