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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1980-12-10 GROTON TOWN PLANNING BOARD MEETING Held. at ' Groton Town Hall December 10 , 1980 - 8 : 00 P . M . * denotes those present G . Totman Be Bucko L . Raymond T . Robinson R . Gleason x V . Rankin D . Payne G . Van Ben Schoten C . Twigg L . Sovocool • J . McNeil F . Carrey The meeting began at 8 : 15 p . m . with the discussion of special permits . Totman : Where did you read this ? Bucko : I don ' t know , I saw it in here ; that is the reason I raised the question . Right here ( section. 202 . 2 ) The reason I wa. s trying to find it is , I don ' t recall Town Board special permit , under 501 , as I was reading . - - - 501 , this is how you issue the permit . Totman : Under special permit issue - - - - -- what is doing now , - - combined plan . In fact , it makes more work for the Planning Board and the Board of Appeals because of the way the ordinance is written . . Be Bucko rea. ds . 502 . Totman : May be some reason in state law . Lyle , do you recall granting special permits . Raymond : There was a discussion one ' might . Trying to think what the circumstances were about that . I don ' t recall what members were present at the time , something about the special permit and something about what would hinder the possibility of- - - and what would hinder Zoning Board of running the thing through without looking at it . I don ' t clearly recall, but it had something to do alot with the Town Board in certain cases of taking the power away from the Zoning Board as it was . I clearly recall_ something of that general vein . Bucko : Application of a special permeit comes TownBoard , whether Zoning Board should handle it , take it away . Totman : . I don ' t like that statement . Raymond : I don ' t either - 1 - Pg • 2 . .G Rankin : I don ' t either . Bucko : What I think has to happen , you guys have been working on . this for two years , spent your time on it . May cost money to reprint it but you have to have it reprinted . Totman : Done in sections . Reprint certain things . Bucko : - - - - - - - - - all sides the pages - - - - . Totman : We had hoped to have three of these books . When I got them . this morning , I called Gary back , he then remembered he was suppose to make two other books . What we are doing tonight is to go over and leave this book with you and Teresa . Bucko : For instance , not being critical or anything , Section 217 , destruction of buildings . Here is where it has to be condusive - - - - and we are now amending . The hearing ' s next week . You guys working on this , just that section is not consistent with the law . This has to be consistent with law . You guys have done a helluva job . - - - - - - - - - - simplified things - - - - - - - - leaves alot for the Town Board , Totman : Special permits need more work on for Zoning Board . Bucko : Planning Board . Totman Study this out . - - - - certain areas not consistent - - - - - we are not as consistent in that area . Bucko : Means you have to have facts and figures . Totman : Creates more work for us . �I Bucko : Town hearings - - - - Totman : If Groton was - - - - as Dryden did . Bucko : Over all , what you here - - - - Rankin You ' re the one that approved the old one . Totman : Basically what we intended to get . We have been working on this for two years - - nor Town Board involved in it` . Rather than y ; c present a book like this , we made a summary . This is the official book of the Planning Board . We might have to go back . We are not saying it is perfect . This is the work of the Planning Board and wording from Gary Evans for our thoughts . ' Rankin : He wrote the book ? Totman : From our meetings , he wrote the book . Robinson : What - do you mean special permits ? Totman : For example , the undertaking service in a commercial zone , should be under special permit , should regular zoning permit in industrial - - - put in other zone . Should look at the area , see what it contains . y Pg • 3 Bucko : They have undertaking in industrial . Totman : We are saying under special permit , conducive to the area. , gives people a chance to see what is going on . Robinson : That would be allowed on Rt . 222 ? Bucko : Now is allowed . Robinson : Now allowed ? Totman : The real estate dealers will- say , " What is allowed in this area ? " You tell them anything is allowed , it ' s a breach of contract . People who are spending alot of money , they ' re concerned with what is a. 11owed , in the area . Bucko : If you have agriculture , then a motor vehicle shop . Payne : That was . brought up awhile ago . . Totman : We are saying what is allowed under special permit - - - - - - - - - - - . Bucko : What they saying is that you have an area and hope that - - - - - - - north ofRRt . 38 , what if there is someone who wants to come in and build something though the ordinance says no . May be inconsistent with the rule , but you may think that this type of activity should be allowed . Am I clear in this analysis ? Raymond : That is the thought in general . Robinson : Who is this going through ? Bucko : Board of Appeals , and interviewed by thePlanning Board . Totrnan : If you are going to have the Planning Board granting special permits - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - it had no say in the world what made the or. d nance . In fact , the schools of New York of where the Board of Appeals was . - - - - - happen in the past , - - - - - - - wha. t we are saying is put them together . Bucko : - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Last page says the Planning Board will not - - - - - - these circumstances are not met . This presents a job , how do you know if they meet ? Robinson : Actually , Board. of Appeals has power of judgement , the next step goes to the court ? Bucko : That ' s true . Robinson : Then , what you are saying , - - our laws - - - they have to apply their judgement . p g • Totman : It is the intent of the Planning Board . Robinson : Board of Appeals , I think . This should be ,up to the two bodies to take care of - - - - - - - - - haul them into court . Bucko : ( 202 ) Are you saying Planning Board gives recommendations to the Board of Appeals - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - '? Payne : We are an advisory board . Totman : I think by state law we can ' t change that . Bucko : What I am . asking , must special permits recommended by the Manning Board or granted by the Town Board or Board of Appeals . . . ? Totman : Town Board over - rules . Rankin This guy must know what he has to do . Robinson : It is one - - the person who issues permits to prove the Totman : - - - - - - They give your make recommendations , but Board of Appeals - - - decide the one thing . Robinson: The decision based on- - - - - - - - Totman : Sometimes not . Stop and think of. the money - _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ and this way the law of state is written . Planning Board feels people can do the job , but those people have never worked on a zoning ordinance you read in all areas of state , New York Board of Appeals makes suggestions . We are saying important to be - - - - - - - - - - • Rankin : Good thing . Robinson : That is the reason I wanted to know if you guys knew who was on the Board of Appeals . Totman : Should be working closely withthe two Boards . - - - - - - - Basically revise zoning ordinance and to look into the references - - - - - . Bucko : Has Raymond $ Really recently ? . Robinson : I am especially intrigued by 108 . What does that mean? Bucko : One part invalid , the rest is valid . Clled the grandfather clause . It means if one section in invalid or declared invalide , it doesn ' t make the entire ordinance invalid . Rankin : Do you have anything on these coops - 10x 10 ? Here it says you can build morethan one of these things . Case in West Groton , buy built one of these buildings , then at least three more of these . 10 x 10 ' s . pge 5 Bucko : Attached to each other ? Rankin : No , not attached , but he has . bu'ilt two or three 10 x 101s . Bucko : He has to have a building permit for each of them . Rankin : We . got into a real big . pow wow . Bucko : . 10 x 10 separate ? Rankin : How many allowed ? Bucko : As long as - - - - - - - - - Rankin : He has some attached to the building . Bucko : , Everytime - - - - the building , he has to have in the law . Robinson : Does it say separate ?. Bucko : Yes . . Rankin : We ' ll come to that . Bucko : - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - attached . Rankin' Or he was sly . Robinson : The one that screamed at me . Bucko : You said was indifferent to . zoning laws . . Robinson : Yes . - - - - - - - - - - - - - Rankin : Ordinance allows to do this ? Bucko : I told Bob Brown . He said he needed a zoning- permits Robinson : He orginally . was going to build a garage . . Don 'it know if he got permit . Bucko : . - - - - - - - - living in the gar . e then built on . Bob Brown told -him ' he could not have it unless - - - - - - - - . He said , " I got the . square footage . " - - - minimum square footage - - - - - - - - I don ' t recall as he built it . If he , . - - - - - - -minimum square footage- part . Payne .: No matter what of - - or how tight you are going to have trouble . It ' s going to happen . . Rankin : - - - Robinson : One man asked us if he built an underground home , why did he need a building permit , and if not above ground , why did he have to pay taxes ? Totman : You asked about underground ?