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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2003-12-09L4 i m!h Public Comments at the Town of Dryden Draft Comprehensive Plan tuformation Session 'Varna, December 9, 2003 - Prepared by Debbie Gross, FnvironmeuUd Planner Slightly more than 50 people were present- 48 signed the participant list. nn 6 den Rd Varna 72 -6302 14ltike Richardson, 9 Dry , • Concerned about hamlet den sil of 8 dwelling units per acre in the area of Forest biome- ■ Would have to take down existing single family homes and replace them with apmtmerats, thinks this would replace long term community oriented families with short term renting studerits- • Likes idea of putting irk sidewalks, but not if it rneans dismantling front porebes — raises the. question of whether there is enough space for a main street. development, while respecting the integrity of existing homes. George Frame. responds Existing residential development. zs from the time of horse and buggy roads. + There., is a need for.4reStoration of rundown places in ama and sorriebody needs Mentive to fix them and build attractive and affordable housing. One acre lots won't attract developers; you need higher density - • If town houses were built, owner occupation could be a condition of subdivision approval. Mike Richardson, Varna (again) • The hamlet would lose its rural feel if it became all town houses. George Erunt2 responds * The plan talks about an average density of 8 units per acre. This sloes not mean �dl town houses. Roy Brio, Varna Fire Chief, 93 Wood Rd. 3474383 We should make sure that new development considers fire 1 safety needs, For e amp]e, some new developments have put the fire hydrant ou the wrong side of the street. The new 1~ nd T building has the hydrant placed such that the entrance to GutbTi e would be blocked if there ever was afire at F and T. - this hydrant needs to be moved. Zoning and site planning should be up to fire code- Etna load will need improvements before it can take more traffic. There have been bad accidents on 13 in this area. • In general, the plan has some good ideas, but missing pieces, as mentioned above.. it arthx Rohertsion, 1655 E Ili % 1vl till aw Road, 2724584 # How is the relationship with the villages informing this plan? George is often. say i.rtg "Je Is thhi s the Planning Board's 's plan, or George's. plan? • These are good ideas, but change will be hard. County Health and Human Services is reporting, a serious countywide housing, shortal;e. This is %vhy assessment is high, and there 1W 41 t{ are record numbers of homeless sbelter nights. Even high tech businesses report that employees are having trouble finding housing, 8,000 people per day come into Tompkins County for work from outside of the County. They would prefer to live closet in, but can't afford it. Affordable housing is needed, And the shortage i ffo n housing applies to all income levels. We need to find good ways to accommodate. housing, er,rge Frantz responds ■ About relationship Mth. the villages= He has used Freeviilee s 4 year old comprehensive plan as a guide. The Village of Dryden is beginning a cornprehensive plan noon and he hopes their process wiII be coordinated with the town`s. The town is avoiding competition with the villages for commerce, + He semis this as his plan, because the punning board is waiting to hear .Torn the public before making it the town plan, Joe Laquatra Jr., Planning Board + The plan1ling board has put in a lot of work with George on the development of this draft, and also on resident surveys in the past. The plan is very rnuuh a draft and open to public input. Art .Burley, 1.205 Ellis hollow Road, 272 -0230 * Active with the Varm Community Center, used to live in Varna • Concerned that it may be diffjcult to get DOT permission to make changes to 366 through Varna, because so fur the state won't even prohibit Sassing there. (were the next question, l cornments a] so feom Art Burkey?} • Wondering about County plans to extend bike lanes on E111s Hollow road between Game Farm and Ellis Hollow reek Road? + Wondering whether extension of wateTan d sewer in a loop ►long Ellis Hol low road is part of the plan? Suggests pinuig the Varna Main Street project on the T[.P ('I'ransportati.ou improvement Program) for the Ithaca - Tompkins County Transportation Council (1`1 CTQ...this is hove Groton got Main St. funding through Senator Seward. John Andemstin, 1 Woodland ltd, Ellis Hollow, 539 -7096 * Has lived here a while, returned to the area after a short time away. * Would like to sec efforts to help ]:llis follow £eel more a part of Drvden. + Says making the turn onto 13 coming from Elli9 kTollow by Googers is a dangerous turn. • onc&rned about people cycling at night on Ellis Hollow Road — dangerous; would like to see a bike path through Ellis Hollow that is not on the road. One p en, without giving his name, said that a bike path through EI].is Hoh ow is impossible, George says that no specific. alignment is set for the }path, but i1 can be explored_ %r ti r Greg Kimbell, 355 Rhagwood Road, 5396367 • Would like to see a bike route for Ringwood road also, because it is so twzsly- * Thinks change will happen, and this plan is a framework worth pursuing. Wonders whether the predicted 1,800 new residences can fit i-n the amount of land planned for residential development. George Frantz respoo& * The total potential build -out if the plaD is foI lowed is well in excess of 1,800 residences. Erica Evans, 49 Turkey Till road, 273 =718 • has lived here for 50 years. • Objects to the density in Varna- Traffic is already too bad. Other areas could be developed instead- Graham Dobson, 30 Etna Lane, 3474600 or 4660) • Concerned about the industryloffice�rescarch area proposed around Etna Lane • There are wetlands there, and a bird sanctuary • Currently i.t is zmned RBwl residential. In 1993 when it was suggested for commercial coning, the community strongly opposed the change. Htl bUlit his home there, assuming that It would remain residential. He is upset about Versatile Foods corning in, and the appearance of the facility. What kind of businesses would Borne in? Better design standards are needed, and variances should not be aitowed SQ easily. George Frantz responds * Could use conifer screening between residential areas and other kinds of development IF Graham may have an important point., .this area should be looked at again to see ifthe mdustrW designation is appropriate, and to check for wetlands David Weinstein, Planning Board The future land use plan lumps together industry/research office, but how would it be for professional offic:es to go there? * The planning board's approach was to build on intersections that already had a commercial footprint, which is why this area was considered Graham Dobson, Etna Lane ■ He would prefer that the area remains rurai residential, If'necessary, of=fices could be okay - Warehouses create a prob] em because of the traffic and noise associated with trucks. * T`here are better places for this kind of development, such as industrial parks in Lansing which are separated from housing, or areas in Cortland which could be re -used. L• { Bernard Cornelius, 253 Ringwood Road, 3474841 ■ He's a builder and developer and also has a 400 acre farm between Etna and >+reeville. • Concerned about intense residential development and water and sewer it is good to keep some sites larger; to draw larger commercial development (my notes on what he said are spot so good... perhaps we should get in touch with him) George Frantz responds • Residential development rare,] y pays for itself, so the town needs some commercial development and agricultural activity to generate surplus fuads for infrastructure, etc. The surveys were resoundingly against large scale commercial deveiopment_ * Dryden doesn't have the population base #o support large commercial development. and it is already in iihaca and Cortland (Debbie's th ough t : what about a countywide tax sharing agree meat that would allow Dryden to be more residential and receive some of the benefits ofcommercial development elsewhere` — a headache to set up, but it might be good in the long run). Joe Laquatra Jr., Planning Board * There was a concern that strip development would come in along 13 between NYSEG aud the village of Dryden if water and sewer were put in. l3rendu Franklin, 69 Turkey dill Road, 272 -1980 * Wonders whether water and sewer lines wiIi came to her area and cause lots of digging, (George said no, i# wouldn't) David Weinstein, Planning Board • Referring to the water and sewer areas shown in the plan: these are areas where water and sewer could go in if demand mm and arises ad the counity supports it_ The town can't just go ahead and put it in. George Frantz * lvlany proposals in the plan depend on hove much development actually occurs (parks, etc.) Nanev Suci, 98 Turkey Hill Road, 272 -7139 • Would like to know what a density of 8 dwelling units per acre looks like, For example, what is the density of the trailor park in Varna? (George says it is aboLit 2 per acre) Junto Auble- azzara, 620 1V.l�ain St., Etna, 3474700 • omerned about density. that apartment dwellers often don't participate in the ccrnmunity, that it is too many people for a small area_ { * +ill Etna have a. lain St_ project also? Red of traffi c on 3669 • Etna needs safe places for w�rWng where cars are not going 45 to 60 miles per hour. She would like to see bicycle / pedestrian paths_ Graham Dobson, Etna * Also suggests well paved shoulders for walking and cycling. George Frantz responds Density need not be URK -om thou bout an ama. Tf one development is more dense, others can be less dense_ Tbere could be different 4omiag districts within each suggested future Iand use category, Peggy Walbridge, 123 Lunt Till Road, 539 -7264 * When more density comes (gulp). then we can have more busses. We should make sure that it is comfortable to v aTi to the bus stops. * Trail network should be loth for commuting and recreation_ * Hopes that the denser areas (red areas) wilt silU have small ,parks. If development is clustered, then open spaces can be preserved for people to use_ George Frantz responds • The town should look at the tax maps and find where large parcels meet eachother, At these intersections, neighborhood parks can be planned. Steve Whicher, 2,,16 Hunt Hill Rd ., 53947701 * The county looked at snaking a bike lane on Ellis Hollow Road, but the problem zs finding funding. Some people would not like to see tho road widened to make a bike lane, others would. • '14e seems to be connected with county issues (? FA Resler, Turkey '14ili Rd, 272 -2139 Is the county stilt considering creating a beltway around Ithaca for trucks? Turkey ImEll road would be involved. The North .East Coridor Stud} (was he referring to Northeast Subarea Transportation Study? � NESTS) explored many possibilities, and made man} people unhappy. Barbara, Ellis Hollow Road • We need to find ways of reducing traffic as well as ways of accomodating traffic. Lets face it, much c the traffic on Fills Hollow load is from residents of Ellis Hollow, II Martha Robertson * Concerned about the Ellis Hoilow bike patio shown along the creek. it shouldn't go along the creek because this is Important habitat. Maybe it would lie better along the road here_ Talk with Fernando D'Aragon. + Park funding may be available for trails that are recreational. South kiill gat Enviror4mentai ualiry Bond Act funding, LnTormally (before or after the meeting) Rory Rizzo + C;oncern od about standards for bike trails and ability of emergence vehicles to travel dov4m them_ Will they be plowed? • Town should fbl) ow the codes larom the National Fire Protection Association ( FP ). Zorika Henderson, Ellis Hollow (sbc: called the day after the meeting) 27248921 (it might be Lortka, lives at Sunny Knoll) * Owns 22 acres on Ellis Ho11ow road. + C"oncemed about a bike trail going through her property. People can impact the land. Already trespassers have been digging up triljiums, killing raccoons, bunters shooting near her house at night_ Doesn't vaunt more people to become aware of-her land because a trail rusts through it_ The down side of human nature, • The area is very sensitive, Count} Uniq ue Natural area, wed ands, di versity of species, • She is thinking of getting a forever wild conservation casement on her land + In general, trails should stay away From creeks and wetlands and sensitive areas. They should go through areas that are already impacted and involve some restoration of those areas; rather than into virgin land. • Town should listen to Martha Robertson and Steve Whi.eber who are also concerned about this trail, ]Mohan Nair, 1211 Ellis Hollow ]load (calked) + New homeowner on Falls Hollow Road, Are there plans to put in water and sewer? I4e is interested in seeing municipal services there. He has rte ver had a well before. • Wondering if there are any plans to change the school distri ct boundaries between Ithaca and Dryden_ b '' / 4 II Martha Robertson * Concerned about the Ellis Hoilow bike patio shown along the creek. it shouldn't go along the creek because this is Important habitat. Maybe it would lie better along the road here_ Talk with Fernando D'Aragon. + Park funding may be available for trails that are recreational. South kiill gat Enviror4mentai ualiry Bond Act funding, LnTormally (before or after the meeting) Rory Rizzo + C;oncern od about standards for bike trails and ability of emergence vehicles to travel dov4m them_ Will they be plowed? • Town should fbl) ow the codes larom the National Fire Protection Association ( FP ). Zorika Henderson, Ellis Hollow (sbc: called the day after the meeting) 27248921 (it might be Lortka, lives at Sunny Knoll) * Owns 22 acres on Ellis Ho11ow road. + C"oncemed about a bike trail going through her property. People can impact the land. Already trespassers have been digging up triljiums, killing raccoons, bunters shooting near her house at night_ Doesn't vaunt more people to become aware of-her land because a trail rusts through it_ The down side of human nature, • The area is very sensitive, Count} Uniq ue Natural area, wed ands, di versity of species, • She is thinking of getting a forever wild conservation casement on her land + In general, trails should stay away From creeks and wetlands and sensitive areas. They should go through areas that are already impacted and involve some restoration of those areas; rather than into virgin land. • Town should listen to Martha Robertson and Steve Whi.eber who are also concerned about this trail, ]Mohan Nair, 1211 Ellis Hollow ]load (calked) + New homeowner on Falls Hollow Road, Are there plans to put in water and sewer? I4e is interested in seeing municipal services there. He has rte ver had a well before. • Wondering if there are any plans to change the school distri ct boundaries between Ithaca and Dryden_ s a .Public Comments at the Town of Dryden Draft Comprehensive Plan information Smion ,Freeville, December 11 th, 2403 - prepared by Debbie Gross, Environmental Planner Abou 25 participants, 21 on the participant list Ld RappapoM Etna * works in real estate development, architecture • concerned about the proposed industrial area on Ctna Road because it is right next to residential areas and the l=inger .Lakes Bird Sanctuary (not on map, 6 acre s)- + No buffer between hamlet of Etna and industrial area. • ale was involved in a survey of lot sizes in Etna, found they tend to be 20,000 square feet (half acre), secs a density of 8 dwelling units per acre as too dense given the existing density, and given what people prefer. A 5,040 acre lot is real I small. ..clustered housing makes more sense. • Agrees dhat we don't want strip development on 13; but thinks it is a better place for development. than near. Etna • thinks Etna residents are not currently interested in commercial development there, strong sense of community, active community association • thinks water, sewer, and more lousing development is good in Etna Janis" (ask Alan Dobson for the name of the woman sitting to his left), Route 13 between Etnna Road and Etna Lase • concerned about the traffic that industrial development could bring to where she lives, and intersection with 13 Alan Dobson, 21 Etna Lane, 34743113 • ooncerned that the proposed industrial area would divide the Etna neighborhood, because people living on roue 1.3 to the south also consider themselves part of Etna, and the trailer park is part of Etna too suggests that the planning board needs to find out the boundaries of the Etna community as residents see it * the proposed industrial area (between Etna lane and 366) is largely wetland * best use would be to add it to the biTd sanctuary • in choosing the railroad ling, which .1 just a line on the map (it doesn't exist anymore )t thiS will allow industrial development in crushed stone. The people who lived there in the past when it was stone crushing found it an enormous nuisance. (see his written comments) • Sirioe I've lived there it has been a truck repair unit and is now in dis -use. That was no] Sy. 1 wouldn't like to see any kind of development there, l would much rather see the whole thing kept residential - • The railroad goes across my property, and this has legal implications that you may not like- Tf you made that industrial, you also give zone the opportunity of making another (couldn't hear; see his written comments). • Bruce Richard Horneastle, l tna on route 366, 347-4680 • is an electrical engineer lives near the gird sanctuary — an environmen ,lly sensitive area • thinks that making Etna more of a hamlet with sidewalks is not necessary, it is fine as is. • but would Tike to see something done about 3 66 and the trafflic — perhaps providing some kind of bypa s. or eliminate it as a majar thoroughfare. Most traffic is passing through rapidly, * would like to peep the area residential observes that the increase in tr-affic is probable due to increased work. commute distances, rather than due to increasing population • though Etna's water is not always so good (his is good, but some of his neighbors have lead trouble getting good potable water), he is concerned about the experxse of extending water and sewer, especIC y because people have already Bivested in their septic systerm • If the town makes this rt=r mendation and the land is developed, hove wi]] that broaden the tax base? I don't see this benefiting Etna or necessarily Dryden. It will benefit developers. and impact U). I'm afraid it's going to a 4 lane highway. Bob McGuire, 46 Whitttid Rd., 2256-0460 + Where does the process go ftom here? When will the formal public hearing be scheduled? How will these comments be incorporated? What is the timeline? • How will the plan deal with road bypass issues? If the state suggests anything? Laura Daly, PO Box 539, Etna Lane, laurstkdaly yahoo.corn concerned about the industrial area near Etna, would not like to see trees cleared in her neighborhood • It will desvoy the natural resource eohave_ 1 spend a good deal of time walking in the bird sanctuary, doesn't think that putting more people in Etna will reduce the tral iic through Vama, ,.thlnks that people will still want to get to Cornell by talking 366 south Tom Lyson, Freeville Mayor, 1 Union, F ireevlle 844 -9[042 • In the Village aCFreeville, traffic bas increased dramatically. When you have 14,000 cars per day it`s a real issue_ In Freeville, we slow them down, If you lowered the speed Jimit starting at route 13 and kept it slow nortb to Cortland, you would shift significant traffic away. But that would channel all the traffic into the village of Dryden. But people liT6ring in Etna, Freeville, and towards McLean would love to .see that. Nancy, Freeville • very Much in favor of bike routes, Freeville to Dryden, etc. Chrilq `I"essa lisr -thyme% 9 Etna bane, 3174279 + grew up in Ithaca area, living in Etna since 1997 • thinks increased traffic. through FAT3a on 366 developed when there was construction on 13 and people were avoiding it and never switched back • would like to see bike paths because it might help reduce traffic + the Etna Nature Preserve (FLLT Bird Sanctuary) should N3 vn our map • he records bird soands, and is noticing distinct increase in traffic noise, thinks that trees along road helped reduce noise agrees with Alan Dobson that people living on the south side of I' and in the trailer park also comider themselves part of ) tx • he is against development, thinks we should be proud that Dryden is 0% un&veioped, should promote this as a val -ae for tourism, unlike .Ithaca, which is cli�arcutting its downtown floodplaul, putting in big box stores, and asphalt fields * thinks this draft plan is too much of a sales pitch for development_ If you bring ire more fobs to an industrial site it will brim in snore people, and you' 11 have more traffic and where will this all go..,thc roads AiII widen, and that wi11 bring in more tra#fic and more development. It's a snowball, and it's happened downstate. + This draftpian is a sales pinch where developers are going to bene -fit, • What about the residents? You should be presentirig a residential plan. Roger 1Pellerin, Freeville, 844 -9214 + Sees agriculture going "flown the tubes ", dramatic decline, • J 16 years how many will be left? f've worked with dairy farms 20 years and I've seen half of theta disappear. + how will this effect the pl.,? thinks that any land that is designated as ag land is going to "go foul ", going to change anyway because of larger treads. Bruce Horneastle, Etna + Industry is indeed important, and certaizdy a staple of the economy in any community, and certainly .Dryden relies on industry, much of it not in dryden, but it's presence, . , in Cortland, Universities in Ithaca, Most residents irj l�tna are professionals or in academia. • In the villages of Dryden and F~reeville, there are buildings already zoned industrial and empty. Use the spaces already allocated for this rather than modif=yiag pristine areas. Graham Dobson, 30 Etna Ln, 3474660, GD11@eornell.edu eornell.edu + ,spoke at the Varna meeting, feels strongly so be bas come again + concerned about proposed industrial area near Etna • currently zoned RB -1. An attempt to change it to MA izi 1933 was turned down by public coie ra. There was discussion of where business concentration areas should be, and residents strongly opposed such development in Etna, and it was decided that the concentration area would be around NrYSEG and up 13 • No it Ioaks lime you want tv reduce what i going Up 13 (from Sunoco to 366) and make h a green space. I'm not apposed to that_ _ ,but why do you want to take land in Etna that is less suitable for development because it is wetland? • concerned that even if the zoning was tailored towards quiet busliaesses, things might come iA like Versatile Foods (which be doesn't like at all) through variances • Kirk road and .Etna lane ._.upholstffy peoplc..,nice busirtess.,.that's what we like to see * I've lived in Etna 36 years, we invested in the area, 7 new houses up there, view of Etna preserve_ We might move if things start to clhauge. • he likes the idea of sidewalks can 36 through Etna, and zoning that allows development such as convenience stores, but there should be planning controls to make the buildings look. ruc:e (not like Sunoco), put vegetation up in #`i`ont of it • Tie thinks that the impetus 1'or zoning this area commercial r` industrial is that Aldo Communications wants a ne e building, and an owner of residentially zoned land there wants to sell it as eornmemial land. Lithe Corner across from Kirk rd. • When you have empty places like the box car, the state police station, and the prudential building, why do you then redevelop land in green areas. • Would like to see very strong regulations for aesthetically pleasing commercial buildings Laura Duty, Etna there are others who would have come, but children have concert sees that people from Etna axe not represented on the town's hoards Coyne to Houtz ball and speak. Jun isl Etna • Wonders about projected future Wowth.. will it realiy be 1800 dwelling units over the next 20 years? iII planes l for the worst case scenario risk encouraging that scenario? Now George 1Frant.? and the Planning Board members begin their response, with some continued public discussion George Frantz says it is better to plan fot the worst case scenario so that you ate not susceptible to sprawl if it does happen_ ii °s not that I want 1800 dwellings in Dryden, but best to be prepared. Joe Laguatra, Jr., that number was contentious among planning board members, but in the end we decided it was best to be prepared. Barbara Caldwell addressed the process question: We'll take what comes out of these meetings (share your comments in writing). We'll make some changes, then have a public hearing, then perhaps further changes? Theti ►eve will formally present the plan to the Tc wn Board, and they iIi have their own public ]rearing process. `i'his is not an overnight process, .. YOU will have many eNmces to add your input, What is your timefra=9 When will we know how our input has beLeri taken. Depends how touch input. a get_ Won't delay ii f()T another 2 ,years. Come to our next plarxrling board meeting and we Will discuss the input received and have to respond_ k • he likes the idea of sidewalks can 36 through Etna, and zoning that allows development such as convenience stores, but there should be planning controls to make the buildings look. ruc:e (not like Sunoco), put vegetation up in #`i`ont of it • Tie thinks that the impetus 1'or zoning this area commercial r` industrial is that Aldo Communications wants a ne e building, and an owner of residentially zoned land there wants to sell it as eornmemial land. Lithe Corner across from Kirk rd. • When you have empty places like the box car, the state police station, and the prudential building, why do you then redevelop land in green areas. • Would like to see very strong regulations for aesthetically pleasing commercial buildings Laura Duty, Etna there are others who would have come, but children have concert sees that people from Etna axe not represented on the town's hoards Coyne to Houtz ball and speak. Jun isl Etna • Wonders about projected future Wowth.. will it realiy be 1800 dwelling units over the next 20 years? iII planes l for the worst case scenario risk encouraging that scenario? Now George 1Frant.? and the Planning Board members begin their response, with some continued public discussion George Frantz says it is better to plan fot the worst case scenario so that you ate not susceptible to sprawl if it does happen_ ii °s not that I want 1800 dwellings in Dryden, but best to be prepared. Joe Laguatra, Jr., that number was contentious among planning board members, but in the end we decided it was best to be prepared. Barbara Caldwell addressed the process question: We'll take what comes out of these meetings (share your comments in writing). We'll make some changes, then have a public hearing, then perhaps further changes? Theti ►eve will formally present the plan to the Tc wn Board, and they iIi have their own public ]rearing process. `i'his is not an overnight process, .. YOU will have many eNmces to add your input, What is your timefra=9 When will we know how our input has beLeri taken. Depends how touch input. a get_ Won't delay ii f()T another 2 ,years. Come to our next plarxrling board meeting and we Will discuss the input received and have to respond_ doh McG uire is pleased at many of the goals: bikeways; pedestrian walkways, slowing trafic, preserving agricultural land, open space protection, recreating hamlets, slowing down cars, and he gives thanks. Barbara Caldwell recognizes that we may need to consult residents and redraw neighborhood lines. ,Foe Laquatra Jr.: A good place to start is with discussion of the route discussion- You'll notice that proposed water and s calls from people who want to buy that Iand...If We susceptible to strip development. See the details on Corridor Overlay section of the plan. P.58, 13 corridor. This is a big item for ewer don't go down ()here. Henry Slater gets put water arad sewer there, it would be what is proposed there, in the Highway comment that water and sewer is not always necessary for residential development...many are fine with septics and wells. Alan DaN"a. suggests looking back at the 1993 d�L;CUSaio17 of these topics, and the planing board members think that this would be in Town Board records anti ..Remy might know also, Someone asked; Is there anyway to reduce the noise on 13 •. -a band of trees? Would that help? As a planner, what would reduce the noise that comes in ? George says that distance and sound barrier walls and architectural design can redtice noise, but that trees only proNzde psychological relief (accordirig w scientific studies ) . But what about a square mile of trees? But there has been success in smoothing the traffic on 13, leading to reduced noise ITum trucks braking, Highway bypasses Dr den's terrain limits the potential for highway bvpasses ... this has been studied before. Two b}Te s proposals in the past really divided the community. It is better to make the road right -of - -ways wide enough so that houses don't go it so close to the roadways (but engineers avoid this because it is expensive)- Challenge of getting state suppot-t foT changes on state roads. Mate DOT won't take Ithaca's traffic problems very seriously because of greater magnitude ofproblems in other parts of the state — for funding. Large part of problem is people commuting into work from out of the county. Question on how to control development of'agricultural harts; George says could essentially I1MIt it to Olae residential unit' per 10 acres S- uggests looking at the Town of Ulysses webs] te when they have their agricultural zoning posted. Roger Merin thinks that changes in agriculture are going to drive the whole system. Tom Hatfic id grew up on a farm and his whole family has been in%+olved in farming — he knows that economics is a powerful force in agriculture today. lout he dunks that as a community, we are cornmitted to protecting farms and farmers. People really enjoy the beauty of farming. The town has right -to -farm laws to support farmers, the plan will do its best to direct development away from farms. People are farmi.Rg now because of history and many reasons, We will encourage them as much as we can, We may see more consolidation of land as farmers need to increase acreage to survive. rahnm asked about the Corks and Carpenters farms just west of the v111age. Understands that they want to farm there for the long term. How will this plan affect them? Why doesn't the future land use plan designate thou land for agricuiture? George — that lard could be zoned for agriculture.. , everybody sees its importance as entrance to the village, a hope it will stay an agriculture. But this comes back to the balance we are seeking.. _reinforcing village of Dryden,,, more customers for downtown Dryden. Making sure these future residents don't add to Dryden village traffic probJcros. Tour: not everything in the plan will actually happen_.. we Dope that the Carpenters are .able to succeed, and the town's right to fame laws and the agricultural dislzict. are protecting them. However, the plan is saying that if they do stop farming there, wir would like to see denser residential development around the village of Dgdm. This is a trade "o.ff we would 11 ke to see if the worst case scenario that they don't make it comes to pass_ if this land isn't developed, it won't be a major catastrophe for the plan_ They are protected there. In the agricultural district, The town carat afford to extend water and sewer into this area as long as they are farming,, because of the ag disiAct. There would be no harm if this land is zoned agricuItural. if something happened to the farm in the futuue, the town could rezone it. 71 ! r Question on how to control development of'agricultural harts; George says could essentially I1MIt it to Olae residential unit' per 10 acres S- uggests looking at the Town of Ulysses webs] te when they have their agricultural zoning posted. Roger Merin thinks that changes in agriculture are going to drive the whole system. Tom Hatfic id grew up on a farm and his whole family has been in%+olved in farming — he knows that economics is a powerful force in agriculture today. lout he dunks that as a community, we are cornmitted to protecting farms and farmers. People really enjoy the beauty of farming. The town has right -to -farm laws to support farmers, the plan will do its best to direct development away from farms. People are farmi.Rg now because of history and many reasons, We will encourage them as much as we can, We may see more consolidation of land as farmers need to increase acreage to survive. rahnm asked about the Corks and Carpenters farms just west of the v111age. Understands that they want to farm there for the long term. How will this plan affect them? Why doesn't the future land use plan designate thou land for agricuiture? George — that lard could be zoned for agriculture.. , everybody sees its importance as entrance to the village, a hope it will stay an agriculture. But this comes back to the balance we are seeking.. _reinforcing village of Dryden,,, more customers for downtown Dryden. Making sure these future residents don't add to Dryden village traffic probJcros. Tour: not everything in the plan will actually happen_.. we Dope that the Carpenters are .able to succeed, and the town's right to fame laws and the agricultural dislzict. are protecting them. However, the plan is saying that if they do stop farming there, wir would like to see denser residential development around the village of Dgdm. This is a trade "o.ff we would 11 ke to see if the worst case scenario that they don't make it comes to pass_ if this land isn't developed, it won't be a major catastrophe for the plan_ They are protected there. In the agricultural district, The town carat afford to extend water and sewer into this area as long as they are farming,, because of the ag disiAct. There would be no harm if this land is zoned agricuItural. if something happened to the farm in the futuue, the town could rezone it. 71 ! Public Comments at the Town of Dryden Draft Comprehensive Plan Information Session Dryden Town Hall, December 18th, 2003 - Prepared by Debbie Gross, Environmental Planner About 40 participants, 32 on the participant list. Kelly Horowitz, Virgil Road in Dryden Thanks to all involved, this plan is really thoughtful and progressive and she's very impressed. This year Dryden had a request for low income multi -unit housing, if a request like this came up again, where would it fit into future land use plan? George Frantz Multi - family housing for all income types (not just low income) can be accommodated within the proposed suburban residential areas, that show up in red. The plan recommends that the town's new zoning ordinance have design guidelines for such developments, such as providing buffer areas around such development, and minimums for available open space and recreational areas for residents..,maximurn limits on number of stories. You can govern this type of development so that it can be built and stall be in character with the community, but you have to make sure that these things are in your zoning ordinance. Paul DeSantis, 14 Lake Road in Dryden We're hearing a lot about houses and parks and communities, but what about putting some industry into the area so that people have a place to work so they can pay for those houses. • George Frantz There is actually a substantial increase in land for industrial development proposed, especially the area along Hanshaw road between the ? and the vicinity of Ludgate produce. That whole area is under the airport flyway ... not a good place for residential development, not a good place for things like churches with a lot of people. So we are proposing this area be allocated for additional development for industrial uses. And then along Route 13, this area is expanded, and again, there is a lot of undeveloped land north of the village that would be available .for industrial development. Richard Fagan, 27 .Keith Lane, 844 -9525 What is the capacity of existing water and sewer system and how much would have to be newly constructed to accommodate proposed new development? George Frantz The system has adequate capacity at this point ... the Ithaca Area Wastewater Treatment Plant and the Bolton Point system ... from the standpoint of the town, the decision is where do we install the pipes and what areas should we serve. But the town has, at this point at least, capacity for treating additional wastewater and for potable water ... those are not issues. L, -Kathleen mclsaae, 302 Etna Road, 3474197 T am a farmer, and I bear you talking about respecting farrriland and agriculture, but on the land use map I don't see any agriculture in my area- The existing zoning is all about agri culture and right to farm. but in the new plan, my farm is smack dab in a big clump of red. I'm very concerned. Are we going to get ramrodded? How can I have 18 homes right around my fartrt with farm animals and al the things that invol.ves. I better stop here..- George Frantz This is a generalized map...uot a zoning .map. It is a framework for a zoning map. it doesn't mean that all ofth.e land in red will be zoned for development immediately. again, what we are trying to do is create contiguous tracts ofagriculturai land where we know that we oars enhance the long -term viability of the agricultural sector. But, the fact that there are sorr e farms in other areas... we are not wiping theta off the map. Kathleen Maclsaac But if I am in a residential areal, I Fill be taxed as if I have a 25 acre back yard, And I've got neighbors who are pissed off because 1 have goats and chickens and the roaster crows in the morning and the kids are afraid of the hens and... George Frantz One of the reasons for this is the fact that agriculture and residential development are Just as irtcompatibte as residential and commcrcial- athleen Maelsaac When I bought my farm 20 years ago there were no houses...there were just a couple of houses, ..now some houses have gone in... now Ftna road is going to get sewer and water and all of the sudden... you know I can't just pick up my 2 5 acres and move it into your green areas. Martha Robertson When you drew the lines, did you look at active agricultural lands? Kathleen Macisaac What happened to all of the yellow on this current land use rnap?., . So tnuoh of it is missing from your future land use map. George Frantz This is getting back to the issue of this, is it gives future residems oft to Ithaca or Cornell, as opposed to over here, where they would drive development west of FreeviIle and through Varn L balance, The reason the planning board is recommending his area the option of using Hanshaw load and route 13 to get laving it over here where they would drive through Varna, or through Etna or Freeville. The point mere is to get the major west of Etna and in a place where people won't be driving Kathleen Maclsaac So my long term plans should be: screw the farm, get rid of the animals. and subdivide- George Frsnu Not at this point...this is not adopted yet, (no name stated) Wouldn't her situation fall under right to farm? George Frantz We are tallying zoning now. This is the land use plan. The zoning ordinance is a whole different animal. The decision of what to zone what parcel, what land use, is down the road, Kathleen 14Laelsaac And you don't think that this proposaI v6l] push tbern in one direction or another about zonirxg? I rnean currently 1 am zoned agricultural l residential, which allows me to farm, and allows me... when the rooster crows and the neighbor complains, I Cry to shUt hirn up. but they can't suc me, because my rooster crows in the morning. if I am put into residentia], I am no longer allowed to have a rooster. David Weinstein We have right to farm laws Ut this gown. YO will always be protected for your abiliry to do the agricultural activity that you are cumntly doing. George Frantz The big diff-erence between this map and the zoning map is that in the zoning map you get clown to parcels, and again, I don't even know where your land is, but it may be possible that it falis into an agricultural zoning district. I can't tell at this paint, because this map is too generalized. (no name stated) So we need to make all of the meetings that are coming up to stay on top of what is happe. ing, (no name stated) 1 thlA it should be pointed out that the comprehensive plan is not 1tselfa law, once adopted by the town board, ht's a policy document. And that requires separate and additional laws to change any of the...the town board is not Iegal]y bound to 19ollow every reconunendat7on in the plan ... so there is the political process still to be at play. (no name stated) George Frantz Right now in Ulysses, they are -3 years ahead of the town of Dryden. They spent the last 3 months drawing the boundaries of the new zoning district, and we have successful I y, I think, appled with the very issue that you are raising, and }yes, boundaries were changed. land was pulled out of the modtwatc density resi dent] al district and put back into Ch A -1 agricultural district. See their website for agricultural zoning and hamlet zoning examples. They have been strntggling almost Tn a parallel track in Dryden but with their zoning ordinance. Martha Robertson Your rationale sounds life a good idea, but the devil is in the details- .So it requires going back and realty checking where is there active agricluture. And in particular, . L farm] and without r farmers won't continue to be farmed, but you've go a farm family here that wants to stay there and that should be a really high priority. That was clear in the surveys that you did. Maybe O Purchase of Development Rights is a good way to help also; to push back the development pressure... if there's going to be a residential community in the area, that might be a help. Nancy Munkenbeck, 832 Ringwood Rd, 5394902 First, I'd like to comment on working towards equitable distribution of sales tax from retail establishments so that towns without such establishments get a fair share of the benefit. Secondly, this plan seems to provide some guidelines for changes in zoning. Hopefully any zoning changes which would change the dollar value of the lands in question, if you are going to devalue land, especially something like zoning agricultural land so that it cannot be used for development, that farmers are reimbursed for their financial loss, in other words, so that you don't take away development rights without buying them. Martha Robertson In response to the first comment, sales tax is 8.25 percent, and the first 4 percent goes to the State, the rest.. sales in the city, they get a portion themselves... the rest is distributed among all municipalities. In Lansing, they don't get any more sales tax than we do, though they have to bear the infrasturcture costs. Nancy Munkenbeck So if the town of Dryden does not develop retail areas, we are not cutting our throats on the sales tax. ® (no name stated) We are still getting a share of pyramid mall. But they get the property value differential. George Frantz To respond to the section question...this is a critical issue. One of my areas of expertise is agricultural land preservation, the impact of zoning on agricultural lands and purchase of development rights. One of the problems here in Tompkins Cty (both a problem and a blessing)... development pressure is still relatively low, so really the difference in the value of land for agriculture and the value of land for development is really pretty small, even in places like the town of Ithaca, where there is public water and sewer ... there is not such a differential between what a farmer could get to sell the land for development and what it's worth for agriculture. We just don't have that development pressure like places like Lancaster Cty and Chester Cty and other places where farmland for farming starts at $7- $8,000 dollars an acre and sales for development for $20 to $30,000 per acre, so a farmer can sell development rights for $20,000 an acre in some parts of Lancaster Cty. The biggest differential we found in Tompkins County (1 did a study for the county on PDR about 2 years ago) and really the price differential is $500 to maybe, in some places $1000 per acre. It's not even enough in the Town of Ithaca to attract any real takers for it's PDR program. It's just not worth it for a farmer to sell them and tie the land up. Taney Munkenbeck That's at this time. George Frantz Even again, 20 years down the road ... the population of Tompkins County is not expected to experience any dramatic increase. Stewart Baker, 275 Lake Road, 8444995 There seem to be inconsistencies in this plan as it currently exists on the role of agriculture. is it important or is it not? Is it an open space assett or is it not? The graphic that showed open space did not include agriculture, and the slide on key issues for open space protection did not include preservation of agriculture. Also, the plan specifically targets Ag. district number l lands surrounding Village of Dryden for development, and that is inconsistent with the stated goal of preserving agriculture. That needs a closer look. This was a comment, so there was no specific response. Dave Vollenweider, Weber St. I have great concern over residential creep on Dryden Lake. It is a wonderful jewel of this community and I am seeing housing over the last few years go up around it and it distresses me to see that. I'm also greatly concerned that if the golf course folds someday that it will be sold off and developed for housing and I think that would be a crime, and I would like to know,. .you talk about creating park land and requiring that developers set aside parkland ... I tried to suggest that for a property behind my house and I sort of got laughed out of the room ... where's the money to pay for that.. Ym just concerned about that, especially on the lake. .How can we put a moratorium on current development? 1 see these expensive 2 and 3 acre places and if that is how Dryden Lake will end up in the next 20 years it will be a real sad state for us all. George Franc, The plan itself goes into detail on this. But maybe we should go back and look at that area and sec if there would be need for more conservation open space... expand the green. The question is whether the current designation as rural residential would lead to too much residential development in this area and would it impact the lake? Dave Vollenweider This is about quality of life in the community ... the lake is an open space... but people with money will buy that land and expensive houses will go up. By the time the plan is ready, there will be another half dozen houses up. How do we put a brake on that? (no name stated) Tell the people there not to sell the land • Dave Vollenweider I'm sympathetic to the landowner there too of course, but that should be a priority of the community, to save that piece of land. (no name stated) Is it an issue of direct accessibility to lake? Having a buffer around the lake? Dave Vollenweider All of that side of the lake shouldn't have a house on it ... in my opinion. Cliff Norte The problem is when we try to legislate behavior; somebody's property rights get trampled on. In the Adirondacks there are programs to buy land, the State spends money buying land to put these tracts together. Why can't that happen on a local level to compensate the land - owner? George Frantz. What we are talking about again is Purchase of Development Rights — it's done for agricultural land ... the Town of Ithaca ... they haven't acted on it yet, but they have a proposed program that would parallel their PDR program for Ag. land, that would go in and buy development rights to the kind of land you are talking about. Natural heritage preservation program,. so that's an option....for the town to identify areas and say we really don't want these areas developed at all, and purchase development rights to it. Cliff Norte, 1925 McLean Peruville Rd., 83 &3311 Taxes and how they impact development need to be considered. Some people are keeping open spaces on their own without a government program, but it's becoming very difficult to maintain open undeveloped space because of taxes. And also taxes work to discourage maintenance of the properties and taking pride in those properties, because they get penalized every time they do that. So if you want a certain behavior, lets keep track of what taxes do in encouraging or discouraging certain types of behavior. They are getting to be a huge impact. Taxes play a big part. .'particularly as we talk about setting aside our land as this gentleman mentioned, we all value and appreciate the open spaces, but the way we pay for them is not very proportional a lot of times. And when we start talking about impact fees, wanting builders and developers to pay for impact fees, I'm in favor of use fees ... let the people who use the bike trails and parks and schools pay impact fees. If we are going to have impact fees, lets have them equal, lets not get so socialistic in our thinking that we trample on people's personal property rights and their ability to maintain what they worked real hard to have. It's pretty easy to take from those that have accomplished something and give to others, but that's not always appropriate. Dan Karig, 71 German Crossroad Has a scientific question, he'll ask later (see written comments).