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HomeMy WebLinkAbout01_06_2021 Planning Board Meeting & Public Hearing01-06-2021PBandPublicHearingSolar.mp3 Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:00:01] So I got all the documents into the Norbut folder, the one you sent out at the last minute, too, so that is accessible from the announcement. So people can just go everything everything is linked from the planning board meeting announcement. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:00:18] Right. Great. Great. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:00:22] I did have some some more interest than I than I normally get on a public hearing about this. So. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:00:29] Have you had a few people calling? Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:00:31] I did have someone from a carpenters union. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:00:34] Oh. Because I like to build things. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:00:37] And then Jim Matthews, also someone named Jim Matthews. So I gave those people instructions for participating. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:00:44] Good. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:00:47] Hi Anne. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:00:54] Hello Ann. She disappeared. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:00:58] Hello Aaron, Hi Henry.. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:01:02] Hello, everybody. How's it going tonight? [00:01:05] Good,. [00:01:05] Good,. [00:01:07] Good. [00:01:07] Pretty good. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:01:10] Hey, I have a question because I don't know, maybe I'll wait, but then maybe desert solar array need a fence all the way around it. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:01:18] Yes. They have to fence it for electrical safety reasons. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:01:26] Chain link? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:01:29] Well, Dan,. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:01:30] Hello, everyone. How are you? Happy New Year. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:01:32] Happy New Year. [00:01:34] David. Recording Secretary Patricia Speno [00:01:36] Yes, happy new year, everybody forgot,. [00:01:41] John. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:01:47] Alan. Are you there? So, yeah,. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [00:01:55] I'm here. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:01:55] OK, what was the name? I didn't I couldn't find the property. The information you just sent me, did you send me information on that one on Halsyville Road about Halsyville Road? Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [00:02:09] Hayts Road. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:02:10] Hayts Road. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [00:02:12] I believe I sent you the email. I was just looking for myself. I'm just looking for it right no w, actually,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:02:19] Because I couldn't find it. I actually got the tax map up, but. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [00:02:25] I will give you a tax map, ID in a few minutes. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:02:27] I have I have it up on my screen already. So when we get to that point, I can. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [00:02:34] So what I have is the right of way,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:02:40] Yup. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [00:02:41] Property,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:02:42] Yup. If you could send that... Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:02:48] I think he can send it to me and then I'll pop it up on the announcement. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:02:51] Yeah, yeah, send it to Ellen, you can put it in. And that's going to be an additional item on the on the agenda. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [00:02:59] Yeah, I will send the email to you both in a couple of minutes. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:03:02] All right, that's good,. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:03:04] Does it have an attachment Alan or is it just like a tax map number. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [00:03:07] It has a digital document attached. Jude [00:03:16] Dan, is this the final approval or is this just a review? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:03:23] Yeah, this is the going to be the public hearing. And we have a pretty complete package. So it's possible to make this a final meeting, but I'm not I think there's going to be a few questions or people, so... Jude [00:03:47] I'm scrambling to catch up a little bit. I haven't had time to look at it ... Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:03:52] Yeah, I'm going to I'm going to pop the link to the announcement in the chat where all the documents are linked. Not that you can review them super quick, but. [00:04:03] Every. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:04:11] All right. Are Joe and Rich on one of those phone calls. Recording Secretary Patricia Speno [00:04:21] I don’t recall their numbers... Think so. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:04:41] I'm seeing we've got. So we've got Ann, we've got Aaron, Henry.. Mike Carpenter, are you out there someplace,. Recording Secretary Patricia Speno [00:04:53] I don't see him yet, unless he's on a phone. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:04:58] Mike, if you're on the phone, can you unmute and... Recording Secretary Patricia Speno [00:05:09] Unmute him if you can as host? Board Member Joseph Dawson [00:05:22] Dan can you hear us now? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:05:25] Yes. You're at 60,. Board Member Joseph Dawson [00:05:28] We're trying to get the phone to cooperate. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:05:31] OK,. Board Member Joseph Dawson [00:05:33] This is Joe and Rich? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:05:35] Alright. OK, so we got Rich, we got Joe, we got Henry.. And myself and Ann. That gives us and we've got Aaron here to. So I believe we have a quorum, so I'm going to open the meeting. [00:06:00] Call it to order. The first item on the agenda would be to review the improve the minutes from the December meeting. Is everyone had a chance to read those. Board Member Richard Teeter [00:06:24] Henry read them. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:06:32] I have read them, I don't have any changes myself. Does anyone have any comments or changes? Alternate Board Member Aaron Abb [00:06:45] I don't have anything major, this is Aaron, Patricia just correct by the spelling of my name on the first go around the second one. Recording Secretary Patricia Speno [00:06:55] All right. Yeah, did I spell your first name wrong? Alternate Board Member Aaron Abb [00:07:00] Hmm. Maybe. Recording Secretary Patricia Speno [00:07:05] OK, I'm sorry about that. I'll correct it. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:07:20] The good. Someone like to make a motion to approve minutes. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:07:29] I make a motion to approve the minutes. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:07:33] Ann you want to unmute yourself? And OK, so I'm just going to all in favor say yes. Board Member Ann Chaffee [00:07:46] AYE. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:07:46] YES. [00:07:47] AYE. Board Member Richard Teeter [00:07:47] AYE. Board Member Joseph Dawson [00:07:48] AYE. Alternate Board Member Aaron Abb [00:07:48] YES. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:07:49] I think we got five in there. The minutes are approved. OK. Recording Secretary Patricia Speno [00:08:11] And I don't see Mike. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:08:18] OK. All right, Henry., you had a question you wanted to ask before we get into the public hearing. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:08:54] Fence? Is that what you mean? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:08:57] Yes. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:08:59] Oh, yeah, I mean, it's just such a large parcel and it's. So it's a huge area to fence in, and I was just surprised that that was necessary. I mean, I'm not somebody who wants to get in there. They'll find a way in. But and I thought if it's chainlink, it's going to be kind of an eyesore and it's got to be trimmed at the bottom. The grass grows up around it because you can't go right up to it. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:09:25] Yeah, well, electrically. The electrical requirements required to be fenced with at least a seven foot high fence, I believe. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:09:40] Had a whole and not just the where all the where all the power comes into the center to a substation or whatever it's called. But I mean, the panels themselves. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:09:53] The Panels themselves to generate a pretty good shot if you get to the wrong point on this series connection. So electrically that it's the underwriters request require that to be fenced in, and I believe Dan your fencing each of the separate arrays, too, I believe. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:10:15] Yes, we are fencing. So legally, we were required to fence five megawatt array, completely enclosed. But the way we designed it to make sure that there wasn't any dead space or wasted green space, we are sharing some of the fences. But each five megawatt array, does have its own blocked entrance where all of the components for that five megawatt array will be housed within its own secure fence. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:10:44] That's. That answer your question, Henry.. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:10:51] It certainly does. I guess it's a legal requirement and it makes sense. I was just I wasn't sure if there's if it had to be done and it was a requirement. But that answers my question. There going to be a chain link fence along the road. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:11:06] Oh, it'll be backed away from their believe,. Jude [00:11:09] It has to be twenty feet back from the road. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:11:13] So chain link fence will be about twenty to twenty five feet away from the panels themselves. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:11:20] What we really like about this property is that we are moving it away from the road because we've heard from many folks that there's potential for future farming in the areas that we don't use. It also provides a nice buffer away from the main road and houses. And so there's opportunities for, again, future farming right next to the road in the areas that we don't use for potential future development of houses as well, if that's something that the community wants to see later on down the road. So we tried to put it in an area where the the property next to the road could still be utilized if that was part of the community's future growth plan. Jude [00:12:15] Are you entertaining questions Dan? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:12:18] Well, I we can actually have a public hearing is scheduled to open at seven 15, but I'll open the public hearing at seven 11 and we'll make sure we extend well beyond seven fifteen, I'm sure. So anybody else? Everyone will have an opportunity. So the way this will work, I will. Does everybody have the hand raising option on their. [00:12:50] I was. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:12:51] OK, and raise your right or raised your hand, so that works there, so and you have a question, you want to speak first. Ann Rider [00:13:02] And I want to speak at the public hearing the public hearings open. I don't have a question. OK. Hi, I'm Anne writer. Seventy seven Halsyville Road, Ithaca., New York. I just want to say that this project is being done at the highest professional level. [00:13:31] I'm disappointed to hear that a member of the planning board doesn't think there has to be a fence. It's your own law that made it a requirement. And Dan is very good at reading laws, local laws, as well as being very supportive of the community. And I just want and you're not going to see this chain link fence. You can't even see the solar arrays that are already up up there. [00:14:14] I just want to say that since the Town former Town board shut down the wind farm, that I urged them to be supportive of most solar farms, but especially this solar farm who has read the law knows the law that we the another Town board, the first one wasn't good enough. So they made a Second one. And he knows how to follow rules. And the town of Enfield should be supportive of alternative energy. And this is a relatively local company, Rochester, right now. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:15:09] Yeah, the Norbut is out of Rochester,. Ann Rider [00:15:12] I think I got the.... Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:15:13] We got two Dan's so... Ann Rider [00:15:14] So local. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:15:16] The answer is. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:15:19] Yes. Oh yes. We are based in Rochester. And yes,. Ann Rider [00:15:25] The memory hasn't failed me too much yet. And they also are supportive of the local community. And just as oh, maybe a reiteration in the Enfield Community Council will be looking for your support in our new venture. And I also want to urge the board to go through the IDA whatever they changed their name to. [00:15:56] I'm so confused. That is the professional organization in our town that can handle the tax abatements in a very, very professional manner. And the Town will not have to hire a expert to represent them. [00:16:23] We have an expert who represents us very well and knows what they're doing with the tax abatement and the number is esca ping me. [00:16:39] I want to urge the planning board to go ahead with this project and help it move forward and. [00:16:54] Hopefully the local Town board will do the right thing, first of all, the planning board will do the right thing and then the board will. This is the right thing. Thank you. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:17:05] OK, yeah, I probably should have started this off with letting Dan describe the project a little bit. And he's done it a couple of times already. And unless. Everyone is familiar enough with it, so they think we can I. I would be great if he did that. Yeah, yeah. Then why don't you want to put up on my screen? So, as I find. The right documents. OK, and see how this works. [00:18:09] OK, everybody with a computer, can they see my screen? You know, and I'm waving my cursor around him, so, Dan, if you want to just describe the project. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:18:24] Definitely,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:18:25] I'll zoom in on the project data. [00:18:33] So go ahead. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:18:35] Sure. So so what we are proposing as a project in Enfield. There is a parcel of land at the corner of Mecklenburg and South Applegate. It's just under two hundred and fifty acres is about two hundred and forty nine. [00:18:50] And change that we are under contract to purchase. And what we're proposing is a 20 megawatt solar facility that's broken up into four five megawatt arrays that, you can see right here on the screen and what we're proposing to do is have it set back from the road several hundred feet. [00:19:17] What we've designed here is a very environmentally conscious design. You'll see underneath the black lines there's a light, bluish color. Those were all of the wetland areas that we were able to record and survey with our environmental engineers, LaBella associates. And so what we did is, is we originally set out when we saw this project is the way we came about the property. To take it all the way back to the beginning is solar projects. [00:19:50] Their location is dictated by the power lines in a very specific size power line. So when you're first looking for a solar property, you need to find the power lines that the utility company has based on their maps and then kind of trace the power lines just like you would on a map with a road. You follow that power line down to see where it go es, what it connects to, and you try to see if it has any viable land that might accommodate the type of design and features that we're looking for. [00:20:23] This property was especially appealing because it was right next to the type of power line that we would need for a project like this. And the Town, to their credit, already had a very robust solar policy and law in place. They had already done a few projects as well. Same thing with the county. [00:20:44] And so it kept a lot of really good boxes. And what was great about the property was its size. A lot of times what we face in communities when we are looking at solar developments, most people say not in my backyard or not that close to my house. And what we felt was really positive about this specific spot was Aye. the environmental was really panned out. Well, it's a flat piece of land. It's not too heavily forested. [00:21:11] The wetlands that you see here in the in the slight blue color were minimal. And they were the type of wetlands that are governed by the Army Corps of Engineers. So you have some restrictions that we can work in. And luckily, the soils in the area when we did a soil test worked out well for the type of installation that we do. So kind of all the stars really aligned in this in this development in that we can do some very environmentally friendly construction where when we go to put the racking in, all we are doing is pounded posts. [00:21:49] So we don't have to disturb the land in terms of digging up large sections of the property to pour concrete or gravel. We're really just pounding a post directly into the ground, like putting in like a driveway marker in the winter. When you're on your mark in your driveway for the for the snow plow, it literally gets pushed in about 10 to 12 feet. Thankfully, we have some really good soils for that. So we're excited that we could do a really environmentally friendly project in this area. And on top of that, with about two hundred and forty nine acres, we could really be we had the flexibility to design something that was construction related in terms of cost. Very smart. [00:22:35] A lot of times the shape of the property really dictates what the solar array will look like. Thankfully, we had a nice big canvas and we're able to design a solar array that was really condensed and next to itself so that we weren't wasting a lot of green space. One of the biggest issues we have is when there are heavily forested areas, you kind of have to move around them and it creates a really jagged, not very electrically friendly design where what we have here is a nice, simple box. It's very electrically efficient. [00:23:14] So we can condense everything to the middle while minimizing the amount of environmental impacts that we have on the prope rty. We're really excited that we're able to avoid the heavily forested areas to the south and keep everything pretty much condensed to the middle and the north of the project. It also gave us the flexibility to completely avoid the larger wetland that you see on the right side of the map, which is actually the east east side. We designed it to completely stay out of that altogether so that that is not disturbed. We are crossing some of the wetlands in the middle, but we are working with the Army Corps of Engineers. [00:23:54] And they did indicate that we'd be able to cross those areas as long as all we were doing were the pounded post style. And then also we were able to set it back from the road, as I mentioned, to. Earlier, several hundred feet, which allows for future planning, future growth in the community, if there's interest in houses to be to be developed, there are other type of community buildings could always be put in. It makes it more than just a solar development. And that's really something we look for in all of our developments, is that it's more than just a one stop shop. We're not just building a solar farm and saying,. OK, we're done and walking away. [00:24:35] We have opportunities here to come back in and look at future developments. One of the things I shared with the planning board and the Town board was our current website called... [00:24:46] Ranchesonthefarm.com, in which on a previous solar project we actually looked at how can we use the the additional space that we have. And this is in the Spencer Parma area. And we came up with the concept of building one hundred percent electric Town homes where all of the electricity that they would potentially need or use came directly from the solar farm on site. And it actually created a nice little electric style community where you don't need gas. The infrastructure requirements are a lot less and all the electricity is generated right there on site. [00:25:25] So the whole little community in itself would have trails and tracks and and different opportunities there that might appeal to a specific type of person who wants to live off the grid or who wants to be a little bit more sustainable. And and we're pretty confident that that's a type of living style that will catch on in the future. And so we think this is this is a piece of land and a development that has multiple opportunities in the future for some very exciting things, if that's something that the community is interested in. [00:25:57] Obviously, right now we're only talking about a solar farm, but that's how we approach a lot of our developments and that's why we're so excited about this opportunity. And also seeing the amount of work that the Town has put in into identifying a solar la w into their comprehensive plans. It is it is rare that towns have as much work put into being thoughtful, into the type of development they want. [00:26:25] And so we were pretty excited about this, working with the planning board. But as you can see, it is it is a little bit larger than the current solar array that's on there. The current solar farm will be on our property right now. And we are we're good friends with the owners of of those solar arrays as well. We've worked with them before. And so we will continue to work with them and make sure that there's our operational as well while we build ours if the project is approved. But you can see that the construction was designed to really stay as tight to the center as possible and not allow for any wasted green space in the process. [00:27:08] So that was really a key element for us in this was the opportunity to really build the type of solar farm that we would like to do on other projects, but unfortunately don't have the space for or have to work within the contours of some more heavily forested areas. So we're pretty excited about this. And it sounds like there is a good amount of support in the community for it as well. And I don't think it's going to really impact anyone in the surrounding neighborhoods. [00:27:38] I believe the smallest setback we have from a property boundary is close to two hundred and fifty, almost three hundred feet, something to that effect from the property boundary to the nearest solar panel, which is a healthy distance . And then it goes all the way up to almost a thousand feet, I believe, from South Applegate Road. So all in all, there is a lot of additional space for some future development, but it really does condense the solar array into a tight, neat little package that we think really takes the environment into consideration. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:28:17] This shows the size of the parcel, I've got the existing condition map up and the parcel, actually the north boundary line is just probably three hundred feet south of Mecklenburg Road. And that and it comes over. [00:28:41] To this point and then goes all the way down and I don't know exactly how many feet that is, but I would say it's probably close to three thousand feet. And then it comes across the bottom, comes up and goes across and the actual. Coverage area for that parcel is this this dash line, right, right here. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:29:08] Yeah, I believe the total area that we're using is under a hundred and twenty acres of the two hundred and forty nine. So that effect. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:29:23] So, OK, thank you, Dan, I guess the way I'll try to do this. Ann Ryder, did you have another did you want to say something else or you had your hand up? [00:29:38] But maybe more, I lowered your head. Ann Rider [00:29:42] I didn't know,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:29:44] OK, I'm fine. Ann Rider [00:29:48] This is better planned than I first thought, I forgot that it included the first hour, a solar farm that's up there already that you don't know is up there because you can't see it from the road and they're meticulous planning. I'm triple, triple impressed after I see the intro. And again, I want to urge the Town of the planning board to do the right thing in this because it is part of sustainable living and I certainly hope the Town board will do the right thing in approving this. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:30:32] OK, thank you for your comments Ann. OK, Jude, I believe you. Jude [00:30:37] Yeah, I just said I had a couple of questions. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:30:40] Yep, that's fine. Jude [00:30:41] So, um, and I. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:30:45] Just gave you your first and last name for us,. [00:30:47] Oh sorry Jude Lempke. I live at 215 Connecticut Hill Road. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:30:50] Thank you,. Jude Lempke [00:30:51] Nufield. So my my main question is the decommissioning plan. I was a little confused when I was looking at it because the heading seemed to indicate there was no salvage value being taken into account, which is what our law requires. [00:31:08] When I was reading through it, it looked like maybe it was being taken into account. So that was one of the questions I had. Was how salvage value is being treated to our plan says that you can't take salvage value into account for the surety amount. [00:31:26] And then the other quick questions were, I didn't see an operation and maintenance plan, I didn't see a complaint plan. [00:31:37] And I didn't see anything on liability insurance, but I may have missed it because I was going through things quickly. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:31:48] Yeah, in terms of decommissioning, we have in previous projects, we have presented two different plans, one, as you mentioned, is without scrap value and one is with scrap value. The one we submitted is without scrap value and our decommissioning costs run I believe it's about one hundred and fifty six thousand dollars per five megawatt array. And so each five megawatt array would have its own decommissioning plan. They would be identical and we would be responsible for holding that plan in place, and current every year. We would have to show the record to the Town that it is in place. [00:32:30] We typically we have in the past argued that scrap value should be included. [00:32:36] We realize we realize now that it's very difficult to include that because of future values of materials. It's very speculative. It can go up and down. And I do agree with the current Town law that it shouldn't be included because it just makes it a little bit more complex. So the plan we submitted does include the decommissioning. I believe it has our legal decommissioning agreement that we typically use for every project, and it also has the decommissioning information for how we would go about doing it. Jude Lempke [00:33:15] I don't know if that is is that on the in the linked stuff? Because I didn't see the plan itself. I saw a discussion of it, but I didn't see the actual decommissioning plan. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:33:27] I would have to defer to the Town on the. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:33:30] So, so in the chat. Is a bunch of links, one goes to a folder with all of the documents that have been submitted. Jude Lempke [00:33:40] Right. But I didn't see a decommissioning plan. [00:33:43] I just saw something that. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:33:45] That might be on the documents page. There were a few that were submitted early on that were small enough that I could get them on the documents page. t [00:33:55] It's one of the three links. [00:33:58] Let me see it, it should say it's Townofenfield.org/Norbutsolar. [00:34:06] I see it on the Second link down. Jude Lempke [00:34:12] OK. OK. All right, it's on the second link. [00:34:19] Yeah, I see something called decommissioning. [00:34:22] There is a decommissioning plan. [00:34:24] Without scrap value. [00:34:27] It's on the laser Fische site. [00:34:30] An accounting. Jude Lempke [00:34:32] I'll have to... Having trouble finding things. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:34:36] I'm sorry. I'm sorry, that was hard to find. I will. I can send it to via email right after the meeting. Jude Lempke [00:34:43] OK. OK. And then the others were just the the property operation and maintenance plan, the general complaint plan and. And do we have the liability insurance in place, those were the three of the questions. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:35:02] We do have an operational maintenance plan that we include with all of our solar projects and depending on different towns laws, we do tailor it for that specific Town I'm 99 percent sure I submitted it with the packet. I would have to just double check. [00:35:19] But it is something we include with all of our applications. In terms of complaints received, I'm happy to say we've never had a complaint thus far in all of our projects. Good after after a while construction and after construction. [00:35:37] Obviously we've had some opposition during public hea rings, but once approved and the projects are presented to the community. Typically we do get a pretty strong buy in in terms of an actual complaint portal. [00:35:53] We've never actually set one of those up before. But I'm I'm sure we could work something out with the Town and figure out what would be the most appropriate way to facilitate that. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:36:09] And then normally the complaints with complaints would be channeled through the code enforcement office in the Town. Jude Lempke [00:36:19] I don't. I'm not sure we need a portal per say, but we do need a general complaint plan for, you know, who do we contact? How do we deal with complaints? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:36:30] Right. Well, we'll have that. The Town is also the Town board is also discussing the. The community agreement. And so we'll have that all that information will be provided and on file at the Town. Jude Lempke [00:36:54] Also going back to the decommissioning so... I see the general outlines of the plan. The question is financially, I guess what I was asking is the financial assurance piece would. Doesn't really layout, does it? What the actual financial assurance is going to be.... See it? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:37:24] So we would have to have a decommissioning bond policy held with the Town decommissioning, so decommissioning was was typically set up for solar farms that are leasing land from the individual. And it was a mechanism to protect the landowner from the lease. [00:37:45] We ... we see. [00:37:49] And in the event that the company is not able to return the land back to its normal state on their own dime, the decommissioning plan would come into effect. [00:38:01] How we're different from those solar companies that are typically from out of state is we actually purchased all the land that we develop and we feel that it's a safer, better way for us to control the environment in which we are developing. [00:38:15] And it and it doesn't put us or the landowner in a situation that could produce some legal issues later on. So a decommissioning plan in this sense would be, in essence, an insurance policy that we would have with the Town. If anything did happen, it would then be paid back to us to remove the panels, our panels from our own property. Jude Lempke [00:38:41] So the question I guess the question is, are you going to buy a surety bond? Is that what you're saying? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:38:47] Correct. And we would sign that agreement, a legally binding agreement with the Town. Jude Lempke [00:38:53] The board has to approve that. So that's fine. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:38:56] Yes, correct. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:38:57] OK, I want to give some other people Henry. that you have your hand up to do a. Question for now or after we have the public hearing, or did you want to make a comment? As part of the public hearing? Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:39:14] Yeah, well, I'm going to have a little trouble sleeping tonight if Ann Rider's disappointed in me. So I just wanted to mention that I did read the fencing item number six on page six of the law. And that's why I brought it up, because I'm just generally not a fan of chain link fences, as I don't think they blend in well with the with the countryside. And so but I mean, it's a requirement. It's a requirement. I just checked. Ann Rider [00:39:45] It's a requirement. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:39:47] Yeah, I understand that now. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:39:48] The fence is a requirement. The form of the fence does not have to be chain link. Been very popular in a lot of solar sites that I've been involved with there using a seven foot high or a six foot high agricultural fence with a seven top layer across the post of seven foot total height. So it's basically a six by six agricultural type, well woven wire fence, which. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:40:19] It's not a huge issue. I just and, you know, it says it's to prevent unauthorized access, which, of course, is six foot high fence wouldn't do that. If somebody wants to get in with. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:40:30] A fence is only going to stop the honest people. You know that. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:40:33] Yeah. Yeah. And I might be getting ahead of ourselves here, but the Tompkins County Department of Planning Sustainability recommended a glare assessment survey. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:40:45] Right. We'll talk about that as we go through what the public comments at first and then we'll have a lot of discussion with the board members. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:40:57] The other thing is, I heard and say a couple of times that you can't see the solar panels from the road. But I, I mean, maybe I'm misunderstanding something, but I'm pretty sure I can see all that land from the road, so I don't know why I would not. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:41:12] I think she was talking about the two existing Renovous. Ann Rider [00:41:15] Yes. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:41:16] Plants. Ann Rider [00:41:16] With two existing. OK, you don't know where they are Henry. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:41:20] And no, I don't I haven't seen those, but. Ann Rider [00:41:23] I know we'll definitely,. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:41:27] Definitely see this project. [00:41:29] The area from the corner of Route seventy nine over to the south, of course, you're going to see because it's open land. Yep. Of course you can see them. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:41:41] OK, I wasn't sure what you're referring to it because we were discussing this project and you said we wouldn't see the solar panel. So I was a little bit confused what you were referring to. Ann Rider [00:41:50] You'll see them from the corner of seventy nine over south, but the ones that are already existing there, you don't know what they're there, you can't see them unless you really slow down and look,. Board Member Henry Hansteen [00:42:05] I'm not interested in those. Ann Rider [00:42:07] Well then build a house in front of them, ok. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:42:10] We got to give other people a chance to talk to. That's. Try to go down the line here, see, Jude, you've already spoken. And so a bunch of raised hands, I thought maybe I was seeing things. OK, Marcus Gingerich. Marcus Gingerich [00:42:36] Yes can you hear me? [00:42:38] Yeah, I can hear you. [00:42:40] OK, I wasn't sure I've had problems with my zoom zccount. So, yeah, Marcus Gingerich 101... Road. I had a couple of questions to actually do, kind of an address on the back of the decommissioning fund of the use of scrap, which I don't think was yeah, I'm pretty sure, that's not allowed by our law to it as well. [00:43:10] But apparently we're going to be talking about it because of the Glare study. And maybe I'm wrong that one of the designs of these might be motorized and .... [00:43:24] And that raises another question. How do you address that in a glare study? And if that's going to complicate things, if if they're nice and they're actually changing the angle and getting the best, sounds like it's pretty big field, so and hopefully it's not a big issue. [00:43:44] But if I recall correctly and maybe I don't and I believe the neighbors around there have to be notified, you know, that this is going on as well. And one of the other things, and I believe that's one of the biggest things I'm concerned about is these things are getting put in now and they have a 25 year expected lifespan. [00:44:09] And we know that things start to fail as soon as they start. So and it's just a matter of progression. And the one thing that I don't quite and I say this that concerns me is the decommissioning plan. And, yes, it's there. [00:44:30] It's kind of an, but there's also some things about it that I'm quite sure I completely agree with. They say that the panels are completely nontoxic. [00:44:39] They maybe, in 25 years there will be everything. We agree that it's nontoxic. And I know in Seema's processing, which are essentially polycrystalline and then having to make a projection, you have to do it with arsenic. And I guess many things that I would like to see is that Americans are going to be up on site because that could potentially be a problem down the road. [00:45:13] And if and I don't know that there's enough to be significant that if there would be enough and if it's because I mean, I'm not saying that there is an option of the phosphorous or arsenic depending on the manufacturing process, and that if there is if these were going to decommissioning somebody just decides, somebody just decides whether they're going to bring them up and get rid of them. [00:45:36] That could potentially be a problem, especially when you've got, know, potential that one issue out there as well. So, yeah, I mean, if it has been mentioned and I think you've mentioned it to the person of very specific things that are required by our law, and I'm just not quite sure that we are there yet. But maybe I left them as well. I think that's it for me. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:46:08] OK, thank you, Marcus, of trying to go into some logical order here. I know we have a couple of board members that raise their hand, which is fine, I just want to see. Well, Michael, I see you're on the now it's good. [00:46:33] Michael Carpenter, that is it, Mike, Michael Miles also. OK. Michael, you have Michael MIles, you have your hand up? Councilperson Michael Miles [00:46:51] Yeah, Michael Miles, three twenty six Aiken Road, also Town board member, I had a question about a fire response and I know this is I know some of us who are veterans of the windfarm debate. [00:47:11] That was an issue that came up is what is the first responder a fire response to this kind of project that I didn't see that the plans and the specifics on what is going to happen is going to be training included. Is that going to be accommodated in any kind of pilot or host agreement? So more information on that would be helpful. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:47:39] OK, if you're talking about a, information for the fire department? Councilperson Michael Miles [00:47:47] Yeah, I'm assuming that the fire department or other first responders who may have to show up at this facility say that the grass fires. I'm not sure what the what the potential could be, you know, probably minimal, but say they had to show up to this facility and it's a 20 megawatt energy production facility. I'm sure that the response would be unique to that case, you know, to be able to mitigate whatever they need to. Well, not destroying property and also keeping everything safe. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:48:22] OK, yes. We can make that a condition before they get the building permit very easily and having a preconstruction conference with the fire department. Is very common to do all these things so well. OK, well, we'll make sure we have. That addressed. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:48:49] Just a side note, we have put together training programs with other towns and talk through working with the fire chief to say, hey, if X, Y or Z happens, this is what happens. And once we get once construction starts, we do . [00:49:05] We have put together plans to show them where things are going to be, where the shutoff switches are, and go through the nice sort of training for any type of issue. So we definitely have a plan for that as well. And we can definitely submit that to the Town as part of our building permit. Councilperson Michael Miles [00:49:22] OK, yeah, I just want to make sure that they're in the loop on this eventually for what they need. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:49:27] Yeah. And we and we're happy to have other towns come as well from other areas. We've incorporated, I think our last training incorporated for different fire departments. [00:49:35] It's a great point. What do you do? Because you definitely don't want someone shoot water at it. So the electricity is still on. That would be the last thing you want to do. So it's a great point that you make and we will definitely make sure to include that with our building permits submission as well. Councilperson Michael Miles [00:49:51] OK, thank you. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:49:54] Bob Lynch Aye. [00:49:58] Callin. Councilperson Robert Lynch [00:50:02] Good evening. I wanted to express my general support for this project. I've been very enthusiastic about it. I'm speaking as one of fou r voting members on the Town board. I am very enthusiastic about having it happen. I like to make it happen. And I don't see any big impediments here. [00:50:25] I did read what the Department of Planning and Sustainability had written on the twenty third of December, and one of the recommendations they made was for a Galre assessment survey. And my recollection is that's required by the Town solar law anyway, so I'm not surprised they would request that. [00:50:43] And the other request that the Department of Planning and Sustainability made was that they require the applicant to maintain a natural vegetative cover around the proposed installations. And I presume they would do that. A number of these solar farms use natural grazing sheep or goats. I guess sheep are better than goats, but to to keep the foliage down. [00:51:15] And this has been done elsewhere. And I would support that. As I mentioned at a prior meeting before this public hearing, I would highly recommend that any part of the project that is not being developed for solar panels be kept in an agricultural state or a wooded state. The existing forest remain forest, the existing fields to the west of the solar array out toward Applegate Road. I believe I would rather have them be farmed tha n be left to go to waste. [00:51:49] I think I would make the Town look more aggressive and consistent with our comprehensive plan, and I would highly recommend that that be done. The only other thing I have is regarding the fencing. I know the fencing is required under the law, but I for example, the solar farm on Podunk Road, they use the woven wire agricultural fencing to surround the array and it does look more compatible with the rural agricultural environment. [00:52:23] And I don't know if a decision has been made by Norbit as to go with the more industrial looking chain link fence. But I would prefer, all things considered, the use of the agricultural fencing. Another thing it allows, it allows for small wildlife that might otherwise be trapped in that solar array to escape, whereas a chain link fence might not. And those are my only comments. And for the record, my name is Robert Lynch. I'm a Councilperson on the town of Enfield board and I reside at 175 Gray Road. Thank you. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:53:00] All right, thank you, Bob. Brian [00:53:06] Excuse I'm a call in, I've had my hand up a half an hour. Sorry, who is this? That's fine. It's a it's a call in number. My name is Brian Noteboom. I'm president of Newfield, New York. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:53:21] Hi Brian. Brian Notboom [00:53:22] Have an Irish Hill Road. How are you? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:53:25] You remember me, probably. Brian Notboom [00:53:26] Last name? Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:53:27] Walker. Brian Notboom [00:53:28] Yes. Yeah,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:53:30] I worked with your dad quite a bit. Brian Notboom [00:53:33] My my father's happily retired so. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:53:36] Yes. I don't enjoy that. He's smarter than some of the. Brian Notboom [00:53:39] Many years. I don't know. Ask him what he does with all his time but yeah. Grandkids and things, so I live on Irish Hill Road Newfield, and I want to wave my hand to my neighbors and Enfield,. [00:53:58] And I'm a union carpenter from local to 277. We've been merged, but I reside locally and Tompkins County, as well as many of my other members, and I am going to just ask that you support this for the local Labor region. Norbut and Dan has as a developer, they have committed to the use of using at least New York State based contractors. So I can say that a lot of other solar fields are not. [00:54:28] And I'm also excited that their going to commit to using local labor as well on this project that, you know, is possibly going to start in April with a summer reracking build, this is going to employ our brother and sister members throughout the summer. As you know, this allows local money to stay local groceries, pay mortgages, taxes, less travel so the fossil fuels aren't used, less wear and tear in vehicles. [00:55:01] Know if a member can live with Brian Ithaca. the surrounding area they want to travel to to Bampton or Elmira for work. I have been observing other solar farms in the area, Tioga County and and one in Freeville as well. I did personally notice that dozens of the plates were for Virginia, Carolinas, Georgia, and I believe the contractor on that Freeville project was based out of Florida as well. I'm very confident after speaking with Norbert, the management team, that they will and and commit to use local labor throughout this project. [00:55:43] And they'll pay the area standards, which our carpenters make and tradespeople make their standards includes a health care retirement, a good wage to raise a family, and that area standard will circulate and stimulate the local economy as well. So sounds like the board is very supportive of this. And I want to thank you for your time. [00:56:06] And the support of local labor is huge in our industry because the money stays local and we don't see the travelers coming in that only buy a cup of coffee and maybe stay in a hotel room, maybe not even an Ithaca. because of the cost of the hotel rooms usually aren't that cheap and a lot of them are using Air B & B's and such. [00:56:29] So I'm just saying that the money is not staying in the area when they are leaving. It's they make the money and they fly right out. So thank you for your time. Again, my name is Brian Notboom for the record, I think. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:56:45] OK. Acting Town Supervisor Stepahnie Redmond [00:56:48] And I can't raise my hand, but I'd like to ask a question when you have a chance. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:56:52] Sure. Who is this? Acting Town Supervisor Stepahnie Redmond [00:56:55] Stephanie Redmond. Board Chair Daniel Walker [00:56:56] Oh, Stephanie. Acting Town Supervisor Stepahnie Redmond [00:56:59] So I was just curious, I know you've indicated certain financials over the past, but I'm wondering if during the public hearing you could state anything about the willingness t o or sort of what level the will the Norbut is willing to engage in a community host agreement. If you have any idea and I know it's probably just a ballpark figure and we have to sort of hammer out the details. But and what that's been discussed on your end at all. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [00:57:30] In terms of financials, we are still working through the IDA because the Town is out of the forty seven, we are legally required to go through the IDA in order to negotiate a pilot. And the IDA does that on behalf of the Town, the school district in the county. [00:57:49] And depending on where the the IDA lands on what a pilot fee or a pilot amount would be, per megawatt would be what dictates what is available for a community host agreement. As the as we get further along in these projects, the the grants that we're allowed to apply for sunset. [00:58:11] And so what that means is every time a megawatt block gets filled, it moves down to the next level. So a project that we did last year in the town of Allegheny had a twenty three cents megawatt block where you could get twenty three cents for every kilowatt that you were generating. [00:58:35] And so what that means when when it goes down is there's less potential for grant money or they sort of funding to help with the project. [00:58:44] So eventually they're going to get to zero. Those. [00:58:49] And so this time I think we're at about 13 cents, which is significantly lower than where we were last year. And they also changed a few things in terms of the community atter program. So we are working very diligently to figure out Town now in IDA. [00:59:10] And as soon as we can figure that out, that is when we'd be able to better understand what we can do on the on the community end of things. So we're hoping to negotiate that in tandem with the IDA. And I actually do have a call with Heather MacDaniels tomorrow because typically the IDA gets involved shortly after the the secret process has been. [00:59:33] Has been received for a negative declaration, so that's what we're hopefully achieving tonight is the negative declaration, which would then bring us to the next step of working through the pilot negotiations. Acting Town Supervisor Stepahnie Redmond [00:59:45] OK, great, thank you. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [00:59:47] I just want to make an announcement, if you are not speaking, could you please mute your microphone? So that we can get a clear recording of the people speaking. Thank you. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:00:00] OK. They're. Does anyone else from the public want to have the comment? I see there's a sea birds call. And looks like a n ice clutch of eggs, not identifying who they are, but. I'm going to actually. Oh, like, uh. This. [01:00:54] I don't want to leave anybody out, so if anyone does want to say something on mute your microphones, I believe I have allowed everybody to. Do th at and just say your name. [01:01:14] Ok. [01:01:18] Robert Lynch, you have something else you want to say, it was your hand up, left over? Councilperson Robert Lynch [01:01:27] I do not have anything additional I wanted to say,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:01:30] OK, that's fine, and that's want. Councilperson Robert Lynch [01:01:32] I support the project. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:01:33] OK, sounds good. Thank you. OK. It's now eight o'clock, I'm going to close the public hearing. And bring it back to the board for discussion. Anyone on the board want to start off? [01:02:11] Oh, or. Board Member Henry Hansteen [01:02:15] Yeah, I'll say something, Dan, about the the glare from the panels with the sun moving east to west every day and north and south through the seasons, at some point, somebody is probably going to get some glare houses nearby. And I'm sure that's what the report will say. And I just wonder. What do y ou do about that, other than just say no, that's part of having solar panels. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:02:58] Well. Board Member Henry Hansteen [01:03:00] I just Googled it and I and I the first thing that came up was somebody that puts them on the roof and their neighbor complained that forty five minutes each day, certain times of the year, there's a there's a glare, blinding glare coming in your house. And he was wondering what he's supposed to do. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:03:17] Right. Board Member Henry Hansteen [01:03:19] But I did. So, I mean, I understand that they can produce a report, but I just wonder, the report's going to say that solar panels make glare I assume and then what. [01:03:29] So then. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:03:31] There is a clear analysis of methodology and. I think one of the comments that I heard was maybe I forget exactly who made it, but about the rotation of the panels, but these are all, I believe, fixed tilt panels. That's correct. And right. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:03:55] Yes that's correct. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:03:55] They are not planning on putting trackers in. In my experience with glare, the solar panels, the morning glare usually hits receptors on the west side of the site. And eveningglare usually has receptors on the east side. And the methodology to prevent uncomfortable glare is if if it shows up, would be to provide a screening of vegetation usually. Am looking at this particular site. The major there is an airstrip that is west of the site. But I believe the alignment of the airstrip is north, central to the alignment is is north of the actual panels. [01:05:14] So I would not anticipate that airstrip getting any glare. There right now, there are no receptors on the west side other than the Johnnys wholesale, and I believe there's one residents over there attached to that in that direction. And I believe on the east side, there's a pretty good distance to any. Any residences, but. Board Member Henry Hansteen [01:05:42] That's the thing about it, there aren't many houses around there to be. [01:05:47] There aren't many houses, as you say, there aren't many houses in the area that will be subjected to it. So that's a good thing and. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:05:55] So the other potential receptors would be along Applegate Road, so I talked to Dan Norbut earlier today, and if if the board wishes to have a glare study done, he said he would be willing to provide that. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:06:22] I would make a comment, Dan, about it. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:06:24] Go ahead, Mike. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:06:26] We've a the business that I have been in. We've put up solar panels, solar systems for about the last twenty two years, large scale, small scale in small neighborhoods, Clerk neighborhoods out in the woods in the city, never on any of the a couple of hundred systems we put up. Has anyone ever mentioned glare we're having an issue with it or even said anything about glare. [01:06:52] That being said, the solar law, page five. Number six. I believe if you want to look it up, it's number 6B six, it says a glare assessment survey and a complaint and mitigation plan reasonably acceptable to the planning board to address to address glare on other parcels of land on an ongoing basis during the life of the project. That's one of the requirements of a permit to be issued. [01:07:28] We can waive that requirement, but but it is in the solar law. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:07:32] It is in the solar law. And I think there are a number there's a number one way to look at the impact of glares is to see if there's receptors that would be having it and then there is software to actually do the analysis, which is. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:07:55] To me is as far as the glare situation goes, I think that the more important part of that line is that the complaint and mitigation plan reasonably expect both of the planning board to address it. Probably more important than spending a lot of money on a survey. [01:08:12] I don't think that I think a survey is fine. [01:08:16] I think you could spend a whole lot of money on a study of it, and you probably wouldn't get much further than saying, well, if there's going to be a problem, then we'll have to fix it when the time comes. [01:08:25] I would rather see Norbut Solar saying. We will have a mitigation plan, some way to deal with complaints. Basically, this is something that's really important and it's mentioned a number of times in the solar law of it that if there are issues and if there are problems that come up, there needs to be a system whereby people can bring those complaints to the Town or to the planning board, to Norbut Solar and then have it dealt with in some manageable way. [01:08:56] And that really needs to be written out ahead of time in in the application itself so that people have a reasonable way to deal with it. [01:09:04] I don't think we need to be unduly concerned about people being unreasonable. But but we shouldn't really take into consideration that somebody may have a problem in this area or that area or whatever area it might be. [01:09:16] And that I would think that I'm pretty sure would like to address it and not have it be a problem in the future. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:09:23] We can make that a condition. Board Member Henry Hansteen [01:09:26] I support Mike in waiving the Glare Assessment Survey. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:09:35] OK, or any other board members have comments on the glare issue. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:09:47] In order to not do what the what the is being recommended by the county planning board, we recommend that the Town require the applicant to develop a glare assessment survey to address the glare. If if we are not going to require the applicant to do that, we will need a four fifths vote of the board. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:10:10] Right need a Supermajority to approve it. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:10:12] Exactly. Right now. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:10:15] To override the county comments. OK. Councilperson Robert Lynch [01:10:28] And I would just interject, as a member of the governing board of the Town, that I would support my position on that, that if he thinks he helped write the solar law and if he thinks that it's not required and it can be waived, let it be waived. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:10:48] And in looking at the site and being there with glare analysis. I would say that the. Potential glare from the site, probably. Would be in the early morning. Usually between six and eight a.m.. Depending on daylight saving time and that you might be getting some glare on the properties directly west of the site. And. It would probably be a duration of 10 to 15 minutes maximum, but. I think just the discussion we've had evaluates the glare, which tests to meet the requirements. [01:11:46] Of of the of the the local law to review the site and with potential for and visual impacts from. So I will I'm I'm facilitating meetings and then I'll give you some of my technical expertize in evaluating things, but I will not be voting on this project. So when we do the final resolutions, I'm sitting back because of my companies doing the site planning development, not me particularly, but other people within our organization. So. [01:12:35] To the one issue that we. Have here is that we do have a fair amount of mapped wetlands out of the site of if I don't know if anyone's read the whole. Wetland evaluation report. These are wetlands, but they're not state wetlands, they do meet the federal wetlands definition. [01:13:11] And just driving most of the wetlands is acceptable in most cases for these these types of low, low value wetlands. And the main requirement that the corps would have on wetlands is that you're not placed below the wetlands, so. [01:13:40] You the the roadway. And the equipment pad areas are all outside any o f the wetlands, either where it crosses the one wetland or the northwest corner, which is actually, I believe, a drainage ditch. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:14:12] And if I may just add a quick comment, first, design, the site are very preliminary designs. Have this the arrays pushed all the way to the east and putting up against the other arrays that are already there. [01:14:26] When we did the wetland delineation and we discovered the larger wetland over there, we reasonably could assume that it's a DEC regulated wetland. So we shifted the array away from that and also outside of the 100 foot buffer that typically accompanies a DEC wetland so that we were fully in compliant and wouldn't run into any other issues later on down the road. Obviously, we want to be as cautious as possible and not create any issues that may arise later on. [01:14:56] So to Mr. Walker's point, we also shifted the entire system to the west slightly. And then we also redesigned the the road in the cul de sac area where the pad mounts are. So as you can see, the two arrays to the west are slightly smaller than the two way arrays to the east. And that was so that we would avoid the wetland that's coming north and south just to the right of that cul de sac area. You can see it in the you can see it to the right of the mount. [01:15:27] The the pad mounts in the light blue. We wanted to make sure we weren't building a road over a wetland as well and following the Army Corps of Engineers guidance. So we've done several different designs to make sure that we were not negatively impacting the environment and the topography that we currently have. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:15:49] Because Dan one question on me was that a previous version you showed the access road coming directly west to Applegate Road and this plan now you've got the access road coming out of the arrays and then running north to, I believe, the connection to NYSEG. Was it was that done because. They like what's the connection point up there? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:16:23] Yes, so what happened was originally we had it coming, going directly west, coming right out to the road. We would prefer that because it's cheaper to build a shorter road. But unfortunately, what the utility was telling us was at that specific spot in the road, we had to connect to a power line that was closer to it and that was going south on Applegate Road rather than going north. [01:16:48] North where Applegate Road meets Mecklenburg Road is where the power line is that we need for the facility. And so the utility company was saying, well, if you connect coming straight out onto Apple Gate Road, you have to go south on Applegate Road down and around. [01:17:05] And it would have been an additional like two to five million dollars of power lines. For some reason, they couldn't just run it north. [01:17:14] So they told us we had to shift our point of interconnection closer to the Applegate and Mecklenburg Road intersection, which is why you see the road kind of sneaking up that way, because they would not allow us to have it coming right where the where the access road comes out of the array. [01:17:33] Unfortunately, that kind of silly and not really sure why they couldn't accommodate that, but that was what they told us we had to do. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:17:43] But see, with the access, roads still have to go up there. If you your all your utility, your electric is underground, I believe, to the point of connection. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:17:56] Yep. That was one thing we actually discussed was to save costs was to have that Stubbe Road where those those telephone poles are those black dots. Everything would go underground immediately after that, the last pole there. [01:18:12] The reason for keeping the road was we didn't want to bisect the land and create two separate corridors in case there ever was a future use for it, whether it's farming or another type of development. We didn't want to have a road completely cutting it in half. [01:18:30] So it was something that we thought was it was more expensive for us to do, but it gave more opportunities for that land in the future. Again, whether it's farm, the land, it's a continuous contiguous piece of land rather than being bisect by a gravel road. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:18:47] OK,. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:18:48] Again, a little bit more expensive for us, but allows for better opportunity in the future. And again, we're trying to think long term for future plans and not take any shortcuts that might look good in the short term, but really kind of hurt the property in the long run. [01:19:13] And just as a side note, we would have to build a culvert and a small. Drainage way for that that little waterway right there, that is a drainage ditch. But it is identified as a wetland area. So we would follow the Army Corps of Engineers guidance to make sure that we didn't we didn't disturb it unnecessarily. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:19:35] Yeah, that's how they take manmade features that become wetlands. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:19:43] Yeah, golf course ponds have been the bane of my existence. Man made golf course, ponds turn into wetlands and yeah,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:19:52] It's it's like there was a project that I was reviewing at some point that the developer put in and stormwater management pond. And it was a phase project in the second phase that expanding the pond. But as soon as they built it, it became a wetland that couldn't make it any bigger. So they had to build another one. So so figure it was the Corps doing both things. So anyhow. Do any other board members want to enter into the discussion? Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:20:32] I've got a fairly long list and that's fine for me to start. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:20:37] Yup. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:20:37] OK, the first part of it, actually, I'm going to read because I was thinking it more clearly this morning, which is typical for me. By the time it gets to this time of night, I'm not thinking so clearly. So I'm going to just read this part. Having gone through the stream and wetland plan the geodeck report the FEAF part one, the SWIP report, the site plan, existing conditions report, I find a significant amount of information. [01:21:03] Some of which I'm qualified to evaluate, some not because a great deal of information was generated through LaBella , it seems inappropriate to ask Dan to do a final evaluation on its appropriatness or it's efficacy. Does this, therefore require the board to look outside its membership for professional evaluation of the totality of the submittal in order to be assured that the Town will have all the necessary safeguards and oversight personnel in place to allow the project to proceed? [01:21:32] This will, of course, entail time and money spent on both sides, but I think we need to consider it now at this point in the project, have a number of specific questions that I can go into in relation to the SWIP, in relation to the decommissioning plan mostly, and how they relate to the solar law itself. So I would be happy to go into them today. It's a little bit piecemealing, but at some point we'll have to do with them. My bigger concern, though, to start with this is how we decide to deal with all this information. [01:22:03] For me, I actually did read all the information, but some of it really just kind of went through my head and said, oh, that's interesting, but I have no way to evaluate it as to whether whether it's what we need, whether we don't need so forth and so on. One of the biggest concerns I came up with was oversight. [01:22:22] So there's a lot of oversight in place in the applications, the oversight of the project itself and its and its paid oversight paid for by the Norbut Solar itself or whoever is going to be doing the actual construction of the project. [01:22:38] But I don't see any there and I don't know exactly that, I'm sure of how the Town itself will go about oversight of this project itself or whether this is expected that Alann will be in charge of all the oversight involved, that, you know, he may not have the skills either and may not have the time to do that, or if we're looking for some kind of oversight facility or person to take the town's role in this project and make sure that that the interface between the people that do this work inspection's the people that do the contractors inspections, Norbut Solar and anybody else involved with it also can interface with the with the Town inspection people and make sure that we're watching the project as it goes along carefully. [01:23:22] So I'd like to leave that out there to start with as a p roject and get some response to that, mostly from from Dan and Dan, I think possibly to start with. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:23:36] Yes, in terms of engineers, we've done both to verify the information provided and work through it. I will say in one scenario, the Town required that they hire a third party engineer and it ended up creating a lot of chaos because engineers were trying to engineer each other. [01:24:00] And what we found was the most helpful was to make the engineers who produced the reports available to the Town board members to ask questions and and have them available at a zoo meeting like this where they are directly fielding your questions and answering them for you rather than through me or third party. [01:24:20] And we'd be happy to do that. We've already talked to the Lobello folks as well, and they're happy to to jump on a call like this and have the Town board ask all the questions about all the reports that they generated and have them explain them in detail. And we found that using the engineers to explain that typically gets a quicker, more educated answer. When you bring in third party engineers, as you mentioned, it can be costly for both sides. [01:24:49] And typically it's it can be a little bit tricky for outside engineers to get up to speed on all the intricacies of the project and understand the intent of the design or reasonings behind why we created something the way we did. Whereas the engineers we work with can explain how we got from design A. all the way to design C. [01:25:12] So I'd be happy to offer offer up all the engineers that worked on this project to attend, to attend a meeting and you guys can ask your questions directly to them and have them answer. [01:25:22] That would be my. My suggestion for that piece of it,. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:25:27] Let me before you go on, interject there, just for one thing, that that's that's a great idea and that's a good thing to have happen. But it doesn't deal with. However, is the initial approval of all of these things? I don't think that well, myself, I'm not going to speak for anybody else. And I certainly am not speaking for Dan when I say that I do not have the expertize to evaluate these hundreds of pages of reports. [01:25:51] So it's not so much that somebody would come to answer my questions. I wouldn't even know the questions to ask, honestly. OK, and what I need is for somebody who has looked at these reports and to be honest, it's fine with me for them to be the person to do that. I know he feels as a conflict of interests there. [01:26:10] At the same time, I feel Dan has great integrity and is not going to. Use uses conflict of interest to his or his company's advantage, but I don't know that he's comfortable with doing that at the end to say that, oh, yes, I've looked at all these reports and they're definitely in keeping with what we need and what we want. [01:26:28] But for the Town itself, I need to do my due diligence and say I need to make sure that the Town has looked at these reports. Someone that I can say from the Town is looked at all these reports, these hundreds of pages and say they're OK. [01:26:43] Here's a question. Here's a question. Here's a question. So let me stop there and let you respond to that. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:26:50] Yeah, I agree. Dan Walker does have a wealth of knowledge, and I will say that LaBella has already been paid for all the work rendered at this point. So there's no more advantage that they could really gain. But I do agree with you. [01:27:08] I understand your perspective in that some of the information is very granular. I know from experience trying to figure out the geotechnical report that it took me several months to to get comfortable with what I was looking at. [01:27:22] And that was looking at the same report over and over again. So I definitely can appreciate your request. And again, it's up to you guys how how you would like to have it reviewed. I do know Dan can provide insight. He I think in this scenario it would be an ethical conflict for him to vote. [01:27:42] But I don't think it's an ethical conflict for him to provide guidance in the process. But that, again, is your decision as to what the board is comfortable with. [01:27:52] But if I had a resource, I will tell you, if I have other boards with someone like Dan on it, I would highly encourage them to pick his brain because we have been in scenarios where Town boards don't even know their own law, and that can be challe nging from the very start. So. [01:28:12] My suggestion would be to use Dan and his wealth of knowledge. He is has all the capability to dissect this pretty, pretty surgically. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:28:25] Dan, would you mind weighing in on that? Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:28:27] No, I can I could give you an unbiased. Review I I've I've gone through. Not in detail every line, but it went in review in the geotech. I'm not seeing a lot of issues that are popping up the. I reviewed the w etland report and assessment also, and. I know the... [01:29:01] Team that does those wetlands are very. Thorough in their evaluations. So I'm. If they're showing a wetland out of sight, I know that they found the characteristics and have evaluated it fairly. The. I think the biggest I'm comfortable with providing a technical review and. And I've been looking at it from that standpoint, I've already given some sort of comments today, Dan, about things that might better be done. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:29:43] My other my other question then was involved with continuing oversight during the course of construction and after construction oversight of the project. While, it's an operation. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:29:55] Normally. Well, I'd like to keep a real close handle on everything that's happening and any job that I do or including the Town or and the private side, typically the SWIP inspections are done. [01:30:16] By the owner, the contractor. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:30:20] For their independent contractor right there, they're hired out. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:30:23] They hiret that out by the... [01:30:28] All of the any contractor working on a site that disturbed me more than an acre have to have people that are trained basically five hour training, which is kind of sketchy, but it's it's an overview type. [01:30:45] But to know what they're supposed to do to maintain the sediment erosion control elements of the SWIP document, that of two hundred and seventy pages is quite thorough. And it's it's been in front of the DEC. regulators that the format that LaBella uses, they cover all the bases and they're all the things that the DEC. has look ed at. And believe me, they look at it pretty closely. [01:31:21] Especially on the bigger projects. So the stormwater inspections. Would be done by an independent contractor. And they have to sign off on that and have a licensed professional do that work, the site construction is pretty straightforward at this site. [01:31:44] There's not a lot of earth moving. I don't believe they're not regrading the site. They're they're making the the arrays will be able to follow the contours that are out there without having to totally. [01:32:00] We level the whole site. The electrical inspections are done by third party anyhow. Alan wouldn't be doing those, and the foundation inspections are pretty straightforward and they're definitely within the biggest foundations are the community foundations that are really there are the pads for the equipment is the only concrete slabs that are out there the. [01:32:32] The experience has been that the equipment suppliers provide the foundation analysis and certification for the posts driven posts, groups using. [01:32:50] So I think the biggest part of oversight needs is construction hours. And making sure that they keep the dust down and keep the road clean. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:33:03] So let's go with the assumption that that most almost all, let's say ninety eight percent of all the inspections are going to be taken care of by either Norbit or the contractor that they hired or the contractors, independent contractors. So all that being said, there is an overall project, it has to be looked at by someone from the Town. [01:33:27] I'm assuming that falls into Alan's purview as building inspector. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:33:31] Yes, he's got a building permit. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:33:34] Someone has to track all this paperwork, store all his paperwork, keep all this paperwork, pay attention to it, pay attention to the continuing reports from the swip inspector as they come in. Does that fall to the purview of the Town and the building inspector in the Town to do that? Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:33:50] I would. I would not. Normally, it's the project owner that's responsible for that. The certifications that are required by the building code, they have to submit the proper reports and all the record drawing documents after construction. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:34:12] That all goes to Alan? Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:34:14] That all goes, they would all go to, Alan, and being in the code file,. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:34:18] Yeah, yeah,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:34:20] In the financial end, the financial end the Town board would be responsible for the pilots and whichever agency is doing that pilot. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:34:32] Well, there are some other financial issues that have to be tracked as well, and I can't remember from the from this solar law very well, if the Town board or the planning board actually is responsible for keeping track of all the financial issues involved, we can look up that and see. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:34:49] Yeah, I. I think the the Town board is a legislative board that would be that would be named in any financial security documents and insurances because they're they're the legally responsible agency. The planning board is advisory. So we normally would do that. But that would be a Town board requirement. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:35:16] So they'll have to gear up to be able to track that someone by now. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:35:21] And Alan is the eyes on the ground to make sure they're following the conditions that we put on the planning board. And if this is a huge area project, but it's very it's not very complicated. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:35:36] No, I agree. I agree. One, go ahead. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:35:39] You know, the biggest complication is the. The electrical side. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:35:46] Yeah, I think one of the issues that I'm concerned with there with with the financial side is that not having done this before, the Town board isn't any more familiar with this or perhaps even less familiar with them than people on the planning board are. [01:36:01] And at some point, we need to we need to make it clear or get the information communicated well to the Town board so that they know what their obligations and responsibilities are in relation to the financial part of this project. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:36:17] Well,. Acting Town Supervisor Stepahnie Redmond [01:36:18] Stephanie, I just wanted to let you know that I know that the Aye. decommissioning fund is under the purview of the Town board because I know that I've been looking into different investment opportunities for other funds that we have sort of sitting around like the decommissioning funds to gain an interest during those while they're sitting there. [01:36:39] So I know at least that is under the purview of the Town board. Beyond tha t, I know that we have to sign the agreement with the IDA and Norbut for the pilot agreements and then we have to work through the community host agreement. But I'm not really sure beyond that. I know that Alan was talking about the fees for the inspection fees and whatnot. So I think he controls a lot of that aspect. But that's all I know that,. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:37:06] You know, this one thing we didn't really make clear in the solar law and maybe then anything you could apprize me of what's typical for this. But we still have to go into the decommissioning plans and the funds and so forth and so on, which I'd like to do hopefully we'll get to in this meeting. But one thing I did wonder right off hand was that if. If it's true that. [01:37:30] That money can be taken, then invested somewhere safe, obviously, and get interest from it. Who does that interest belong to? Does that belong to the Town? Is that belong to your company? Because it seems to me it's your money that the interest wo uld belong to you. Maybe I'm wrong about that. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:37:49] So I'm hesitant to to comment on it off the cuff, but I do know it is it is money that is not supposed to be invested or allocated in any other way because it is a bond or an insurance policy. [01:38:06] It is supposed to be held in that account and cannot be used for anything other than the decommissioning aspect. And it can't be released. We did come across this in another situation where the Town wanted to borrow against it. And it's not something that is technically in the town's bank. It is it is reserved separately. [01:38:31] So my understanding of it, given my limited understanding of it, based on that one situation, is that it can't be used for anything other than its intended purpose. In another Town there was a 20. They were working on actually changing the law right now, but they're decommissioning law required a 20 percent bond of the construction costs and that would have been roughly about two and a half m illion dollars for that specific project. [01:39:00] And the Town was was talking about how they could use that for a lot of things. And our lawyer chimed in and said, well, I just want to I want to make it clear that you can't actually touch that money. It is solely for the purpose of decommissioning and it can never be used for anything other than that. So. So that is my limited understanding of that as a financial mechanism. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:39:23] That's that's my understanding of it also. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:39:26] And we've done both. We've done a bond, which was an actual cash payment held in a bank account, and we've done an actual insurance policy where if for whatever reason the bond was called or the decommissioni ng program was called into effect, that there was an insurance policy to pay out that money. So it wasn't actually an amount of money in a bank account, but an insurance policy that was held with the Town. [01:39:53] And we've also done the other version where it was a bond that was held with the Town, where that money was sitting in a bank account waiting to be used, but could only be used for that specific reason. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:40:04] I assume that you've read the solar law, OK, are you aware of what of what our solar law actually requires in terms of that? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:40:17] Yes, I believe there is a bond that's required. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:40:20] No not a bond. That's what you offered. Or one of the one of the possibilities that the solar law actually requires either a letter of credit from a bank or cash. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:40:31] You're right. [01:40:36] Yes, we can do either of those. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:40:38] OK, that's not a deal breaker for you to be able to do that. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:40:42] No, not at all. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:40:42] OK, and that obviously is a letter of credit. If that means that if it's your money and you're putting it somewhere and whatever it is, whatever happens if there's any interest to be gained by that, obviously that belongs to you? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:40:55] Correct It would be, in essence, held in an escrow account. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:40:59] And maybe I should bring this up at the same time. I don't know if it's inappropriate, but. My understanding of the way you described the decommissioning fund, was that what you would like to do or what you were planning on doing was to take the cost of decommissioning, subtract what you thought was the scrap value from that, and then use that final number, the cost minus the scrap value for the amount of money that you would be putting in in escrow for the decommissioning plan, which is actually our plan calls for you not being able to do that. [01:41:34] It calls for the actual amount of the decommissioning as a total whole dollar amount without the scrap value subtracted to be the amount of money that you're going to put in this or other credit for. Does that sound right to you? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:41:49] No, we actually submitted the one without scrap value. We. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:41:53] Well, you did. It says at the top. But then when you talk about it down below there, it actually says it's not clear at all. [01:42:00] It actually says the amount of money minus the scrap value. So I think we ne ed more clarity in the language that's all. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:42:09] We can definitely, definitely make sure that's a little clear, we do have two plans. We we are of the belief that there is scrap value in the project, that we work with third world countries, specifically Uruguay, in which we've shipped panels down to that country for reuse. [01:42:31] Our owner is actually down there right now. And so we do believe that their scrap value. But again, we've run into a lot of issues with including that into the portion I apologize if the language was confusing, I'll have to double check that. I was of the belief that we submitted the one without scrap value included. I will definitely have to double check that before the next meeting. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:42:54] That's great, and I may just be misreading it, that may be my fault. So be great to have you take a look at it thanks. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:43:00] For sure. [01:43:04] All that being said, Dan, I guess I need to know from my other comments whether what your what your procedural process is going to be, are you planning on going through the FEAF part one and then us to do part two and three in this meeting? Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:43:24] Part one, yeah, that's what I was planning on . I sent everybody has the all three parts. The, I started going through part two on the. Of the document, which is. A lot of pages,. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:43:57] Right? Yeah,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:43:58] And in past days, I've read through everything and just told you what I thought. I want... [01:44:11] Is getting a little bit late, and I I'm tired. And don't do my best work when we're exhausted, what I would like to do is. I started the part 2. And I was not, my impression was we did not have a large impact from anything that seems. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:44:41] That seems right to me. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:44:43] You know, there the there is some farmland that's going to be taken out of production, but it is it permanently taken out of production with this type of facility if they do. Um. Demolish it, decommission it. [01:45:05] They can remove everything and have it go back to farmland. I believe they they have been using this for agricultural production, and it is some of the soils are fairly good. That was it was the one area of the environmental that, might you know our regulations are looking at minimizing the loss of important farmland. [01:45:34] We're not taking everything off this property. The and this, you need separate tax proposals for this one or not?. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:45:49] Yes, we would be making each of the four arrays their own tax, partial I.D., and we would be separating out the r est of the land,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:45:59] Right. So we actually have a subdivision approval to do on this once we go through. And if if that's the case, the biggest impact I'm seeing is that in relation to our regulation. Is that the ground coverage would be. We'd be we'd be taking more than the what is it, 60 percent maximum coverage. [01:46:31] Although we're not taking 60 percent, you know, we have a smaller percentage of the the whole parcel, so we would have to waive that portion of the sight plan or solar law? And I think. So you haven't you haven't given us a subdivision plat, yet, have you? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:47:05] Not yet, we are... Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:47:05] I mean, it's the fence line is there. That's usually where the subdivision, but.... Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:47:11] Correct.. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:47:11] Was it, would the intent be to, go all the way to the east property line with the parcels that are, on the east side. Or would you want to keep that reserve that as a separate lot over there? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:47:28] We would most likely reserve that as a separate lot for insurance reasons. If we incorporate it into the the two eastern arrays, it would have to be insured as part of it. And what we typically do with our our subdivided lots is make sure that we're insuring the actual array area. [01:47:46] Part of the subdivision portion is any land that was agricultural befo re we have to pay back up to five years of the agricultural exemption that it was receiving. So by defining what that specific acreage is that's being used for solar array, production, helps us define what we have to pay back for the last five years of a tax abatement that they received. [01:48:11] So, again, we would try to keep it to the exact fenceline, give or take 10, 20 feet so we can do maintenance. It probably about 20 feet outside of the fence line, but would not include the extra land otherwise. That would kind of create a conflict of interest for insurance and secondary use purposes. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:48:32] So that's something that the board has to consider with the approval that. We're not taking up the whole existing parcel. We are going to be creating lots where we have basically 80 to 85 percent coverage and, actually anything inside the fence line is defined as the plant. [01:49:00] It's not just the area, the panels, it's the area, the a rea area inside the fence line is considered the covered area. If you follow me. So you've got 50 percent groundcover in each, ray. But there's actually. One hundred percent, of of the area inside the fence, you know, I mean. [01:49:29] Why, I'm not making myself clear,. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:49:33] So what Dan's saying is that the way your law was written, I believe, and I could be wrong, but I felt that the intent was, if you're going to put a solar property or solar farm up, if you have one hundred acres and you're covering one hundred acres, you put in there that you couldn't cover more than 60 percent, I believe. [01:49:55] And if you have one hundred acres, you didn't want to have more than 60 percent of that covered. And that includes everything within the fenced in area. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:50:04] Right. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:50:06] In other laws, what that typically means is the lot coverage. So you can calculate what is actually covered by a panel as opposed to th e space in between the arrays. So in your law, everything inside of a fence is considered part of it. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:50:21] Right. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:50:21] In order to accommodate your law, every array that we have here, the three to four arrays we have roughly covers about 30 acres. So we would have to build in another 20 acres of open land that would be encompassed into the fence in order to truly stick to the letter of the law. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:50:43] Right. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:50:45] But I believe the intent of the law was to make sure that you weren't completely covering a whole parcel of land. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:50:49] Right. So I think we we would put a condition on there that that the some amount of that land would probably, well, either remain in agriculture or woodland and be, we just want some assurance that that area would all be developed at sometime in the future for heavy coverage. I mean... Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:51:13] I think you're right then I think this is the intent of the law, which was not to to make it really difficult to do this, it was it was like like Dan Walker said, it was to make sure that we didn't just completely cover every piece of property with solar panels. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:51:30] Right. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:51:31] For sure. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:51:32] And we're doing that also by creating individual small lots, the definition of a lot, and I think in the law, would would we just have to make a note on that? And I think that's reasonable. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:51:49] It's reasonable, I think it is reasonable. I know from the discussions on the solar law that would that would be in keeping with what was the intent of what the law was supposed to be. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:52:01] So this is I just want the board to know that I'm making. I'm giving that interpretation and saying that we should be able to do that because it's logical. It's I speak for the Town here, not for the the engineering company that's designing this. Yeah, go ahead, Jude. Jude Lempke [01:52:23] Know, I just think you need to look at Section three point one for all these waivers in the site, plan review law and make sure you're in, you can't just waive after waive it in accordance with three point one. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:52:40] Right. There's got to be a logical. Jude Lempke [01:52:44] Yeah, so just take a look at it, make sure whatever you're doing complies with that. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:52:52] So,. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:52:55] Dan, I do have probably three, four or five other small issues. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:53:01] Let's get them out. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:53:02] But I just would like Dan to have under his belt before he goes away. We're not going to finish up tonight. This is going back to the solar law itself. And I don't know if anybody has a copy of it, but I'm on page five. This is number six, approval standards for large scale solar systems in order to get a permit. [01:53:22] And this is number four under that. A property operation and maintenance plan shall be submitted. Such plans show the spread continuing photovoltaic maintenance and property upkeep, such as mowing and trimming, in the last sentance there is no chemical herbicides or pesticides shall be used in the project in the SWIP itself. I t does have mentioned a couple of different times, one time of pesticides and one time herbicides that may just be generic in the SWIP. But I just want to check and see if what the thoughts were there. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:53:59] I believe in the heart of the EAF, the they said they would not be using herbicides. And I would have to look there, there is a significant amount of boilerplate in that SWIP related back to the DEC regulations. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:54:20] It's on pages 14 and 15 of the SWIP, if you want to find it. But I just want to make that aware that the law does prohibit that. So that's part of what you're thinking. We would have to have a discussion and probably would. It would be one that we would probably want to keep. That's probably something we wouldn't want to have an exception to. [01:54:44] What's the next thing to. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:54:47] Not use any any pesticides or any chemicals on our our projects? We stick to mowing the grass. Naturally, we actually do use grazing sheep in our project. And Chamont New York, it's north of Watertown. Any place that we can do something natural and and sustainable is one hundred percent what we focus on. So, yeah, no chemicals for sure. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:55:11] OK, so number five is projected production plans showing the annual amount of energy that will be generated and transmitted for each one year period during the life of the project. That's something that the law is looking for. That's number five on the next page, I think Dan. Board Chair Daniel Walker [01:55:27] The next. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:55:29] Yeah, right there. Is that something that you would anticipate doing or not? Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:55:35] Yeah, I believe we included those in in our initial submission. I can double check to see. I believe we would include those in our actual application for a building permit. Part of the process right now, what we're what we're approving and working on is the concept of the plan. [01:55:54] When we get to the building permit phase, we will have this specific solar panel module identified at that time and then we can run what they call PVsyst reports to show what the actual production will be and when. We do have to provide that as well to the IDA for the pilot. [01:56:16] But we can provide that once we go to the building permit and we have gone through the EPC process, its engineering, procurement and construction and those PVsyst reports of exactly how much energy will be generated and put on the grid. Well, in terms of put on the grid, it will always be 20 megawatts. [01:56:37] They do not allow us to put more than 20 megawatts. We can generate more energy than 20 megawatts, but we cannot connect more tha n 20 megawatts. So in terms of connected production, it will never exceed 20. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:56:52] OK, so let me go on to number eight, and we discussed this a little bit when we talk about the glare, but number eight says as a general complaint plan with the procedure for determining mitigation that is reasonably expect acceptable to the planning board shall be submitted. I haven't seen that yet. Can I assume that that's something you would want to do? I think that's kind of a stickler because we we we found some issues with that in terms of a, of a past approval. [01:57:20] And it seemed like something that was very appropriate for the Town and for the people in the Town that they just wanted to be able to have a say and have somebody that will listen to them when they say something. And and it's a little bit vague. If this was a wind generator, I, I wouldn't accept that as being that vague. But I don't I don't anticipate any real significant problems with this if you're not making noise. So that's that's a big deal. But I still think to have this plan in place would be helpful. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:57:53] Yeah. And we we we purposely left this piece out until we had an opportunity to speak with the Town and figure out what the mechanisms were in place currently. [01:58:03] Typically the way and we touched on earlier are typically the way we receive complaints would be from the Town someone saying something to the code enforcement officer or an official at the Town that's then passed on to us. [01:58:18] We have a portal on our website where comments can be made and people can fill out information as a contact form. I think if it's a complaint specifically, it should it should funnel through the Town and we can provide a point of contact for all complaints in the future. More recently, it has been me who typically fields them anything from trespassing issues to all kinds of different stuff, snowmobile trails. [01:58:48] We haven't had anything too serious about the actual solar arrays outside of a I think a coyote got stuck in one of those howling like crazy inside the fence. But typically they come to me from whatever Town or jurisdiction that they are are sent to. But I'm happy to work on one and have that submitted to you guys before the next meeting. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:59:10] I think I think Aye. something reasonable in terms of mitigation. I mean, it doesn't have to lock you into we'll fix it tomorrow. But something that says we will look into it, then we will deal with it in one way or another in a way that's acceptable to the planning board. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [01:59:25] For sure. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [01:59:27] I think the only other thing that I have right now is we went to page eight. This is the number one. And probably the you or Dan could answer this question from me, but... [01:59:44] Think it's down at the bottom Dan... [01:59:49] And that's they should not be located in the following areas unless otherwise approved and I don't know this this situation with farmland that says not to be located in prime farmland soils as identified by the USDA, nrcs so I don't know if that is considered prime farmland, soils or not. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:00:11] I think. Some of the soils are considered important soils and that I was going through that report,. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:00:24] Some of them are are portions of it we tried to condense the array into the currently non farmed areas as much as possible and also in the shorter brush areas rather than the heavily forested areas to the south of of the property. [02:00:43] So any area that we could we really, really condensed it into those spaces that weren't being farmed to the best of our ability. But there are some areas that they are closing in on some of the soils. But as much as we could preserve those areas, we we tried to it at all cost. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:01:03] I think for me, I rather look at it in a long term basis. I think the idea of letting that soil lie fallow for 20, 25 years, 30 years is not a bad thing. It's more of a concern with the decommissioning and removal plant. If those soils then can be put back to use, they're going to be here for a long time. We may not be here, but that land is going to be there. And who knows what food production we'll need in the future. [02:01:29] So just as long as the decommissioning plan and removal plan is a good one and will ensure that those soils can come back to use in the future, to me that that's very much in keeping with what the intent of the law is. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:01:44] With with these really we're not doing any damage to the soils other than where the road is or maybe the concrete slabs are, those are pretty small areas and you're still maintaining healthy vegetation. [02:02:03] And actually there's some, you know, having the soil rest for 30 years isn't a bad thing either. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:02:14] No this is. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:02:16] Our bread and butter is usually closed down golf courses because they are very heavily fertilized and they're usually very difficult to to turn into something other than like a housing development. [02:02:31] So typically, if we can find golf courses that have closed down and are kind of running fallow or looking a little wild, that's usually our sweet spot because like you said, letting the land breathe, letting that watershed kind of flush everything out, come back to normal, really does allow it in twenty five years to be very productive farmland if that ends up being the case. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:02:54] But that's pretty much all that I have for now Dan. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:02:57] OK, so what I'd like to do. Is have... [02:03:14] All the all the board members. Come up with any written comments that they might have. I think. Mike, you've touched on pretty much all the critical areas that I was seeing that might need to be addressed by by Dan. I think we would like to see the agricultural style fence used. [02:03:40] For this, actually, I think it is a little cheaper now. You don't have to put concrete posts in every every 10 posts with chain link fence, you actually do more disturbance or a driven post system there. They're pretty, pretty popular and it is a little more friendly to the small, animals on the site. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:04:07] I'm sure that would not be an issue. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:04:09] And the other thing I found is we don't want to many small predators is going through. If people are using sheep, that's good to keep the coyotes out and that that fencing will still do that. I sent out the part one of the SEQR form, and I've sent out the part 2. And I like each of the board members to take a look at that in the next week or so if they could. [02:04:49] I'm what I'm going to do is I will complete, the part two and the part three is as a professional, I would complete that, and I want to I'm going to send that I've send that out to all the board members later this week. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:05:06] That's great. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:05:07] And I want you to read through that. And if you have any disagreement with what I said or if you have any questions, call me and I'll tell you what my thought process was. I've done a lot of environmental review work. And I do take my job as Planning board person working for the Town very seriously. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:05:38] That's really great and I appreciate that. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:05:41] Yeah, so I guess. You've got a few comments, from us Dan, on what needs to be done and just go through. I'm going to go through the list again more and more carefully now, and I'll get back to you early next week. So if we can if we need to make some minor revisions to the plans to comply with the comments that we received, and if you had had a survey or putting together the subdivision plat yet. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:06:15] Yes, we're working with. J Miller, Miller,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:06:22] P.J. Miller. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:06:23] That's all. Yeah, there we work on T.J. Miller. They were the original surveyors for the previous owners and they were actually working in another subdivision at the time of. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:06:33] right. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:06:34] Entering into the agreement. I know that was in front of the planning board or Town board. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:06:38] Yeah. Then they withdrew it when we got into. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:06:39] They withdrew it. And so we're going to be working with them as well to to get that done. I will tell them that we do need that prior to the next meeting. So, yeah, I appreciate everyone's time tonight and everyone's comments. [02:06:53] I will definitely link up with you, Dan Walker, and address all the comments that everyone had. Make sure I come to the next meeting with answers for everyone. But I appreciate everyone's discussion and I'm excited to continue working with you all. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:07:07] Ellen, you have a question. Town Clerk Ellen Woods [02:07:09] I am just going to repeat this for Mike's benefit. There is there's a growing list of documents associated with this project. So there's been a folder created on the laser Fische and that's under the public documents. So, Dan, I'd love for you to take a look at that and make sure that I meant Huntington, but also, OK, just make sure that there's not redundant documents or things that are no longer relevant. Let's just all have that as the folder where we put all the documents. And that way people can have like a central point of reference. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:07:44] That's good. That way you don't want miss something on my own. I have to have a whole new just a whole drive just to handle the Town stuff, keep it separate. Not a big drive, just a thumb drive. [02:07:56] Yeah, I got it. I got 20 or 30 megabytes per gigabytes worth of stuff already, so. Very good. [02:08:08] Well, thank you, Dan, and we'll be talking we'll try to get this through. My goal would be to have resolutions of drafts, of resolutions up for the board members to look at and try to make the, February meeting the approval meeting. [02:08:27] If that works for everybody, yeah, I think I think we could if we need to, we could just do approval with conditions and then,. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:08:34] Yeah, we could deal with conditions. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:08:36] You know, there's always some little thing that we we miss and. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:08:42] Well, there's some things that Dan won't have yet at that point anyway. So. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:08:45] Yeah, well, all the financial stuff and everything like that. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:08:49] Exactly. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:08:49] But is at least as far as a technical sight plan stuff, we should be able to wrap that up, I think. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:08:54] Exactly yeah. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:08:56] OK, thank you, Dan. Dan Huntington Norbut BDM [02:09:01] Thank you all. I appreciate your time. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:09:03] OK. Next item. Is. They're putting up a tax map, if people can see it. Alan, are you there still? And unmute, Alan,. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:09:23] I am still here. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:09:25] OK, I if I have the text map up and this is. You remember the address, but it's on Hayts Road. Across from t he golf course. It's it's just, um. This is Applegate Road, so. This property right here, the people know Hayts Road, there's a there's a right way. But this point is pretty much at the crest of the hill that drops down going to the west now. Apparently in years past. There were three Landlocked parcels created. Board Member Henry Hansteen [02:10:20] Ya. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:10:23] Explain that right, Alan? Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:10:24] That is correct,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:10:27] And there's a house on this parcel, there's no house on the one on the left, that's what they want to do. They want to build a house there. Right. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:10:37] And that's what we're looking at. There's someone who wants the land to sale. Someone must purchase the land, but he's only going to purchase that if he's allowed to build a house there. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:10:46] Right. And because which which where did you see the law attributing now that if the planning board approves it, they could create? Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:11:05] It's the New York Consolidated Law, Town law number 280-A. Basically, it says it's a Town board made by resolution to establish an open area within a Town for permits for a structure as long as there's a right of way or an easement. [02:11:24] But it looks to the planning board for its advice before they can approve it. So if there is a planning board to plan for you to make a recommendation to the Town board. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:11:35] Thank you. I knew we had to do something here, so. If anybody's familiar with this lot, there's a right away that crosses this frontage parcel that crosses back, I, I have not driven down here to see how big it is down here, but it almost looks like a Town Road with, at Hayts road up at the intersection up here. And. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:12:12] And what do you do, you know, we have that right away leads what the conditions of that right away are. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:12:18] Um. That's. Alan you just sent me a bunch of stuff. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:12:29] Yeah, it's got to work right away, it was filed with the county years ago, and where it is and just how big it is. I think. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:12:38] The one the one thing I would be concerned about is the fact that it's more than 500 feet from the road to the start of this parcel. The New York state fire law would require a turnout on that right away that two fire trucks could pass each other along the way. [02:12:52] So that's actually fairly wide area that right away would have to encompass in order for them to turn out along the way. And then at the end of it of cours e, you'd have to put up a turnaround space like the T for the fire truck to turn around. [02:13:06] But unless the fire department wants to waive it, you would need to have a turn out place for two fire trucks to pass each other, which I assume is going to put you at least 30 feet wide under right away. And I wonder if the right away approval is the written right way, that it would allow him to do that. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:13:27] That is all correct, and I don't think the fire department can grant that waiver since it's part of the NYS fire code. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:13:34] Yeah, the fire chief was supposed to be the one who decides. And what's happened in some othe r towns is that they say we don't really care, which I don't think is a good choice. But it really is the law that says you have to have a turn out there. [02:13:48] So I would think you'd need at least 30 feet with two trucks to comfortably pass each other. Maybe I'm wrong, but you have to have you've got to have swails on the side and some shoulders and things like that. So. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:14:01] That is correct. We've had a couple of them in the Town already, and I think 30 feet is correct. 30 by 40 is the turn out or something similar to that. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:14:12] Sounds right. Yeah. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:14:24] So we had that's it on the screen, but I can't quite read it. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:14:27] Oh, yeah, we make it bigger. Oh, gee,. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:14:42] Looks like forty two for a second. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:14:44] Yeah, it looks. If this is 60. We're here to here that would be could be 42. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:14:57] Or maybe 52, but. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:14:59] If you can you go a little bit north of that line. OK, so so it doesn't show the existing houses there law. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:15:09] There's a house over here. There's a house here. There's a house in here. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:15:15] I'm wondering about the house on the on the middle property area right away. I mean, if you have the fifty foot right away that that's needed, it seems like that would be sufficient to do that as long as he has the deed for it. I just hate that I've talked to this guy on the phone a couple of times. [02:15:29] And the main thing was, like Alan said, just can I really build here or will I buy the land and then I can't do it anymore. It just that that was his concern. And I think that's a valid concern. Spend the money buying the property and then have the people who own the property say you can't widen that, that's not allowed. You don't belong to that land. Is that that right away to belong to you? Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:15:55] You know, you're dealing with two other three other property owners and. Is the access right a way? We would come right in here. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:16:03] Yeah, and I think I'm seeing a driveway right on the property line there as well. Maybe that's not a driveway. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:16:08] Now, this one looks like it crosses the property line. [02:16:11] Yeah,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:16:13] ...depending on how, that this is the tax map. So they're. There's a little bit of. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:16:19] Yeah,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:16:20] They want to get a new survey map showing exactly where the right away is, because if it's on this parcel a little bit and you got, you know, five different people involved. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:16:35] It's usually not a problem until the cement truck starts going through and. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:16:39] Tears the road up,. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:16:40] Things like that happen, then it's an issue. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:16:44] So. Do I the. Alanc from a safety standpoint, do you think the fire department's concerned about it? Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:16:59] Probably not have been I haven't looked at it in a while, I've actually been down that driveway two times to the Second house there. They put it in, got a permit several years ago, and it's a pretty substantial driveway. [02:17:18] But it's been a while, so I should take a look at and see what's actually there,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:17:21] I think before I think we'd have to get a draft easement with everybody involved signing off on it before, I want to consider it. So real estate agents got some work to do if it was to sell their lot. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:17:38] Yeah, it'd probably just be something from the from the one lot, three point four one, because that would have to be where the turnout would be. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:17:46] Yeah, but I mean, do they have a written easement? To go back without that. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:17:56] I believe that was there with the documents. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:17:59] OK, maybe I did, I'll look at it. I guess we just what I just want to have. I wouldn't want to have concurrence for all the property owners that. They know the easements there that they're in agreement with it. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:18:21] OK? Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:18:22] It's a good idea,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:18:23] Let's let's go that route or we could build a road on the other 50 foot wide section. [02:18:33] Go, oh.. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:18:36] Yeah, I'll take a look at what's there in the next few days. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:18:40] OK,. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:18:41] Driving out there usually helps see what's actually there. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:18:43] Yeah, I want you to get us a couple of pictures and. [02:18:46] Um,. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:18:48] And I do know that one property owner, I say, did get a building permit years ago,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:18:52] OK,. Code Enforcement Officer Alan Teeter [02:18:54] Had a good relationship with him, he is pretty reasonable fellow, but can we talk for five minutes? [02:19:01] Yeah. Yeah. All right. [02:19:10] OK. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:19:11] All right. We. Just this one. One more item is. [02:19:31] I will. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:19:36] We have come to the end of a year where my term is up. I'm interested in continuing on the planning board. Do the rest of the planning board members agree with that? Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:19:55] Yes. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:19:55] Did they make that recommendation? Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:19:57] Yes. Board Member Henry Hansteen [02:20:00] 100%. Board Member Joseph Dawson [02:20:01] Yes. Board Member Richard Teeter [02:20:01] Yes. Board Member Ann Chaffee [02:20:02] Yes. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:20:02] OK, we'll make that a recommendation resolution then if you can, Pat. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:20:08] OK, I'm glad you're staying Daniel. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:20:12] Well, I. Board Member Ann Chaffee [02:20:14] Don't leave us now. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:20:16] All right. I'm going to make a motion to adjourn because my wife said the country is falling apart. [02:20:23] Yeah. [02:20:24] Yeah,. [02:20:27] I've heard that. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:20:28] At least our end of it, our end of it is doing well. So,. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:20:31] Yeah, we're we're far enough north. I guess so. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:20:34] Yeah. Board Chair Daniel Walker [02:20:35] All right, everyone, have a good evening. Thank you for meeting. [02:20:39] And I appreciate your attention and will be I'll be source of back and forth the next week or two here. Acting Chair Michael Carpenter [02:20:45] Thanks, Dan. [02:20:46] OK, everybody good night. Recording Secretary Patricia Speno [02:21:07] Well, rest easy now, Dan, that you're saying this.