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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1971-03-03 GROTON TOWN PLANNING BOARD MEETING Wednesday , March 3 , 1971 8 : 20 P . M . - 10 : 10 P . M . PRESENT : D . Carey - Chairman G . Totman R . Cotanch R . Gleason F . Scheffler J . Bell - Secretary A . Clark - Ithaca Journal D . Carey : Everybody ' s had the minutes of the last meeting ., - - did you have them , Frank ? F . Scheffler : I don ' t think so . (Mr . Carey gave him a copy of them to read ) . D . Carey : Have you read them , Ron ? R . Cotanch : Yes . D . Carey : Any corrections or omissions ? If not , they stand approved . I wonder if , for the record , we could have a resum6 of your meeting with the Town officials and other people in the community ; G . Totman : For the record , - - you want a report of the meeting of interested citizens concerning trailer parks to which some of us went ? R . Cotanch : 0 . K . D . Carey : How many of you attended it ? R . Cotanch : George and Hicks and Zana and I attended the meeting held in the Board of Directors ' room of the First National Bank last Wednesday , along with two people from the School System , one from the First National Bank and two from the Savings and Loan , and Mr . Munson and Ben Bucko . Did I leave anybody out ? G . Totman : The two you included from Savings and Loan - - Eddie Westlake and Durwood Stewart , R . Cotanch : We had an hour and a half discussion on trailers which was entered into by everybody present pretty enthusiastically and the consensus from that meeting was that the Planning Boards , as such , shouldn ' t have any part ,of anything that would transpire from thereon . Some of the people there expressed an interest in going to the Town Board meeting and asking the Town Board to take the situation of trailers in hand . D . Carey : That ' s about it ? Was there a recommendation made ? R . Cotanch : Munson had put it on to his agenda last Monday night and it was dis - cussed , I guess , according to the paper and they directed Ben Bucko = 1 W to draw up an ordinance which would prohibit placement of trailers on individual lots in the Town and , after that , the Town Board will have to have a public meeting on this recommendation and decide whether they want to approve or disapprove . D . Carey : So that ' s the status of it at the present time ? R . Cotanch : That ' s it right now . The reason expressed by the interested citizens ' group was the detriment to the tax base , especially on the school system and they were mainly concerned with the numbers of kids from trailers coming to the school and demanding services that the school and community supplies and not holding their own as far as taxes are concerned . I personally think that there is more to it than just simply deleting the section on the placement of trailers in the Town because there are several things more you might want to leave in as part of a future ordinance and all the trailers that are in the Town today will , of course , be able to remain there and I , for one , at least would like to see the possibility of any trailer that ' s here now up- dating it - - in other words , if they have a 10 x 40 and want to put in a 12 x 60 I see no reason why they shouldn ' t do that which would mean that you would have to make an allowance for that : Some discussion was held on this and Mr . Cotanch mentioned that according to Mr . Bucko you can fix it to say that all trailers have to be removed from the Town of Groton . F . Scheffler : Can you get them out if they want to change trailers by saying you can ' t replace it and that if the one there goes , that ' s it ? R . Cotanch : I guess you can . I ' m not in favor of that myself but what they will finally come up with is something else . You could say that after May 1st all trailers that are here now can remain and all others will have to be in a trailer park . G . Totma.n : I don ' t think that we can just make a law saying they can ' t so that the ones that are already here - - but I think , looking into the future , something could be done concerning the trailers already here that don ' t comply with any type of ordinance that if they want to replace their trailers any time they would have to comply with the ordinance . We have some right now on lots that couldn ' t comply and I think that situation should be looked into . R . Cotanch : Glenn made the statement that last year there had been 19 trailers approved for placement in the Town and one was pending . I would contend that there are quite a few that they don ' t know about and that doesn ' t include the five in Jacob ' s Trailer Park . So this is interesting as far as the 701 population increase is concerned . 25 trailers in the Town means we had 25 new ones just in the Town . F . Scheffler : In this trailer park up here ? D . Carey : That was started before we had an ordinance . F . Scheffler : Well , it was approved . They got the money for it . R . Cotanch : It ' s in operation . - 2 - D . Carey : But it doesn ' t meet the regulations by any means . R . Cotanch : He has done a fair job with what he had to work with . I think looking at his plans he didn ' t allow for - - he made right -angle corners and cars just don ' t go that way . More discussion was held on the trailer problem by all . D . Carey : We ' ll see what they come up with as far as changing the ordinance is concerned . R . Cotanch : There isn ' t going to be any discussion with the Planning Board , I don ' t think , unless Bucko comes to us with the final ordinance and asks us to read it over , which he may . G . Totman : I doubt it . R . Cotanch : It was mentioned that he might - - I doubt it - - don ' t think you have to worry about ! it for awhile . D . Carey : So much for that . Now in regard to recommendations that were made by Tom Niederkorn to the 701 . R . Cotanch : 0 . K . The following are our recommendations : Development - Intensity The Town and Village feel that the projected rate of growth will not impose any particular hardships or increased demand for services in the community . Existing community facilities in the Village are adequate to serve the existing population and much of the growth anticipated by 1995 . The Town recognizes the value of these exist - ing facilities and will try to encourage new growth to locate in and around the Village where these resources can be used to their full advantage , as well as centering it in the nearest skirting Hamlets . Housing The Town and Village recognize the existence of housing problems in the community and intend to investigate the specific nature and extent of these problems . If warranted , the Town and Village will use State and Federal housing programs to provide a variety of housing choices at prices both present and future residents can afford . (Mr . Cotanch then commented that he had also asked that Niederkorn ' s office suggest specific financing institutions that might help the Village with their housing programs . ) Commercial Development The potential of the Village as a commercial center and community focal point is recognized . A plan which capitalizes on this potential should be adopted which will provide long range guidelines for public and private investment and channel commercial development to the Village Center . = 3 = W Transportation The Community realizes the benefits which can accrue to the region as a whole by the relocation of Route 13 in any corridor north of Freeville . If this relocation does occur , the Town intends to work for good access from Groton to the new Route 13 , hopefully putting Route 13 into the . Homer interchange which is the recommendation of the Village Planning Board , this Board and both the Village and Town Boards . (Mr . Cotanch commented that this is a little bit in conflict with Niederkorn in that he has recommended that 13 swing south to Polkville from the north of McLean and has also recommended that an access road be built from that - - - - - - - - - - - - - - swing to 222 . ) Recreation Owasco Inlet and Fall Creek both offer the possibility of some recreation development and extensive open space conservation which could provide additional recreational resources for the Town , enhance the natural beauty of the Village and conserve two valuable resources for future generations . For these reasons , the Town and Village intend to protect these resources by purchase , easement or other means , and to select the most appropriate areas for development as recreation areas and for consideration of recreational areas to be set aside in the four Hamlets . ( Before Mr . Cotanch could go on to the next recommendation the following conversation took place : R . Gleason : What about the present Sykes Street site as a recreation area ? R . Cotanch : I wouldn ' t see where - - you mean to develop it further or to preserve it as it is ? R . Gleason : Well , possibly both . I ' m not sure but the Village does own quite a lot of land there . Some discussion was held on this by all present . R . Gleason : I guess I ' ll throw it in - - I don ' t know whether it comes in here or not but - - I talked - - we haven ' t gotten into it yet except when Niederkorn was up here last week and I asked him about agricultural development so I requested some information on what they might have - - I guess they called you , Art ? A . Clark : Yes , - - I called them back this afternoon . R . Gleason : What I was after was not about recreation - - what I was after was if not developing land use plans in the Town if they had any recommenda - tions or thoughts on the role of the forests , which is a commercial use and which goes along in the State , Somd discussion was held between Art Clark and Roger Gleason , and others with Mr . Gleason very concerned that there be something in our zoning for a method to prevent the proliferation of wood lots in many areas into very small plots and the preservation of our forest land . ) = 4 = R . Cotanch : Industry The Town and Village recognize that other communities in the region are competing for new industry and that , compared with Groton , some of these communities have more to offer in terms of available land , good transportation links and basic facilities and services . For this reason , the community does not intend to devote a major effort toward attracting new industrial development but will , instead , attempt to create the setting which will make the community more attractive to the industry that it now has and might also appeal to small industries seeking a new location . Land Use Control Because the impact of anticipated growth will be minimal in most of the Town , regulations related to land are desirable in the Town and Village of Groton and should be used to encourage growth in some areas and retard it in others . D . Carey : What is your pleasure in regard to the recommendations that the 701 Committee has made in reference to the recommendations made by Mr . Niederkorn ? F . Scheffler : First of all , I want to look them over . When you read them aloud I don ' t quite get it all . R . Gleason : Could you just run quickly through so I can check them off on my copy ? I feel that there should be something more said on agricultural . I think the figure said 75% of our area is in agriculture and that is quite a resource and if we have a good resource - Frank Scheffler asked about the interchange at Polkville and some discussion was held on this . R . Cotanch : I think Frank has brought up a good point indirectly . We haven ' t as yet - - this Board hasn ' t made a planning statement as to what they want the Town of Groton to be like 15 - 20 years from now . Do we want it to be a commercial area , - - do we want it to stay like it is , -are we willing to pay for it if we want it to stay like it is ? It ' s going to cost us both ways . If we get a lot of development we will have schools and services ' problems . F . Scheffler : You can ' t hardly picture this as a commercial community or ever becoming one ! R . Cotanch : It was , in the past . Roger Gleason discussed the Ithaca- Cortland corridor for the future and mentioned that Groton isn ' t in it at all . Some discussion was held on this by A . Clark , R . Gleason , R . Cotanch and others . D . Carey : Have you finished reading the recommendations , Frank ? F . Scheffler : Yes , pretty well , - - 0 . K . = 5 = R . Gleason said that since we have a good agricultural resource it should be protected , and from what he heard at the meetings in New York City that they are gradually coming to the concept that they are going to have to step in and preserve some of the agricultural land . Mr . Gleason will give his report on the New York City meet - ings at the next Town Planning Board meeting this month . D . Carey : What is your consensus in regard to the recommendations of the 701 Committee ? F . Scheffler : I move that they be accepted . R . Gleason : You don ' t want anything on agricultural use in here or on forestry ? That night I spoke to Tom and he said - A . Clark : I think that you have to be aware of that from now on he will be coming back to you with just reams of stuff to go over and check . I think his general recommendation doesn ' t exclude what you are worried about . R . Gleason : 0 . K . R . Cotanch : These are very broad recommendations . I think , like Art says , that from now on we will get ten times as much homework as we have now . D . Carey : Do I hear a second ? R . Gleason : May I ask just one question ? Exactly what ' are we doing ? We are approving this recommendation as a - - and just what is it ? G . Totman ; It ' s a planning policy . R . Cotanch : And the broad basis for future planning and zoning development . R . Gleason : This is what bothers me a little bit . I still think there has to be something in here - - as long as it ' s understood . A . Clark : In that last section could be something in there specifically re . the preservation of agricultural and forest land . R . Cotanch : This still is very broad and we haven ' t talked about anything specific here , - - agricultural or whatever . The regulations related for land use - - is about as broad a statement as you can get . A . Clark : I think that ' s as broad a statement as you can get on land use . More discussion was held on this by R . Gleason , F . Scheffler , G . Totma.n , D . Carey and others . D . Carey : Who will second the motion ? R . Gleason : I will second that motion . D . Carey : All in favor ? Motion carried . R . Cotanch : The special meeting that we had , I thought that the studies that were presented and the proposals that were made from the work that had been done up to that time was very well received by the 125 or so people that were there and we didn ' t have any real discouraging comments = 6 = A from anybody there . There were some that questioned the financing for the downtown renovation of Groton but still the proposals were made and well received . I am one who will sit back and wonder if anything is going to come of it . D . Carey : I talked to Frank and he says that after looking it over that so far as the area around the creek and so forth is concerned there ' s no reason why the Town couldn ' t buy trees and dig some holes and the Rotary Group plant the trees or make it a citizens ' participation project on this . A . Clark : I think that they think - - I think we have to have a good deal of community support for it but if we get the support it ' s possible . I also have the feeling after sitting back and assessing what we have done to date on this 701 project , that Mr . Niederkorn has the worst ahead of him . The tough part is yet to begin . R . Cotanch : As Town Planning Board representative I ' m one of them on this 701 Committee I talked with Tom about my feelings on how the Town should be zoned and also made it perfectly clear to him , and the representa - tives of the Village Planning Board ._ that any future meetings concern- ing zoning , I will discuss the Town and the Village will discuss the Village . I don ' t have any thoughts on the Village as I am not familiar with it , but my thoughts on the Town are we have mobile home regulations , subdivision regulations , junk yard regulations and so far as zoning is concerned should be very simple machinery that regulates only lot size and set back and enhances the possible development of the McLean area and 222 area and , perhaps , others we might think of but so far as - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - part of Town divided by 38 should remain farming as it is today . I would be very willing to defend that at any kind of a meeting but from now on even though the 701 Committee will be meeting together Niederkorn will also be meeting separately with the Village and the Town to develop separate zoning ordinances . D . Carey : Earlier Ron brought up a question I think we should discuss a little . We do not have a planning statement from our Planning Board . R . Cotanch : The implication is that the Groton Township is going to be a residential , agricultural community . D . Carey : In the Township we are not going to make recommendations for anything else - - recreation or anything else ? A . Clark : There is going to be associated commercial development - - will have to include that . G . Totman : It was also mentioned that we might possibly look into the recreation areas of Fall Creek and the 0wasco Inlet areas . R . Cotanch : Also if Route 13 does become a reality , there might then be some fall - off at the intersections of Groton Avenue and 222 . D . Carey : Did you ever get through the Bill - - that piece of legislature on Planning Boards , George? G . Totman : I forgot to bring it with me . Yes , I went through pretty much of = 7 = r • it . Dan ' s talking about the one where you had sectional meetings - - I forgot to bring that with me . D . Carey : Have you any recommendations on it ? G . Totman : My only recommendation is to tell them to forget it and leave it the way it is . D . Carey : If you can get it to Hicks or somebody else so they can read it too . G . Totman : 0 . K , Mr . Totman talked on what this Bill entailed and said what it winds up doing is to eliminate the need of local planning boards and that all they will be doing is going over what the State and Regional Planning Boards recommend and go along with them . D . Carey : Actually they have the review power over anything we do - - either the County , the area or the State . They want to make the local planning board an administrative board and get rid of the Board of Appeals and the Planning Board after the Town has adopted any regulatory program , we would have to enforce it . G . Totman : All it would be under that system would be a Planning Board of Appeals . More discussion was held on this by all . D . Carey : We haven ' t included Liguori in too much of our discussion as yet . I tried to get him to come to that special meeting but couldn ' t get him . A . Clark : The last time he was up I flayed him . D . Carey : Now on this survey we made on the commercial farms , I have been trying to push the Extension agent to get that thing written up . He was down in Liguouri ' s office and put me on this committee on the old houses and preservation of these two buildings and sent in our first report on maintaining the Boardman House . Some of these old structures should be maintained because of their historic value . I don ' t know what they will do with it from here on out but we did our part so I mentioned the fellow from the soil conservation was there and I asked him if he had gotten his part done on agricultural land use so we could get our report out - - area resource report - - and I guess he had so then Frank came out with a statement that they had and I think that the Extension agent had sent that to him and he hadn ' t evdn looked at it so we made some suggestions to try to strengthen the report a little bit but I hope they get that out because it has all been finished for Groton - - it ' s all been done except soil conservation and some of the others haven ' t got their part finished yet . D . Carey : Well , I ' m wondering - - don ' t know if they will do anything about this Bill at this session of the legislature but I would be opposed to it myself . G . Totman : The only way you wouldn ' t be opposed to it is if you want to get rid of your Planning Board and throw up your hands and say "Let the State take over . " R . Cotanch : Would we be in order , then , to so notify Connie Cook that we are in opposition ? = 8 = r D . Carey ; I think we should notify LaVerne and send a copy to her and Smith . More discussion was held on this by all present . D . Carey : Suppose we try to get this around so you can get a look at it before our next meeting and I ' ll write up something on this . R . Cotanch : We started to get into our planning policy statement . I think , probably , we ought to either make one or be thinking about it . G . Totman : I think we ought to make one at our next meeting . R . Gleason : We should perhaps - - one or two people - - sit down and really think about it beforehand . G . Totman : I think what we should do is come back at the next meeting with our individual thoughts and discuss it and make it right there . Some discussion was held regarding changing the date of our next meeting since it falls on St . Patrick ' s night and it was decided to hold it Tuesday night , the 16th , instead . D . Carey : Then we will meet Tuesday night , the 16th . R . Cotanch : 0 . K . D . Carey : Any further business ? R . Gleason ; I just want to bring up - - I spoke about this forest thing and maybe it isn ' t the time to do it but at some point I would like forest and agricultural - - it goes together - - where we could get a little more depth and discussion of just what might be a possible role of our planning on this . I ' m not sure just how to go about it , frankly that ' s one of the things I called the fellows in Conservation about - - if there is anything you would like to know about the value of the forests and so on one of the fellows would be willing to come over and talk to us . D . Carey : You don ' t know how it would tie in with the zoning law ? Some discussion was held on this and how it would work and what the goal should be by R . Gleason , A . Clark and others . G . Totman : What you are really looking for is some measure to preserve what forest land there is left in the Town of Groton unless it ' s used for recreation or such ? R . Gleason : Again the recreational part enters into it . D . Carey : Of course your forest land and whatever timber there is is owned by individuals . More discussion was held on this by all . G . Totman : You have a good idea and what you are talking about makes sense but , as I sit here and think about this - - at the past meetings you have been concerned about people not being able to buy land to put trailers = 9 = on and if you go in and tell the farmers they can ' t sell their forest land to people from New York City� you are discriminating there , too ! More discussion was held on this . D . Carey : Why don ' t we , at this point , appoint Roger , as a committee of one , to go into this and study it? G . Totman : You can tell Dan ' s been a politican ! It ' s a good thought but I think that you have to be careful . R . Gleason : If I talk to these fellows - - would you be interested in them coming to talk to you ? G . Totman : It should be a meeting where we don ' t have anything else . D . Carey : It ' s after ten o ' clock - - is there any further business ? R . Cotanch : No . D . Carey : The meeting is adjourned . Respectfully submitted , (11Jephine Bell a - 10 -