HomeMy WebLinkAbout1985-06-20Luvljli
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Li-L- Yuen
Planning_;
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June 20th,
Planning Board met June 20, a 00 P, f-,I, with Chr. B. Caldwell
calling the meeting to order and Board members J. Hunt, B. Lavine,
' R, La.mpila, R. Chase, and Z , 0. S, Stewart present, The public
hearing; for T11r, Mutton was cancelled, Minutes of the May 16th
• meeting were read. On page 2 the word. "perc" was added to R.Chase
question near the bottom of the page, ( "Did. It change the "per.c"
rate ?" '". Lavine's name was added. to members present. J. Hunt
made a motion to approve the minutes as corrected. Second. by
B, Lavine, CARRIED Minutes of the April l8tF meeting were
read., There were no additions or corrections J,Hunt made a.
motion to approve the minutes, Seconded by R. La.mplla. -QED
B. Caldwell - -- "Dryden Enterprises, ( Clyde Cotterill) for the record
Trou contacted me and told me you had done the things
that we had requested when we last met. I've con-
tacted Mahlon like you asked. He said from his
sta.nd.point everything has beer, accomplished, there-
fore here is the folder."
C, Cotterill -- "I don't think I have any more to say. I stopped
to see Sib the other day, and �rou have four copies
of the f ina.l nap. We're asking for final approval.
"Ue've done everything you requested. including the
ditching to satisfy DOT in Ithaca, Weeve made no
changes from the preliminary approval. I had a.
visit with Fred Grout last week e, he and 111a.hlon
agreed everything was OK."
°. Caldwell - -- "Does anyone have any questions' ?"
• J. Hunt-- ----- "Wha.t were the condition: ?"
General Discussion -- looked back through prior minutes to find
list of conditions,
C.Cotterill assured. Board that all conditions had been met.
B. Lavine - - - -- "Wha.t documentation is there that the development
Of lots will indeed require zero run-off ?"(Meaning
no extra. run-off.)
C.Cotterill - - "I think we said to you, when the Town gives a.
building permit, that's one of the conditions on
a lot in a subdivision, of course the only one that
has built is Dryden 1Iutua L and ' I' ll guarantee that
is satisfactory. We:ve done the ditching along
Route 38, Land drainage itself there is good. It's
gravel 6 ft. deep and there's no run off. We did
agree from the beginning that anyone who builds any
building should take care of the runoff."
J.Hunt------- "Sib, do you have them in a, form that will cue you
that this is a. condition that you need for issuing
a permit ?"
• S,Stewart--- "Here in the folder is a booklet."
B. La.vine---- "What is the test going to be for you to issue a.
building permit? What would you need to determine!
whether or not there is sufficient run -off from the
sight provisions are set up so that Sib will not
have to judge that?"
i
S. Stew
I
-. 2-
--- (? "ad._ :n " Resource Engineering ") - - -- "It is
recomme d that dry wells for roof drainage and
parking .rea.s be in i3ta.11ed. for the Ins. Co. Office.
It is not to add. any additional down stream or
storm run -off. It goes on to say , plans for balance '
remaining buildings on the portion of the site North
& West are remiss at this' time but like industrial
and commercial buildings, roof drainage and parking
area be tied into dry wells that feed. into a. gravel
or sub soil so that increases in run -off will not be
experienced."
B. Ca.ldwell--- "We ca.n reiterate for tonights' minutes. "
B. La.vine--- -- "There has to be some acceptable engineering
calculations showing that the run -off will not be
increased for any building that is constructed in
a subdivision. I am concerned about two things.
1. As I understand the wording, it'*s not required
that anything be done and 2. Eiren if it is requir-
ing that it be done, it's not giving; us any indi-
cation that there's a. study so all those things
going on, such as, it will not increase run- off."
B.Cald.well--- "The person who is doing the engineering for the
Town for building permits, should if we make it a.
condition, be one of the things that he would do."
General Discussion...Ma.ybe Town Engineer should design it.
Decided going back through the minutes was not a, good way.
B. CaldUrell--- "Could it be something in a motion for the final
approval, that .such & such will be noted on map.
J h
. unt=
_3-
one entrance only onto 1it, 38, if lots 3 cot.4 sold separately -
one entrance each onto rite,38, on lot C (3.50 acres) any,buildin
shall be at least the minimum setback from the proposed extention
of Enterprise Drive,
• ;��. on site retention of water, The pea.k drainage will be no
greater after development' -than drainage before,
:d.Caldwell-- - "What Planning Board may want to do is that by
signing the map, a copy of the minutes be an of f icia!
part of the map and filed as such,
B. Lavine - - - - "I think all of those conditions should be on ma' 11
J.Hunt ma.d.e a motion to grant final a orova.l4 of the subdivision
with the conditions 1. - 4 of the petit, 20th minutes Included as
a. pal]yr7tLL of the subdivision maps R Lpmbila secon e_ e motion,
(.A Hll I1JD I I
C.Cotterill -- "What is the next procedure ?"
B. Caldwell - -- "'rou're going to have to have either a Linen or
Hylar or whatever the County Clerk requires."
C. Cotterill -- "our surveyor has a Iyl �r, do I bring that to you ?"
B. Caldwell - - -" Iow I have authorization to sign on that basis
t�rith the motion, �d0, we don't need the Myla.r, but
you have to have my signature on that copy in
order to have it filed with the County Clerks off ice.
• C, Cotterill - - "Do I bring that to you for your signature? Are you
going to wive us the conditions ?"
13. Caldwell---"1es, that will be part of the copy, part of my
signature according to the conditions in the
minutes."
C,Cotterill - - "I'm speaking for Tom Todd and myself in saying we
really appreciate your cooperation, We've had a few
words on occasion over the past year, that's only
natural. I know we're probably one of the first
commercial subdivisions in the Town of Dryden, We
hope it's good. for the Town, The planning Board
has been great, and we want to say thanks."
B. Caldwell - -- "I see INr .Peed is here tonight, Do you have some-
thing formal for us ?"
A e Heed------- "I' m not sure how formal it is „ . Basically I'd like
some ideas. Here are the tax maps so you'll know
where I'm located. The MA zone is here and I own
here, Here are the survey maps also.(General Dis-
cussion of boundaries etc.) "The question I had was
whether to go to a major subdivision .right off or
try to keep it a minor subdivision with larger lots,
• In my business, people are looking for lots for ;
,..50,000 houses, not the 1'1100,000 houses. We just
haven't anything left in that range. 'That's why I'm
proposing this, I have a. 'total of 830 ft. of frontage
and was wondering if I could sell off a lot here &
put in a joint use right -of. -Sway and restrict this
I
6
i
district to one house r lot, making this a. Town .3d. I was
wondering about making, this 250 ft. frontage, to straighten up
the line. If I went t(, putting in underground utilities, w'on't
require sand. filters. I wondered what your feelings were on the
densit' of this area.. It joins the H A ?one, the slope goes up
to 15,: and the airport by -pass goes through there.
B. Cald.weli - - -11 How is the water there ?"
A. Reed- -- - - ~-"No problem there. jJe11s are good there now. If
j you put the density any thicker I can't guarantee
anything. We already put in 1650 ft; of the
there this spring. We thought about mobile homes
but decided against it.
J.Hunt ------- "You're talking about an RC lone here ?"
A. Reed 7------- "Yes. We're not Ag.. Dist. We have 336 acres."
J.Hunt -- --- - - "I'm concerned about the 15% dope. I'd need to
see a contour map of that area.. I'm not concerhed
with water where it is flatter.
A.Reed. - - - - -- "It's rolling, knoll like going to 15;4. This is
why, when I wa.s laying this out I'd like for the
Board to go out and do an on -site inspection. Do
you still do those ?"
B. Caldwell - - -- "vie sure do. "
A, Heed.!- - - - - -- "There's vood. sites, but they have to be spaced.
out* "
B.Lavire - - - - -- "You have 250 ft, frontage laid out ?"
;deed ;- - - - - -- "Yes, it depends on what the riealth Dept. says.
'Ale Yaay go down to 200 f t. I was wondering if there
was any way I could subdivide this out so I could .
provide housing for people with the type of in-
come these people have and still not get messed
up
B.Caldwell--- "With that size lot, you put a house, storage shed,
driveway and car, how much of the drainage pattern
are you going to be 'changing? It's not like some of
these mammoth lots where we can restrict cutting
etc.
A. Teed ----- - "I've taken out the brush and. a. few trees. The
drainage is good here. We put in the where the
dra.ina.ge was not good naturally.
B. Lavine - - -- "1ahere are the lines on Bilker Hill ?"
A.tleed - - - - - "I outlined the property-line carefully. There is
14 acres there. We need. lots in the ;$8000 ra.nge. "
J. Hunt ----- " °1e11 at this point I'm unable to go any further
because I need to see the land and, the contours."
I
A. 'Heed. "Yes, I would. like to have you look at it. They
raised the assessment the other day, and I'm
beginning to get just a. little nervous the way
taxes are going up."
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B. Lfavine - - - -- 1114hy isn't this in the AP
A.Aleed.-- -- - - - "I don't believe in the AS. Dist. I'll pay my
r
taxes until I can't do it any longer, then I'll
• ret out. The point is why did they set up the pg.
Dist, at 500 acres Tkihen the ave.r.r+ge sire farm in
I?. Y. State is 285? I threatened to take them to
court on that, ..ha.t means you're got to have! a
neighbor in farming and your livelihood. is de-
pending on whether or not the neighbor's son
wants to farm, or how his health is, or how he
rna.nages .... and. I just can't see it. I'd rather
pay the taxes - -if I can't, I'll get out. The Ag.
Dist. Jill, to my notion, has not worked at all.
All it's done is hold. land in limbo until the in-
evitable Is going to happen.. `r'o�.i can't preserve
farm lands if you haven't got a farmer. All you
have is land.. I've been to Albany « I've proposed
this 4 years -ago and before long- it's going to
come to pass, that all lands utilized for food.
production, riot be used. for school tax purposes,
however, if you would. tie that to a comprehensive
soil conservation program where you keep that
1 ^.nd via.ble, you would do the necessary for the
summer run -off etc, Also we should. consider com-
pata.ble recreational uses for those la.nd.s. I think
that wa.v we'd move closer from an agricultural
base to an i_ndustrical base, plus maybe we'd have
so!ne income, Now this isn't going; to be 'the i,reak
for the fa.r,ners yo-,.'d think it may be because of
• ta.xes on our facilities. The point is, our young
X% can not afford these lards in close. v1e
never had 500 acres and we're the ones feeling
the pressure. So I c<j.n't see where Ag. Dists. allow
for. I think it IF, given a lot of false security in
a lot of people,
B. Lavine---- "Well, it would talre you out of the bind. you're in
now though."
A.Reed------ "Oh,no! We're sitting on a. powder keg, and we have
been for five generations now. Kept moving back out
of Cornell's way. I would. appreciate you taking a
look at this property, I don't want high density. I
know Mr. Miller is going to address the problem of
aquifer etc. ;Mly question was -- should I go to major
right off? I could sell 4 right off, We tried to
check on the airport hazard area. I don't know how
far that gwoes."
J. Hun.t--- -- "aA7hen I vias trying to develop the overlay maps I
never could find anybody who could. define that very
plainly, not even the Town Attorney."
A. Heed - - - -- " ;de are in JiC up there, ',he'd talked about going to
• iB. What 'r. Miller has to ay tonight may change my
mind., but I would appreciate it if you folks could
look around out there."
i
Be Ca.ldvel?_- .:.,y ll:, l be able to het there at
Lme, so d.oe�l-, everyone know what's what
s it alright with you if there's lots
out there 1ookins. around. ?"
A. Heed � - - - - -- "That's fine with me. "
?.Ia.mpla---- ' °Tiow far up :t�nl.er bill i�: it from 366 ?"
A. Heed.- ; - - - - -- "It's 911.
mid.d.le of
Be Cn1d.�Aiell - -- "We'll try
meeting. "
the same
there,
of stranger,
ft st:�.rting point. It starts right in the
the cemetery."
to take a, look a.t i� before our next
.T
A. i�ieed.-- - - - - -_ "��here °s no rush, I just need. some ideas, pow, that
vra.s one thing. The other thing was addressing `i'urkey
_fill Ed, which I was to the hearing for, last weeA, "
Be Cald.t fell--- 1111 41 our r. ec o:rd s, would. you make .=3. comment?"
1,eed
read the attached. letter------ -
13. C�ld.Tr,ell - -- "`,7ould it be helpful if t�Te requested the ToTTn EEoa_^d
add their voice in tryin -; to het <o 45 mph s,>eed liiIi
through there ?"
A. , eed- i - - - - -- "I'd. appreciate it, Ken Tillopau ;l a.nd. Bill [Jobbs
roth have copies of the letter. The last x)et.ition
oLO lost `or a, spell but we fit q.l_ly :;ot it to the
I've nlTqays cooper.a.ted with them, What I' n
concerned. about here is they've spent so much money®
on the Northern end and with n.11 the protesting aboa!:
tree removal they'll fo.r_;et about the speed. limit.
?•7 ?-snit with jo;;Jers, deer,and. snoTV build ur) we need to
louver that speed limit, "
coUrse you'll 'rove q problom, ;rettin� someone t Q
A.
enforce the �T�eecl ]_irnit. " v
3 L, vir:,e - - - - - "I t iin14T. i t Y• c�ltld. be worth r,)I nc; P resolution to
3 ce),IdT'a ;11 - -- •!.iO voij T'r ?nt to f)h2' =1:;0
i
T 1
?1. Ft t.? - - - -- "1 t.'r1iY_ '.i: th0 C'e solutl.o'1 sl "tould ln?re a refer -`Ico
t' c= Letter., lle're i*. slal.)port of the letter, I pro -
r)ose resolution thrr t Tae call to the attention of
the 'Town lRoard: the letter ro:n Alton deed on June %
EO 3ill iifobbs , i ol:nty lighwn.y 7e')te I Dr000 ^E? we
s'.)pbor the tT10 lnr , ().r 1 oint s in GYIe e+ ter in thT
4.''!f s1)eed iiilit, On tCfIe Section tee should be
to ; (n*0 l as n.ro�osed. and, tha t the bank glon'_
the rnn ghou _ . Oe t<il)ere _. oI to e. imin=t t,e the sn0'C.
_e
'm
aS C.C:;CTa:_eC ill the E'' %'.eI', i�eso Z.1 .i011
sd;•C; O `Ii G eC bT! Jo _ .fi tY
t l t. .r. r a_ ec
i
t i tom"
L_
1 i
I
r r
oblem.
I I'Inve
two
lots
G. tOt'. ;l - --- "`I :t'r. I
jus "t
h'rlve
n
ii
:ln I -"I
bl�il_cl
on 'Y: e
l l o
.'r a,
r'n
t'totr.
o
buildirl,
snot.her
one.
We ^1re
^d.;
L_
1 i
the
r r
oblem.
I I'Inve
two
lots
:ln I -"I
bl�il_cl
i
nfl. ^
iol.ise
t11cr.•e
t'totr.
buildirl,
snot.her
one.
We ^1re
^d.;
_7
have the building permits. I'd like to get a. variance for the
second house. Instead of having the proper .road frontage of 125 f;
it would have to be 65 ft. road frontage. I'd like to propose a,
road in here so when we sell this lot, I want to sell it with thi:
surveyed. off of it. In other words this would. still comply with t}
. Health Dept. I want to make a road back in here probably some timt
next year. This is a larger survey. It used. to be the Yellow Bprn
Development. I bought this field and it joins my property here.
There are at least three lots there, possibly four."
J.Huntg------ "Basically what you're talking about is bringing a
road through here so you can develop this area ?"
G. Rotunda ----- "Yes, someday after the road is built, this lot wou.l
pick up it's road frontage from the new'road: There':
295 ft, there."
J. Hunt-- ----- "If you don't sell that lot until you develop the
road, you're home free."
G.Rotunda--- "Right. In other words I have the building permit
to go ahead now, but I would la.nd.lock myself and I
want to leave that optional."
J.Hunt------" You're setting up a right -or -way through there
which cuts off your compliance with the zoning code."
G. Rotunda--- "Yes. It
J. Lunt------ "I think in order to give any approval of any kind
• we'd have to see your long; range plans on it."
B. Ca.ldwell--- "Yes, for an actual variance you would have to go to
the Zoning Board. of �ppea.ls, but it could be with a
recommendation one way or the other from us. "
J.Hunt--- --- "If we're talking about a subdivision development
here, then that's our business, including the road.
I would like to see what your plans may be, to see
what other problems may arise. You have an odd shaped
piece of property here and you could run into diffi-
culty.."
B. Lavine.---"Is this all your property? Do you have frontage on
Ferguson Road ?"
G. Rotunda. -- "Yes, •I have frontage both here and here."
�M. Chase----- "You don't have houses built 'on Fer*c.xson lid. do you ?"
G. Rotunda -- "AIo. I think thos
develop this whol
want houses here.
gardless if I get
do that. I'd like
We're almost f ini
e are Jim
* field.
I guess
a va.ria.n
to start
shed with
'Morton's
I live he
I can bui
ce except
digging
this hou
I don't want to
re and I don't
ld this house re.
that I'd hate to
the foundation soon
se.
B.Caldwell - "I'm just thinking out loud now. I'm not sure which
might be the proper way to go. Could you in selling
this off, retain an option on that particular chunk
I
w
ll S --
so that when
you
diu
::ide to build.
draft
of where it might go.
It would not
be committir
you
that
opt i(.'.,::. as
a.
per
i.rea,greed sum?
still
be in compliance
show
your future plans for
up until that
you'd_
have additional
road frontage
any
problems."
a. road, you could pick up
That way this lot would
point. If you did that,
anyway, there would.n °t be
G.Rotunda--- "Right, but the problem with that is, that's the
way it was originally. I had building permits for
both of these places."
B. Caldwell--- "Yes, right now this is thought, of as a combined
lot and. there's 300 ft. there."
G. Rotunda. - -- "The original survey has this reserved. along the
creek & my original thought was to come up here on
to Yellow Barn Road. In talking with Mahlon about it,
we thought there was probably two problems with that.
First, it is not 100 ft. from the center of the Rd.
and I guess there's an angle at which you have to
come on to another road., so I would have needed 8.
variance for both .of those things. I had George
Schlecht resurvey the thing so that If came out with
more than a. 100 ft, a.nd. it come out at a,900 and all
those things. It was also away from the stream bed..
I talked to dYSEG about it, telling them my long
range plans. I just quickly drew this to scale for
tonight. lour .lots here is all you could. ever have.
They said. don't worry about underground, You can picl-
up overhead here."
B. Caldwell -- Illde can't say for sure that this is likely to be
in
the right place until we've
seen at
least a rougrmw
draft
of where it might go.
It would not
be committir
you
to have to put it there,
just have
something to
show
your future plans for
development."
G. Rotunda--- "Would I need. a survey for that' ?"
J. Hunt ------ 0llgo, just sketches to scale of what you might be
going to d.o. We don't want you to end up with a
dead. end here."
G. Rotunda--- "I talked about that with Mahlon too. The thing I,
have to find. out is . if we can't come in here & have
a. turn- around or a. dead end, unless we have a variance,
right?
J, Hunt - - - -- "I O, you can, but we frown on it."
B.Lavine - -- "It's not likely to be approved.."
G.Rotunda-- "Hahlon and I thought if we were going to build four
houses it would be feasible to put in a road from here
to here, but I'm not sure I want to build four houses
there. If I only want to build three it wouldn't be
feasible in dollars rand cents, to put in an expensiv®
road, "
B.Iavine--- "The Town has another concern about that which I'll
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mention to you as a preliminary concern and that is if you're ,
building a fair amount of road which will be deeded to the Town
as public, the Town is going to have to maintain a fair amount
of road for three houses, the amount of .road in many other situ-
• ations could support eight or ten houses. Getting three houses
tax based to support a. road. that could support eight or ten is
another problem from our point of view in terms of a development
of this sort. Not to say it can't be approved. however."
G.Rotund.a--- - "I realize we both have problems trying to do this.
These neighbors have been mowing this grass and
using it'for their lawn since they lived there. Now
if I come along and build a road he they're
going to be madder than the dickens. I'm not sure
I want to stir up that hornet's nest right now.:"
B.Ca.ldwell--- "It may be stirred up 15 years from now. Let's
think of this as phase I and another chunk as phase
II and another as III etc. If we see them in a
sketch fashion that does not mean you have to com-
plete all those things at once. It may take years
to complete and. thats fine. What we basically do is
.get a rough sketch of how it might be, .so you don't
end. up with some rep-1 odd shaped parcels or roads
coming out in the wrong places etc. Then we have
that for a tenative approval for a. basic sketch.
Then you can get specific approval for one phase
at a. time."
G. rotunda - - - "So what you would. lilte me to do is get this all
.
drawn to scale ?"
J.Hunt------ "Yes, then continue into the other phases. Your
sketch plan is not a, survey, it's a drea.m. You may
change your mind. later on phase two or three in
the future.,,
G..Rotunda--- "I have no problem with that. The problem I have is,
and maybe it's not a problem, but I want to start
building this house very soon, but I don't want to
landlock myself. If I get the foundation all done
next week then find out I can't get a variance for
the 65 ft. , I've -cut off anything I might want to do
over there."
J. Hunt------ "As
dic
we
to
We
car
far as this Board is conc
tion over subdivisions. We
only approve subdivisionso
go to the Zoning Board of
could make P. rec ommend.a.t i c
ry any weight,"
erned, we have juris-
don't grant variances,
You would really have
Appeals for a. variance,
n to them but it doesn'.
G. Rotunda. - - "I'd like to build three or four houses a year. I
have lots on Ferguson Rd..a.lso, but I don't want to
do anything there now."
J.Hunt - - - -- "You're talking about
brings it back to us.
phases. After we look
to them with a. better
now that we're going
a phase subdivision which
Shots us what you want to do in
at it you ma.y still have to go
idea. We obviously can't say
o approve it."
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G, Rotunda- , )o if I forg ; the subdivision for now, you folks
aren't the ones I'd see about the 65 ft. frontage
anyhow ?"
S.Stewart - -- "Then you think he should go to Zoning ?" 1 0
B. La.vine---- "I think the idea. of retaining an option on (that
is good*" i
S.Stewart--- "That's what I thought."
B. Caldwell--- "Then you wouldn't need a variance."
B. Lavine - ---- "Then when and if you're ready to build, you
exercise your option to buy that strip at the pre-
! arranged price."
J.Bunt=----- "Then you'd need your variance at that point unless
you build the road,"
B.Lavine---- "Timing is the important thine there, but if your
road is there the variance would. be ea.sier to come b.,
G.:Rotunda - -- "0k. Thank you. I'll be back. 11
B.Caldwell-- 11'11r. miller, you wanted. to talk to us tonight ?"
G,,,Uller--- - "Yes, in regards to your review to the total zoning
law, and I'm spea.ki.n g on behalf of the RB None over
in Lllis ilollova. , e're havincr problems even though
the development is in a.ecorddanee with the zoning la.
`le're '.avin� ;pollution in our wells, we're F;ettin
dry wellr,, �irid also trouble with our septic systems
in that area. Actually the only changes in the RB
zoning law which relate 'to structures & the density
and area. requirements. We were suggesting that per-
haps because of the water & sewer problems we're
getting pollution."
B.Caldwell--- "What areas of the Hollow ?"
G.Miller--- - - "On Hunt Grove road there are two families that
have pollution, and you know about Norm Vra.na's
problem as a, result of multiple housing. There's
two more that have gone in there since and I don't
know how long it will be before it'll come back
again. Lucey and Moses are the ones having the
problems. It come from the development up above
them. There's quite a few wells that are going
dry because of the a.quife.r dropping. They're
having a big problem over the Hickory Highlands
area.. That I didn't know about before Alton was
commenting on that earlier. To get back to the
zoning law, is to leave the one x two family
housing units which would be single dwellings and
a dwelling with perhaps an apartment in it and
only permit multifamily dwellings with public
water and sewer. I believe in JIB Zones, There's
no public water or sewer anywhere because it's
low density. It would. eliminate that from the
I
-11-
zoning law until water and sewer became a. fact. And the other
is to increase which would help development with the one and. two
family dwellings. I think it goes through here as 30,000 sq. ft.
to a lot, in the zoning law, and to increase that to an acre
which is around. 43,000 sq.ft, of usable space, not where there
is a, creek or swale where it would riot be usable drainage. Now
the Health Dept. is still going on that 200ft, circle or somethini
like that. So only change the lot size and the restriction on
multiple family dwellings requiring public water and sewer. I'll
throw this out here, that someone over there suggested that the
two family dwellings be owner occupied. I'm not personally for
that but thought I should mention it. Those a-re the only changes
we had -- -the only restriction is the increas.e in•lot size for
anyone who wants to build one or two family homes. We are having
problems, water is getting scarce, tl,e soil over there is mostly
clay anyway and it does not provide good. d.raina.ge.
J.Hunt - - - -- "Have you looked at a soil map of the town lately ?"
G. Miller - - -- lljio I haven 't to "
J.Hunt ---- -- "The soil map of the town shows vast differences in
very small areas. This is true.in any area, but
you find differences in feet from one type to
another. I don't know that it would be practical
to go through the s<;il program eve.rytime you
wanted to build or set up a zone based on the soil
characteristics. So basically what you need is a
size that would solve the worst case is what you
are suggesten, "
13. Caldwell - -= "I think gr=adually
f.:r all the
subdivisions
we've
had. come before us
in the past
4 or 5 years,
they
are virtually all
co,zin, in at
one acre or
more. "
i
it was when
we started
planning.
Only put multiple
•
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zoning law until water and sewer became a. fact. And the other
is to increase which would help development with the one and. two
family dwellings. I think it goes through here as 30,000 sq. ft.
to a lot, in the zoning law, and to increase that to an acre
which is around. 43,000 sq.ft, of usable space, not where there
is a, creek or swale where it would riot be usable drainage. Now
the Health Dept. is still going on that 200ft, circle or somethini
like that. So only change the lot size and the restriction on
multiple family dwellings requiring public water and sewer. I'll
throw this out here, that someone over there suggested that the
two family dwellings be owner occupied. I'm not personally for
that but thought I should mention it. Those a-re the only changes
we had -- -the only restriction is the increas.e in•lot size for
anyone who wants to build one or two family homes. We are having
problems, water is getting scarce, tl,e soil over there is mostly
clay anyway and it does not provide good. d.raina.ge.
J.Hunt - - - -- "Have you looked at a soil map of the town lately ?"
G. Miller - - -- lljio I haven 't to "
J.Hunt ---- -- "The soil map of the town shows vast differences in
very small areas. This is true.in any area, but
you find differences in feet from one type to
another. I don't know that it would be practical
to go through the s<;il program eve.rytime you
wanted to build or set up a zone based on the soil
characteristics. So basically what you need is a
size that would solve the worst case is what you
are suggesten, "
13. Caldwell - -= "I think gr=adually
f.:r all the
subdivisions
we've
had. come before us
in the past
4 or 5 years,
they
are virtually all
co,zin, in at
one acre or
more. "
.'l.Chase - - - - -- "But see, it's riot written in our own zoning laws."
B.Ca.ldwell--- "You couldn't d.o anything for pre - existing lots
anyway."
B. Lavine---- - "But there is also a. lot
in under subdivisions. I
places I can't und.erstand
approved."
of things that don't come
can show you a number of
why the Health Dept.
B.Cald.well--- "They're talking of a bigger area now, than just
one chunk of Ellis Hollow Road. That's-why I
questioned it."
G. I-1Tiller--- -- "I was thinking of the RB from the Town of Ithaca
line right up the whole valley. I think the whole
case covers the other RB zones in the town too,
because none of it is high enough density to afford.
public water and. sewer districts."
A. Heed--- - - -- "I came to the hearing about Beam Hill and
putting in a
multiple
family unit.
I feel that
:-3B and BB 1
retains one
and two
family houses,
take out the
multiple.
Keep it residential.
like
i
it was when
we started
planning.
Only put multiple
i
-1..
i
where there is public wat
had have been over multip
Is the'problem with bacte
bl t t t dd
er and sewer. All the problems we've
le dwellings. The thing beyond. that
ria a.nd. nitrates in wells. This is a
pro em we mus s ar a ressing. I'm trying to get the Health
Dept, to change now. It appears to me this should be addressed
before,it gets out of hand. They're having this problem all over.
I'm not for more regulations being a. farmer, but on the other
hand, there's such a thing as common sense, and that is to drill'
dolan with the inch bit, set those casings. and grout the thing
to keep things from going in there. He might have his well dis-
covered and then it comes on clown through the rock'and right
down a cased well then what are you going to do with nitrates?
I think the requirements are Important." i
J.Hunt =, -- "I don't think even Ellis Hollovr ca.n afford. public
water and. sewer."
B. Caldwell -- "You're talking one acre lots."
G. Miller - - -- "That was just a. suggestion."
B. Caldwell -- "We're just playing
for frontage?"
G. hiller - - -- "I'd
ta,nc
now.
311 t
a.qu i
have
1 ea .
e be
T e),
it s
fer
lar
ve the fi
tween lot
i s good.
till does
to get wn
ger lots
ideas here. What do you suggest
ontage the same. Yoeve got dis-
lines a.nd any structure in there
So long; as they've got the depth,
n't take care of dipping into the
ter for the wells. That should.
even."
a. Chase - - -- "What is the bi,; attraction of people building in
the face of a water shortage? I've 1neard contractor:
pror:lise they'll get water. "
G.Miller--- "They get it too, but you know they hit the stra.tta
and someone else is going to have less water. This is
what happened in Hickory Highlands. When three or
four are using the same water supply, it cuts it
down. We haven't gotten the rain or snowfa.11 to
build the aquifer back up and we're still losing
ground because the water usage is increasing-all
the while."
B.Caldwell- "Have you run into increasing amounts of salt or
gas anywhere in the town ?"
A.Reed--- -- "Yes, Cornell has- -down on St
looking for a grant to run wa
a.11 the way up. The wells are
think it would. help a lot to
and RB 1 and keep it low dens
evenson Road. They're
ter from the game farm
deteriorating. I really
take multiple out of RB
ity. to
J.Hunt--- - - "In the residential zones of the Town then we should
either require immense lots for multiple housing or
not allow them at all, and in general we should' in-
crease the size of the lots. You're timing is near
perfect. We're just getting ready to review our
residential classifications."
A. Reed--- "I still think the old 111 zone was a. good idea. But
it ii-rent over like a lead balloon."
-1.3-
,.Caldwell- - - - - "I think this is one of tine reasons we've been
paying so much attention to how much are people
going to be striping things to increase the
speed. of run -off. " I
•G.Miller- - - - - -- "That's another thing I haven't addressed, here,
but the larger the lot size, the better the run-
off in general. "
A. Reed--------- "We're letting the Health Dept. do our zoning."
G.Miller- ---- -- "Their restrictions are not great enough."
J.Hunt--- - - --- "People
are becoming
more
agreeable to
zoning
restrictions
and.
lowering
density. The
time is
right to
move in
that
direction."
GENERAL DISCUSSION: 701.
come
news
how
clus
s
p
t
t
tudy - - -a .
about s i
a.per art
o avoid.
er d.evel
11 the changes that have
nce. J. Hunt mentioned a
icle about Washington and
the urban take over and
opment.
B. Caldwell - - - -- "`1-'here are two studies going on now at the
State level which ;) outhern Tier East is involved
in. (water qua.nity water quality). Maybe Buzz
can het something on that."
B. Lavine-- - - - - "I can't rive you much
although I can get :,om
- B. Caldwell--- -- "I think that may be
to do population proj
in terms of details now
e reports for us."
helpful. They were trying
ections."
A. deed.--------- "tdha.t is your gross projection ?"
B. Caldwell--- .- "'This was a draft of Southern Tier and County
Planning-- -
1930-- 12,156 1990 -- 139500 2000 -- 149875
so that's about ll in 10 years.
G.Miller- - ----- "Has there been any consideration on the Planning
Board. level of restricting growth of development
based on 6� of slope ?"
General agreement that there had been)
B.Caldwell ... -- "Can we perhaps continue this d.
later date? It's getting late.
plans? Our next meeting will be
that meeting, what are your pla
then we will have been able to
land and then maybe we'll have
cuss the zoning."
iscussion at a
What are vacation
July 18th. For
ns? Presumably by
look at Alton's
some time to dis-
S.Otewart------ "I got a call the other day on a roadside stand.
•
They have to be 50 ft. from the center line. This
fellow wants to have a stand at the end. of his
machine shop."
B. Caldz ^cell---- "Is it a roadside stand or pa.r.t of a building that
crept a. little too close to the road ?"
i
-lt�-
te-rvart- - ----P Jae build.in� isn't built yet. It's a. proposed
build in,g. "
J. Hunt -- --- - -- "I might a.d.d. the proposed build.ing is 75 feet
from the roa.d center line and the roa.d.side istand.
sticks out from that. I think we should turn
that one over to Mahlon."
R, CHASE MADE A MOTION TO ADJOURN THE MEETING
SECONDED BY J, HUNT CA BIED
MEETING ADJOU. NED 10:05 P. ii.
secretary,
r �