HomeMy WebLinkAboutDec 6, 2010 public hearing.pdfN12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
1
1 Village of Cayuga Heights
2
3
4
5 PUBLIC HEARING
6
7 Monday, December 6, 2010, 7:00 p.m.
8
9
10
11
12 HELD AT: Cayuga Heights Elementary School
13 110 East Upland Road
14 Cayuga Heights, New York
15
16
17
18
19
20 REPORTED BY: MARISA NOLD
21
22
23
24
2
1 MAYOR SUPRON: Okay, thank you so
2 much for coming this evening to share your
Page 1
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
3 views with the board. I'm going to go
4 ahead and open the public hearing. And
5 before we begin the period of public
6 comment, which is this evening, and the
7 process will be that we have speakers
8 limited to two minutes a piece, and we will
9 have residents speak before non-residents.
10 Before we do that, I want to give a
11 very, very brief overview of where we are
12 in the progression of deer population
13 control in the village. The deer
14 remediation committee formed in August of
15 2008 and worked to put together a proposal
16 for a recommendation to the trustees, which
17 they did in May of 2009. We also held
18 forums in which questions were answered and
19 public comments were taken. The trustees
20 then looked at the FEIS proposal for a
21 period of four months and adopted a draft
22 plan very limited to the developing EIS
23 proposal, and that is what the board has
24 been doing since last fall, and first we
3
1 were the lead agency as we went through the
2 prescribed DEC process of the state
3 environmental assessment form. The board
4 completed that review process in March of
5 last year -- or, of this year of 2010 with
6 two positive declarations. The positive
7 declarations were of statements of things
Page 2
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
8 that could have negative impacts on the
9 environment. Our positive declarations,
10 one related to public with respect to
11 privacy, and one related to the negative
12 impact to the deer that would be culled
13 under the draft plan. Because of those two
14 positive declarations, the next step in the
15 process in the environmental impact is to
16 conduct the DEIS.
17 Fred Miller is -- Fred Welch is here
18 this evening from Tim Miller and Associates
19 to -- to listen to your comments as they
20 prepare the DEIS. At this point, the board
21 has been presented by our outside
22 consulting firm with the draft
23 environmental impact statement, and we have
24 the option of having a public hearing to
4
1 hear the public's review of that. And then
2 the public comment period extends ten days
3 beyond today.
4 Tonight's comments that are deemed to
5 be substantive and relative to govern the
6 DEIS will be reviewed and answered by Tim
7 Miller and Associates in the final DEIS,
8 which will then be presented to the board.
9 It's at that point in the process, once the
10 board accepts the final environmental
11 impact statement, that the village board
12 can vote for the first time on whether or
Page 3
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
13 not to implement deer population control.
14 So we are so pleased that so many of
15 you have come out this evening to the
16 public hearing on the draft environmental
17 impact statement.
18 Do you need to add anything else?
19 No. All right.
20 Mary Mills, I'll introduce you to
21 her, who is going to be calling up speakers
22 and also letting you know when you are
23 almost out of time and then out of time. I
24 think we'll pass along and introduce the
5
1 trustees. Okay, I'll do it myself, because
2 it's faster. I have next to me Bea
3 Szekley, who is a village trustee and
4 deputy mayor. Diana Riesman, trustee, Liz
5 Karns, trustee, Bob Andolina, Christopher
6 Crooke and Steve Hamilton; all trustees.
7 And then at the end here we have Randy
8 Marcus, our village attorney.
9 MARY MILLS: Okay, as I make my way
10 back, I have to get my list, which you all
11 graciously signed.
12 What I would like to do is call four
13 people at a time, there's four chairs in
14 the front. And if you'd like to move up to
15 the four chairs and take turns speaking,
16 that would be great.
17 MAYOR SUPRON: If you wanted to speak
Page 4
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
18 this evening, we had everybody sign in, and
19 there was a spot on the list to check your
20 name to speak. What we'll do is run
21 through the people who have signed in and
22 checked the box, who were residents, and
23 we'll ask if there's any other residents
24 and then we'll move on and do the same
6
1 thing with non-residents. So regardless of
2 whether you checked the box or not, you'll
3 have your opportunity to speak.
4 MARY MILLS: I'm showing the first
5 four people, and please forgive me if I
6 mispronounce your name, I don't do it
7 intentionally.
8 Peter Bottomer, then followed by
9 Roger Segelken, Barbara Johnson-Foote
10 Sandip Tiwari; those would be the first
11 four people, please.
12 And I will interject. When you start
13 speaking, I will start the timer at that
14 point. And when it gets to be 30 seconds
15 left in those two minutes, I will interrupt
16 and say 30 seconds please.
17 So, Peter, if you'd like to start us
18 off.
19 PETER BOTTOMER: Hi, can you hear me?
20 At one of the village meetings, professor
21 Paul Curtis, who was the expert advisor to
22 the deer remediation committee, said if
Page 5
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
23 there weren't too many deer in the village,
24 we wouldn't be having this meeting. That
7
1 applies tonight, and it defines the problem
2 that the trustees are seeking to overcome.
3 As you know, the recommendations of
4 the Cayuga Heights deer committee was a
5 phase program of sterilization and culling.
6 It was -- the DEIS, I don't know if I've
7 got that right, did a very good job of
8 commenting on this plan. I urge you to
9 read it, if you haven't done so already.
10 In contrast, the so-called
11 alternatives that have been put forward by
12 the cayugadeer.org do not address the
13 overpopulation problem and would make it,
14 in fact, worse. They clearly want the
15 village to do nothing, and they have had
16 the -- they will have the environmental
17 damage without limit, and eventually the
18 herd will be limited by starvation and
19 disease. Cayugadeer.org has engaged in a
20 campaign based on the use of firearms to
21 cull a herd. But when a -- a new method
22 that does not require firearms has been
23 mooted, they immediately attacked it. This
24 proves to me that they have no real concern
8
1 for the people in the village. They're
Page 6
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
2 only concerned about the deer. And I just
3 learned today that there's a video clip on
4 their website that totally misrepresents
5 the net involved process, so, you know,
6 more deception. Finally, they seem
7 incapable of honest and --
8 MARY MILLS: Peter, time please.
9 MAYOR SUPRON: Finish your sentence.
10 PETER BOTTOMER: Well, my last
11 sentence was to call for a round of
12 applause for the tenacity and the
13 determination and the courage that you all
14 on the board of trustees have shown
15 throughout this process.
16 (APPLAUSE)
17 ROGER SEGELKEN: My name is Roger
18 Segelken, 114 Texas Lane. My wife and I
19 have lived there for more than 17 years.
20 I'm also the village's municipal
21 representative to the environmental
22 management council of Tompkins County;
23 however my remarks tonight are as a private
24 citizen and as a resident of the village,
9
1 and not as a member or chairman of that
2 advisory group. The EMC may render a
3 separate opinion on this draft
4 environmental impact statement in its
5 official capacity.
6 In my opinion, this draft represents
Page 7
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
7 a proper environmental impact statement in
8 that it covers all of the impacts, legally
9 relevant impacts, it covers all of the
10 alternatives to the proposed action, and it
11 covers all of the mitigations to negative
12 impacts. In regards to mitigations, I
13 would make three points; one, that during
14 the trapping, sterilization and culling of
15 the deer, every effort should be made to do
16 it humanely, so that the animals do not
17 suffer.
18 Secondly, any meat that's harvested
19 during this project should be distributed
20 to people in need; and third, at any time
21 in the course of this project, if
22 alternatives arise, to --
23 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
24 ROGER SEGELKEN: -- to the culling
10
1 and/or to the surgical sterilization, these
2 alternatives should be considered and
3 implemented at least.
4 Thank you.
5 BARBARA JOHNSON-FOOTE: I'm Barbara
6 Johnson-Foote, I live at Kendall. I think
7 the deer are pretty to look at, but I think
8 that the whole country, not just Cayuga
9 Heights, needs to help reduce the deer
10 population.
11 They don't have natural enemies like
Page 8
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
12 they used to have. They are destroying not
13 just your planting, but they are destroying
14 the country. All over the country, the
15 deer, where they're not being harvested,
16 are eating the new vegetation in the
17 forests, and there will be no new
18 vegetation growing.
19 There will be no new trees. It's
20 important that we harvest those deer, do
21 something to stop them. One of my
22 neighbors at Kendall can't drive his car
23 right now. It's in -- parked in the
24 garage, because he had a -- a deer ran into
11
1 him, and when he went to the body shop,
2 they told him that 40 percent of the
3 bodywork they have to do is on cars that
4 have been hit by deer. It's ridiculous for
5 -- to just let them keep growing.
6 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
7 BARBARA JOHNSON-FOOTE: I think
8 that's enough.
9 SANDIP TIWARI: I am Sandip Tiwari.
10 My family and I moved here in 1999,
11 attracted by the combination of Cornell
12 University and the values that the
13 community has presented, a non-self
14 centered and humanist view of the local and
15 global world as we have it and affect to
16 our actions.
Page 9
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
17 We have resided on Upland Road since
18 the arrival in 1999. This will end, since
19 it is becoming knowingly clear that the
20 extremism and lack of civilized
21 conversation that has become more pervasive
22 in this decade across the world, two wars
23 and community-based polarization has
24 arrived here. This country is going
12
1 through its worst financial crisis with
2 nearly 10 percent unemployment. There are
3 budget shortfalls all around, local, state,
4 nation; and we propose to spend a million
5 dollars on the deer culling.
6 Mahatma Ghandi said the more helpless
7 a creature, the more entitled it is for
8 protection by man from cruelty of man. If
9 we are not willing to consider solving the
10 problem through individual use of fences,
11 it's unethical, uncivilized and is
12 representative of the style of government
13 that is becoming from too pervasive from
14 Cayuga Heights to Washington, and all this
15 act of killing will do is to create a
16 long-term sustainability problems for the
17 community; Cayuga Heights, Ithaca, the
18 institutions and the companies that have
19 made this area their home.
20 We, in Cayuga Heights, think we are
21 rich and immune to this financially
Page 10
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
22 struggling country --
23 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
24 SANDIP TIWARI: -- and we may
13
1 complain about the taxes. We think that a
2 good use of a million dollars is this
3 proposition. May I suggest, you look at
4 the workers and the way they live and find
5 a way of spending this money, so that
6 people who work for you actually can live
7 around here.
8 Well, look at the potholes and look
9 at that intersection of Cayuga Heights --
10 of the parkways and Upland and fix that
11 intersection that has always been iced up
12 during wintertime. Help improve education
13 in the elementary school here. Bring a --
14 to every grade, and support arts and music.
15 MARY MILLS: I'm sorry, that's time.
16 The next four people, please, Mary
17 Tabacchi, Guy Tabacchi, Joe Romano and Judy
18 Leviet.
19 MARY TABACCHI: Hi. As a 33-year
20 tax-paying resident of Cayuga Heights, I'm
21 opposed to the current plan for deer
22 remediation, which clearly means killing
23 the deer in an inhumane manner.
24 I am afraid of stray bullets, I am
14
Page 11
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
1 afraid of deer running loose who have been
2 injured. I am afraid to be out walking,
3 biking, jogging, cross-country skiing or
4 whatever I like to do outside. I do not
5 want the children or elderly people in the
6 -- in the village to be tongue-tied by
7 culling or viewing of injured deer. I will
8 be afraid to have my pets outside, if we're
9 going to shoot. I do not want to pay taxes
10 for the slaughter of these animals,
11 especially when the village needs to pay
12 more attention to its infrastructure.
13 And in a time when we need to focus
14 on the safety and security of our
15 residents, walkways, speed bumps are more
16 tactilized and so on. I believe we could
17 resolve our car/deer issues by placing
18 speed bumps in Cayuga Heights, just as did
19 the residents of Forrest Home. I believe
20 that we can resolve the garden issues by
21 allowing adequate fencing.
22 I am strongly opposed to the deer
23 remediation plan, because it divides the
24 residents of Cayuga Heights into camps,
15
1 neighbor against neighbor. I believe that
2 this annual killing will reduce property
3 prices and the value of my home. I will
4 not allow deer to be killed within 500 feet
Page 12
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
5 of my home. I do not want to be alarmed at
6 night or suddenly at home, due to noise or
7 violence associated with the killing of
8 these deer.
9 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
10 MARY TABACCHI: I believe that
11 baiting and killing deer is unethical and
12 cruel. I do not like being intimidated,
13 because I believe it is wrong to kill deer.
14 It is unpleasant to live in an atmosphere
15 of pressure and fear.
16 Thank you very much.
17 GUY TABACCHI: Guy Tabacchi, we've
18 been here for 33 years. Since this
19 previous administration has continually
20 culled the deer remediation by lethal
21 means, the village has become divisive and
22 has destroyed the community spirit. We now
23 have a split community.
24 So that the board may know, I do not
16
1 give permission for our property to be used
2 for any purpose of this program, nor do I
3 give permission for the discharge of any
4 firearm within 500 feet of our home. There
5 is no guarantee that if a bait and shoot
6 plan is adopted that a straight projectile
7 will not become a lethal object to people
8 or pets. If a deer is eluded that animal
9 can become a damage to drivers, since the
Page 13
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
10 animal in all probability will run away
11 very frightened.
12 How can the number of deer left to
13 survive be defined as 20? Exactly how many
14 deer do we have in the village? Since the
15 mayor claimed in her television interview
16 on WSTN that there are too many deer, and
17 has been claiming this for over a year, it
18 is time that we know exactly how many deer
19 there are. I would like to know how much
20 public monies our mayor and the board of
21 trustees have spent on the deer remediation
22 issue.
23 Why are the mayor and the board of
24 trustees not concerned about the village's
17
1 infrastructure, such as sidewalks for all
2 neighborhoods, so that adults and school
3 children can walk safely and not have to
4 walk on our roadways? But I guess that we
5 would take money away from their wanting to
6 kill a living creature who does them no
7 harm.
8 Why is the mayor and the board of
9 trustees more concerned about maintaining
10 divisiveness within the village than
11 creating a harmonious place to live? How
12 long a time frame does the board of
13 trustees allow to commit public funds.
14 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds.
Page 14
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
15 GUY TABACCHI: Are they allowed
16 to commit future administrations to this
17 expense and tax burden?
18 Thank you.
19 NANCY GREEN: I'm Nancy Green, and I
20 am a Cayuga Heights resident. I am not Joe
21 Romano, but I'm reading this statement for
22 him, because, unfortunately, he and his
23 wife are out of the country. I'm reading
24 this on behalf of Joe Romano, who can't be
18
1 here this evening.
2 I'm overwhelmed by the latest turn
3 thus farce has taken. Up until now, I have
4 held back from talking about the inhumane
5 aspects of form of deer killing process --
6 plan, I have focused instead on the dangers
7 of firing guns in our small community. But
8 this current plan is so ghastly, I have
9 even refrained from telling my 13-year-old
10 daughter about it, because of the effect I
11 know it would have on her. Net and bolt is
12 a horrifyingly methodology, condemned the
13 world round and is illegal in our state.
14 Why is Mayor Supron so focused on
15 this deer killing issue? Why will the
16 board work for years to protect the few
17 hostas, coming out with such outlandish
18 plans that media has made our small, and
19 normally wise community, into a laughing
Page 15
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
20 stock and media circus? Anyway, I'd much
21 prefer that our roads be fixed, that our
22 school children be made more safe going to
23 and from school and that our water supply
24 be brought up to modern standards than
19
1 waste any more time on these dangerous and
2 shockingly inhumane plans, made by a
3 handful of people behind closed doors.
4 A community is made up of intelligent
5 people, who care about one another. If we
6 were brought together in a forum where we
7 could really talk amongst ourselves in
8 small groups, instead of being given a few
9 seconds to spot our position, we could hear
10 each other and solve this problem. Put
11 this issue into the hands of the community
12 where it belongs. Thank you.
13 JUDY LEVIET: Hi, everybody, I'm Judy
14 Leviet. I've lived in the village since
15 the year 2000. I want to say, first of
16 all, where there's divisiveness, there is
17 democracy. And I think there's a place for
18 all points of view, and I don't think that
19 we should exaggerate the idea of pitting
20 neighbor against neighbor.
21 We have different ideas about what
22 should happen, and we all have the right to
23 express those ideas. I think there's been
24 ample opportunity for people to get
Page 16
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
20
1 together to talk about these things. There
2 have been countless hearings, I've been to
3 four of them myself. I think the process
4 has been extraordinary.
5 I just want to say that there -- we,
6 as human beings, have -- have the
7 responsibility to be stewards of this land.
8 The deer cannot be stewards of this land.
9 There is overpopulation in the country of
10 deer, and many, many communities are
11 wrestling with these very issues.
12 Just -- I have a lot of wooded area
13 on my property. When I first moved here, I
14 could barely walk through the woods because
15 of the understory and the underbrush. Now,
16 it is gone, and the little animals that
17 that supports are gone, as well. The
18 little saplings that will take the place of
19 the major big trees that will die of old
20 age, trees do that, will be gone, and the
21 damage to the landscape will be
22 extraordinary.
23 In this time of fiscal
24 responsibility, there are people starving,
21
1 who would be happy to have the venison.
2 And I like -- I love animals. I did not
3 like the idea that there were three dogs
Page 17
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
4 this summer who were attacked by deer
5 during the fawning season in their own
6 backyards. I think the behavior of the
7 deer is changing, because there is an
8 overpopulation, and I think we have to be
9 responsible for that, and I applaud the
10 efforts of the committee, who have given
11 countless hours and energy to this process.
12 Thank you.
13 MARY MILLS: The next four people,
14 please: Linda Bors, Ronald Bors, Joan
15 Mangione and Rick Falck.
16 LINDA BORS: I'm going to make this
17 very quick, short. I agree with the last
18 speaker, almost everything she said, I
19 totally agree. In a way, I feel like I
20 want to speak for the deer, but in a
21 different fashion.
22 On our street, in our own backyard,
23 we had a deer that was hit in traffic and
24 died miserably out in our backyard. We
22
1 didn't know about it until the next day and
2 we had to call for somebody to help take it
3 away. That is a terrible way, as is
4 starving to death in the winter, because
5 there isn't enough to eat. So when you're
6 talking about loving deer, I think we all
7 love the deer in a certain way. But I do
8 not believe that most of us want to see
Page 18
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
9 them get hurt the way they're being hurt;
10 forced into the road, if there are too many
11 fences, fenced-in yards, and on our
12 particular street we have, you know, we
13 have so many deer, a dozen or so moving
14 through all day long that if -- if
15 something isn't done, it's going to be a
16 really bad winter for all of us on Texas
17 Lane.
18 So I just want to say, please keep
19 going forward with the original plan of
20 sterilization and culling; and I do want to
21 thank you all for your perseverance and
22 dedication.
23 RONALD BORS: My name is Ronald Bors,
24 and I have lived at 121 Texas Lane in the
23
1 village for 35 years. I have been greatly
2 concerned about the current economic
3 downturn in our economy, and particularly
4 about the high unemployment rate.
5 However, when I opened my mailbox a
6 few days ago, I found an eight-page
7 newsletter dealing with the subject of
8 tonight's meeting. So you can imagine my
9 relief, when I realized that those paid
10 political activists are still on the
11 payroll of a certain wealthy Cayuga Heights
12 family.
13 When I moved to the village, we did
Page 19
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
14 not have a deer problem. My family had a
15 wonderful vegetable garden, and we were
16 able to feed our children with many
17 varieties and nutritious, homegrown foods.
18 As the deer herd slowly increased, we found
19 ourselves sharing our vegetable garden. As
20 the deer herd grew to an unmanageable
21 level, we sadly had to abandon our
22 vegetable garden.
23 I would like to commend the current
24 members of the board of trustees for
24
1 continuing to pursue a rational course of
2 action with our gross overpopulation of
3 deer. You know from the past two village
4 elections, and from all of the public
5 meetings that a substantial majority of
6 villagers are in agreement with this
7 proposed action.
8 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
9 RONALD BORS: Please pull firm in
10 your resolve to bring the deer herd back to
11 a reasonable size.
12 JOAN MANGIONE: My name is Joan
13 Mangione, and I've been a village resident
14 for the last seven years, as well as many
15 years during the 1980's.
16 In the last six months, my dog was
17 attacked by deer, chased up to our deck,
18 where my husband and I were finally able to
Page 20
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
19 get the deer to stop the attack. My dog
20 was also found to have contracted giardia,
21 a one-cell parasite carried by deer. My
22 physician put my husband and me on
23 antibiotics to treat us for exposure, as
24 well.
25
1 My yard is completely littered with
2 deer feces. I have a compromised immune
3 system, due to cancer treatment. I want,
4 and I expect, my village government to
5 protect me, my family, my pets, and my
6 property. Let's be honest, if this
7 situation had been dealt with through all
8 the years, our community wouldn't be forced
9 to take such drastic measures, the same
10 arguments made by some of the same people
11 and funded by the same source are robbing
12 us of our rights to use our property in
13 peace.
14 I predict that by January and
15 February, the huge herd that's been allowed
16 to breed here will be starving. I watch
17 these animals suffer on a daily basis.
18 They struggle to survive. They eat plants
19 not in their normal diet and they've raided
20 bird feeders, and --
21 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds --
22 JOAN MANGIONE: -- this is during the
23 growing season.
Page 21
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
24 What are they supposed to do now?
26
1 They didn't cause this imbalance, we did,
2 by our inaction. Keeping our environment
3 bio-diverse and healthy for all residents
4 is our responsibility as stewards of this
5 planet and public safety for all is the
6 primary responsibility for government, and
7 ours have failed us up to this point. I
8 commend the board for tackling this
9 difficult problem, and I urge them to vote
10 to control the deer.
11 RICK FALCK: My name is Rick Falck.
12 My wife, Nikki, and I have lived here for
13 25 years, 20 years or so on the parkway,
14 now we live on Highland Road. Our kids
15 went to this school, and I'm also concerned
16 about disease, specifically Lyme disease.
17 My daughter contracted Lyme disease, my
18 daughter, Olivia, who was here in Cayuga
19 Heights, and she'll never be the same.
20 And I, you know, I live two
21 houses away, so I can see 8, 10, 12 deer
22 right here in the play yard. In the
23 summertime, you come out here, there are
24 deer all over the school yard, as they are
27
1 in the village, you've heard about the
Page 22
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
2 other areas. My daughter won't be the
3 same; her eyesight, her compromised immune
4 system. You know, it's an epidemic in
5 Connecticut, you don't have to go far to
6 find Lyme disease.
7 We just have this distorted
8 population of deer. You can't -- you know,
9 it's sad. I'm not a hunter, I don't mind
10 hunting. I eat meat, I know where it comes
11 from, I've been in the ranching business, I
12 know where the meat protein comes from.
13 And you know, there's different ways to
14 deal with -- with this situation, but to
15 just let it go on, I think the last speaker
16 was absolute correct, it's irresponsible.
17 And I guess to close, you know, to
18 characterize people like me -- I'm all for
19 controlling this distorted population.
20 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds.
21 RICK FALCK: To compare and to say
22 that I am a slaughterer, I just find it
23 reactionary and just so offensive to take
24 this position.
28
1 I'm just trying to -- I live here, I
2 would like to see a much more balanced
3 population. I had a wonderful garden that
4 was decimated, but, you know, that wasn't a
5 problem for me. It's the automobiles, the
6 deer, the health issue with them and with
Page 23
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
7 us.
8 So, you know, a lot of pieces --
9 tough choices aren't easy, I have to make a
10 lot of them. Let's just make the choices
11 that are sensible.
12 MARY MILLS: The next four people,
13 please: David Sahn, Jane Pederson,
14 Rosemary Parker, Joel Schell. I'm sorry,
15 Rosemarie Parker.
16 JANE PEDERSON: My name is Jane
17 Pederson, and I live on Cayuga Heights
18 Road. I first came to the area in Cayuga
19 Heights 40 years ago and have been in and
20 out of it since then and now in for quite a
21 few years.
22 The introduction and normalization
23 that systematize the mass slaughter, I'm
24 sorry, but it is technically slaughter or
29
1 killing, whatever you wish to call it, is
2 likely to produce a manifestly negative
3 change in the character of any community.
4 In this case, it also raises a question
5 about a community structure of government.
6 It is well known that a portion of the
7 community find the proposed plan both
8 morally objectionable and extremely
9 upsetting, but officials elected without
10 anything resembling a mandate to kill are
11 choosing to go forward in spite of visible
Page 24
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
12 and vocal opposition. This is a varied
13 change of the character of the community in
14 terms of its culture of government.
15 A few short years ago, the mayor and
16 the trustees did not implement a plan that
17 had blatantly divisive effects and
18 contravene the fundamental values of a
19 significant portion of the community. To
20 blow off that portion of the residents both
21 marks the failure of practical wisdom and
22 threatens to make the community a house
23 divided against itself.
24 Besides the general offenses, the
30
1 suspicion and mistrust, for many there is
2 disillusionment in the sense that there is
3 no real democratic exchange, respects of
4 the views of others and a willingness to
5 compromise an issue that are for some, very
6 basic. For instance, revisiting fence
7 questions in a more serious way than the
8 recent years, nor does there seem to be a
9 sound sense of priorities. As some others
10 have said, mentioned or referred to, this
11 is a very high cost plan, upwards of a
12 million dollars.
13 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
14 JANE PEDERSON: At a time when taxes
15 may be increasing at all levels of the
16 local government and important programs,
Page 25
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
17 which support the families and children of
18 the region of being cut, this use of tax
19 dollars seems not only non-sensible, but a
20 offensively out of touch with the current
21 economic reality. So a lack of hard data
22 and clear outcomes in this plan, it's
23 seemingly an inevitable failure. It's
24 bound to go on and on and be not
31
1 sustainable, but would have to be repeated
2 annually, as well as its exorbitant costs
3 cannot diminish suspicion and create
4 goodwill. This is especially the case when
5 there are obvious less costly and viable
6 alternatives to the plan, one of them being
7 flexibility with respect to the fencing
8 policies. Thank you.
9 ROSEMARIE PARKER: Rosemarie Parker,
10 I've been here since '97, I live on Cayuga
11 Heights Road. I'm really concerned about
12 the discussion about democracy and being --
13 being divisive and whatnot, we voted on
14 this, people, we voted twice. We voted for
15 the people, who very clearly made it a
16 mandate to do something specific about the
17 deer, including killing them. We voted.
18 Now, of course, there's a minority.
19 It's a minority that are not for this,
20 there will always be. Everybody has the
21 right to their own opinion, everybody has
Page 26
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
22 the right to protest. Yes, there will be
23 protests indefinitely, if we do this. But
24 that's not the point, we have voted on
32
1 this.
2 I don't understand why we're not
3 doing it, I think if we had done it ten
4 years ago or three years ago, we would be
5 so much better off now. I happen to like
6 deer, I happen to have a deer fence. I
7 think that fences are wonderful if you need
8 to fence off a particular area, but they do
9 not help the deer, they do not help the
10 other wildlife, they channelize them. They
11 barely get through -- a deer has a 15 foot
12 gap between everybody's fence, that's
13 nothing left for the deer either, that's
14 not appropriate.
15 I think Cayuga Heights is -- is a
16 manipulated environment, there's nothing
17 natural about it. Every single bit of
18 Cayuga Heights is affected by people, and
19 we need to decide what we want that to look
20 like. Do we want it to look like lots and
21 lots and lots of deer, not too many plants,
22 not too many other animals, not too many
23 birds, invasive plants? Do we want it to
24 have some deer? Some deer, yes. And some
33
Page 27
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
1 understory, and all of the rest of the
2 lives that that understory --
3 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
4 ROSEMARIE PARKER: -- encourages. We
5 need salamanders, we need butterflies, we
6 need some of the native plants. And I
7 thoroughly resent people classifying this
8 topic. Everybody knows that deer eat
9 hostas, we don't plant hostas. But they
10 eat my corn, my native plants, that really
11 hurts. Thank you for sticking with us.
12 JOEL SCHELL: Hello. My name is Joel
13 Schell, and I've been a resident in the
14 village for approximately 15 years. And my
15 concern with the DEIS doesn't relate to the
16 deer, but to maintaining the safety of the
17 village and to the safety of the village of
18 Cayuga Heights police department and the
19 officers of the department. It's already,
20 people -- someone has already spoken about
21 the increase in the tax rates that would
22 have to take place to fund this program at
23 a time when we don't know what the
24 financial situation of the state and -- is
34
1 going to be, the funds are going to be
2 unavailable to the police and fire
3 departments, perhaps the police and fire
4 department budgets are going to have to be
5 cut in future years if we commit to a
Page 28
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
6 long-term funding of this program.
7 Secondly, the proposed investment of
8 manpower of the Cayuga Heights police
9 department in this plan would be extensive.
10 For example, quoting from the DEIS, the DCH
11 police chief would work with the DMD and
12 the DEC to develop and oversee the culling
13 protocol and the hiring of the
14 sharpshooter. A security plan will be
15 developed by the DCHPD. Protests and
16 objections may require involvement of the
17 Cayuga Heights Village police department to
18 enforce the law and protect public safety.
19 I'm confident that the chief does not
20 have unlimited time to devote to this
21 project.
22 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds.
23 JOEL SCHELL: How much time are we
24 prepared to have siphoned off and what
35
1 duties are we prepared to have left undone
2 in order to see this project through? The
3 safety of the officers and residents of
4 Cayuga Heights is at risk. Implementation
5 of the plan outlined in the DEIS threatens
6 the safe and secure environment that we all
7 enjoy here in the Village of Cayuga
8 Heights.
9 MARY MILLS: The next four people are
10 David Sahn, Steve Shiffrin, Jim Gilmore and
Page 29
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
11 Leslie Ungburg.
12 DAVID SAHN: Good evening, thank you.
13 Thank you for accommodating my comments.
14 Since I'm a little out of breath running
15 over here, I will keep my comments brief
16 and especially since I haven't had the
17 opportunity to hear others, I apologize for
18 that.
19 So I just have come here to express
20 my strong sentiment on behalf of my family
21 and some of my close neighbors to urge the
22 village to act expeditiously and to -- to
23 cull the deer herds. I live across the
24 street from the school, and, of course, I
36
1 guess the school is an ideal stomping
2 ground for the deer. But I drive home at
3 night, regularly night after night, and I
4 must see 15, 18 deer roaming around in the
5 school yard and trying to get into my yard.
6 I don't have children in Cayuga Heights
7 school any longer, I had three children who
8 attended school here. But I do walk over
9 to the school, and I walk over and I look
10 at the deer droppings, and I look at the
11 deer droppings in my yard and my neighbor,
12 who I think has spoken to you, has spoken
13 about how Lyme disease has threatened and
14 devastated his family. I have a cousin who
15 has Lyme disease, who was equally
Page 30
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
16 devastated and has been disabled throughout
17 her life. To me, this is a public health
18 issue first and foremost.
19 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
20 DAVID SAHN: So I urge something to
21 be done. Second, it's a matter of
22 protecting my property. I have a lovely
23 home, which I cherish, take care of, and it
24 has been decimated by the deer population.
37
1 And the third and final thing I'd
2 like to say is that while the village is
3 pondering this issue, and I hope you move
4 quickly and expeditiously and forcefully to
5 kill the deer, I would at least urge you to
6 allow us to put up fences to protect our
7 property. Thank you very much.
8 STEVE SHIFFRIN: My name is Steve
9 Shiffrin. I'm in favor of sterilization of
10 the deer, but not killing the deer. I want
11 to make a preliminary point.
12 The environmental impact report says
13 that it would cost $150,000 a year over a
14 five-year period, and it is unclear as to
15 what it would cost after that. I don't
16 understand that claim. If you killed 170
17 deer and sterilized 60, which is more than
18 what the report costs, than it says, that
19 would cost, according to the EIS report's
20 figures, $150,000 actually $151,000. So
Page 31
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
21 where are the other $600,000 going to?
22 Your report does not add up.
23 About sterilization, the report says
24 that we tried sterilization, and it reduced
38
1 the herd. The report says we shifted from
2 surgery to chemical attempts, but had the
3 wrong serum. I don't understand why we
4 don't try sterilization first. The report
5 does not discuss the fact that although
6 females stay in the village, male deer are
7 transient, so the report --
8 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
9 STEVE SHIFFRIN: -- is asking for the
10 killing of transient deer, it is not clear
11 to me how much that culling or killing
12 would actually reduce the deer. It strikes
13 me that the best approach is to try
14 sterilization first, which worked before,
15 before proceeding to something that has so
16 deeply divided the village.
17 JIM GILMORE: Good evening. Thank
18 you, Mayor Kate, and all the trustees and
19 Randy for having this open democratic
20 event. I haven't been behind a mike for a
21 while. I just want to say that first of
22 all, I don't feel in my neighborhood on
23 Hanshaw Road that we're divisive, that
24 we're at odds against each other. We've
Page 32
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
39
1 been talking about this in a lively,
2 respectful manner for a long time, and I
3 think that's part of my point.
4 It's been a little bit too long. I
5 personally gave about two years of my life
6 to this issue, and I'm really glad that the
7 trustees and our current mayor are
8 continuing the resolve to do something
9 about it.
10 When I was in office, we did not have
11 the net and bolt option. If I were sitting
12 in that desk today, I probably would
13 consider that, because I do feel that it
14 may, at some level, be perceived as safer
15 for our residents, and, also, I suspect it
16 could be quite a bit less costly. But I
17 don't have any of the details, except I
18 know it's not a projectile that goes
19 hundreds of feet or, in this case, if
20 you're shooting downward, 30 or 40 feet or
21 50 to the ground.
22 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds.
23 JIM GILMORE: I am fully -- I've read
24 the draft environmental impact statement,
40
1 and I think it's well done. I commend our
2 board and our mayor for having it reviewed
3 and thoroughly summarized by the firm of
Page 33
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
4 Miller, et cetera, and I think it's right
5 on, and I do support culling, as well as
6 sterilization, but I would have to say I
7 think the net and bolt is a good idea; and
8 I also spent the summer volunteering, at
9 Loaves and Fishes they could really use the
10 protein. Thank you.
11 LESLIE UNGBURG: My name is Leslie
12 Ungburg. I live at 3 Winter Place. I'd
13 like to thank the mayor and the other
14 members of the board for the time and
15 consideration they've given to this
16 difficult problem. I've lived in the
17 Williamsburg Park neighborhood for 35
18 years, and for five years in the Town of
19 Ithaca and 30 years in the Village of
20 Cayuga Heights.
21 If there were deer on the land that
22 became our neighborhood, we rarely, if
23 ever, saw them, so in that sense, the deer
24 were not here first. As further
41
1 development has taken their woodland and
2 meadowland retreat, especially within the
3 last ten years, it has become increasingly
4 common to see deer in the neighborhood; and
5 within the last five years, be increasingly
6 impacted by their behavior. It is
7 heartbreaking that they have so little
8 natural habitat left in which to live out
Page 34
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
9 their lives and raise their young, and I
10 can understand the horror that some feel
11 with the idea that we're really killing
12 some of them.
13 But at the same time, while I do not
14 care about growing tulips or hostas, I do
15 care about the investment we made in our
16 property over the years, and I do feel
17 increasingly stressed out that a constant
18 presence of deer in our neighborhood -- I
19 find it increasingly invasive and expensive
20 to me and my family habits; and more than
21 that, for the ultimate lifestyle that the
22 deer are going to be subjected to, if
23 nothing is done about their numbers.
24 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
42
1 LESLIE UNGBURG: For every passing
2 year for the last five years, I've spent
3 more and more money on fencing and other
4 remedial things.
5 I just -- I've written a lot here, I
6 won't get to say it all. I've been in car
7 and deer collisions, I've read that a herd
8 of deer can double itself in as little as
9 two to five years, and I've seen evidence
10 of this in my own yard. If the deer keep
11 multiplying in this way, doing nothing and
12 letting nature run its course will not help
13 anyone; either humans, plants or the other
Page 35
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
14 natures that are worthy at least as of much
15 concern, as the deer or ultimately the deer
16 themselves.
17 MARY MILLS: Thank you. The next
18 four people please; Ann Druyan, Jeff Cox,
19 Derek Stewart and Lesli Sagan.
20 ANN DRUYAN: Hi, my name is Annie
21 Druyan, and I've lived at Tyler Road for 33
22 years, also known as unique natural area
23 number 102. And I heard these stories
24 about people who suffer from Lyme disease
43
1 and in various other ways because of the
2 presence of the deer. And I ask you, what
3 if you're wrong?
4 What if there is not a connection
5 between the deer and Lyme disease? I ask
6 this, because I read the environmental
7 impact statement, and I've been writing
8 about science in books and television and
9 motion pictures for 30 years. And the
10 report struck me as being very poorly done,
11 with all due respect to the gentleman, who
12 is representing Tim Miller here. It seemed
13 like a cut and paste job. And the science
14 seemed suspect, so I sent it to six experts
15 on biodiversity and deer, on Lyme disease
16 and deer and got a very interesting
17 response.
18 First of all, a number of -- one
Page 36
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
19 letter directly from the author of the book
20 on Lyme disease that has just been
21 published by Oxford University Press last
22 month, he wrote a letter addressed to the
23 Village of Cayuga Heights trustees.
24 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
44
1 ANN DRUYAN: Upon reading reports
2 that the DES contains many inaccurate and
3 un-supportive statements about
4 relationships between deer, black-legged
5 ticks, incorrectly called deer ticks, and
6 Lyme disease. Harvard School of Public
7 Health, killing deer is not the answer to
8 reducing Lyme disease, says Harvard School
9 public health scientist.
10 Biodiversity makes salamanders and
11 other creatures thrive in areas with higher
12 deer populations. I agree passionately
13 with all of the people who have spoken
14 against the cruelty of killing these deer,
15 but I ask those of you who cannot have any
16 compassion for the deer to think what if
17 you're all wrong, what if this will not
18 solve the problem that you are seeking to
19 solve? Thank you.
20 JEFF COX: Hello, my name is Jeff
21 Cox. And ten years ago, I served on the
22 Cayuga Heights Deer Committee, which
23 primarily consisted of people who wanted
Page 37
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
24 deer reduction. We met for two years every
45
1 other week and worked closely with Paul
2 Curtis from Cornell's Department of Natural
3 Resources to develop a plan sanctioned by
4 the community and privately funded by one
5 of its member. After our research was
6 finished, the survey was sent to every one
7 of the approximately 800 land owners, and
8 the response rate was high. While like
9 now, the majority of residents wanted deer
10 reduction. Only a third or less were
11 willing to kill deer. No such survey has
12 been done since then to determine whether
13 the community, as a whole, now favors
14 killing.
15 Without this information, it is
16 difficult to know that we are properly
17 represented by the proposed deer management
18 policy. It appears or might appear that
19 we're being bullied and taxed in certain
20 means of the minority view.
21 2006 was the last time the deer
22 population was studied, and the number was
23 determined to be 147. This number is close
24 to what was found by Cornell ten years ago
46
1 and indicates that the herd has not
2 actually grown; however, the issue on the
Page 38
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
3 table has not really been the number of
4 deer, the issue is whether a minority of
5 residents who perceive deer to be an
6 intolerable problem to determine the policy
7 and budget that serves their interests, and
8 not necessarily that of a whole community.
9 After the killing, many deer still in
10 this community may still be the ones who
11 visit on the gardens of the people who most
12 vehemently want them removed. Deer
13 migration must continue to fill the space
14 left by killing. Also not being considered
15 are the people who actually enjoy deer or
16 those who will tolerate them as a pesky
17 neighbor and who consider paying more taxes
18 to kill deer an exorbitant, unacceptable or
19 an immoral solution.
20 Without an objective survey, whether
21 privately or publicly funded, we will not
22 know whether our community now favors
23 killing and is willing to pay more taxes
24 for them. Clearly, the need for those who
47
1 will not tolerate the presence of deer have
2 not been adequately addressed, and that is
3 why this problem has raised its ugly head
4 again.
5 However --
6 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds --
7 JEFF COX: -- the possibly divisive
Page 39
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
8 solution, I'll say possibly, because nobody
9 is out in the streets yet, being forced on
10 our community by a minority view is likely
11 to create a greater problem for us than the
12 one caused by deer.
13 Is there not possibly a better
14 solution for this creative and affluent
15 community to come up with than netting and
16 bolting? I think Steve expressed a lot of
17 what the original deer study came up with
18 as a viable solution and the problem with
19 the serum.
20 I'm wondering if netting and bolting
21 had to -- had to have a variance in the law
22 to allow it to happen here. There's some
23 problem with the serum. They make good
24 serum in Canada, but apparently not in the
48
1 States. They keep the serum too long, and
2 it destroys some of these properties for,
3 you know, contraception. However, if we
4 could get a variance for netting and
5 bolting, which is illegal, why not
6 something that actually gets us the
7 chemicals that we need that could be
8 quickly and easily applied at much less
9 cost?
10 DEREK STEWART: Hello, my name is
11 Derek Stewart, I have lived in the Village
12 of Cayuga Heights for six years now, I live
Page 40
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
13 up right on Overland. And I just want to
14 express my support for the deer remediation
15 program that's underway. There's been a
16 lot of talk about the tax that will go into
17 funding this effort, but I would argue that
18 we all right now pay a hidden tax in our
19 village.
20 I know a number of you have had car
21 accidents with deer. You're looking at
22 over $1,000 worth of damage to your car
23 that needs to be fixed and time involved in
24 that every time, that's a tax we have right
49
1 there. That's happened to myself; and then
2 on another issue is the Lyme disease, which
3 is a concern for myself. I have two
4 children, who really like to play outside
5 of our house, but this year, we have seen
6 more ticks in the area which can carry Lyme
7 disease, and I know it's been raised, but
8 it's possible that the deer may not carry
9 them, but as a father, I have to assume
10 that that's a possibility.
11 And when I go to get them checked, my
12 daughter had one on her back just the other
13 week, and we're still waiting for the
14 results to hear back about the possible
15 Lyme disease. It's a big concern for me,
16 and one of the -- another hidden tax that
17 we're dealing with with the deer, not to
Page 41
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
18 mention anything about the gardens or the
19 effect to our property in the area.
20 I think -- as people, we really do
21 have a responsibility for managing our
22 environment. Many of us wear leather
23 shoes, many of us eat meat. And there are
24 things involved in getting those products
50
1 --
2 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds --
3 DEREK STEWART: -- that we like to
4 distance ourselves away from. Now that we
5 have the deer here, we have to deal with
6 them, and we have to deal with them in our
7 community. And I think this is the right
8 way to go, and I applaud the determination
9 of the committee. Thank you.
10 LESLI SAGAN: My name is Lesli Sagan,
11 I've lived here since 2006, and my husband,
12 David, has lived here since the early '90s.
13 We're both in favor of deer
14 remediation. There are many reasons for
15 this, and most people have gone over them
16 already, but I'd like to say that it's
17 clear that the deer are a problem. I moved
18 here from Schuyler County, I was in a rural
19 area. I never had a problem growing a
20 garden, I never had a problem growing
21 flowers, although I saw deer all the time.
22 Here, we all know, we put up fences,
Page 42
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
23 and that is our hidden tax. I just spent
24 about $46 on a roll of fencing. I do not
51
1 think it is cruel to shoot deer or to
2 slaughter them or bolt them or whatever
3 word you chose to use. We are big, I eat
4 meat, I wear leather shoes. I understand
5 that sometimes animals die. And, frankly,
6 I think that it is much less cruel to shoot
7 a deer or bolt a deer than it is to let it
8 starve to death.
9 I also think that we need to manage
10 these deer, because there are at least two
11 that go through my yard daily with broken
12 legs. I don't see how we're going to avoid
13 sometimes culling deer, because some of
14 them need to be culled. Those that are
15 walking around with broken legs certainly
16 should be culled for their own good. I
17 think that it is cruel to let a prey animal
18 breed out of control, and I think that that
19 is what's happening here.
20 And I think that it is up to us as
21 the people who are here to take care of
22 that in the safest, sanest, humanist way
23 possible, and I do think that --
24 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
52
Page 43
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
1 LESLI SAGAN: And I do believe that
2 includes killing some of these deer. Thank
3 you.
4 MARY MILLS: The next four people,
5 please: Ralph Janis, James Webster, Fair
6 Gouldin, Nancy Richards.
7 RALPH JANIS: My name is Ralph Janis,
8 I have lived at my current address in
9 Cayuga Heights for 27 years. I first moved
10 to Cayuga Heights 48 years ago, but the
11 first four years, I was in one of those
12 fraternity houses, and I was worried about
13 other issues, besides deer.
14 I want to share with you just two
15 observations, because so much has already
16 been said.
17 First of all -- well, actually, three
18 observations. One, I, too, want to applaud
19 the board of trustees for their efforts to
20 try to do something about what, I believe,
21 is a serious problem.
22 My second point is, somehow, nothing
23 is ever said about the fact that Cayuga
24 Heights is this weird, little island,
53
1 surrounded by thousands of square miles of
2 deer control projects. 120,000 deer,
3 according to the New York Times, were
4 killed in New York State last year legally.
5 Cornell University has just removed
Page 44
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
6 whatever the population of deer it had at
7 the Plantations, we all know they did that.
8 I don't understand why there's been no
9 complaint about that.
10 We seem to be living in this weird,
11 little world, where -- where only Cayuga
12 Heights is doing something strange and
13 weird and awful. I don't believe that for
14 a moment, I believe that we're being
15 victimized, because we're the only place
16 that isn't --
17 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
18 RALPH JANIS: -- actively culling
19 deer. I would like to make one
20 observation, and for those of who I don't
21 agree with completely, you've made a very
22 good point, which I wish we would consider
23 at a little bit greater length. I think
24 much of the hostility, much of the anger,
54
1 much of the divisiveness would disappear if
2 we could return to the method of
3 sterilization.
4 We do that at the SPCA every day, and
5 I don't think anybody in this room objects
6 to it. I hope we could find -- that might
7 be a solution. Thank you.
8 JAMES WEBSTER: Would the timekeeper
9 please raise her hand?
10 I have a procedural question, first,
Page 45
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
11 I hope the clock cannot tick until I'm done
12 with that. Am I correctly informed that
13 technically the subject of tonight's
14 meeting is comment on the issue of the
15 approval or not of the DEIS, is that
16 correct, as opposed to making substantive
17 suggestions about what to do?
18 MAYOR SUPRON: It's to give comments
19 on the DEIS.
20 JAMES WEBSTER: That's what I was
21 afraid of.
22 MAYOR SUPRON: As you see, people
23 will make all kinds of suggestions and
24 comments.
55
1 JAMES WEBSTER: I know. Okay, you
2 can start.
3 My name is James Webster, my wife and
4 I have lived on Iroquois Road since 1977.
5 On the one hand, there is a very serious
6 deer overpopulation in the village, and
7 indeed, the whole area, with many very
8 serious consequences to people and
9 properties, who -- all of which have been
10 mentioned today, I won't mention it again.
11 From -- and in that sense, the effort on
12 the part of, the successive board of
13 trustees and mayor to do something about
14 it, I entirely endorse and support.
15 On the other hand, it is very clearly
Page 46
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
16 a divisive issue, not only politically, but
17 morally and ethically, and I must say that
18 both the board and the successive board to
19 the DEIS, in my opinion, completely fail to
20 make a plausible case that the proposed
21 remediation of mechanism will actually
22 succeed. And again, I don't need to go
23 into detail, many people have made points
24 about that and so on.
56
1 Therefore, there's a conundrum, it
2 seems to me, politically and realistically.
3 And the only possible solution, in my view,
4 therefore, is something that somehow cuts
5 the cord in the hut and takes a different
6 approach. I don't mean to deny the
7 attractiveness of sterilization as a
8 possible -- it could be thought to work as
9 a possible compromise.
10 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
11 JAMES WEBSTER: Thank you. But who
12 knows about that, and that would also be a
13 long-term, somewhat expensive solution.
14 So my suggestion is something that
15 you will probably think is frivolous, but I
16 do not mean it as frivolous. And that
17 although you may smile about it tonight, I
18 hope you'll remember the suggestion when
19 you wake up tomorrow morning, it's quite
20 simple and would cost almost nothing.
Page 47
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
21 Repeal the leash law. Thank you very
22 much.
23 FAIR GOULDIN: My name is Fair
24 Gouldin. I've lived in Cayuga Heights
57
1 since 1996 and have had an interest in the
2 village's issue with deer since that time.
3 I have to say that my husband and I
4 have watched carefully, as the village
5 trustees have worked to -- to contend with
6 this very divisive issue. I have seen them
7 working scrupulously and astonishingly,
8 meticulously in the process of both
9 surveying the residents and in reviewing
10 possible solutions to this issue.
11 There has been great integrity and
12 irreproachable openness on the part of the
13 village deer remediation committee. I
14 think that the suggestions that they have
15 given us have been as well researched as
16 any -- anyone could ask for. I think it's
17 clear that the village's voice has been to
18 do something to control the deer
19 population.
20 It is time now to carry out the
21 democratic process, to go forward with the
22 -- with the remediation plan that the
23 trustees and the deer remediation committee
24 have called for.
Page 48
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
58
1 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
2 FAIR GOULDIN: It's time to move
3 forward with this plan that has been
4 suggested to us, which clearly the majority
5 of the village population is in favor of.
6 Thank you.
7 MARY MILLS: Nancy Richards?
8 NANCY RICHARDS: I just want to say
9 that I agree with most of the people
10 speaking here tonight, and thank you very
11 much.
12 I've had two deer, one carried away
13 this morning. A few weeks ago, my husband
14 found one probably in the garden. The
15 Cayuga Heights police were nice enough to
16 come by, lend a hand, drag it down to the
17 road. My friend said she has a deer in her
18 garden, the bone was sticking out, and she
19 doesn't know if it's still there or not.
20 It's just -- I can't fence it in. I
21 have a narrow, long high stake lot. If I
22 fence it in, more deer are on the road. So
23 I think it's a problem, and I appreciate
24 the people working on this resolution.
59
1 MARY MILLS: Thank you. The next
2 four people: Susan Barnett, Vera
3 McLafferty, Paul Ginford and Hazel
4 Brampton.
Page 49
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
5 SUSAN BARNETT: Hi, I've lived here
6 on Triphammer Road for about 17 years.
7 And I'd like to encourage the
8 trustees to stick to their plans to reduce
9 the deer population in the village to a
10 more natural level. This has been
11 thoroughly researched by both the village
12 and the outside consultants, and the
13 conclusion is clear that it would be better
14 for the health and safety of village
15 residents and our neighbors and better for
16 the ecosystem as a whole. Lyme disease and
17 deer/car collisions are dangerous, that is
18 clear.
19 It is also clear that having this
20 many deer is bad for the ecosystem, both
21 plant life and other animals, as the
22 Autobahn Society and other environmental
23 organizations have stated. Deer are hunted
24 down the road at Cornell, and up the road
60
1 in Lansing and all over the place. This is
2 nothing new or different.
3 I, therefore, ask the trustees to
4 stick to their plan and to not be
5 intimidated by the bullying tactics of the
6 richly-funded activists who are so
7 aggressively pushing their narrow-minded
8 agenda here.
9 I know it must be very tough to be
Page 50
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
10 brave and do what we were
11 democratically-elected to do under these
12 circumstances when they misrepresent what
13 you're doing and why you are doing it, both
14 in print and online, but, please, do it.
15 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
16 SUSAN BARNETT: And please show us
17 that the democratically-elected government
18 is still in charge here, not those with the
19 most money or the loudest voices. I know
20 that there are many countries in the world
21 where that is not the case, and where those
22 with the most money always get their way,
23 but I hope that is not the case here.
24 Thank you.
61
1 VERA MCLAFFERTY: I just wanted to
2 express our concerns as a family, as Cayuga
3 Heights residents, with two points; that we
4 do believe that the deer overpopulation is
5 an issue and does affect our daily lives.
6 We live on Cayuga Heights Road, I'm a
7 mother of three young children. And while
8 the deer are very cute, it doesn't mean
9 they're not a danger.
10 I'm not a hunter, I do not typically
11 advocate guns. At the same time, Bambi has
12 ticks, and Bambi has antlers. There's
13 typically about seven, ten or more on our
14 front lawn every evening. I drive by a
Page 51
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
15 dead deer on the side of the road probably
16 three times a week. I'm a safe driver in a
17 minivan, and on the way to evening sports
18 or music practices with my kids, I
19 encounter a deer in the road at least three
20 or four times a week, if not, more. We've
21 actually kept track.
22 It's only a matter of time before
23 there's another serious car accident,
24 regardless who that driver is. We moved to
62
1 Cayuga Heights about three years ago from a
2 large property in Trumansburg. There were
3 deer, but we were able to co-exist, because
4 the property was large, there was an
5 abundance of food for them, and you could
6 hear the coyotes at night. I think in the
7 nine years we were there, I found maybe two
8 or three ticks on our Labrador retriever.
9 When we moved to Cayuga Heights, we
10 started picking them off of our dog on a
11 daily basis. This summer, my children and
12 I watched our dog die a slow and awful
13 death from Lyme disease, as her organs
14 failed one by one. We now have been driven
15 to using toxic tick control on our other
16 dog, getting her vaccinations we don't know
17 are even effective.
18 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
19 VERA MCLAFFERTY: We use it more
Page 52
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
20 often, because the ticks on her are so
21 prevalent.
22 I don't know when people will agree
23 that they are starting to be toxic, when
24 there's 20 in our yard every night or 40 or
63
1 60, but I'm insulted at the insinuation
2 that this is about tulips.
3 They do restrict our activities, my
4 son is afraid to play basketball in the
5 driveway because of the bucks that are out
6 there every day and the poop all over the
7 grass and the kids stay inside more often
8 than not because of that particular reason.
9 I wish there was a less expensive
10 way, but I do support the remediation
11 solution and voice my disdain for the
12 propaganda and fearful messages that come
13 from cayugadeer.org to our house on a
14 regular basis.
15 PAUL GINFORD: I have the feeling
16 we're just running in place, the problems
17 are getting worse. Among what I've seen
18 recently is the property across from me has
19 been, increasing numbers of the properties
20 have been -- it exposes the absolute lunacy
21 of the people who think that fences are a
22 solution to everything.
23 Obviously, as we know as scientists,
24 that there's a conservation law; the same
Page 53
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
64
1 number of deer, smaller amounts of space,
2 higher density that make the problems worse
3 and everybody seems devastated. We also
4 see the results. These fences are not
5 coming down. It's a long-term impact on
6 our neighborhood, the way it looks. It
7 exposes the willful negligence of the
8 people that preceded you as -- as trustees
9 on this deer remediation committee. And I
10 very much wish that people express that
11 they had done their job before.
12 I'm very tired of being held hostage.
13 What are we talking about here? A couple
14 hundred deer, that's it. I'm tired of
15 being held hostage to a couple hundred
16 deer. I'm tired of being held hostage to
17 few, a handful of non-resident invaders.
18 And was mentioned by two people preceding
19 me, they've been doing this in Lansing for
20 years. What do you have against Cayuga
21 Heights, why don't you go to Lansing and
22 protest against the killing of deer in
23 Lansing?
24 The One comment I have about the
65
1 report is there was a concern about the
2 noise from firearms. I'm not a hunter, I'm
Page 54
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
3 not in favor of using firearms, but in
4 order to make my sentiments perfectly
5 clear, I might not have been clear enough
6 so far.
7 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds.
8 PAUL GINFORD: I'd like to say that
9 every shot that I hear will be music to my
10 ears, and I will reextend the invitation I
11 made to the trustees last year.
12 Tomorrow morning, 8 o'clock, my
13 property, there will be 20 deer there.
14 Bring your guns, you can bag 20 of them.
15 I'm glad you're writing this down. Come
16 back the next day, another 20. Two weeks,
17 you'll have 280 deer. Thank you.
18 HAZEL BRAMPTON: My name is Hazel
19 Brampton, I've lived on Christopher Circle
20 since 1961. We have our own herd of deer
21 there.
22 I just want to say that as I sat in
23 the last meeting on this subject in this
24 same room, it became evident to me why
66
1 we're involved in so many endless wars in
2 this country. Many people think the way to
3 solve problems is to pick up a gun, instead
4 of using their brains and negotiating and
5 figuring out other ways to solve problems.
6 This seemingly ever larger group gets more
7 powerful every day, so we find ourselves
Page 55
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
8 with a local government, not unlike the
9 federal one, deciding to kill as leeway to
10 get things done.
11 I have attended several meetings on
12 this subject at the town hall, and I've
13 never heard the board discuss alternatives
14 to killing. That really -- they seem to be
15 obsessed by using guns to solve this
16 problem. It surprises me that the most
17 privileged group of people in this area
18 could be planning to kill local wildlife in
19 an illegal and most painful way.
20 Where are the educators --
21 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds --
22 HAZEL BRAMPTON: -- and those who
23 care for the wild things in the village?
24 What has happened to the knowledge that
67
1 fences keep out unwanted animals from yards
2 and gardens? Are fences too much work, too
3 ugly, too insulting to our neighbors? The
4 bottom line is that they work and, in my
5 experience, send animals elsewhere looking
6 for food.
7 MARY MILLS: Thank you. The next
8 four people, please: Brian Eden, Tamas
9 Bloomfield, Kora von Wittelsbach and Gail
10 Warhaff.
11 BRIAN EDEN: I'm Brian Eden, 147
12 North Sunset. I'm here to focus on the
Page 56
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
13 values of biodiversity in our community,
14 not much mentioned here yet.
15 I have observed the deterioration of
16 forest structure and composition and the
17 failure to regenerate some species of
18 trees. Unfortunately, we have had no
19 coherent biodiversity policy in the
20 village. This has led to whitetail deer
21 becoming a very dominant species in the
22 local ecosystem. Some want to maintain
23 this dominance by privileging deer over all
24 other floral and faunal species.
68
1 Unfortunately, these lesser
2 appreciated living plants and animals lack
3 the human support network provided for the
4 past 50 years by the Disney corporation for
5 deer. We all should be stewards of our
6 natural environment in our neighborhoods.
7 We will not be intimidated by those who
8 refuse to recognize the values of living
9 things other than deer.
10 In other words, I'm not willing to
11 see the moral high ground on this issue. I
12 support the value of maintaining
13 biodiversity in the Village of Cayuga
14 Heights.
15 TAMAS BLOOMFIELD: Hi, I'm Tamas
16 Bloomfield. I've been a Cayuga Heights
17 resident for the last 12 years.
Page 57
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
18 I'm glad that the speaker before me
19 mentioned biodiversity. My soon-to-be
20 daughter-in-law just got her Master's in
21 Forestry from Yale, and she has educated me
22 on how much of a menace deer and deer
23 overpopulation are to healthy forests and
24 biodiversity at large. The problem is is
69
1 that -- just -- I think that we're a little
2 bit susceptible to the allusion that when
3 we see deer traipsing through our yards,
4 oh, we're at one with nature, we live in
5 this very natural setting, and that's not
6 really the case. Without a lot of bears,
7 without a lot of wolves keeping the deer
8 population in check, things get out of
9 whack.
10 And this is really what is happening,
11 and there are going to be substantially
12 more bird population and other little
13 critters. Now, we don't worry about
14 keeping squirrels in balance, because there
15 are hawks and there are other predators
16 that keep other animals in balance. But
17 there's nothing doing that for deer, and
18 the idea that fences can solve all these
19 problems really just doesn't work.
20 My particular yard, also, is not at
21 all suited to having a fence. It's just --
22 the layout of the land, it's just --
Page 58
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
23 there's no way to fence in your foundation
24 planting then when you have a U-shape. And
70
1 the deer come up three feet from our front
2 door and eat the plants that they told me
3 at Garden Center, deer really, really,
4 really don't like these. They didn't used
5 to eat these ten years ago, but now they
6 are so hungry.
7 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
8 TOMAS BLOOMFIELD: There's so many of
9 them.
10 Also, a year and a half, I spoke at
11 one of these meetings and the next day, I
12 had a brick through my window. So I would
13 like to think that that was just random,
14 but we've never, ever, ever, ever, ever had
15 such a problem on any other occasion and
16 our kids are already off at college, so
17 it's hard to imagine that it was any other
18 reason. Thank you.
19 KORA VON WITTELSBACH: Hello, I'm
20 Kora von Wittelsbach, and I'm a resident of
21 the village and a long-term resident.
22 I would like to say that I did not
23 move to Ithaca, Texas, but to Ithaca, New
24 York, and one of the reasons I like living
71
1 here is the wildlife. And I don't have
Page 59
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
2 children, but if I did, I would love them
3 to see deer in our backyard. I consider --
4 frankly, I consider wasting money on deer
5 culling, true serious mismanagement of my
6 tax dollars. And I also think this is a
7 diversionary issue. If we're so concerned
8 about our health and our ethics, let's walk
9 to work more. Apparently, 75 percent of
10 Ithaca -- Cayuga Heights residents commute
11 to Cornell in their cars. I couldn't
12 believe it when I saw the statistics.
13 We're so concerned about the ethics.
14 I look at my mirror every morning and look
15 at all of you and all of us. First of all,
16 these creature come way, way above, in my
17 book. And I think the real problem for me
18 right now, as a woman, I'm too young -- too
19 old to be fondled, but I'm not too old to
20 be mugged.
21 And I'm seriously concerned about the
22 mugging, recent muggings in the limitrophe
23 areas of Cayuga Heights, and I would like
24 my money to be spent on the abrasion of the
72
1 Ithaca police and Cornell University police
2 in controlling this, so I can walk from my
3 Cornell office to my Cayuga Heights house
4 without feeling threatened and be worried
5 that my face will be smashed because of my
6 money.
Page 60
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
7 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
8 KORA VON WITTELSBACH: So as somebody
9 said at Cornell, well, the curse is on the
10 land, and I do not wish to be part of this
11 land. If you're concerned about your
12 mother-in-law being eaten in the yard by
13 the deer, there are parts of the world
14 where wild animals live.
15 Go and spend a sabbatical there, you
16 will have a different perspective of your
17 tulips and your bad deer.
18 GAIL WARHAFF: My name is Gail
19 Warhaff, I live in Cayuga Heights, and I
20 have done so for some time. And I see a
21 number of my neighbors, who have spoken on
22 the opposite side of me on this issue that
23 I feel very strongly about.
24 I didn't come with a prepared speech,
73
1 I was not prompted or paid to come here,
2 and I really object to the remarks that are
3 being made about the wealthy lobbyists that
4 are paying people to come here. The people
5 I know here, who have spoken, have not been
6 either paid or coerced to come here.
7 One thing I would like to say is that
8 I've heard the term stewardship of the
9 earth and environmental concern voiced by
10 people ready to cull the deer herd. The
11 stewardship of the earth, which man has
Page 61
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
12 been responsible for, has been dismal and
13 we're all feeling the consequences.
14 There are serious issues about -- to
15 me, about, for example, the sort of cars
16 that are driven, the speed at which we
17 drive around Cayuga Heights. My children
18 also went to this school. I'm much more
19 worried about people driving cars up Upland
20 Road than I am about the deer. And if I
21 drive at 15 miles per hour around Cayuga
22 Heights, which is a sensible, I think,
23 speed to be driving around here, even if I
24 did have an accident with the deer, I think
74
1 the bodywork on the deer would be more
2 costly than the bodywork on my car. And as
3 far as damaged properties are concerned,
4 I'm a neighbor of a lot of these people,
5 and I have no idea what they're talking
6 about.
7 I have a -- I'm a very keen gardener,
8 I have an acre of garden and no fences. I
9 go to Agway, I find out what deer don't
10 like, and, okay, they eat the odd things I
11 don't expect them to eat. On the other
12 hand --
13 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
14 GAIL WARHAFF: I grow a lot of things
15 that deer will not eat, and it's possible
16 to be a good gardener here and share your
Page 62
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
17 garden with the deer. As far as the
18 methods used for culling the deer, I don't
19 believe that deer need culling. If we're
20 going to cull them, why not try an
21 alternative to shooting them, which is
22 problematic, as we all know, on many, many
23 levels, and why spend so much money on
24 this?
75
1 Thank you.
2 MARY MILLS: The next people, please:
3 Sally Grubb, Ellen Cohen-Rosenthal, Joe
4 Kreitinger and Mark Eisner.
5 SALLY GRUBB: Good evening, my name
6 is Sally Grubb. I've lived here about 20,
7 25 years on 104 Midway Road, just up the
8 road from here.
9 I want to applaud the trustees for
10 their efforts to move forward with a plan
11 to manage the deer. My concern is that in
12 the long term, it's not going to be
13 successful. There is one thing that could
14 be done that would help all of us in the
15 interim, and that is to take action to
16 revise the fencing ordinance.
17 I'm fully in favor of people being
18 allowed to put up deer fences on their
19 property, and I would urge anybody who is
20 similarly interested to contact me and let
21 me know, so that we can take further action
Page 63
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
22 to persuade the trustees to change their
23 minds over the fencing ordinance.
24 Thank you.
76
1 ELLEN COHEN-ROSENTHAL: My name is
2 Ellen Cohen-Rosenthal. And until two weeks
3 ago, I loved the deer. But two weeks ago,
4 my 11-pound dog was attacked by a deer in
5 my backyard. The deer -- the dog suffered
6 a broken leg, was hospitalized for a week
7 and has serious lacerations on its back.
8 At a cost of $4,000, our dog is on the
9 mend.
10 Now, my husband said, well, we don't
11 have to fix the dog, but, of course, that
12 was not an option. And I'm beginning to
13 have greater sympathy for the remediation
14 plan, although I implore the idea of the
15 notion of a government killing; however,
16 I'm with Sally with regards to thinking
17 about changing the fencing law.
18 In order to fence my yard, I would
19 have to move the -- the current ordinance
20 requires a 15-foot -- I forget the word,
21 setback, which is not cynical. And there
22 is a lot of great fencing material out
23 there that might protect my family and my
24 animals. And I have to wonder, if a dog is
77
Page 64
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
1 attacked by a deer, when will the first
2 child be attacked?
3 JOE KREITINGER: Hi, I'm Joe
4 Kreitinger. I live at 211 Hanshaw Road,
5 and I've lived in that location for almost
6 20 years.
7 I just have to say over the course of
8 20 years I've been gardening, and it really
9 has become quite intolerable with the deer
10 that are down in our yard. And just
11 recently, my wife came in with a tick on
12 her and we pulled one off of our dog. And
13 I think it's an ecological disaster. And I
14 hope you all understand the significance of
15 Lyme's disease. And my wife grew up in
16 Hudson Valley, and her father died from
17 complications of Lyme's disease. So you
18 should be aware of it, and it's a big deal.
19 And that's all, I support the
20 remediation.
21 MARK EISNER: I think I was next, but
22 I'll pass.
23 MARY MILLS: Vally Kovaur?
24 VALLY KOVAUR: Hi. I just got here,
78
1 so forgive me if I repeat what someone else
2 said. I'll be very brief.
3 I hate the idea of killing deer, and
4 I really hate the idea of killing deer with
Page 65
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
5 my car.
6 MARY MILLS: Okay, that is all of the
7 resident people that have checked in to
8 speak, is there any other resident that
9 would like to speak?
10 MAYOR SUPRON: I'm not actually
11 trying to speak. I'm asking for a few
12 minutes break.
13 (RECESS TAKEN.)
14 MARY MILLS: Okay, everybody, shall
15 we get back to business?
16 Are there any other Cayuga Heights
17 residents that have not had the opportunity
18 and would like to speak? If no, then let's
19 start with our non-residents.
20 The first four people, please:
21 Charlene Temple, Scott Teel, Gabrielle
22 Vehar and Susan Lustik.
23 CHARLENE TEMPLE: Hi, my name is
24 Charlene Temple, I live at 246 Renwick
79
1 Drive.
2 I want to thank the board for the
3 patience, these are long meetings. And
4 this has been going on for months and for
5 years to discuss this issue, and I
6 appreciate the democracy that allows us all
7 to have different points of view.
8 I'm wondering, because I've been to a
9 number of meetings, what is going to
Page 66
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
10 factually resolve all of our differences.
11 As someone said, of course, we all have
12 differences of opinion. And I'm wondering
13 if supposition has taken the place of
14 facts, I second what Jeff Cox said that
15 there was a survey done in the past where
16 the people were specifically represented by
17 the points of view that they wanted to
18 have, and I don't hear that that has
19 happened now. I hear that people have very
20 livid anecdotes that support their point of
21 view, and I don't know if they are the
22 minority or the majority of the village
23 residents, but I would really like to see a
24 non-killing resolution come to.
80
1 I'm sorry to see that deer have now
2 become predators. I enjoy them in my yard.
3 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
4 CHARLENE TEMPLE: I have not had any
5 complaints about them. And where I came
6 from -- from Boston, when I moved here in
7 1970, I never saw one deer. And I consider
8 it a part of the culture of Ithaca that
9 besides the culture that we get from the
10 universities and the people living here, we
11 get wildlife and beautiful geography.
12 And I'm grateful for that, so thank
13 you.
14 SCOTT TEEL: Hello, my name is Scott
Page 67
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
15 Teel, I lived in Cayuga Heights until a
16 couple of months ago. The reason I don't
17 oppose it in Lansing is because I lived in
18 Cayuga Heights until a couple of months
19 ago, that's where I lived.
20 Cayuga Heights I always considered a
21 part of Ithaca as a whole, as well, when I
22 lived here. I live downtown now.
23 Something that -- you know, a couple of
24 people have mentioned, you know,
81
1 sterilization and stuff, something that
2 doesn't seem to be talked about here yet is
3 that there's kind of two different sides
4 here.
5 One of them says we don't want the
6 deer anymore, and we should kill them, and
7 the other side says well, if you think
8 there's too many deer, we're willing to
9 respect what you believe, but we just don't
10 want to do it this way, let's try something
11 else. And one side is willing to
12 compromise, we're willing to meet you
13 halfway to, you know, reduce the number of
14 deer, whether we believe it or not.
15 There are people saying that
16 sterilization doesn't work, well, I have an
17 article from the Suffolk County News, Fire
18 Island, New York a dart program. Everyone
19 from the state parks and the Humane Society
Page 68
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
20 said it was a great program and it works
21 fantastic. We can't say that we tried it
22 here, although I believe that some people
23 have, because the vaccine was faulty,
24 that's not really trying it. You might as
82
1 well use water.
2 You know, what -- when it comes down
3 to being called narrow-minded outsiders,
4 for one thing, I lived here, again, until a
5 couple of months ago, so I've been doing
6 this for a while now. But narrow-minded
7 and misinformation and outsiders and stuff
8 like that, I'm willing to compromise with
9 you. We're willing to say, okay, you don't
10 like this number of deer, let's reduce it.
11 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
12 SCOTT TEEL: We'll do that for you,
13 but you won't compromise with us, you won't
14 come halfway to us. You will not listen to
15 us, that says that you believe you are
16 right and everyone else that doesn't agree
17 with you is wrong, and you're not willing
18 to budge on it. And that shows a lack of
19 respect that is ridiculous, as far as I'm
20 concerned.
21 I've asked now six times -- this will
22 be the sixth time that I'm asking for a
23 debate, a public debate with me, a polite
24 conversation back and forth. I have some
Page 69
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
83
1 legitimate, honest concerns and questions,
2 and I'd like some answers. You won't
3 answer me here. I'm asking you again now,
4 have a debate with me, do it right here in
5 front of people. I'm not going to be rude,
6 I've always been very nice to you. I've
7 been very polite.
8 MARY MILLS: Thank you, Scott.
9 SCOTT TEEL: Debate me. Oh, if you
10 need tick control, by the way, there's a
11 great product called cedarside.com, it's
12 all natural.
13 GABRIELLE VEHAR: My name is
14 Gabrielle Vehar, and I live in Ithaca,
15 where I moved from Amherst, New York, a
16 town very much like Cayuga Heights, and
17 where I saw the damage that the deer issue
18 brought upon the environment.
19 Amherst started a bait and chew
20 program, because they were concerned with
21 the number of deer/vehicle collisions and
22 not so much their gardens. But the effect
23 was the same kind, and it involved both
24 Amherst council members and households
84
1 alike spewing the literal hatred at each
2 other. And it already has started to
3 happen here, it will end up in an uncivil
Page 70
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
4 war of neighbor versus neighbor if we allow
5 this to happen not just the deer, but our
6 entire community. And it will be an
7 attack, whether the decision is for bait
8 and chew or net and bolt, it will affect
9 the environment in a way that a couple more
10 feet of fencing for a garden could never
11 do.
12 In Amherst, a deer sharpshooter shot
13 out the windows of a residential home while
14 his young boy and his father sat just down
15 below. Amherst is not as densely populated
16 as Cayuga Heights, we have many more
17 undeveloped areas and yet still the bullet
18 went astray. Cayuga Heights has declared
19 that they would use frangible bullets,
20 which explode upon contact, whether in a
21 deer, a window, a pet or in your child. Is
22 this the way we want to live?
23 Do we want our children to grow up
24 seeing the world as a completely hostile
85
1 environment, where a rifle or an explosive
2 net and bolt gun may go off at any time or
3 where a dead and bloody carcass may be
4 viewed out the window.
5 Our community is supposedly a
6 peaceful, educated one, and so is Amherst.
7 And yet as of last year, the number of
8 deer/vehicle collisions in Amherst was
Page 71
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
9 reported to be increasing, despite years of
10 bait and chew, with more than a 1,000 deer
11 killed, vast sums of money spent and a near
12 bunches of tragic accidents, not to mention
13 a bitterly-divided community, and it has
14 still failed to develop a successful
15 strategy for dealing with the deer, because
16 it has still failed to implement
17 cost-effective, non-lethal methods with a
18 proven track record.
19 Is this the environment we want in
20 Cayuga Heights's future? I sincerely hope
21 not.
22 SUSAN LUSTICK: My name is Susan
23 Lustick. I've been a real estate agent and
24 actively involved in Cayuga Heights, and I
86
1 live in the Village of Lansing.
2 And I just wanted to mention having
3 been a real agent for so long and showing
4 so many houses, I want you to know, don't
5 worry your property values with the deer,
6 because often I show the house, the family
7 looks outside and say oh, honey, look,
8 there's a family of deer in the backyard,
9 and that sells the house. Let me tell you,
10 that sells the house, and then I go, well,
11 wait until you find out.
12 But anyway, the reason I came tonight
13 because I heard about the netting and
Page 72
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
14 bolting, it disgusted me. I don't know a
15 whole lot about what's happened in the
16 Village of Cayuga Heights, I haven't read
17 all the documents I was supposed to have
18 read to come to this meeting. All I can
19 tell you is from my heart, that netting and
20 bolting sounds cruel and inhumane. We have
21 a zillion deer that live where we are.
22 They have relationships, they experience
23 fear, and to me, this looks like the
24 ultimate fear.
87
1 You group together a bunch of deer,
2 you throw over a net, some die, some don't,
3 but in the process, there's tremendous
4 fear. If you need to do something about
5 this problem, I beg you that you do it in
6 the most humane, deermane, whatever word is
7 appropriate way. I like the sterilization
8 technique, I like the dogs off the leash --
9 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
10 SUSAN LUSTICK: And I just ask you to
11 take that into consideration. Thank you.
12 MARY MILLS: The next four people,
13 please: Lowell Garner, James LaVeck, Neil
14 Golder and Levi Vetez.
15 LOWELL GARNER: Everybody hear me?
16 I'm Lowell Garner, I'm a Village of
17 Lansing resident for 26 years.
18 I am not funded by anybody in this
Page 73
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
19 room, and I'm heartbroken over Ellen
20 Cohen-Rosenthal's dog that was injured by a
21 deer, and I want to thank you for letting
22 me speak tonight.
23 The past three years, I've watched
24 silently and with progressively more
88
1 outrage at each deliberation of the deer
2 remediation advisory committee on the
3 Cayuga Heights board. But now because of
4 the disclosure of the latest proposal and
5 intent, netting and bolting, presented in
6 the environmental impact statement, I am
7 compelled to speak out. There is not
8 adequate time for me to speak in depth
9 about the science here, so I will keep my
10 remarks specifically to the method of
11 slaughter proposed and in the EIS, as well.
12 The net and bolt technique outside of a
13 slaughterhouse lacks ways to minimize fear
14 of the condemned animals, two, lacks
15 effective and predictable restraint and,
16 three, lacks quick and accurate killing
17 that minimizes pain, making the slaughter
18 of these netted deer even more odious.
19 To expand about the fear, there is
20 mainstream neuropharmacology supporting the
21 assertion that fear and stress, and not
22 pain, are the most inhumane of all stimuli
23 we can inflict upon an animal. Even those
Page 74
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
24 who aren't limiting -- by eliminating deer,
89
1 speak out about the increased stress the
2 animals experience with the net and bolt
3 technique.
4 Netted deer will agonize from the
5 most severe form of fear, I can't emphasize
6 this enough. From the time the deer are
7 netted until they are killed, these animals
8 will suffer. In terms of effect --
9 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
10 LOWELL GARNER: I will talk about the
11 EIS. I compared the EIS for Cayuga Heights
12 to a 2009 National Park Study EIS, which
13 had similar conditions for implementation.
14 The NPS EIS had rigorous outcome
15 indicators and at reassessment time
16 intervals that the Cayuga Heights plan
17 lacks, wishful words describing outcomes in
18 the Cayuga Heights' EIS, like potentially
19 and expected, are at the very least, in a
20 point to this community's intelligence.
21 JAMES LAVECK: I've been elected to
22 represent all the outsiders and invaders
23 that are present in our community, and I'm
24 going to speak to the outsiders and
90
1 invaders from Collegetown, the Town of
Page 75
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
2 Ithaca and the City of Ithaca, passed down
3 from Collegetown.
4 Much is made of this division in our
5 community and how separate Cayuga Heights
6 is and how people from other parts of the
7 community have no say and are interfering,
8 and much has also been said about the topic
9 of deer feces. How are these things
10 connected?
11 In the DEIS, it said that deer feces
12 are deposited daily in the local water
13 shed, and essentially, the implication is
14 made that killing all of these deer is
15 going to save our water from pollution.
16 But I'd like to ask if everyone here,
17 how many people in our network of friends
18 and family have suffered from cancer? What
19 causes cancer? Have you ever heard of
20 textavalientchromium? Textavalientchromium
21 was found in the three million gallons of
22 water that Cayuga Heights took the money to
23 process through their sewage treatment
24 plant, which was never designed to process
91
1 industrial waste, into Cayuga Lake. When
2 environmental attorney, Helen Kowachi, came
3 and brought this to the attention of the
4 trustees, they did not follow up -- a
5 freedom of information request showed that
6 they did not investigate what she said, and
Page 76
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
7 they also rescinded -- after she spoke,
8 they later rescinded, a headworks analysis
9 that they had scheduled that would have
10 shown that the water that went through the
11 sewage treatment plant did not have the
12 heavy metals removed.
13 So I ask you, is our heavy metals
14 deposited in the source of drinking people
15 for thousands of people, is that less
16 important -- does that not due any public
17 discussion? Instead, we're going to have a
18 protracted debate on the horrors of deer
19 feces.
20 You know, that's my question, as an
21 invader and outsider from Collegetown who
22 has lived in this town here for 25 years
23 and got my first job in Cayuga Heights.
24 Thank you very much.
92
1 NEIL GOLDER: So much has been said
2 and will be said, and I don't know that I
3 can really add very much.
4 I'm in favor of a non-lethal, humane
5 technique to reduce the deer population.
6 My name is Neil Golder, and I also live in
7 Collegetown. And I'm just going to read a
8 poem.
9 I've seen their hoof prints in the
10 deep needles and knew that they ended the
11 long night under the pines, walking like
Page 77
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
12 two mute and beautiful women toward the
13 deeper woods.
14 So I got up in the dark and went
15 there. They came slowly down the hill and
16 looked at me, sitting under the blue trees.
17 Shyly they stepped closer, and stared from
18 under their thick lashes, and even nibbled
19 some damp tassels of weeds.
20 This is not a poem about a dream,
21 though it could be, this is a poem about
22 the world that is ours or could be.
23 Finally, one of them, I swear it,
24 would have come to my arms, but the other
93
1 stamped sharp hoof in the pine needles,
2 like the tap of sanity, and they went off
3 together through the trees. When I woke, I
4 was alone. I was thinking, so this is how
5 you swim inward, so this is how you flow
6 outward, so this is how you pray.
7 This not a poem I wrote, it's by Mary
8 Oliver. Thank you.
9 MARY MILLS: The next four people --
10 Lee Vetez, V-E-T-E-Z?
11 The next four people: Ann Serling,
12 Gayle Gray, Jenny Stein, Eric Huang.
13 Go ahead.
14 ANN SERLING: My name is Ann Serling,
15 I live on Cedar Lane. I've attended
16 several of these meetings, and each time, I
Page 78
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
17 leave a little more disheartened. I can
18 only describe the initial proposal to bait
19 and shoot deer in the Village of Cayuga
20 Heights a sheer insanity.
21 I shudder to think of the
22 consequences that such an act would inflict
23 on my neighbors and their children. I
24 think, too, of the legal ramifications that
94
1 such an action could incur, if, God forbid,
2 a child or someone else were accidently
3 killed.
4 Now, you come forward with this next
5 proposal, this egregious plan to net and
6 bolt these creatures. I had to look away
7 from the video of this, and I wonder how
8 any of you could even stop for one moment
9 to consider such an atrocious act.
10 Mayor Supron had said, in a recent
11 newspaper article, that 75 percent of the
12 village supported killing the deer. Please
13 tell us where that statistic came from,
14 because I have talked to people in Cayuga
15 Heights. Not one, I repeat, not one has
16 ever been questioned as to their feelings
17 about these proposals.
18 Those in favor of killing the deer
19 have said that they are violate. For the
20 past 25 years, I have run on Cayuga Heights
21 Road almost every morning. In those 30,000
Page 79
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
22 plus miles, I have on several occasions
23 seen deer, and they have seen me. I have
24 never had cause to be fearful. I have
95
1 never even been approached by these
2 animals. To categorize them as aggressive
3 or violent is a misrepresentation, you're
4 looking at the wrong animal.
5 I would implore this board to make
6 the right decision, and use sterilization
7 or raise the fences. Torture of any
8 species is never the right answer.
9 JENNY STEIN: I had some prepared
10 notes. I'm Jenny Stein, and I have
11 prepared notes.
12 But I can see that -- most of the
13 people -- many of the people are still
14 here, but I think this sort of symbolizes
15 the problem. And with the break, the
16 people could be allowed to leave, and then
17 those of us, who live outside of Cayuga
18 Heights, finally get our chance to say
19 something, and it's as if we don't matter
20 or we're not part of the environment or
21 we're not part of the community culture.
22 I was born in 1964 in Ithaca, New
23 York at the Tompkins County Hospital, which
24 is now Cayuga Medical Center. And, you
96
Page 80
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
1 know, I've never ever, been treated so
2 disrespectfully by fellow citizens, and I
3 would argue that this program has already
4 given the community and the environment,
5 because it's unrecognizable from the
6 environment, that I grew up in, as a child,
7 and I would like you think of the children
8 now who, for ten years, are going to have
9 netting and bolting in our neighbor's yard.
10 The children -- not only in Cayuga
11 Heights, but the entire community, and are
12 we a community? If not, one needs to see
13 Cayuga Heights and make your own place and
14 call it Cayuga Heights, New York on your
15 letterhead or on your letters, I'm sure you
16 receive mail and address it in Ithaca, New
17 York, and please acknowledge that we have a
18 voice.
19 I see no reflection of it in the
20 entire process. I've been to almost every
21 single meeting, all but one meeting, and I
22 have not seen one recognition of the points
23 of view, the people who live one block over
24 the village line. I mean, it's incredible
97
1 and it's an egregious, egregious problem.
2 And that's why this is such a polarized
3 situation. And we also -- you know, I'm an
4 activist, dreaded word.
5 This community produced this
Page 81
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
6 activist. So if you think I'm so
7 repulsive, you know, you need to think
8 about --
9 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
10 JENNY STEIN: -- who invaded and took
11 over our community. That's how I feel, I
12 think I've lived here longer than everybody
13 but Hazel Brampton or maybe -- I don't
14 know, maybe there's a couple others.
15 So I'm like the deer, I've been here
16 a long time, and I hope you'll respect me
17 as part of your environment.
18 ERIC HUANG: My name is Eric Huang,
19 and I'm a resident of Ithaca.
20 There's been repeated mention of
21 extern for biodiversity with great
22 attention paid to songbirds and
23 wildflowers. However, biodiversity is a
24 concept that encompasses much more than a
98
1 handful of species. It addresses all
2 species in the ecosystem; animal, plant,
3 those that can sing and those that cannot.
4 I had previously brought to the
5 attention of the trustees research that
6 shows reducing deer can lead to a reduction
7 of reptiles, amphibians and vertebrates
8 and, crucial to the health of any
9 ecosystem. Yet the DEIS shows that no
10 consideration has been given to these
Page 82
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
11 species. Even if for the moment we just
12 consider birds, research has shown that
13 reducing deer can lead to the resumption in
14 ground nesting birds.
15 Other research has shown significant
16 decreases in bark origin birds, such as the
17 wood peckers. Yet another study has shown
18 decreases in species, such as blue jays,
19 northern cardinals and California --
20 Carolina wrens. The point is, as one
21 researcher concluded, management actions
22 taken to regulate deer density could have
23 the unintended affect of reducing local
24 animal diversity.
99
1 It is also revealing that requests
2 under the freedom of information law for
3 documentation of consideration of
4 biodiversity, and the approval for
5 development projects has returned zero
6 results to date.
7 MARY MILLS: 30 seconds, please.
8 ERIC HUANG: Therefore, if
9 biodiversity is indeed a sincere concern
10 for the trustees, I call on them to perform
11 the necessary field studies to measure and
12 quantify biodiversity in the village before
13 proceeding with this environmentally
14 impacting plan.
15 MARY MILLS: Marion Deats?
Page 83
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
16 MARION DEATS: Thanks for giving me
17 the opportunity to express my sincere
18 thoughts, too. I'm a 38-year Ithaca
19 resident.
20 I live near Buttermilk Park. I think
21 that this -- the deer overpopulation
22 problems -- or issue is something that is
23 not just contained in Cayuga Heights. I
24 was recently diagnosed with Lymes disease.
100
1 I walk in Buttermilk all the time, and I
2 have dogs, so my heart goes out to the lady
3 whose dog was hit.
4 That being said, I really feel that
5 in a humane -- in a society that is a
6 caring and progressive forward looking
7 society, we need to use the resources that
8 we have.
9 I think that Cornell -- I just don't
10 understand why every avenue isn't looked
11 into through Cornell to research. We
12 talked about sterilization, are there other
13 avenues, are there other contraceptive
14 avenues that could be researched?
15 Why isn't there -- even -- we have
16 the perfect opportunity here to be in the
17 vanguard of research for sterilization and
18 mitigation. Cornell has a living
19 laboratory all around here. Cornell, as
20 being in the vanguard of veterinary
Page 84
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
21 science, what an opportunity, and to -- to
22 research this and to put into effect some
23 of the sterilization and the contraceptive
24 research and practice that can be used.
101
1 Yes, there is perhaps an abundance of
2 deer. I am phobic about hitting a deer
3 with my car, for the two reasons, the two
4 obvious reasons; hurting a deer and hurting
5 my car. But why can't we move forward in
6 as much in a humane and as much of an --
7 MARY MILLS: -- 30 seconds, please --
8 MARION DEATS: -- intelligent way as
9 we can? I advocate even how -- what a
10 great opportunity to be in the
11 international limelight with research for
12 cutting edge -- cutting technologies on
13 humane and non-lethal ways of reducing deer
14 population.
15 Has every avenue been explored?
16 That's my question.
17 MARY MILLS: So that was the list
18 that people had signed up for. Are there
19 any other people that would like to address
20 their opinions and views?
21 Please say your name for us.
22 VICTORIA CAMPBELL: My name is
23 Victoria Campbell, I'm a resident of
24 Ithaca.
Page 85
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
102
1 Really, there's so many things I
2 could say, but just to keep it short and
3 simple, I've repeatedly heard and, you
4 know, the research that I've done on the
5 situation, I fail to see a really good
6 group of science. I feel like there's a
7 lot of biological questions that have not
8 been answered.
9 What is the deer population, and what
10 is the biodiversity number of different
11 species, how will eliminating deer effect
12 that? What about the corridors that the
13 deer should be using going in and out of
14 Cayuga Heights? Why are they not -- if
15 they're starving, why aren't they moving
16 on?
17 Those are really important questions.
18 If those are not addressed before any
19 action is taken, the whole deer population
20 might come up again in another ten -- five,
21 ten years. So I think those are really
22 important things, and I think money would
23 much better be used towards looking at some
24 of these biological studies. Thank you.
103
1 MARY MILLS: Are there any others?
2 MAYOR SUPRON: If there are no other
3 comments, we'll ask one more time if any
Page 86
N12062010CAYUGAHEIGHTSPUBLICHEARING-Laserfiche
4 residents or non-residents wish to speak,
5 and if not, we'll close the public hearing.
6 Thank you very much for coming.
7
8 * * *
9
10 C E R T I F I C A T I O N
11
12 I hereby certify that the proceedings and
13 evidence are contained fully and accurately in the
14 notes taken by me on the above cause and that this
15 is a correct transcript of the same to the best of
16 my ability.
17
18
19 Marisa Nold
20 ___________________________
21 Marisa Nold
22
23
24
Page 87