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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1987-09-15 GLENN H . MUNSON & SON , AUCTIONEERS 448 Locke Road ( Rt . 38 ) P . O . Box 127 Groton , New York 13073 Phone ( 607 ) - 898 - 3739 or ( 315 ) - 497 - 1331 September 15 , 1987 Town i f Gr' t it lzln Planning Br.lard Conger B � �_ilevard Grrlzltori , New Y �Drk. 130 723 Dear Bl_iard Members Q Encli.-Ised ar- e the dimensions cif the Robert 8 Margaret M . Kluge Real Estate Auct i p:jr, pr ,:, p fsa 1 fo rr the pr-topert y Itzicated at 690 Clark Street Extension , Grmiziti:in , New Yiz trrk . The auct it.-In was held .-in Friday , Septer,iber� 4 , 198 7 . Tax _ Map - # 17 . PARCEL # 1 - C r, sists 11 .f the 4 BR h me , 18 ' x i ' r*1 rt n building & large s '� r' V b • t 'r' Y'I with i`slppl'' , ximately v rAcr' es Rli� and. fr !=fnt - ue rf Clark Str' ee4cpp ' Cxlfat ? ly Cty � 1 , X ' ns PARCEL # 2 - C ; r, sists I Rppr� i_txir,lateiv 1E:, acres all t i 1 lable with r _ ad fr ,Dritage c of appr 'Dximr -Ately 4 Street Exter, si _tr, . PARCEL # 3 - Consists of apprczlxiriiatel -y 9 acres with road fry ir, tage of appre xinlatel. y 51C.) ' j:in Clar <. 5' ree Extension & 569 . 5 ' or, Salt Rr.lad . PARCEL # 4 - Cl.-Insists of approx irnately 9 acres with rpad fry Dntage or' appr _tximately 569 . J ' on Sait Rtzia =. ( PINK ) - Shows the section 44 Acre �� n _` f land previc� ,_! s1y s ��� 1d by Kluge to12 _ bcrts wi pp 1::1xirnately 700 ' of r goad fr [Dr, tage on Cla -rk Slur, e E_: x t e r, s i I_[ n „ The 4 parcels that were offered at auction were sold to� individual buyers . This results in the need f111 -t a five parcel sub -- divisi _ n . ( This includes the 44 acre tract sl::lld tcI Rober� ts ) . r*'ir . Lgruce Davis Ir, has been contrracted to perf ,_Wr,l a sure vey of the complete Tax Map Parcel with the i rid ividual parcels being identified . t ir,ie and clDr, sider^ at i _ir, in this rnatter is appreciated . What we are requesting tonight is appri_1val 1f the subdivisi 'Dr, pr-• Clp ',Dsal with the under, standing that a copy of the cizimpreted sur-tvey will be pr� ,_lvided "CC, you fc.W yc_"_tr recl::lyds and a copy to be filed with the Ccl ,_inty , once it has been ccnnnp1eted . Page Please feel free tci ccintact me if yr.O( U shy luld have any quest is lns . y time in this matter is appreciatecl . spectf- u11 , Rciber, t F • Wa 1 p .i '1 e Real Estate Manag r TOWN OF GROTON PLANNING BOARD Tuesday , September 15 , 1987 , 8 : 15 p . m . BOARD ( *present ) PULBIC present G . Totman* , Chairman Gary Wood , Zoning Enforcement M . Post* , Vice Chairman Officer , Town of Groton N . Ostrander , Core Secretary Roger Gleason C . Twigg Glenn Munson M . Carey* V . Rankin* Be Casolara G . TOTMAN , Chairman opened the Planning Board meeting at 8 : 15 p . m . The,Ili. minutes of the previous ; meeting , August 18 , 1987 , were read and approved on motion of M . CAREY and seconded by V . RANKIN . PROPOSED MAJOR SUBDIVISION at the northeast corner of Clark St . Ext . and Old Stage Rd * submitted by Roger Gleason , Tax Map No . 121 - 1 - 21 . 2 : ( Motion made after closing of a public hearing held this date at 8 : 00 p . m . ) M . POST made the motion the Planning Board approve the proposed major subdivision presented by ROGER GLEASON for the northeast corner of Clark St . Ext . and 101d Stage Rd . consisting of approximately 20 acres per the survey map presented to the Board , Tax Map No . 1214 -21 . 2 ; M . CAREY seconded the motion . VOTE : All in favor Motion carried PROPOSED MINOR SUBDIVISION proposed by ROGER GLEASON located at the southeast corner of Old Stage Rd . and Clark St . Ext * in the Town of Groton , Tax Map No . 1214 - 21 . 2 : R . GLEASON You see by the map ( copies � g ven tokthe.° Board members ) this is in the southeast corner of Old STage Rd . and Clark St . Ext . and consists of 2 parcels , one of 2 . 6 acres and one of 9 . 5 acres . The 9 . 5 acres - is a sale within the family . There is a grove situated in the northeast corner of the 9 . 5 acres and that is where they propose to locate a mobile home . It will not be visible from the road . G . TOTMAN : This sketch map has no dimensions on it . On the 9 . 5 acres what is the road frontage ? Is the same person going to own all of that ? R . GLEASON : " c <- Qne person will own the 9 . 5 acres . There will be two owners for the two lots . There is a scale of 1 inch equals 100 feet . There is something like 500 feet for the 92 acres . PLANNING BOARD - 2 - September 15 , 1987 G . TOTMAN : That ' s included in the trailer lot ? R . GLEASON : The trailer will be on the 9 . 5 acre . Maybe you are getting confused with that little dot . I -:.- simply indicated the grove of trees with that . G . TOTMAN : What I am saying is , someone is going to live in that trailer , right? R . GLEASON : Yes . G . TOTMAN : So you are going to have two dwellings on the 9 . 5 . R . GLEASON : No , only one dwelling on the 92 acres . G . TOTMAN : Then they will have to come in and get a permit for the trailer . R . GLEASON : Yes , but that won ' t happen until next year . G . TOTMAN : What we are concerned with now is the land and not the trailer . R . GLEASON : Originally Mr . Bennet , adjoining landowner , was going to buy a��Rparcel :around his land . We had it all set up for him to get the 92 acres then he• decided he did not want to , he did not feel he could afford to buy the whole thing , so we divided it UP * V . RANKIN : This is into 3 parcels then? R . GLEASON : No , two parcels ; 92 acres and 2 . 6 acres . Tax Map 12 . 1 is 2 . 9 acres sold to Bennetts previously . G . TOTMAN : What you are saying then is Parcel No . 2 is going to have over 500 foot of road frontage and Parcel No . 1 will have about 300 foot of road frontage on Old Stage Rd . R . GLEASON : Parcel No . 1 will have approximately 500 feet on Old Stage Rd . and Parcel No . 2 will have 500 feet . G . TOTMAN : Then this is not to scale . R . GLEASON ! ( measuring with tape : 1 in . = 9100 feet ) 500 feet frontage for Parcel No . 1 and 300 feet frontage for Parcel No . 2 - on Old Stage Rd . G . WOOD : If that is only 500 feet then that 9 . 5 acres can only be re - sub- divided once more . R . GLEASON : The other would be hard to subdivide with 200 feet on Clark St . Ext , G . TOTMAN : , You have 400 foot frontage on Old Stage Rd . and 200 foot on Clark St . PLANNING BOARD -3- September 15 , 1987 G . WOOD : The point is neither of those lots can be divided more than one more time . G . TOTMAN9 If they divide Parcel No . 1 again it will be 200 x 200 . G . WOOD : Unless the final survey comes out differently , as he says . An acre is 208 x 208 . R . GLEASON : With the topography of the land it would not be feasible for more than one house on the corner parcel ,: unless there is municipal sewer . G . TOTMAN : We will hear a motion now for whether to proceed with long form and have a public hearing or go through the short form and waive the public hearing: V . RANKIN : I see no reason for the long form . G . TOTMAN : Most of the same land owners are involved as with the previous proposal and according to Colleen Pierson , Town Clerk , all owners were notified of tonight ' s public hearing and none appeared . V . RANKIN made the motion the Planning Board proceed with the short form and waive a public hearing in the proposal for a minor subdivision proposed by ROGER GLEASON located at the southeast corner of Old Stage Rd . and Clark St . Ext . Tax Map , No . 121 - 1 -21 . 2 ; M . CAREY seconded the motion . VOTE : All in favor Motion carried M . CAREY made the motion the Planning Bard approve the proposed Minor Subdivision presented by ROGER GLEASON located at the southeast corner of Old Stage Rd . and Clark St . Ext . consisting of approximately 13 acres , Tax Map No . 1214 -21 . 2 ; V . RANKIN seconded the motion . DISCUSSION : M . POST : It seems like , Roger , you are turning around and'!-:doinga good job with the lots out there . You have been , in my personal opinion , more than generous about the $60 , 000 homes and all that kind of stuff . I-! ` think if I were in your position I wouldn ' t have boxed myself in quite that much . You are doing a good job with this development and now an opportunity has come along to put a mobile home on the property and even though there is a grove of trees there , it seems to violate the whole spirit and the idea of this development . I , m sure you have your reasons for that but you are opening the door just a little crack now by compromising on this one I have to wonder about the whole development , if it won ' t -ibe compromised and turn into one of these things that we don ' t want to see in this Town . These are my personal opinions , and they are not directed to you , it is just my feeling about the development because I felt we were doing some really good things here . PLANNING BOARD -4- September 15 , 1987 G . TOTMAN : Roger , you do understand that you have put into the application , you have made it a matter of record in the minutes that you are going to have the deeds made for all these other parcels that no trailers are allowed ? R . GLEASON ,* Right . G . TOTMAN : Except for that one lot . R . GLEASON : The reason for that is that they have a trailer on another lot , at the present time , and they don ' t feel at the present time they can afford to put in a house . They are going to put it on a foundation and it will be , their plans are that it will end up looking like a house . What ' ll I do ? M . POST : Those are your personal decisions but it . . . . . R . GLEASON : As aa;matter of fact I talked to Gary about it . The reason I decided to go with it is it will not be visible from the road . Consequently , I thought I could live with it . M . POST : Roger , if I , as an individual was looking for a home site 'An the Town of Groton and buy a piece of property and spend in the excess of $60 , 000 , I ' m not sure I would want to build in that kind of environment . R . GLEASON : You may be right , although there is a trailer on the corner at the present time . G . TOTMAN : Michael , looking at it in both ways , in most of the rest of the Town of Groton there isn ' t anyting saying that a house trailer can ' t be put up across the road . In this particular area where he is selling multiple lots he is putting restrictions in the deeds ; the rest of the lots do have the benefit of saying there is not going to be any more than that one trailer in there . There isn ' t anything like that in rest of the Town of Groton as far as I know . R . GLEASON : I1would like to add that this land , will not be likely , either the one on the north side of the road or the one here , the nine acres on the south side of Old Stage Rd . , is not likely to hve anything done for a minimum of five years and probably ten years because I have a lease back for farm use . It is highly unlikely that any houses will be built easterly other than maybe 3 houses and the trailer in the whole area , for at least five years and probably ten . That is the way it is for now . No further questions or discussion . VOTE : 3 for 1 opposed Motion carried PLANNING BOARD -5- September 15 , 1987 PROPOSED RURAL AG SUBDIVISION proposed by ROGER GLEASON located in the north- west corner of the intersection of Lick St . and Old Stage Rd . , Town of Groton , Tax Map No . 16- 1 - 18 . 12 : R . GLEASON : This is comprised of 35 acres . Two lots were sold off previously . I ' m putting it in as a Rural Subdivision . You might want to do dome counting , I was not sure . M . CAREY : Didn ' t you have five lots out of it when you put those 2 in before ? R . GLEASON : I m not sure . This one I am not sure about , `J8 . 11 was sold by Mr . MacMasters to my son . G . TOTMAN : That would not be included . R . GLEASON : That was sold before I bought the property so that first division was his . 18 . 2 is owned by MacMasters himself . Excuse me . Mr . MacMasters " originally sold - to . Mr : Zubal and retained 18 . 2 . I bought from Mr . Zubal and my son,=bought 18 . 11 from Mr . Zubal . G . TOTMAN : We are talking about from the time you bought it . R . GLEASON : 56 : 18 . 13 and this one in the southwest corner of 5 acres and the one marked Rood of 5 acres are 2 . So wilthkitheb 35 acres that makes 3 . M . CAREY : The Rood frontage is on Licko St . ? R . GLEASON : Yes , about 4 to 500 feet . M . CAREY : How come you decided to keep out these 5 acres ( referring to area in the north ) ? R . GLEASON : He was going to buy it then he decided he did not have enough money . M . POST : So that 5 acres is a parcel . R . GLEASON : It remains as part of mine . G . TOTMAN : You can go up to four parcels in a rural as long as 5 acres . R . GLEASON : YOu already had one that was less than five and that was originally a minor . M . POST : So this is not a new five acre parcel , Roger? R . GLEASON : No this will remain as part of the original parcel so there shouldn ' t be a line shown on the map . M . POST : So how may new parcels are you creating as a result of this ? PLANNING BOARD -6- September 15 , 1987 R . GLEASON : There is the 35 acres and one additional parcel . M . POST : What ' s left is part of the 35 acres ? R . GLEASON : Up until I actually submitted it he wasn ' t sure what he was going to do , :whether he was going for the whole thing . , that is why I submitted it this way,;. As of now the 5 acres will remain with the original parcel . V . RANKIN : This 35 acres is mostly woods ? R . GLEASON : Yes , 5 acres maybe 6 acres of level land . G . TOTMAN : Are there any reservations of making this a rural subdivision? M . CAREY : Does this require a public hearing? G . TOTMAN : Not if classified as a rural subdivision . M . POST : I have no problems with it . M . CAREY : z•. "r . qNo "problems . V . RANKIN : What about the rest of the road frontage ? on Lick St ? R . GLEASON : At this point I have no thoughts on it or plans for it . V . RANKIN : I have no more questions . M . POST made the motion the Planning Board approve the application for a Rural Subdivision presented by ROGER GLEASON located in the northwest corner of the intersection of Lick St . and Old STage Rd . , Town of Groton , Tax Map No . 16- 1 - 18 . 12 ; V . RANKIN seconded the motion . VOTE : All in favor Motion carried PROPOSED SUBDIVISION of ROBERT KLUGE propertyxlocated on northeast corner of the intersection of Clark St . Ext , and Salt Rd . presented by Munson Realty Tax Map No . 16- 1 - 26 . 1 : G . MUNSON : With the application , everything relates to the map presented at the August , 1987 meeting . I sent out a follow up letter late last month with the road frontages . At that time we had approximate acreages when we first submitted the plan to you . At the auction that was held on September 4 , those parcels were sold to individuals buyers . So we have 4 parcels that Munson Realty sold plus , Kluge himself sold 44 acres previous to our sale . So out of this tax map number we now have 5 parcels . So what we have to do is apply for a 5 parcel subdivision including the previously sold lot . PLANNING BOARD - 7- September 15 , 1987 G . TOTMAN : Which makes it a major subdivision . G . MUNSON : We weren ' t sure when we first applied whether it would be a rural ag or a major . It depended on the sale at the auction . G . TOTMANsI f ' it goes to a major that means a public hearing . G . MUNSON : There is no problem with us there . We just wanted to keep you apprised of what we are doing and to see what we have to do in order to follow the proper ;procedures . G . TOTMAN : Let me ask you a question . If this Board agrees with the preliminary plan that you now have submitted and they find its is okay in their judgment to submit to the public for a final subdivision , are you prepared to go that route ? G . MUNSON : Sure , we have already ordered the survey of the property which will show five individual lots on the one map . Bruce Davidson from Cortland is doing the field work . Mr . Mack is supposed to be getting to him the Abstract of Title so that he can get the map drawn up ; but it has been ordered . We will be willing as soon as we get the preliminary with the exact measurements on it from him to forward it right on to you . V . RANKIN : You have already auctioned it ? G . MUNSON : The auction was September 4 . V . RANKIN : So then these parcels are sold this way ? G . MUNSON : These parcels are sold but in the contract of the sale it is all sold subject to the approval of the Town of Groton Planning Board ' s approval of the subdivision proposal . So we protected both ourselves and Mr . Kluge and the purchasers of the parcels . We are working for Mr . Kluge so as a service to him we took care of his deal with Roberts . We just incorporated it with our subdivision proposal . Otherwise we �would only be here asking for 4 . We would be a rural subdivision for the part that WE actually handled . G . TOTMAN : Do you feel confortable in accepting this as a preliminary plat and setting up here in front of the public and presenting it to them as a major subdivision? M . POST : I do , it seems quite straight forward . V . RANKIN made the motion the Planning Board approve the preliminary plat of the ROBERT KLUGE major subdivision located at the northeast corner of Clark St . Ext . and Salt Rd . intersection Tax Map No . 16- 1 -26- 1 ; M . POST seconded the motion . VOTE : All in favor Motion carried PLANNING BOARD - 8- September 15 , 1987 Discussion among the Planning Board members concerning the changing of the regular monthly meeting date and a date for the public hearing on the Kluge subdivision . It was decided to change the regular monthly meeting of the Planning Board to the4THIRD THURSDAY OF THE MONTH beginning with the October , 1987 meeting . The public hearing for the KLUGE MAJOR SUBDIVISION PROPOSAL was set for Thursday , October 1 , 1987 at 8 : 00 p . m . ELEONOR PROPOSED MINOR .YSUBDIVISION presented by PHILIP MUNSON/on property located at 1364 Sovocool Hill Rd . , Town of Groton , Tax Map No . 33 - 1 - 1 G . TOTMAN : At the July meetingi on the presentation by Phil pnMunson on the subdivision proposal we were questioning about the strip of land in the back and .: road frontage . He has resubmitted his proposal with each lot a little over an acre of land , with 200 foot road frontage and they are all exactly the same size . The reason headid not come to the August meeting , according to him , was my fault . According to him he understood that as long as he had the proposal submitted he did not have to be here for the vote . He thought we could move on it without him being here because we knew just what he wanted because we had discussed it with him before . Which is probably true , but I did not have the same impression that he did so it was not acted upon at the last meeting . V . RANKIN : Is there any scale here ? Why he is keeping this back stretch is a question , it is no good to him it would be a whole lot better off for these people . There isn ' t much of anything back there but swamp . G . TOTMAN : They are all legal size lots . G . WOOD : That first one might not be , the first of the 200 x 220 lots . Because of the creek you may not be able to fit the 150 foot circle for the septic in there . G . TOTMAN : According to him he has checked with the Health Department and they agree with the way he is going to move the creek to fit it in there . V . RANKIN : There "should be no problem in moving the creek it has been moved before . It is manmade the Town put it in there for drainage . G . TOTMAN : Gary can correct me if I am wrong , but at this particular point we are not making a motion whether there are going to be trailers there or whatever . ,-,We are making the motion on whether the land that he is subdividing is legal . V . RANKIN made the motion the Planning Board procede with the short form and waive a public hearing on the proposed minor subdivision of ELEONOR MUNSON , 1364 Sovocool Hill Rd . Tax Map No . 33 - 1 - 1 ; M . CAREY seconded the motion VOTE : All in favor Motion carried PLANNING BOARD - 9. September 15 , 1987 M : CAREY : Gary , is there some reason we should not accept it ? G . WOOD : I don ' t see any . M . CAREY made the motion the Planning Board approve the the Minor Subdivision proposed by ELEONOR MUNSON at 1364 Sovocool Hill Rd . , Town of Groton , Tax Map No . 33 - 1 - 1 ; M . POST seconded the motion . VOTE : All in favoe Motion carried G . WOOD : I was asked by HERB ADAMSof Clark St . Ext . how he could give a piece of property to his daughter so that she could put a home on the property . The property is presently 210 foot frontage , 633 ft . dp on Clark St . Ext . I said you can ' t do that . Two or three phone calls later he came up with this proposal which I ' m passing on to you without comment at the moment . That is to crease a public road 60 foot =dend 635 feet d and create 2 legal lotsX�a� a&e_ w 4- r 200 fee4�ge an&"115 feet frontage on the new public street . G . TOTMAN : This public road he is talking about , is he going to build it g g to Town specifications ? G . WOOD : That would be a condition of approval unless you choose to waive it . M: r CAREY : Who would take care of it ? G . WOOD : It would be a Town road . V . RANKIN : The Town says in order to do this he would have to put in a road that meets the Town specifications before you can do anything else . G . WOOD : That would be my answer unless you choose to waive it , V: RANKIN : I don ' t think you can do that . You have to get fire and ambulance and other Town equipment there . ` G . TOTMAN : You have to have a cul-de - sac . G . WOOD : To establish this , ithe regulations require at least a turn around . V . RANKIN : Where is this located ? G . WOOD : On Clark St . Ext . east of the Salt Rd . intersection . G . TOTMAN : Getting back to the original proposal . You are looking at a piece of land that he wants to divide to °'shave 2 parcels for two homes . You ' re not looking at Mr . Rockefeller or Gleason or Adams PLANNING BOARD - 10- September 15 , 1987 you are looking at the land . You are looking at whether it is feasible or legal , according to books we have to go by , to say ' sure , if you build a road by Town specifications,and the Town Highway Superintendent accepts it , then you do have 2 pieces of land with 300 foot of road frontage which makes it legal . ' M . CARDY : Who would pay for building the road? G . WOOD : He would have to . G . TOTMAN : By doing it hat way , your bouncing the ball back into his court . You say"-Ito him ' once you satisfy the highway department and you have a legal road there , and you have legal frontages then we will act on this . ' G . WOOD : There may be another problem , George , do you remember what the maximum length of a dead end road is ? G . TOTMAN : I don ' t , I know it has to be 60 foot wide . G . WOOD : I mean the overall length , I think it is 700 foot , I ' ll have to look it up . Let me add one other comment , you are not being asked to approve or disapprove this but rather to give the man some guidance on what you would like to see him come back with . G . TOTMAN : Gary , correct me if I am wrong , but aren ' t a lot of towns and villages and cities required a ' T ' for snowplows to remove snow instead of cul-de- sacs ? G . WOOD : That seems to be pretty popular , yes . G . TOTMAN : Because of the fact that the snow , because they are going in a circle builds up ; where a ' T ' they can push the snow off the road . Our Ordinance shows a big cirle . The minimum diameter of what we require is 100 feet , the minimum outside diameter is 200 feet . M . POST : The regulations show he does not have enough frontage here and we say ' no you can ' t do it ' can he go to the ZBA and ask for a variance on low frontage . ` G . TOTMAN : The only people who have the power on a subdivision is the Planning Board , G . WOOD : It ' s not a subdivision because he is only asking to divide it in two . G . TOTMAN : If that is thecase he doesn ' t come to us at all he justapplies for a permit , Gary turns him down , then he goes to the ZBA for a variance . M . POST : That ' s the answer to my question of where the ZBA could fit in . PLANNING BOARD - 11 - September 15 , 1987 G . WOOD : v That is another possibility . G . TOTMAN : Going by the criteria that they have to go by , proving hardship and other things , there is no way - they would pass a variance . M . POST : They have rules and regulations to go by . Would we have a problem in that locations if there were two houses there ? There is a house close to the road and one farther back in . Is density an issue for us ? G . TOTMAN : Yes . As I understand this the question was asked Mr . Wood : ' Would it be feasible what I ' m trying to do ? ' Mr . Wood told Mr . Adams ' take it to the Planning Bard and get their opinion ' . Then Mr . Wood would return with a consenus of opinion or options that he might look for . Then it is up to him to decide what he wants to apply for . G . WOOD : The last conversation was late last week and I told him he was too late for formal presentation for this month and he asked if he gave me some kind of a sketch would I bring it before the Planning Board . I told him probably so . You should not be looking at this as a sketch plan or proposal but rather give the man some guidance on what you ' d like to see him do . M . POST : If there was a road already in there , would we have a problem with the location of the houses ? G . TOTMAN : No , I wouldn ' t think so . When I look at problems I look at what can I legally say no to . He would have x acre in each lot . Gary , if the Board agrees , do you &ag`'it would be fair to give the message back to you that it is not a legal size lot according to the road frontage , as far as the zoning regulations are concerned . And that you , as a Zoning Enforcement Officer , could not pass it as to two parcels , he would have to go to the ZBA to get that which he would be asking for a 95 foot variance on each lot . Or the other possibility , that the Planning Board felt if he wanted to build a road to Town specifications and when he got that done he would come back to you and you would approve it as two individual lots . G . WOOD : A couple of things to address and one is based on the Town Attorney ' s previous determinations he has to divide that into 2 lots in order to put another home on there . Beyond that I ' ll carry whatever message you ' d like back to him . G . TOTMAN : Did the Board understand what I just said ? Board indicated they understood . CVKt G . WOOD : Looking at the duties of the ZBA appeal may be for a variance to the regulations as they apply to a specific site . Addressing that to your question , Mik c the ZBA vary the lot size , I think in this Town they Lam- because it is all put together in one document , both the zoning regulations �� �;hu.�• � ins— f� �/ _ e '- - - - ✓ 7 �� . .Zoo ' o�ee� 4 � � . �� 3 i.r � � � . . . - _/'i07 e 2 Show . � e- �70(-X - - Z " � �' ? C' � oo+ � cS/1 occ lG� a + SQ. i' G� GG ✓J - � 2c CG •e - - - - - - - _C - G•st - av✓��{' - - - to Ow . . 28�. . . Gtf iL ) -0 eel PLANNING BOARD - 12 - September 15 , 1987 and subdivision regulations . That is not the usual case ; but here I think the Zoning Board was given the power to vary all this set of documents . So if the Zoning Board should so see fit then they could approve the lot with less than the required frontage . M . POST : So we need to say to him that that is an option .. and I think we , as a Board , v41fzhel1s going to exercise that option should go to the ZBA and state our position on the matter . ` So . we want to go back to him and say heres your choices : you can try to get a variance throughtthe ZBA or you can put, in a Town road that meets the Town specs . before approval of the division of the land . G . WOOD : I think your job is to be more specific than that . As a Planning Board you should give guidance . Yes , those two options exists . But which one is the one you feel should be exercised? M . POST : So we want to be honest with him and go back and say we don ' t think you ' re going to get the variance but go ahead and try for it . G . TOTMAN : In all fairness to everybody else in the Town who we require present proposals ten days before the meetings ; is just look at this as Gary suggests and think about it and ask Mr . Adams to present the proposal ten days before a meeting and have him come to the next meeting a lay it out for the Board what he proposes ', to do and then we can tell him at the meeting what out thoughts are . G . WOOD : What I don ' t understand what proposal is he suppose to come back with or is he suppose to come and say this is what I want to do can I ? G . TOTMAN So far he really hasn ' t submitted anything . He has submitted some ideas that he has got and he would like our comments on . That ' s it . So there is nothing really official or binding . G . WOOD No question there . G . TOTMAN : What I am saying is now that we have an idea of what he is talking about , which was his original intent , normally we don ' t act on something unless somebody makes a proposal and nobody has made a proposal yet . Let him give us a proposal then we can act on it . M . POST : So , ;Gary , you are going back to him and tell him what ? G . WOOD : Take his choise and bring one of them to the Planning Board for the next meeting . That isn ' t quite right . I am going to tell him if he wants to proceed with this , which he got into because he could not do the other , I am going to tel • PLANNING BOARD - 13 - September 15 , 1987 he can bring that proposal to you or he can go to the ZBA for a reduced lotirfrontage variance . M . POST : Those would be his only two options ? G . WOOD : That really isn ' t an options either . There is the County regulations for 150 foot . G . TOTMAN : His only real option is to build the road . G . TOTMAN : Our Board has been negligent as far as the SEAR . In paying much attention to it or knowing what it is about , our Board is really not very familiar with it at all . There is a two hour training session on the 15th of October at NYSE&G for all local government officials , especially members of Planning Boards . M . CAREY : That is our next meeting night . G . TOTMAN : Would you be in favor of having the Village Board and our Board get together and have a presentation by the County on the SEAR ? Board members agreed . G . TOTMAN : I ' ll get a date from the County and ask the Village Board to join us . G . WOOD : It also came up at the Village meeting about the Village Planning Board getting together with the Town Planning Board on the Comprehensive Plan . G . TOTMAN : If the Village Planning Board wants to pursue it through the Village Board with the idea of looking at the plan that was made in 1972 through the Town and Village , At that particular time there were 3 people from the Town and Village on what was called the 701 committee and got the results of what was in the Comprehensive Plan . If they want to go to their Village Board and ask if they would be interested in sponsoring that type of thing again to bring it up to date , which it was recommended at that time it be revamped every 5 years , would you be interested in proposing the same tKng to our Board ? G . WOOD : I would doubt very seriously if the same type of report could be done again . At that time there was State funding . So it would be a different sort of report . G . TOTMAN : The concept would be the same . I ' m not sure what the goals would be , you have to set a goal . If the Board agrees I will run it by the Town Board . PLANNING BOARD: - 14- September 15 , 1987 Board members agree it would be a good plan . G . TOTMAN : We ' ll table the SEAR for a later date . Since: there was no further business for the Board V . RANKIN moved the meeting be adjourned , seconded by M . CAREY , the meeting was adjourned at 9 : 46 p . m . Public Hearing set for Thursday , October 1 , 1987 at 8 : 00 p . m . Next regular Planning Board meeting Thursday , October 15 , 1987 at B : OOp . m . Respectfully submitted , tMarfgarftA . Palmer 'r f f TOWN OF GROTON PLANNING BOARD Public Hearing , Tuesday , September 15 , 1987 , 8 : 00 p . m . "j PROPOSED MAJOR SUBDIVISION at the Northeat,° corner of Clark St . Ext . and Old Stage Rd . submitted by ROGER GLEASON , Tax Map No . 121 - 1 - 21 . 2 . BOARD ( *present ) PUBLIC PRESENT George Totman* , Chairman Gary Wood , Zoning Enforcement Michael Post* , Vice Chairman Officer Nancy Ostrander , Cor . Secretary Roger Gleason Cecil Twigg Glenn Munson _ Monica Carey* Verl Rankin* Bill Casolara G . TOTMAN , Chairman , opened the public hearing at 8 : 00 p . m . by reading the Public Notice dated September 4 , 1987 : PLEASE TAKE NOTICE , that the Planning Board of the Town of Groton , County of Tompkins , New York , will hold a public hearing at the Town Hall , 101 Conger Boulevard , Groton , N . Y . at 8 : 00 p . m . on Tuesday , Sept . 15 , 1987 , for the purpose of considering the application for development of a major subdivision at the North- East corner of Clark Street Extension and Old Stage Road as submitted by Roger Gleason . All interested persons will be heard . George L . Totman Chairman DATED : Sept . 4 , 1987 G.. ` TOTMAN : Roger , would you show the Board what you propose . R . GLEASON : We had the preliminary plans presented before . The reason for the major subdivision is the same parcel already had divisions off of it before . If you look in the lower left hand corner of the survey , ( copies given to Board members ) you will see a map of the area . It is the northeast corner of the intersection of Clark St . and Old Stage Rd . and it encompasses roughly 20 acres . V . RANKIN : Does that include the whole section? R . GLEASON : Yes , the whole section . On parcel is 5 acres , one is 9 acres and a third of 6 acres for a total of 20 acres . j 3 PLANNING BOARD Public Hearing -2 = September 15 , 1987 Roger Gleason G . TOTMAN : As you are looking at the map , in the lower left corner , the 2 . 6 and 2 . 7 acre lots have been sold to the same person and they will be one lot . So that is cutting down the number of lots . R . GLEASON : There are two new lots now , the one on the corner and one up Old Stage Rd . the other lot is there to rectifyFran error that was made previously on a subdivision request . M . POST : What do-a the dotted liner'An the corners represent ? G WOOD : ( Examining the map ) Dimensions of the surveyed parcel . M . POST : We are reconciling the Proper property ? R . GLEASON : Right , I put that in when I submitted the preliminary plans . At the last meeting I only had a survey for the9'. 5acres and the 2 . 6 and 2 . 7 acres ; now it is all consolidated together . M . POST : Are the same covenents in the deed as before , no mobile homes , homes valued at $ 60 , 000 ? G . TOTMAN : It is stated on the application , ' at least the value of $60 , 000 excluding the land and no trailers ' . That goes in the deed as stipulated by Roger . M . POST : So we are approving the formal survey map . G . TOTMAN : Right . No further questions by the Board or public present , G . Totman Chairman closed the public hearing . I , MARGARET A . PALMER , DO CERTIFY that I took the minutes of the public hearing held in the Town of Groton , County of Tompkins on September 15 , 1987 for a proposed major subdivison on Clark St . Ext . and Old Stage Rd . proposed by Roger Gleason , and the forgoing is a true and exact copy of said hearing . M rgar t A . Palmer